Perenian "Perry" Ethgarnon |
Perry and Able, PLEASE take this to PM's now. This is not making this an enjoyable experience. I'm considering also leaving the game now.
Don't leave on my account.
I had high hopes and high expectations for this game, and Perry contributed consistently and always with the crew (and the players) as his first priority. That's the style I set out to play and with one obvious exception I think I achieved that. I supported the GM during the many drafts of the Rules and I challenged him when I felt something in the game was underdeveloped or amiss. I only regret that I had taken a different tone with Adam or perhaps reached out to him privately sooner. But I realize now I broke the first rule of Survivor, and I choose not to stick around to be voted off the island.
There are good characters here to make it work. Arabella will no doubt pick up where I leave off, driving engagement and moving things forward.
I will not game with Able/Rigor. Though I made several attempts to return the conversation to play, he appears to have an inhuman stamina to cast aspersions, make threats, and demand tribute, and a myopic inability to see that he is guilty of all the same crimes for which he judges others. He is skilled at gaslighting, but it's plain to see if you know what to look for. He'd make an apt politician.
I made my peace with Adam, privately, as was appropriate. For Rigor to endlessly carry on demanding public genuflection was self-serving and the height of arrogance. No one asked him to be this game's morality police and I sure as hell bet no one wants it. I was warned about him during Recruitment, but I thought, how awful can the guy be? Now I know. If you're very, very lucky, he will find a reason to bow out before anyone else bails. He's already admitted he's not invested in the game, so there's a glimmer of hope. I walk away in good company.
GM ZF, feel free to npc Perry as you wish. At -2 to every dice roll, he's pretty useless anyhow. Something for the enemy to shoot at. In the meantime, he intends to stay very drunk. Let the good times roll.
It's Christmas time. I intend to enjoy it. All the best.
Able St.Germaine-Montclair |
I owe most of you an apology. I overstepped the bounds of good taste trying to call someone out on toxic behaviour, and caused some toxic spillover of my own. I feel like I might have poisoned the well and killed the group vibe. ZenFox has asked me to stay on, but if that would harm the game, I will leave too. I suggest you PM Zen with any concerns, and he will let me know if the invitation stands, or if for the sake of everyone's enjoyment, I should move on.
Apologies again. We all have buttons, and the type that blames others for their actions pushes mine. However, that's my baggage, and while I don't regret anything I said, I should have just left and allowed you to make your own choice about how to deal with it.
Either way, no bad feelings to anyone here, and I wish you many happy games.
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
I'll wait for the decisions about who is staying and who is going to settle who the remaining PCs are. I'm reading through the posts in the Gameplay thread and considering how my character may fit in.
I'm not committed to what I have on Arabella's profile nor to the background ideas I posted earlier. If anyone has any suggestions, let me know.
I've played several Savage Worlds campaigns although none was particularly long-term. And those game were with the earlier editions.
I have watched the Firefly series and the movie. It's been a while and I've only ever seen any particular episode once, and that's 20 years ago.
It seems that all the equipment options are contained in SWADE. Let me know if there are any other sources other than the GM's intro document.
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
I'm working on optimizing attributes and skills. Persuasion is a top priority for being a good negotiator which will lead to better jobs and more profits, as I read the rules on job acquisition.
Since persuasion can be used for other things, I'm trying to factor those into the advantage of a high persuasion outside of job finding.
There are edges that boost persuasion generally, such as Shepherd or as I have her now taking streetwise and aristocrat to give a +2 on negotiation rolls. This assumes that everyone both alliance aristocrats and anti-alliance street punks are equally inclined to be more easily persuaded if the arguments are coming from a shepherd.
I know the series had a shepherd who was generally acting as the voice of wisdom and provided moral guidance. I don't remember if the role was something that carried some kind of official recognition, like a companion registration, and some kind of wearable sign of that. Or is it more like the benefit people often give to people of the cloth (priests, rabbis, etc).
From a game mechanical point of view, the Shepherd edge gives frees up an edge at the cost of a minor oath and a requirement to bring religion into the conversation frequently, something I'm liable to do anyway.
I am also leery of leaning too heavily on religion, for while I have a PhD in religion and can easily incorporate what I know into good RP, I'm worried that might rub some PCs or players the wrong way.
