Chief Technical Officer
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Yup; which is 100% intentional and by design. The 11 core classes will probably ALWAYS have more options than the newer 6 base classes, simply because those 11 core classes are the core classes—they're the classes we know that folks have access to. (It's unrealistic to imagine that everyone who bought the core RPG will also by the APG... although that'd certainly be nice!).
We'll be supporting all 17 classes (core and base alike) going forward in new books, but we have no plans on doing a "catch up" product for the 6 base classes.
I asked this because my fear is that the core classes will become (using the new options) more powerful than the 6 new base classes, so that selecting one of the 6 new classes could seems a weaker choice for a player.
Could it be the case?
"New" is not equal to "more powerful." The goal here is not to bump up power levels, but to add flexibility and additional interesting choices for players. People have been playing clerics for a while, so we want to give them new things they can do next time they play a cleric. People haven't played a summoner before, so just having the class *is* a new option.
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Yup; which is 100% intentional and by design. The 11 core classes will probably ALWAYS have more options than the newer 6 base classes, simply because those 11 core classes are the core classes—they're the classes we know that folks have access to. (It's unrealistic to imagine that everyone who bought the core RPG will also by the APG... although that'd certainly be nice!).
We'll be supporting all 17 classes (core and base alike) going forward in new books, but we have no plans on doing a "catch up" product for the 6 base classes.
I asked this because my fear is that the core classes will become (using the new options) more powerful than the 6 new base classes, so that selecting one of the 6 new classes could seems a weaker choice for a player.
Could it be the case?
Well, paladin is pretty powerful as it is, but I'm fairly sure I could whip up an alchemist that would seriously rock!
Ergo, I'm not worried in the least.
Are we able to see a ToC for this or no? I'm curious to get even a tease of what's inside.I know we have Paizo Blogs scheduled for further teases for the next two Fridays...
Does this mean that there will be a preview/teaser each friday until the APG is released? A bit like the Core Rulebook?
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Chief Technical Officer
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Does this mean that there will be a preview/teaser each friday until the APG is released? A bit like the Core Rulebook?Are we able to see a ToC for this or no? I'm curious to get even a tease of what's inside.I know we have Paizo Blogs scheduled for further teases for the next two Fridays...
Hmm. I appear to have been under the illusion I was posting in the GameMastery Guide thread when I said that. Sorry!
Right now, we're focusing on teasers for the GMG, seeing as it's our new release... but I'm sure you'll see a bunch of APG blogs in the weeks between PaizoCon (when we have our first big preview at the APG banquet) and Gen Con (when we release the book).
Does this mean that there will be a preview/teaser each friday until the APG is released? A bit like the Core Rulebook?Are we able to see a ToC for this or no? I'm curious to get even a tease of what's inside.I know we have Paizo Blogs scheduled for further teases for the next two Fridays...Hmm. I appear to have been under the illusion I was posting in the GameMastery Guide thread when I said that. Sorry!
Right now, we're focusing on teasers for the GMG, seeing as it's our new release... but I'm sure you'll see a bunch of APG blogs in the weeks between PaizoCon (when we have our first big preview at the APG banquet) and Gen Con (when we release the book).
:-(
Well you're only human.Will the APG be released as a PDF as well? I will get the book, but I don't want to wait until the book hits Sweden. Also, a lot of us wants a book and a PDF.
I've found an interesting explanation about core classes vs new base classes from Jason Bulmahn in an old blog post:
"In addition to the expansion of the core classes, this book will also contain six new base classes. They are called base classes because they go from level 1 to level 20, but they are not core classes. Confused? Allow me to explain. We are making an assumption that these new classes will take a role in our world (and possibly yours) that is less common. You will not find them in every adventure, nor will they appear in every product. That means that you can introduce them to your game in a more limited fashion, without having to retcon them into every facet of your campaign."
