I'm camping with my family, siblings, parents, and their families this week so little-to-no internet. I'll be quite slow if posting at all until next Sunday.
Was meaning to get a post up over weekend but weekends are slow. Have fun campaign!
Okay, I have gone ahead and read my way up-to-date on the strength of Túrion's account. I'll post something later.
Sorry for slow posts lately. I have been greatly distracted by a matter involving a leaky window well and mold in the wall of my finished basement. I think I've got a handle on that now, or at least I know what I'm doing about it.
In unrelated news, I'm about 48 episodes into an actual play podcast of Curse of the Crimson Throne by Sugar-Fuelled Gamers, a group in New Zealand. The GM'ing is masterful. I've been enjoying it immensely and learning a ton from listening to it. If any of you have a few hundred spare hours of listening time, be sure to check out episode 1.
Ooh. I'm intrigued by the sound of a decent PF 1e podcast.
They're actually running it under heavily homebrewed 3.5 rules. But don't let that stop you, it's still excellent.
Gonna have to pass on that - too little time on my hands as-is - but thank you for the recommendation.
I think the plan is: we go there, buff up, teleport in and start hitting people. Right? So unless anyone else has a cunning plan, I propose we declare buffs and go in.
Mel has Protection from Evil today, plus I can activate my Protection blessing to give myself a +1 sacred bonus to AC and saves. Both of those last one minute.
Other than that I don't bring anything in particular to the buffing party. But if anyone has leftover damage from previous shenanigans, Mel would be happy to heal you.
Kind of, I'll adapt my daily spells tomorrow when I'll also have more time to post. I may need some healing, yeah - not exactly sure where I stand with HP due to time passed, but I assume around 12 from regen plus sleep for a total of 21 or so would be correct.
That sounds right, Turion.
Yes, Melia. I'm just waiting for you guys to say that/how you approach the building.
Hey guys, just a heads up, I'll be out of town this week starting Tuesday for a week long camping trip. I'll try to post tomorrow what preparations Fyrtor makes, otherwise have Mel bot me as needed.
I went ahead and assumed that Mel would patch me up to full, or maybe Fyrtor could have done so before rest, even.
I also locked in todays initial assortment of spells.
When we are ready to enter, I would pre-buff with Invisibility and Heightened Perception on Túrion, and Shield + Mirror Image on Nelly.
Then a Haste enhanced by Potent Spell(for a total of 11 rounds), directly followed by dimension-dooring inside the complex with everybody.
I'd expect others to align their short-term buffs so that they are ready to go at that point.
EDIT: Prior to all that, a "Message" linking all of us, of course. With the long duration, that's the first one to go online.
Prior to going in Hal will be casting
Cast Mage Armor (if more than 8 hours. Uses a pearl) +4 AC 8h
Cast False Life (CL 8) 8h
Cast Tears to Wine (CL 9, burns a belt charge) and offer around. +5 enhancement to int and wis skills (e.g. perception) for 90m
Cast Bit of Luck (CL 8) 4 luck points for 80 mins.
JUST before going in
Vanish (CL 8, charge from rod of extend) 10 rounds
I will mark off one use of Healer's Hands for the day to get Túrion up to full. Here's the roll for that -- I can no longer fail the basic DC 20, but there are benefits for hitting DC 30.
Yay, it's the good one. Túrion gets (5*HD)+9 hit points back, so 54. That covers both lethal and non-lethal damage. He also recovers 4 ability score damage if he happens to have any.
I seem to have Barkskin at CL 7 through a concoction Fyrtor made. I think I may down that before going in as well, on the theory that I can probably get him to make me another one tomorrow.
I'm just waiting for you guys to say that/how you approach the building.
As for how we approach the building, I don't think I have a clear enough picture of the place to answer that. It's in the basement of a sailmaker's shop, apparently. Khaz and Fyrman went to scout it out a little, got distracted by their fight with two of the Harrick sisters, and then left the area to rejoin the party. So we don't know much else about it, really. I don't think we know how many doors it's got or whether the sailmaker's people are in on it.
In the absence of more specific information, I figure we could go cast our buff spells some place nearby, maybe an alley or some such, and then Janus can just try to dimension door us in based on dead reckoning.
Aye, I totally forgot about those.
So, yeah, Greater Magic Fang and Barkskin for Nelly, as well.
As for where to enter, what Mel said. Get close enough, even to the forward observation post, to buff up, then randomly aim for the basement of the locale - since we have no plans, no more exact planning is possible.