Same goes for the Major Hindrance of Pacifist. I've played pacifist characters in other games and I think it bugs some players because they see it as someone not willing to be a team player when combat rolls around.
As I read the rules, the other advantageous uses of persuasion are to support allies with words of encouragement, giving +1 or +2 to a trait roll in melee, and in trying to adjust the attitude of an NPC toward the party.
So if anyone has anything to suggest to help me in working on these details, let me know.
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
I came up with an alternative character who can do the necessary work of the negotiator, but with a more diverse set of skills and less restrictive major hindrances.
I'll add the stats to Arabella's profile next, but here is the general idea.
Hindrances: Elderly, Combat Paralysis, plus a minor vow necessitated by an edge.
Edges: Shepherd, Charismatic, Hard to Kill
Attributes: Agility d4, Smarts d8, Strength d4, Spirit d8, Vigor d6
Skills: Athletics d4, Common Knowledge d6, Fighting d6, Healing d4, Intimidation d6, Notice d6, Performance d4, Persuasion d8 +2, Knowledge Planets d4, Science d6, Shooting d8, Survival d4, Taunt d6.
Concept: a woman who has been kicking around the verse for long enough to have learned a lot. She's not as agile or strong as younger folk, but she is a good shot and also quite adept dealing with various types of people. She's not a combat whiz, but can shoot a gun and defend herself with a rapier if someone gets too close, once she gets past the combat paralysis hindrance. Her main benefit in combat would be encouraging others (Support rolls) and putting enemies off their game with Taunt. Her strengths, however, are persuasion, for getting jobs, and a spectrum of knowledge gained over the years. She is also a shepherd, but not the judgy sort, more of a mystic who quotes wise proverbs or tells stories with a moral at the end.
If anyone sees any fatal flaws in this concept, point them out. I'll work on background. I might need some help from the GM suggesting things that have gone on in the past 30 years that the character might know about or have been mixed up in.
GM: you asked for corrections to your campaign document. The Shepard edge says it requires a quirk plus it requires "an Oath Hindrance of your choice." I couldn't find a hindrance called oath, but I suspect it fits the minor Vow hindrance.
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
Ooooo. Combat Paralysis looks haaaaaaaaard.
I mean, every combat would be rough, but every round? Even the well-known Monologuer only is 1/4th of rounds, and even then you get to move.
Are you...suuuure? =}
I'm assuming this is not every round, but on the first round of each melee. It sounds like ZenFox borrowed this from the GURPS disadvantage of the same name. The once per turn refers to if you fail on the first turn, you can roll again next turn until you make the roll.
Arabella is not much help in combat, so this mainly puts her at risk. I figured she'll make the roll almost 50% of the time.
She'll stay to the back if the group is moving into possible fight situation, so she won't be in the front taking fire if she freezes.
I figure it's a PTSD from her long years of getting into fights and getting wounded.
Edit: also I'm assuming other characters can make a support roll to help her snap out of it.
GM_ZenFox42 |
FWIW, the Hindrance delays you from entering combat on average for 3 rounds with a d6 Spirit, and 2 rounds with a d8 Spirit. Of course, with die rolls, you could occasionally go much longer than this before being able to act.
Yes, you start making Spirit rolls on the first round of any melee, and continue to roll once per round until you Succeed, at which point you can make any Actions for the rest of the melee.
You can make any Free Actions in the rounds in which you fail.
Emma Whiteangel |
So take heed, Arabella, that means, on average, you'll be paralyzed for a full two rounds, every combat.
That's a long time once bullets start to fly. And it does not look like you even get a move action.
Even if other people can help you, that's not always gonna be possible.
Hrmmmmmmmm.
Harold Wainwright |
Ok, so I was off due to family concerns and christmas, and I came back to this.
First, Welcome Arabella
Second, Sorry to see Perry and Adam go.
Third, I will NOT request Able to leave, but I see that decision was made while typing this out.
Now, Can we all get back to the game, and I hope that we can work other disagreements out without this kind of blow up.
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
FWIW, the Hindrance delays you from entering combat on average for 3 rounds with a d6 Spirit, and 2 rounds with a d8 Spirit. Of course, with die rolls, you could occasionally go much longer than this before being able to act.
Yes, you start making Spirit rolls on the first round of any melee, and continue to roll once per round until you Succeed, at which point you can make any Actions for the rest of the melee.