That help me to understand better what James Jacobs meant with his previous post, and I have to say that I like the philosophy that leaded the development of the new classes and that the 11 core classes remain the main, most common classes now and forever.
There's no such thing as a "Jason Jacobs" though... at least... not to my knowledge!
Someone is using the gestalt rules
There's no such thing as a "Jason Jacobs" though... at least... not to my knowledge!
Sorry, corrected :)
There's no such thing as a "Jason Jacobs" though... at least... not to my knowledge!Someone is using the gestalt rules
Seems like perhaps a Half-Red Dragon Fiendish T-Rex.
There's no such thing as a "Jason Jacobs" though... at least... not to my knowledge!
If there were such an unholy hybrid, we'd have to destroy it.
There's no such thing as a "Jason Jacobs" though... at least... not to my knowledge!Maybe if you and Jason mated it would produce such a offspring?
I thought they had.....how else do you explain "Nicolas Logue"...oooh did I go too far??? ;-)
Google says not only is there a Jason Jacobs, he's 39 and lives in Seattle. Spooky.
I'm buying my ticket now. Russ, meet me at the previously agreed coordinates.
Will the APG be released as a PDF as well? I will get the book, but I don't want to wait until the book hits Sweden. Also, a lot of us wants a book and a PDF.The APG PDF will be available on the release date, August 5 (the first day of Gen Con).
Thanks Vic! You've made me very happy :-)
There's no such thing as a "Jason Jacobs" though... at least... not to my knowledge!Maybe if you and Jason mated it would produce such a offspring?
Ack! Urk! Pthagh!
brain .... sponge ... needed ..
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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Google says not only is there a Jason Jacobs, he's 39 and lives in Seattle. Spooky.
I went to elementary school with a Jason Jakes. And a Jason Sloan. And two others I can't even remember the last names of. Very popular name back in the day. In fact, according to the U.S. Social Security Admin, Jason was in the top 4 most common boys' names EVERY YEAR from 1973 to 1983.
But it was never #1.
Hallelujah, we got our first preview of all the new base classes!
Will your Paizo's home page crash? ;-)
I almost missed they were in the Chronicles Sheet to "Master of the Fallen Fortress"
Cool :-)
He is?:-(
Well you're only human.
Well, we got our preview after all. :-)
I think a lot of people haven't actually noticed that yet.Hallelujah, we got our first preview of all the new base classes!
Will your Paizo's home page crash? ;-)
I almost missed they were in the Chronicles Sheet to "Master of the Fallen Fortress"
Cool :-)
Edit:
LOL, I think you are right. Poor Jason when they do.The messageboards will explode.
Anyway. It was very kind.
edit2
Jason if you read this, will the Oracle get burning hands as a bonus spell at level 2? A lot of people will wonder, especially LastKnightLeft.
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I think a lot of people haven't actually noticed that yet.Hallelujah, we got our first preview of all the new base classes!
Will your Paizo's home page crash? ;-)
I almost missed they were in the Chronicles Sheet to "Master of the Fallen Fortress"
Cool :-)
Well it is not super obvious unless you read the whole blog post. Plus the GMG just came out. I doubt most have come up for air yet. :)
Well it is not super obvious unless you read the whole blog post. Plus the GMG just came out. I doubt most have come up for air yet. :)I think a lot of people haven't actually noticed that yet.Hallelujah, we got our first preview of all the new base classes!
Will your Paizo's home page crash? ;-)
I almost missed they were in the Chronicles Sheet to "Master of the Fallen Fortress"
Cool :-)
Well I have come up :-) and I like it is not super obvious.
The summoner looks really powerful."Summon Monster I (Sp) You have summon monster I as a spell-like
ability. Using this ability is a standard action, and the summoned
creature remains for 1 minute (instead of 1 round). You cannot
have more than one summon monster spell active in this way
at one time. If this ability is used again, any existing summon
monster spell immediately ends."
Use it as a standard action and it last for a minute. Great.
