To move this campaign along, I'm ruling that Lera didn't hear Richard claim that magic doesn't exist.
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Turn him into a newt! That'll teach him. ;)
To move this campaign along, I'm ruling that Lera didn't hear Richard claim that magic doesn't exist.
Using rationalizations to avoid confrontations...Some might call you Yella
To move this campaign along, I'm ruling that Lera didn't hear Richard claim that magic doesn't exist.Using rationalizations to avoid confrontations...Some might call you Yella
Yellow?
yeppers (yes)
Just wait until someone uses a fly spell in front of Richard.
Lera will eventually try defying gravity. ;)
Eventually a whole new physics will be created for 'magic'. And machines will replace witches. They will be stronger, faster, and cheaper. Undoubtedly the Lera-bot 3000 will be sleeker as well. :)
Starfinder is some months away yet. Don't spoil it
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Actually from what I've seen, (public information is not spoilers) magic and technology will mesh without one overshadowing the other lorewise.
Oh, I know. I am already vibrating with excitement at the prospect of playing a technomancer.
@Richard I edited when I spotted the GMs ruling here, on talking about Tech and science. I would really like Miya to be into what Richard is selling, I think it would add to game.
GM is there anyone, that could be possible. Magic is still real etc, but Miya would be interested on a piratical front.
As for star-finder, O yes, waiting to see, I wanted to see how they do Psionics, I loved TRAVELER for its Psions.
If they let in Ship to ship TP that would be great,
Psionics is already in the game as the Occult classes and psychic magic.
but magic in star finder is not done the same way, occult and psychic is just a magic list now, my hope is psionic will be the same.
i want a psion not a mind mage, its sifi after all
There's pure psionics in Starfinder? I thought it was magic and and technology.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
Clarke's law
I think Owen Stephens commented somewhere that the core rules will support psionics, but I'd have to find it.
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Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
Clarke's law
I'm familiar with Clarke's Third Law and I understand it. But I prefer to either have magitek (magic and tech combined) or have them work separately each with it's own rules and understanding.
A Wizard's burning hands spell and a mechanical flamethrower may seem similar to a peasant but they are certainly different in practice. The Wizard only needs spell components (and a sorcerer doesn't need those) whereas a flamethrower needs fuel and oxygen without exception.
Magic has its own rules and doesn't even need to follow them all the time. It dances around the edge of our understanding; allowing some knowledge but keeping us from full knowledge of its true workings. Only Nethys got a glimpse which turned him into an insane god.
Science, as those of us in the real world can attest, does not work this way. It is not a force in and of itself with a will of its own. It is simply the collected knowledge the human species has about the underpinnings of life, the universe, and everything.
This is why I generally do not care for works like early Agents of Shield that try to claim that all magic is just science we don't understand (very much untrue in-universe as they were forced to admit after Doctor Strange came out.) Magic is very much unlike science when you look past the surface.
P.S. I don't hate Richard for holding this belief. Characters don't have to always be right.
LOL
I'm not sure there is a 'Right' for fictional magic. To be fair, in a homebrew game. It is whatever the GM says it is.
on a personal level, I've read the works of Crowley and find the whole western occult magick fascinating.
LOL I'm not sure there is a 'Right' for fictional magic. To be fair, in a homebrew game. It is whatever the GM says it is.
True. I was just going off of Pathfinder Lore.
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BTW, Please don't let me discourage you or any player in engaging in a philosophical discussion with Richard in game. It's something I would enjoy writing. I just want to leave the objective truths about the world to the GM. But I will speculate IC about what those truths are all day long.
I can't wait to see Richard try to wrap his brain around the crazy sh!t Jolis will be able to accomplish in later levels.
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Clearly just Jolis using his superior intellect and mastery of mathematics to achieve seemingly impossible feats of physics.
I suppose the simplest way I would define magic as any force or effect which can alter the fundamental laws of reality. As Lera said, it's basically the difference between a flamethrower and burning hands.
The tricky part here being how one defines "Laws of reality."
Clearly just Jolis using his superior intellect and mastery of mathematics to achieve seemingly impossible feats of physics.
But if Magic is real then its laws are "Laws of Reality" too. The problem for the scientist is that they delight in contradicting the laws of nature and science and even its own laws.
A wizard may approach magic in a scientific matter. They experiment with various reagents to pull their magical energy and create a repeatable and useful effect.
Sorcery flies in the face of all of that by simply knowing all of the spells naturally without any experimentation and indeed breaking one of the rules of magic i.e. the need for material components.
Then there are the other magics which follow their own rules again.
Divine casters can turn faith into power with Druids, Hunters, and Rangers (and soon the new Shifter class that I am hyped about) turning respect for nature into potent magical force.
Psychic Casters channel the energy of the Astral Plane yet can go beyond what any other manifestation of the Astral Plane can do. For example, many of the high-level psychic spells can't be done by ghosts. The Psychic Bloodline Sorcerer further complicates these rules by taking "arcane" spells and using in the manner of psychic spells i.e. emotion and thought components replacing somatic and verbal components.