You can make any Free Actions in the rounds in which you fail.
I did a statistical test and found that for a spirit die of d8, you are 48% likely to succeed on the first roll.
Even without this hindrance, you're 50% likely to have to be a target for at least some of the enemies who have ranged weapons just based on the randomness of turn order on each round. So the hindrance guarantees that one will be a target for an additional round half the time.
The problem is that my tests show that
Chance to succeed by the 2nd roll: 69%
by the third roll: 85%
Out of 241 melee simulations, it took 4 rolls to succeed 19 times, 5 rolls 11 times, 6 rolls 6 times, and 1 case where it took 7 rolls to get a success.
That seems not only too harsh to be tempting as a major hindrance, but very likely to get the character killed eventually unless one is wearing loads of armor.
Since this appears to be a house rule perhaps inspired by a similar GURPS disadvantage, I'd suggest it be modified or no one is going to risk taking it.
GURPS gives a progressive +1 per round after the first added to the roll. My tests show this raises the chance of succeeding by the 2nd attempt to 80% and makes the worst case 4 rounds (8 times out of 285).
I might also suggest allowing using bennies for rerolls after the first failure. It means a character with this hindrance will need to spend bennies to survive at a bigger rate than someone without the hindrance, which seems a fair tradeoff.
As is, I'm not going to take the hindrance and will look for something else, but I'll be disappointed. It seems my character, being older and hence having been in more firefights, might have PTSD which could be triggered by combat. She would not survive however, if she froze for more than 1 round with any regularity.
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
If Arabella does not take the Combat Paralysis hindrance, she'll probably replace it with the Code of Conduct Major hindrance. It will fit with her status as a member of a religious order and the way I intend to play her.
I could go with Pacifist Major, but that might be more complicated to do if combat is going to be a regular thing. This would require I get every current player's consent to tolerate, since she would at best use non-lethal attacks during combat, and there are no cheap non-lethal ranged weapons at present (correct me if I'm wrong on that). So she'd have to hang back and try to assist anyone who was wounded.
Secret Major could be interesting but only if the GM could use it as a potential plot point in the future. She's been around long enough to have done things that should stay secret. If ZenFox has any ideas along this line, send me a PM about it.
I'll set up her character profile with the Code of Conduct hindrance and work on backstory. ZenFox: if you need the character to be ready to play soon, let me know when. I should be able to comply.
GM_ZenFox42 |
Arabella - don't make any firm decisions yet, I want to confirm your tests and do some different tests before I make a decision, which I can't do until tomorrow morning.
The best place to introduce your PC is as the group is boarding the ship to leave the planet after rescuing the girl, so it will probably be a few days IRL, just FYI.
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
Meh. I've seen too many characters take a long time to join with a party. It's kind of a lose lose. I'm perfectly fine saying that they've been with us all along.
In lieu of Emma's suggestion, if anyone wants to suggest a connection to Arabella, feel free to read her background (it's stuff that's available on the Cortex, so it won't reveal any secrets). She's done a lot of stuff in a variety of places, so she might have crewed with someone in this crew.
Or it could be a typical cute meet. Or perhaps Arabella could be inside wherever you're going. The characters ready pending the issue over the hindrances, which will be cleared up tomorrow I expect.
I could come up with a reason she would try to book passage with the ship when it is ready to leave.
Daisy Mae Puckett |
Easiest solution is to Retcon it. Arabella was either headed to this planet or our next destination and signed on as a passenger.
Or
She is at the ship when we leave or at the original farmer's house to ask for passage or to just join up...
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
...
So, everyone : what's your typical number of days between posts (once per day, once every other day, etc., or, if you can post multiple times per day, say that)? I know we're in the heady rush of a brand-new game, but what's your posting rate in other games that have been going on for a while?
When I'm a player, I try to post every day that there is something I can contribute to. Some days I can post more than once, but other days, my work won't allow posting more than once.
My work schedule changes every five weeks. I usually let the group know what times I will generally be posting and, in some cases, days I may not be able to post at all.
When I'm a GM, I ask my players to let the group know if they have something preventing them from posting. It should never be impossible to make a quick post saying "I'm not going to be able to post until..." [Obviously, if someone has a medical or other emergency, we all understand the silence.]