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Creative Director
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Well it is not super obvious unless you read the whole blog post. Plus the GMG just came out. I doubt most have come up for air yet. :)I think a lot of people haven't actually noticed that yet.Hallelujah, we got our first preview of all the new base classes!
Will your Paizo's home page crash? ;-)
I almost missed they were in the Chronicles Sheet to "Master of the Fallen Fortress"
Cool :-)Well I have come up :-) and I like it is not super obvious.
The summoner looks really powerful."Summon Monster I (Sp) You have summon monster I as a spell-like
ability. Using this ability is a standard action, and the summoned
creature remains for 1 minute (instead of 1 round). You cannot
have more than one summon monster spell active in this way
at one time. If this ability is used again, any existing summon
monster spell immediately ends."Use it as a standard action and it last for a minute. Great.
That's like looking at a close-up picture of a person's face and seeing only the eye and assuming that the person is covered with eyes. In other words, there's more going on there than what you can see—it's not really worthwhile to get too worked up about class balance when you can't see the whole thing.
I think a lot of people haven't actually noticed that yet.Hallelujah, we got our first preview of all the new base classes!
Will your Paizo's home page crash? ;-)
I almost missed they were in the Chronicles Sheet to "Master of the Fallen Fortress"
Cool :-)Edit:
LOL, I think you are right. Poor Jason when they do.
The messageboards will explode.
Anyway. It was very kind.
edit2
Jason if you read this, will the Oracle get burning hands as a bonus spell at level 2? A lot of people will wonder, especially LastKnightLeft.
I'm not sure they'll explode. The ones I looked at closest seem pretty close to the Final Playtest Version. I made a thread to discuss any changes we find here.
That's like looking at a close-up picture of a person's face and seeing only the eye and assuming that the person is covered with eyes. In other words, there's more going on there than what you can see—it's not really worthwhile to get too worked up about class balance when you can't see the whole thing.
We'll people will probably get worked up about anything regarding the new APG. Some will like that the summoner can still use the Summon Monster spell-like ability as a standard action and that it last 1 minute (per level?) and some will think it is too powerful.
What you gotta remember, people are active on the boards because they love Paizo and Pathfinder. So every time you think we are a pain in the *ss, remeber it's because we are all passionate about the game.
It may never happen but a part of me wants to see a variant ranger and/or paladin that gets spellcasting at 1st. I play rangers when I play so I'm pulling for rangers more than anything for this. But the idea I have is Ranger as a militant druid, Same 4 levels of spells but he gets more of them to cast almost like the bard in some respects. In this variant he'd also get at least 2 more spells in Goodberry and Faerie Fire. Good Berry because it's a healing spell thematically appropriate to how I have the class envisioned. Faerie Fire more as a frivolous spell he would cast at a party when more important spells are not needed. Or use it to enchant a carved vegetable for a Jack O'Lantern type of effect. Wouldn't give a whole lot of light but it would be fun to look at.
I think a lot of people haven't actually noticed that yet.Hallelujah, we got our first preview of all the new base classes!
Will your Paizo's home page crash? ;-)
I almost missed they were in the Chronicles Sheet to "Master of the Fallen Fortress"
Cool :-)Edit:
LOL, I think you are right. Poor Jason when they do.
The messageboards will explode.
I doubt it; Jason's virtually never on here - I suspect what goes on on the boards doesn't bother him in the slightest.
Unless you meant James :)
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I think a lot of people haven't actually noticed that yet.Hallelujah, we got our first preview of all the new base classes!
Will your Paizo's home page crash? ;-)
I almost missed they were in the Chronicles Sheet to "Master of the Fallen Fortress"
Cool :-)Edit:
LOL, I think you are right. Poor Jason when they do.
The messageboards will explode.I doubt it; Jason's virtually never on here - I suspect what goes on on the boards doesn't bother him in the slightest.