And none of this even touches the influence of the Gods. They can create effects outside even the rules of magic in Pathfinder. The obvious example is that of the miracle spell which can be as strong as a GM wishes. Certain Domains granting arcane spells implies that their patron deity is breaking the normal limits of divine casting for a particular servant of theirs.
But let's examine another facet of this line of thinking: the Witch's Patron. Normally a wizard can't cast healing magic as it is the domain of divine magic. A witch can cast healing magic without even taking the Healing Patron.
Magic in Pathfinder is messy and ill-defined. It laughs at efforts to define it and give it consistency. Its users are able to wield it reliably without truly understanding it. Previous attempts to truly understand the underpinnings of magic have led to insanity or death.
This is incompatible with the philosophy of science that Richard so passionately believes in and why his dismal of magic, though arrogant, is understandable. Magic is fundamentally opposed to everything a scientist believes in. Perhaps that may explain his failure to wield it as a mage does despite his success at alchemy which is inherently magical. This slight hypocrisy is an interesting character trait of Richard's and don't think Lera won't notice it.
When I think about this subject, I start from the point that. I reality "Magic" is not real, it only lives as a constructed idea in the minds of humans. Be it faith magic, UFO magic, supernatural or any from. It only lives in the stories we tell, ourselves or others. Luck magic no matter how many house shoes you buy is all in your head.
From that being said, human crafted fiction is wide and deep. Each fantasy reality out wee brains craft, can habe it's own form and logic to magic.
This is unlike use of the scientific method in reality. Hydregen is still hydrogen no matter how you may wish it to be other wise.
This is where there can be a miss match, this magic world for all he knows could all be in his head. As an imperial scientist me may be going around with that as being one of the explanation for what is going on. But that is just one explanations, he may and should hold more. Waiting for evidence to exclude or include each and every one.
So I have no problem with the PC holding many views on this matter.
Don't get me started on 'gods'. There is only one absolute undeniable truth...existence exists. Whether Existence has consciousness or not is an answer that establishes a persons belief in a monotheistic God. Whatever the answer. The little 'g' gods are nothing but posers. Richard shoots a look at Jolis.
Jolis takes a sip from his tankard.
We'll see, Richard. We'll see.
Are you sure you don't want to change your class from Godling to Poserling? :P
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What? And loose my racial bonus to macking on hot maidens? Never!
I can't speak for everyone, but I'm ready to see how we function as a team in combat
Me too. Having both a bard and a skald in the party! That's fricking awesome!
Don't get me started on 'gods'. There is only one absolute undeniable truth...existence exists. Whether Existence has consciousness or not is an answer that establishes a persons belief in a monotheistic God. Whatever the answer. The little 'g' gods are nothing but posers. Richard shoots a look at Jolis.
"'Monotheistic?' The Hells you on about? There are several Major Gods, multiple demigods, and other Divine creatures able to grant divine magic to followers in exchange for faith. For a genius, you're kind of an idiot."
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Jolis gives a small smile and shakes his head.
Gods! This is NEVER gonna end!
Ah, the winning debate move...calling the other person an idiot. Masterful.
Well if the +5 boots of stupidity fit, wear 'em :P
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I can't with your feet in them...Bam, I win. Man, I can't believe I wasted so much time on an education. Winning is so easy now.
Resorting to my tactics proves me the better debater. I accept your apology and surrender.
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Richard rummages around an imaginary bag on his hip. He pulls out something and throws it at Lera. You're an Idiot His hand drops down to the imaginary bag again, and he is posed like a gunfighter ready to draw.
I have a whole bag of 'You're an idiot', and I'm not afraid to use them. He patiently waits, and every time Lera opens her mouth...He fires another, drowning out anything she starts saying. Relentlessly he fires one after another until she gives up talking.
Truly Richard, you are a master 'bater and a cunning linguist.
Looks on as the other chatter. She is playing with a butterfly.
She says.
"Gods Are Like Stars, Born Dying"
And runs about chasing the butterfly.
I added the roll20 link to the header. Miya and Grelda, I need you to post there so I know who assign your tokens to
I did under spugly
Posted now.
Alright, thank you. My next post will be coming later tonight, as I have to do a bit of prep work (and also, just work).
FYI: For those who might be interested, Wayfinder #17 is out! My newest article is found on page 32.
Check it out (Free download): HERE.
cool, what's the article about?
Well the issue's theme is 'The last 5 years of Paizo' so most of the articles have something to do with an AP that came out in the last five years. Mine is based on Giantslayer.
THe article itself is a unique combat style feat, and follow up feats, created for the strange Order of the Peacock Spirit (Wizard-Monks).
Very interesting fluff but I think it would make the Monk MADder than he already is.
The Thassilonian virtues/sins thing is very cool. Are they feats? If so, what kind?