My assumption was that if we would aim for a solid space, we'd get shunted to a free space as close as possible (which I see from the description is not RAW for DD). If your interpretation is "truly random location within 100 feet sphere" and there is a sewer system in place that prevents us from aiming deeper, I would first use Clairvoyance for "obvious" locale: basement of the place, then visualize that for the DD.
As for how we approach the building, I don't think I have a clear enough picture of the place to answer that. It's in the basement of a sailmaker's shop, apparently. Khaz and Fyrman went to scout it out a little, got distracted by their fight with two of the Harrick sisters, and then left the area to rejoin the party. So we don't know much else about it, really. I don't think we know how many doors it's got or whether the sailmaker's people are in on it.
I thought it was the building Harold used Insect scouts on? If so, while we're out of the normal duration, I think that means we have a reasonable idea of the layout from that.
If not, then Harold would prepare one of his scrying spells (say Clairvoyance) instead of Major Image and use that just prior to going in to scout the way. It is risky - high level characters might well spot the scrying sensor and deprive us of surprise - but better than insufficient information on layout and has the advantage we would know where the targets are.
Nope, you scouted the linen shop, this is a sailmaker.
As for your scrying, not sure it would help - as I have to visualize the target for the dimension door, I kind of assume I have to be the one to scry.
@Spotted: Well, going in the front door also won't give us surprise, and they'll be more prepared for us, so at the least, we should be able to foil any plans they had - also, we don't have to go in RIGHT after scrying, if that is needed. We can take, say, 11 minutes and 17 seconds, THEN jump in. Even if they sounded the alarm, it's likely they will not be able to remain on high alert for a prolonged time before our sudden entry turns back into a surprise...(that, and they may believe it was diversionary tactic so they withdraw people from the main entrance, and reinforce the main expecting an attack there all the more-)
Dimension door can be cast with direction and distance, I believe.
If it is a different shop then Clairvoyance's "obvious or familiar location" will kick in - though I hope an obvious location is 'on the other side of this wall' or similar. Sensor can't be moved, but can be rotated. DC 23 to observe.
It CAN be cast with direction and distance, but read above.
The problem with that is that if the exact location we are targeting does not contain sufficient open space, say, because it contains a wall between 2 rooms, then we get shunted to, per the spell, a RANDOM open space within 100 feet. That may be one of the two adjancent rooms, that may be the roof, a sewer that is not even connected, a walled-off room in the basement of a different building, or their prison holding cell.
Since we have no idea about the layout, it seemed risky to eyeball it with this method - hence why I brought up first trying to place a scrying sensor that gets to be placed by intent, then port based on the information from it to 'home in' on a valid room.
If due to water levels from the harbor an underground sewer system is not valid in this part of the city, then it could be solved by simply aiming 100 feet below the building, so that the only valid locations within the 100 feet square are, in effect, the sublevels of said building - we'd accept to be shunted with minor damage in that case, but it would spare me the scrying.
Ah, same page then. Yeah, scrying sensor to find an area and then knowledge engineering to convey direction and distance.
Is Túrion going to be able to cover everyone with DD? It is 1+CL/3 isn't it? Could potentially try to sneak Hal in using a different spell and then report coordinates using Message.
It's 4 people per, yes. I fully expected to need to make 2 trips.
One with Kazador, Nelly, and you, then a second load with Mel and Fyrtor, preferably into a flanking position.(based on visual Data from the first trip.)
(That assumes Nelly remains reduced for indoor-fighting) - Unfortunately, we are still Level 9 - next level I could cover an extra person by spending a reservoir point, and it would make sense for you to sneak in differently, but we'd be missing one person that way.
(I did consider providing someone with good Sneak, say Mel, with Invisibility and have her go in differently, but I am relatively certain they will have precautions against invisible foes, at least at some chokepoint near the entrance.
(That said, I do hope for a surprise round(port back), winning Init, then porting back in time to have everybody there for round 1 even if we meet immediate resistance.
Hmmm. If Harold is aware of this he can kludge a dimension door together. It'll take a lot, but he can do it. He could take 3 people, and it'll take 4 full rounds.
We could all then head in together.
Is that a worth while idea, or overthinking it?
Also, if clairvoyance doesn't worrk, so long as the walls are less than 1 ft stone he should be able to get an x-ray glimpse inside.
Can you do it repeatedly?
