The Dales and Beyond

Game Master littlehewy

I am on vacation until sunday folks. I drove all day and im exhausted but i should be able to post 1/day, but probably not more while im here..

Origins gaming convention for me next week. I should still be able to post but may be a little busier starting weds.

No problems Kraz and Sorin, I'll bear that in mind. We're getting well into the dungeon now, and have been travelling at a pretty good pace so far, and in fact I think I've been the slowest poster more often than anyone else. Enjoy your holiday Kraz, and your convention Sorin :)

So I just mentioned it on the gameplay thread, but we should probably discuss it here. Did we work out a party treasurer, someone to note the treasure found and kept? If not, perhaps Jack, being the rogue, would like to keep an eye on loot :)

Also, it seems we've had our first dropout on the other game I'm running, so well done to you all for sticking around :) I'm really enjoying this game, and looking forward to seeing how the dungeon goes, and hopefully where the game goes after that.

I can copy one I have in sheets for other games.

Treasure Chest

Haha 2.296 gp each so far... I promise I will ramp up the loot before you get out of here! Good work Nilelane, that'll do nicely for coin. With items, make sure someone claims them and actually enters them on their character sheet if they want to use them in battle.

Can we put the “Treasure Chest” link on the campaign info page?

Nilelane's got it in her status line, but yep, I'll stick it on the campaign info page. Or should I put it in the header at the top of every page?

I’m good either way. If Nilelane wants to keep it in her header that’s fine too.

For sake of past upkeep, Sorin picked up a ruby worth 100g and there was treasure from the Gumbo as well.

Updated with ruby and Gumbos stuff.

I did not even notice we found a book back there!

When we appraise stuff it can be edited. If anyone keeps something just delete the gp value and put your PC name under kept.

I've put it on the campaign info page for now. For usable items, you'll need your name next to it on Nilelane's spreadsheet if you want to use it on the fly, or if you get split up. Even for things like the ruby, it's probably best to have it on there that you're carrying it, in case you fall into a crevasse or something fun like that.

I did not even notice we found a book back there!

Sure did!

Yeah, falling into a crevasse, sounds “fun” for sure.

I’ll look back through later to determine if there is any more treasure. I seem to think there was.

Wow, it definitely shows that you guys have done this before. so organised, i love it. I'm not even this organised when I play in person.

So as Nilelane offers the locked book to Jack to pick... What are your thoughts on taking 10 and taking 20, a la Pathfinder? I'm quite happy to use them if no one has any issue.

And I agree with Beerg, I'd give Nilelane inspiration for the loot tracker if she didn't already have it, makes everybody else's life so much easier when players do stuff like that :)

Hehe, wish I could take credit, but alas. One of my players in a 2016 game on these boards copied it from one of his other games. Who knows how many times its been copied and passed around lol

As for taking 10/20, I've looked into that before and can give my opinion. Taking 10 already exists in that everything has a "passive", not just perception. There is a mechanic that even provides for advantage and disadvantage as a +5/-5 modifier, respectively.

So for example, if Jack had advantage, he would have a passive dex thieves tools of 20 (10+5+5) and wouldn't have to roll over and over and over.

Taking 20 is not part of 5e because they have tried to make it where rolling is not necessary for things that are nearly certain. You want to climb a wall outside of combat? Ok you succeed...no check necessary. Thats just the philosophy of the skill system in this edition.

Thats just my personal perspective and I honestly dont care if we use take 10/20 in whatever form.

I tend to agree with Nilelane on this one. Using the passive system works pretty good. Out of combat skill checks still happen for sure but if its just a matter of success over time with no consequence for how much time it takes, no need to roll.

As far as treasure, we never determined the value of the Shortsword only that it was masterwork. They dont really have that mechanic in the PHB for 5th but its a pretty simple mechanic to transfer if it is indeed just MW. +1 to attack but not to damage. Also what would be the worth on that? Sticking with 300 gp as per PF/3.5?