I'm okay with the GM 'botting PCs once in a while. I do it when I'm GM, but in some cases, the decision the player makes could have important consequences such that only the player should make the decision. I usually give an extra day in that case before 'botting and given the player notice before I do.
GM_ZenFox42 |
Ok, so my results for Combat Paralysis are :
-For a d6 Spirit, the average number of rounds before you can act are 2-3, 25% of the time it can go as high as 3, and 10% of the time it can go as high as 6.
-For a d8 Spirit, the average number of rounds before you can act is 1, 25% of the time it can go as high as 2, and 10% of the time it can go as high as 3.
-For a d10 Spirit, the average number of rounds before you can act are 0-1, 25% of the time it can go as high as 1, and 10% of the time it can go as high as 2.
Decreasing the penalty by 1 each round does this :
Die Mean 25% 10%
6........1........2......2
8.......0-1......1......2
10.....0-1......1......2
Which seems to low for a Major Hindrance.
With Arabella's Spirit of d8, I don't think waiting 1-2 rounds (and occasionally 3 rounds) is too bad. Remember, this was to simulate Kaylee's (the repair girl) "freezing up" *every* time she was involved in combat in the TV show.
If Arabella thinks 1-2 rounds is too dangerous, she can pick one of the other Hindrances she's mentioned. But remember she just can't take non-Free Actions - she can always run for cover until she's recovered (unlike Kaylee, who usually stood frozen in place). Oh, yeah, BTW - Running is also a Free Action....
Might I also suggest the Heroic Major Hindrance? You would always say yes to anyone in need, or who can't protect themselves. Might fit in well with being a Shepherd. Just a thought...
If everyone's comfortable with ret-conning, we'll say that Arabella approached the group as soon as they landed, asking not just for passage but to be a crew member (Arabella, why would you do that?). Would you mind making a post in Discussion introducing yourself and asking to be a member? Other players can respond to that in-character if they wish. Sort of an aside mini-scene.
Arabella, this means that your PC must be ready to go by today or tomorrow at the latest. Sorry to spring this on you so suddenly, I hadn't considered ret-conning, I thought it would be too jarring to the story. But since everyone seems ok with it...
We'll also ret-con that Perry, now not having many other useful skills beside piloting, stayed behind to guard the ship.
Able St.Germaine-Montclair |
She's a shepherd? What if she was in the cabin, having been forced at gunpoint to assist in a shotgun-wedding?
It might alter the story you have in mind, but... whether she's running away and wants to marry, or he is kidnapping/marrying her to try and influence a claim to her father's estate...
GM_ZenFox42 |
All - a thought question : how mercenary is your PC?
So, in the TV show the crew were "heroes" in the sense that they always helped anyone who was in need, especially if they were being abused by someone with more power than them. As I recall (with my bad memory), they rarely if ever got paid, and they didn't ask presumably because they had the income from the shipping.
What I'm getting at is, a lot of the jobs you'll run into in the future may have *much* lower payments offered, and maybe even no payment at all (this first adventure may have skewed your expectations, but Harold was one of the richest men on the planet).
So, be thinking about how your PC would react to being asked to risk their life for no payment.
No need to post a reply to this if you don't want to.
GM_ZenFox42 |
Able - woah! If you're talking about Arabella, what gave you the idea that she was in the cabin? I know it was mentioned as a possibility by some players, but I never said she was. I've even said in the post just before yours that she approached the group right after you landed, and asked to become a member of the crew.
And if you're talking about Harold's daughter, what gave you the idea that she's a Shepherd?
Or is your first "she" referring to one of them, and the second "she" referring to the other?
ALL - the last time players started speculating about what was the truth behind the kidnapping in Discussion, I almost said this, but since it's happened again : PLEASE don't post your speculations about what's really going on, because then I feel obligated to come up with some other reason, and as I said in my first Recruitment post, I struggle with creativity. Thanks!
Emma Whiteangel |
So you're confirming that Harold's daughter is a shepherd, and she's been kidnapped by alien reverse-vampires????
Illuminati CONFIRMED!
Yeah, Firefly was a show about money that rarely ever talked about money. The only time I saw money handed over was after they sold the cows.
Due to Emma's psychosis she is on the verge of amorality. As such, helping people for the sake of some intangible reason is foreign to her. If the party wishes to do that, she may be much like Jayne in the famous bar scene. She'll raise a glass, say, "I didn't fight in no war" and wish them the best of luck, tho.