The way you phrased it makes it seem like it would be strenuous to do it multiple times - point being: if something goes wrong in there, or I am disabled by some obscure luck, we may need an alternate exit strategy - which you could provide in that case. I hope we won't need that, but it would be good to have the option.
That said, it also seems desirable to go in simultaneously, and with fewer wasted spell slots.
The sailmaker's shop was not observed closely but cursory observation indicates that it is a 1-level building of modest size with one door, one window, and staff in there during business hours such as this. The shop is about one block from the docks.
Turion, I think you answered your own question but I'll be explicit: DDing to a solid object means getting shunted to a random open space within 100 ft. Not necessarily the closest.
The location of the shop means there probably are a few sewers nearby, though not necessarily within 100 ft. It's hard to say without a more thorough survey.
Aye, I did answer my question, but I think there is room for table variance.
Say I envision my living room and want to go there, expecting to come in near my dinner table - but someone moved a chair and now there is a solid object in the way - do I get randomly shunted to some neighbour, or simply appear in my living room next to the chair.
If we all cuddle up really close to each other and squeeze into one 5-foot square, does that mean we need less space in the target location?
The modus I always operated under with this was that there is a certain "search" area where the spell attempts to place you - say I want to escape pursuit in a forest and jump 1000 feet forward, but there is a very slight incline ahead - do I run the risk of porting into the ground and getting shunted, or ending up on a tree, or worse, between trees and falling, if I get the math wrong?
The other way round as well - if we form a big circle that basically ensures we won't fit into a sewer pipe, could we avoid shunting there by taking up more room - or, say, if we start out on stairs, thus have a height difference larger than a normal rooms ceiling, can we brute-force arriving in a stairs-like location as well because only those match our initial pattern?
Basically, I think it is up to GM how "fuzzy" the logic on this is, but it's necessary to know so we can work around it - as there certainly is a way to achieve what we want, but we'll need to know how to minimize risk for unwanted outcomes.
You know, we COULD send some earth elementals to survey the place and give us a rough mapping of the sublevel. But I didn't get to learn their language yet, and I only have comprehend languages, not tongues. If someone else could instruct them to spend a few rounds scouting, then return and provide a swift sketch...
Oh! So getting into the shop isn't the challenge, it's that we assume that's just the tip of the iceberg. I had entirely the wrong idea.
Fyrtor will cast hightened awareness, barkskin and pack empathy. 2 people get empathy with Fyrtor, I'd pick Mel and let her pick the third since she'll be hitting me.
Otherwise all non italicized spells should be good to go and the concoction slots as noted.
DD seems to target based on intent so I rule it as reasonably within the bounds of that intent. If your DD target has a chair in the way, one of you might appear tottering on the chair but it wouldn't result in shunting everyone. If someone had moved a big stack of crates so that they pretty much completely occupied where you wanted to go, then you would get shunted. Make sense?
@Turion: Hal can't do it repeatedly, and it costs 2 slots to do it at all.
I also see there is a risk we DD into a closed off cavern or something, and need to use DD to get out.
If we're blind jumping then I'd prefer Turion jumps in with someone robust, and (A) if the location is good, come back for the others or (B) we either give up or rest there for the night and prep.
That said...
After Turion drops his 'I wish someone could summon an elemental' comment.
"Hmmm. How long can ya hold ya breath? I've got an elemental gem that... well, I've got one. Swallow that and ya should be able ta move like they do. I reckon I could empower it for..." the old man scratches his beard "A minute or so? Ya move slow, though. Like swimmin' through treacle. I've never been game ta use it - heard horror stories about people who were underground when it ran out." the old man shivers "But I guess you could just use your magic ta come back. Might even be able ta take someone in with ya when ya glide, save on trips, if you've got a big enough bag a' holdin'."
"Then y'd be able to find a spot, come back and take us in." he winces "If I'm empowerin' the gem though, I'm not goin' ta be able to step through the 'Market ta get in."
Uh, this is the Discussion thread, Hal. You don't need to talk in character here. ^_^;
Targeting the DDoor is complicated by the fact that we know almost nothing about the internal layout of the place. I believe Rollinsby mentioned that it has a basement, and we know it has one window and one door. GM, are those on the same side of the building?
Matters are further complicated because Túrion at CL 9 can only move four creatures: himself and three others. We have six:
- Kazador
- Fyrtor
- Hal
- Túrion
- Nelly
- Mel
Túrion probably needs to take Nelly with him, as he's the only one who can direct her effectively.
So how about this?