I too agree with Nilelane and in truth completely forgot passive abilities for other skills could be used (thanks for the reminder!!). The giving and receiving of advantage for a number of reasons (someone helping you, proper tools etc) seems a much more 5e way of doing things, and I really like that!!

Proper tools and being proficient with them would gain you your proficiency bonus. You would need an additional factor to grant advantage.

When I described the short sword as "masterwork" I wasn't really referring to a mechanical benefit, more that it's obviously very well made, ornamented, and worth more money than a regular weapon. However, such weapons could very well be magical...

As for taking 10 and 20, you guys seem to have the same point of view, for well-articulated reasons. Happy to leave take 10 out entirely, but I'm considering using take 20 sometimes, just because if Jack sits there for 20 minutes (i.e. rolling 240 times) to pick the lock, he's going to get a 20. Taking 20 saves Jack having to actually roll until he gets the 20, which is pretty much a waste of his time, as it's going to happen.

That is, of course, unless we interpret things like Disable Device checks to pick locks as being similar to knowledge checks in PF, where a failed roll means you can't pick that particular lock, which was a 2e thing if I recall? You had to wait till next level to try, I think.

From a realism point of view (not the best perspective much of the time for RPGs, I know), I pick locks myself, and sometimes I can pick a particular lock in 10 seconds, sometimes the same lock can take me 3 or 4 minutes, so I don't really favour that idea... This time around I'm going to let Jack pick it (DC 20) without rolling to save time, but I'm happy to go with however you guys want to do it in the future.

I think if there's no consequences for failing a check, and the mods a PC has make the check possible, and out of combat, then rolling shouldn't be required...just time.

Some of the published official 5e modules have things built into the trap or lock description to get around this philosophy. For example, they will add a contingency that if you fail the check DC by 5 or more, s@@$ hits the fan. This makes the roll required.

Yeah that's a good mechanic to get around it. Maybe I'll allow taking 20 in certain benign situations, but do that kind of stuff in other situations...? Again, feel free to keep the discussion going, like I've said before, I'm pretty new to 5e, so keen to hear what you more experienced folks have to say.

I've put a spoiler on the campaign info page of rules changes and clarifications, as they stand. All of these are, at any time, up for discussion (currently, the Hitting Cover rule is still in limbo as far as I know). Also, feel free to suggest any other ideas you have, whether they're house rules or just helpful clarifications ahead of time. Please be active in helping create the game rules you feel comfortable with.

so this is all new to me. I've just nutted out what DMG meant so now i know what you are referring too. haha, complete noob.

I like the rules proposed, even the Hitting Cover rule which will ironically put the meat shield aka me, at more risk, but it makes sense somewhat.

Cleaving through crowds just sounds awesome for a big dam roll

Going to make that hit point roll Beerg? As Nilelane mentioned on the gameplay thread, for you it's 2d10+4. If you had any healing to burn before you rested, you should do that too.

Ahhh, yes, apologies. I thought FULL HD ie 2d10 + 4 meant we got 10's and didn't have to roll. I thought it was very generous. haha.

I actioned my remaining Lay on hands prior to rest to take me to 5hp
Here we go.

HP: 2d10 + 4 ⇒ (10, 7) + 4 = 21

YES!, back to Full HP

So Kraz has hit upon a way to (almost) ensure healing back to full hp if you have short rest HD left when you take a long rest. The downsides are that you need to spend an extra hour resting (usually not a problem, and in this case others were doing stuff anyway), but more importantly that you only recover half your short rest HD during a long rest. So Kraz goes into the new day with only 1 HD for short rests this time.

This definitely ups the difficulty a simdgeon during extended dungeon crawls, which was kind of the point of the rule. My intention was to add a slight 2e feel to the game.

Also Kraz, the poisoned condition wore off about an hour after you took the wounds from the poisoned weapons.

Ok so on a long rest we get our full hit die plus half of any unused short rest hd? He will still be at full hp just getting clarification.