Unless you meant James :)
Oh, that's not a nice thing to say; I think Jason cares a *LOT* about us and our opinions. The main reason he's not constantly posting here is that he's probably been *VERY* busy. Just think the about the amount of work he's done in the last couple of years (Core Rules, Crypt of the Everflame, APG, GMG etc.) and there are Bestiary 2 and the FAQ coming out. Jason is the Lead Developer, so it's no wonder he hasn't had a lot of time to hang around here.
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I think a lot of people haven't actually noticed that yet.Hallelujah, we got our first preview of all the new base classes!
Will your Paizo's home page crash? ;-)
I almost missed they were in the Chronicles Sheet to "Master of the Fallen Fortress"
Cool :-)Edit:
LOL, I think you are right. Poor Jason when they do.
The messageboards will explode.I doubt it; Jason's virtually never on here - I suspect what goes on on the boards doesn't bother him in the slightest.
Unless you meant James :)
Now that's a cheap (or grossly underinformed) shot. Jason was here constantly during the Alpha, Beta and APG playtests and his late disapperance was due to final phase of works on APG and *cough* Errata *cough*.
He..the Summoner is called Balazar is he...as a follower of RPG MP3s exploration of the 'Worlds Largest Dungeon' that's a name with resonance
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Creative Director
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It may never happen but a part of me wants to see a variant ranger and/or paladin that gets spellcasting at 1st. I play rangers when I play so I'm pulling for rangers more than anything for this. But the idea I have is Ranger as a militant druid, Same 4 levels of spells but he gets more of them to cast almost like the bard in some respects. In this variant he'd also get at least 2 more spells in Goodberry and Faerie Fire. Good Berry because it's a healing spell thematically appropriate to how I have the class envisioned. Faerie Fire more as a frivolous spell he would cast at a party when more important spells are not needed. Or use it to enchant a carved vegetable for a Jack O'Lantern type of effect. Wouldn't give a whole lot of light but it would be fun to look at.
What you're looking for would more or less be identical to a cleric or a druid.
Full spellcasting plus a full base attack progression will never happen from a Paizo product.
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Creative Director
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Oh, that's not a nice thing to say; I think Jason cares a *LOT* about us and our opinions. The main reason he's not constantly posting here is that he's probably been *VERY* busy. Just think the about the amount of work he's done in the last couple of years (Core Rules, Crypt of the Everflame, APG, GMG etc.) and there are Bestiary 2 and the FAQ coming out. Jason is the Lead Developer, so it's no wonder he hasn't had a lot of time to hang around here.
Jason is actually the Lead Designer, not the Lead Developer.
OK, as you can see I am a subscriber to this line of books, but I do not want this book, so what is the best way for me to go about skipping this book and not miss the Game Masters Guide?
Do I just cancel my subscription, and then as soon as I see this has shipped restart it?
It may never happen but a part of me wants to see a variant ranger and/or paladin that gets spellcasting at 1st. I play rangers when I play so I'm pulling for rangers more than anything for this. But the idea I have is Ranger as a militant druid, Same 4 levels of spells but he gets more of them to cast almost like the bard in some respects. In this variant he'd also get at least 2 more spells in Goodberry and Faerie Fire. Good Berry because it's a healing spell thematically appropriate to how I have the class envisioned. Faerie Fire more as a frivolous spell he would cast at a party when more important spells are not needed. Or use it to enchant a carved vegetable for a Jack O'Lantern type of effect. Wouldn't give a whole lot of light but it would be fun to look at.What you're looking for would more or less be identical to a cleric or a druid.
Full spellcasting plus a full base attack progression will never happen from a Paizo product.
No, a Druid has too many spell casting levels and I prefer the ranger's sidebar if you will. There was an interesting idea in Dragon magazine once in the form of a Mystic Ranger.
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OK, as you can see I am a subscriber to this line of books, but I do not want this book, so what is the best way for me to go about skipping this book and not miss the Game Masters Guide?
Do I just cancel my subscription, and then as soon as I see this has shipped restart it?