Priority to get funds to get fake ID = 1.
All other priorities = 0.
Of note, now that I think on it, I do not recall them ever doing something for purely altruistic reasons, or without at least the promise of adequate payment. Yes there was The Train Job, but they did rob the train in the first place, they just gave the medicine back.
In more instances...like the guy with the fake organs that gets shot and dies, or Simon's WONDERFUL raid on Ariel, there was payment along the path.
The A-Team might've done things altruistically.
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
Ok, so my results for Combat Paralysis are :
-For a d6 Spirit, the average number of rounds before you can act are 2-3, 25% of the time it can go as high as 3, and 10% of the time it can go as high as 6.
-For a d8 Spirit, the average number of rounds before you can act is 1, 25% of the time it can go as high as 2, and 10% of the time it can go as high as 3.
-For a d10 Spirit, the average number of rounds before you can act are 0-1, 25% of the time it can go as high as 1, and 10% of the time it can go as high as 2.Decreasing the penalty by 1 each round does this :
Die Mean 25% 10%
6........1........2......2
8.......0-1......1......2
10.....0-1......1......2
I'll e-mail you (ZenFox) my spreadsheet so you can see if I'm doing it wrong. I did dice rolls using the Randbetween(1,d) function, with a column for the main roll and then four other columns with additional rolls if the previous roll was an ace. Then I had the same deal for the wild d6 dice. Then I did a max(Sum(main die plus Aces),Sum(wild die plus aces) and then subtracted 2 from the result.
Then I set up a column that indicated when the result was 4 or greater. Then I repeated the row 500 times. I copied one sample result of the 500 trials and then looked at how many rounds it took to get a success.
I focused on the d8 spirit trait roll since that is Arabella's spirit result.
The average success rate for a single roll (d8, d6) -2 is 48% +- 3%. So it's a bit like flipping a coin. Half the time you get heads, half tails. But the odds are better than most people realize to get a string of tails.
The hindrance has an inherent inconsistency. The higher the character's spirit die, the less consequential the hindrance is and vice versa. No one with a d4 spirit would ever take the hindrance; anyone with a d10 or d12 spirit attribute would not be hindered very often. It might work better if it wasn't contingent on the spirit die.
If movement is allowed even on a failed roll, then all the number crunching is probably moot. The word "paralysis" in the name gives that impression, I guess. It's more like combat aversion, since you can't fight until you make the roll but you can try to get out of lines of fire.
Since Arabella only has nominal combat abilities, it won't hurt the team if she is not firing for a few rounds. So other things being equal I'll take the Combat Paralysis hindrance. But in my next post, I'll reflect on the other options mentioned above.
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
Might I also suggest the Heroic Major Hindrance? You would always say yes to anyone in need, or who can't protect themselves. Might fit in well with being a Shepherd. Just a thought...
Heroic: This noble soul never says no to a person in need. She doesn’t have to be happy about it, but she always comes to the rescue of those she feels can’t help themselves. She’s the first 25 one to run into a burning building, usually agrees to hunt monsters for little or no pay, and is generally a pushover for a sob story.
I could take this hindrance, since I already intend to RP the character along these lines. On the other hand, since she is just one vote, a rescue operation is offered, she'd vote for but if the majority votes against, what then? She can be an advocate for selfless action, but she can't force others to choose what she would choose.
She'll do that anyway, so I'd rather give her a hindrance that is more mechanical, like Combat Paralysis, based in a kind of PTSD condition.
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
If everyone's comfortable with ret-conning, we'll say that Arabella approached the group as soon as they landed, asking not just for passage but to be a crew member (Arabella, why would you do that?). Would you mind making a post in Discussion introducing yourself and asking to be a member? Other players can respond to that in-character if they wish. Sort of an aside mini-scene.
Sometime before the group negotiates with the rancher to haul his shipment and the request for assistance getting his daughter back.
As the crew disembarks from the ship to look for a new job, a woman approaches and waves to get the attention of the group. She wears clothes similar to others in the area, faded jeans, sturdy boots, a duster, and a broad-brimmed hat. She has a pistol on her left hip and a rapier on her right. She's average height for women in the 'verse, about five and a half feet tall. She seems fit but the closer she gets, it becomes clear that she is not a youngster. Her face is weathered, tan and red in places from exposure to the sun. Her hands have callouses, as well as a few tattoos.