No you did it right, you can take whatever short rest HD you have left over for a short rest, then your full HD for a long rest. But you only refresh half your short rest HD when you take the long rest, as per the usual rules. So going into the next day, you only have 1 HD for a short rest.

So Kraz, how many hp were you down before resting?

I took 17 damage. Got 10 out of my sleep hp's and 7 out of short rest so shoul dbe at full hp.

Yep, all good, I was just making sure you hadn't used any short rest dice you didn't need to. Carry on!

Sorry, there is a gaming convention here in my city this weekend. My posting has been slowed due to that. Thanks for the bot.

Hey folks, you've all been doing really well at working with the scenes as I've been describing them, I hope I've been giving you enough to envisage the cave complex well enough. I've just started getting into GIMP to make maps, so I'll make up a (probably fairly simple) map of the complex so far. I'll post a link in the capaign info tab and also at the top of the page soon.

Much like Kraz, im curious as well. It seems we have B-lined through this. From a mechanical point of view, I wonder if there is more we need to explore that may increase our level. From a character point of view, fighting drow at 2nd level is rather scary.

Your characters would have a sense that you have definitely not completed the job yet. The general sense was that the exploration would take a few days. Whether or not you want to complete it is entirely up to you guys.

There was the 3 holes in the ceiling we never explored. Nilelane got the rope down after our rest. Then there was the branching orc tunnels...we didn't explore those 100%, right? I think those would be gaps in our imaginary map were making.

There are areas to the north in the warren of tunnels that you've been going through as well as those three holes in the ceiling. There was also a branch you didn't explore right after leaving the holes-in-the-roof cavern.

Maybe we should search those places out before venturing into the water tunnel of doom.

Sorin would be perfectly ok heading back and making sure we explored all other avenues. We might even level again which would be nice.

Yeh, my thinking is the same. Explore behind us before we go in the 'water tunnel of doom'. potential level up is always handy too. plus we would be less likely to be ambushed from behind also.

Also, the mission brief was to map all the areas east of the door, so makes sense from that point of view also.

So that's my first dungeon map in GIMP Nilelane, no idea what I'm doing, but I nabbed a couple of tutorials and got some ideas for techniques. Colour scheme is horrible! Also, took about 6 hours! Just using this campaign as a fun excuse to learn how to do maps :)

So is the party turning for home base now?

Looks great imo, very clear. I just learn the tools as I come across them, don't need to master the entire software (I mean its college degree essentially). I had a bit of a head start with a background in astrophotography.

I'd vote to go back to town, mingle with folk and possibly copy spells or resummon familiar.

Okay, sounds like it's a majority, if not a consensus. Can I say, well-timed decision, things were about to get nasty. As it is... Let me get a post up in the gameplay thread.

Yeah, I think there was plenty of writing on the wall about the difficulty. I’m glad we’re stepping back to regroup.

We are going to check those areas we haven’t explored though. I’m also not opposed to checking out the rope up through the three holes.

Also happy to not go through the water, regroup and explore the rest of the tunnels before heading to town and reporting back.

Ok folks, so we've only really completed the first bit of this adventure so far, but I'd like to hear your feedback on how you're enjoying it, or what you're missing that you'd like to see more of. So I'd like to conduct a bit of a campaign audit. Below are some questions for you all to answer - you don't have to of course, but I'd like to know what you'd like in your game. So feel free to post your feedback here, openly or in a spoiler, or to PM me if you'd prefer. Anything from a sentence to a large paragraph for each one would be great. Please be honest, I'm pretty thick-skinned, and my main objective is providing a fun game for you all, and the best way for me to do that is to understand what you like in your game.

With all that said and done, here's the questions:

• How do you feel about the tempo of the game?
• What are some of the things (if any) that you're really enjoying about this campaign that you would like to see continue?
• What's missing, i.e. what would you like to see more of?
• What can I do to make the game more enjoyable for you?

Thanks in advance :)