Pretty much, yes. Once the Advanced Player's Guide has shipped to subscribers, you should be able to restart your subscription starting with Advanced Player's Guide or Bestiary II (which is the book after Advanced Player's Guide).
Now that's a cheap (or grossly underinformed) shot. Jason was here constantly during the Alpha, Beta and APG playtests and his late disapperance was due to final phase of works on APG and *cough* Errata *cough*.I think a lot of people haven't actually noticed that yet.Hallelujah, we got our first preview of all the new base classes!
Will your Paizo's home page crash? ;-)
I almost missed they were in the Chronicles Sheet to "Master of the Fallen Fortress"
Cool :-)Edit:
LOL, I think you are right. Poor Jason when they do.
The messageboards will explode.I doubt it; Jason's virtually never on here - I suspect what goes on on the boards doesn't bother him in the slightest.
Unless you meant James :)
Not a shot in the slightest. I picture him as being busy as hell and barely having time to read his regular email, never mind burning precious time slacking on these boards like the lot of us :)
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Oh, that's not a nice thing to say; I think Jason cares a *LOT* about us and our opinions. The main reason he's not constantly posting here is that he's probably been *VERY* busy. Just think the about the amount of work he's done in the last couple of years (Core Rules, Crypt of the Everflame, APG, GMG etc.) and there are Bestiary 2 and the FAQ coming out. Jason is the Lead Developer, so it's no wonder he hasn't had a lot of time to hang around here.Jason is actually the Lead Designer, not the Lead Developer.
Designer... developer... almost the same thing, right? ;)
I should have written James. He is the one who have been active on the boards the last couple of months. Sure Jason has been busy, but James sure hasn't been slacking. I'm sure James work just as hard as Jason. Jason is the man when it comes to rules in the core rulebook and the APG, but Paizo is so much more that these two books. In fact they are one way of promoting their adventure paths.
Paizo would not have been where they are now without the brilliant and creative mind of James Jacobs, who also is my favorite member of the staff. Sure I love what Jason has done for the game and I do want the APG, but Paizo is more than Jason. All of them, Lisa, Vic, Ross, Joshua, Eric, etc. are all important and none of them are slackers. Well perhaps Eric ;-)
I should have written James. He is the one who have been active on the boards the last couple of months. Sure Jason has been busy, but James sure hasn't been slacking. I'm sure James work just as hard as Jason. Jason is the man when it comes to rules in the core rulebook and the APG, but Paizo is so much more that these two books. In fact they are one way of promoting their adventure paths.
Paizo would not have been where they are now without the brilliant and creative mind of James Jacobs, who also is my favorite member of the staff. Sure I love what Jason has done for the game and I do want the APG, but Paizo is more than Jason. All of them, Lisa, Vic, Ross, Joshua, Eric, etc. are all important and none of them are slackers. Well perhaps Eric ;-)
Here, have a Kleenex ... I think you have something on your nose :)
I can't wait for this to come out, but I have a query.
What happens when your Eidolon gets permanently anchored to it's home plane somehow after it gets sent home by an enemy caster? ._. The Summoner is then seriously gimped. What do you do in that case?
I ask because I really want to play a summoner once the book hits, but I'm really worried about this. I don't want to end up summonless and thus tremendously gimped, especially at higher levels when, y'know, every man and their dog probably has a way to get rid of it, rendering you fairly weak. I mean, as weak as still having up to level 6 summoner spells, but still, it's one hell of a hit.
If someone has the tenacity to banish your eidolon, plane shift to where he is and then spam dimensional anchor on him, then really, plane shift to the eidolon's home and kill that guy.
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Creative Director
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I take that you aren't exactly on good terms with the Cleric variant from the Campaign Setting :)What you're looking for would more or less be identical to a cleric or a druid.
Full spellcasting plus a full base attack progression will never happen from a Paizo product.
Nope. That's going away in the revised book. It was a bad idea.