While her features suggest a woman in her 50s, her face is relatively free of wrinkles except for a few slight laugh lines around her eyes and mouth. Her smooth forehead has a tattoo of two interlocking shapes, one black, the other her natural brownish skintone, which everyone recognizes as being a classic Chinese Tai Chi, more commonly called a Yin-Yang symbol. It identifies her as a shepherd in an order that claims to date back to Earth-That-Was called the Zhao Daoling Monastery, a sect of Taoism. The sect refers to their shepherds as Way-masters or Tao-masters, or more commonly just masters. The taoists don't see humans as sheep needing a shepherd as much as novices attempting to find their own way in the 'verse.
"Howdy, pards. I'm Arabella an' I'm lookin' ta book passage to wherever yer goin' next. My job is done on this here rock an' I'm set ta move on."
If asked to explain what she is doing here in the first place, she says, "I's sent here by my order ta organize a temple. About a dozen or so locals requested it, bein' of a general mind ta practice the religion of their ancestors, 'stead o' the local Christ'n church or Buddhist temple. I came, I organized, trained the most promisin' talent ta be a lay leader. I sent a message ta the order and they're sendin' a priest ta lead the temple, so my job is done here."
If asked where she wants to go she replies, with words that suddenly have lost the rim-twang tone, replaced by the steady flow of Core Proper, "I follow the Tao, the Way. I never know where I'm going, only that I'm on the Way. I'll go where you're going. If you grow weary of my company, I'll depart. I can pay, but I can also contribute to your jobs in various ways."
Harold Wainwright |
Chronomancy here; Back at the ship
Arabella sees a 6' 200lb man wearing a faded brown duster step out of the crowd and start to approach her.
When he spots no other people, he offers his hand
Harold here, Pleased to meet you.
He continues to observe for problems.
So I take it you will want to meet the captain, as he is the one that will say yes or no
He waves towards the ship for someone else to come collect her and take her onboard.
Playing security it tough at times
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
Arabella gives Harold a pleasant smile as she shakes his hand. Her grip is firm; her skin is rough and calloused. She nods her head in thanks and continues toward a knot of people she assumes is the crew next to the ship.
As she passes Harold, he sees she has a light well-worn backpack. The beat-up scroll of a violin sticks around the top flap on one side, with a slender straight scabbard extending out the other side. On second glance, it is not a scabbard but a protective sheath for a violin bow. On her belt, she has a small holster containing a harmonica, a small pouch probably containing spare ammo for her piece, and a large pouch that contains a ragged copy of a book.
For those who judge a person by the color of her coat, her duster's original color could be brown, but it's so weathered and worn that the color might have been just about anything. It looks a bit brown but that could just be the color of the dust on this world.
See previous post for conversation examples.
Atlas2112 |
There's a scene in the Masters of the Universe live action movie where the good guys are holed up in some department store, and a trio of the Drones of the bad guys line up and straight up jump -through- a plate glass window to get entry in force.
I always that was so cool. Glad I could pay homage here.
(Of course it was also the coolest scene about the movie because just before they were ready to start shooting the execs said "Surprise you have no budget!")
GM_ZenFox42 |
For future reference, any time you have a penalty or bonus to a die roll, please either be sure to briefly state the reason for it in the text of your post, or in the description part of the die command.
For example, Harold could do : {dice=Shooting & Wild,+2(shot)}...
And Arabella could do : {dice=Strength & Wild,-1(Elderly)}...
(with { } replaced by [ ], of course).
If you have multiple bonuses or penalties, please list them all separately.
If you like to do your main die and Wild die as separate die commands, you only need to include the *reason* in the main die roll command, if you choose to do it that way.
Thanks!
Arabella Stormworth-Darling |
Do you want us to add/subtract the modifier in the dicebot calculation or add it after all the aces are accounted for?
Examaple: Strength, -1 elderly: 1d4 - 1 ⇒ (2) - 1 = 1
Wild: 1d6 - 1 ⇒ (2) - 1 = 1
Result: 1
Or
Strength, -1 elderly: 1d4 ⇒ 3
Wild: 1d6 ⇒ 3
Result: 3 - 1 = 2