1. We go to a nearby alley or similar.
2. We buff up.
3. Túrion Dimension Doors in with Nelly, Kazador and Fyrtor. They target the ground floor of the building. We don't know about internal walls, but we have a fair idea where the rooms must be based on the shape of the building, whereas we don't know how deep underground the basement is or if it extends under only part of the building or whatever. Once inside, they start kicking butt and taking names.
4. Mel and Hal travel in a more mundane manner: we book it for the front door when the others dimension door. We will use Rollinsby's key to get in and join the fight. Hopefully with the benefit of Haste we can get there in a round or two.
This has the advantage that Mel and Hal can intercept anyone trying to escape through the front door.
We have to assume they have other hidden exits. What self-respecting den of thieves would have just one exit? I think I'll go use Mel's other 1st level spell for the day to maybe get some info about those. Maybe that'll work out. If not we'll just have to wing it.
@Mel: True - sorry.
Mel's plan could work too, and has the advantage of simplicity.
If we can capture someone and get them to talk about any basement levels we might find out how to get down more easily.
Hmm - if the building is open for business, couldn't we just walk in the front door?
Since they are holding evidence there, and kind of expecting action, I'm afraid that anything we do that does not surprise them may result in said evidence being destroyed if they suspect anything fishy.
@Combination: If making 2 trips, I would have suggested the teams to be Kazador/Nelly/Hal on the first, and Túrion/Mel/Fyrtor in the second set.
It would eat 3 of my 5 level 4 spells, but could be worth it to secure evidence.
However, I would like to make another suggestion: What if Hal, invisibly, used Earth Glide to make his way into the basement, then relaying coordinates so we can make a targeted jump with me, Nelly, Kazador and Mel.
In the mean time, invisible Fyrtor could keep watch over the exit to see if someone flees - while keeping him 'busy' and safe while the player is camping - then if he returns, he can have made his way inside while invisible(or I'll pick him up).
(Alternatively, trying to see if we happened to have a bag of holding where we could transport someone, I saw that Túrion does have a Scroll of Earth Glide listed in treasure. I suspect I did not copy it into spell book back then because I had no level 4 spell slots and no spare change to afford the process - I think I still lack mundane funds which is why not everything was copied yet, but I could still use the scroll on someone, meaning nobody would be left behind even on a single DD.
Well, if you're looking for copying ink, say hello to Harold "My primary job is supplier spell components and magical link" Donaldson!
Hmmm. Technically if you give the scroll to Hal before he memorises he might be able to learn it - depends what tradition it is. Probably not.
Technically there's no reason Hal can't Earth glide... but if it goes wrong he's screwed, which makes him nervous. Remember it is Earth Glide OR DD. He'd do it though, if he gets some assurance.
Hal does have a teeny bag of holding he keeps his books in.
It feels like we've been chasing our tails in circles for a bit now. We're not going to have a perfect plan; I think we need to settle on one of our options and move forward.
Hey guys, sorry for the delay, I'm back now though life's been a bit busy. New babies tend to shake things up a bit. I just want to point out that Kazador can DD as well. If he and Turion both go in we have twice the ability to jump back out of things go sideways.
I'm fine with whatever else we want to try.
Hrm. That's true. Between Túrion and Kazador we could get everyone inside in one fell swoop.
I am eager to kick this off.
New babies are a special kind of fun/stress. :) Best of luck!
I also want to kick this off. I need answers to my question in gameplay. Ideally, I'd hear from everybody but I'm ok with somebody speaking for the group.
Traveling next week. Will be able to post, but anything with maps will be difficult.
Aye, lets do it as we planned - me and Hal can Clairvoyance the locations basement so that we have a target for DD.
Then me AND Hal can DD in with everybody.
If we need a fast exit, me and Kaz can DD out.
(Kaz for the 'out' because he can't visualize the target location, but can get us back towards the location from where we departed.)
That way, we will bypass the initial defense, all go in together, nobody loses rounds, and we still have an emergency exit.
Sounds good?
Agreed. Let's kill it!
Look, any of these plans could work.
The issue with clairvoyance is that the sensor is static. On the other hand we could cast it more than once. I think the question here is how confident we can be in where the basement/tunnel would be, which might be an engineering check?
The disguise plan has the issue that they might have some form of immediate action they can take. If they go with that plan Hal will knock up a one off 'generic grubby man' disguise that fits with his greater magic (fake) aura.
Given I'm new, I don't want to be the one who makes the call!
Static sensor is no issue imho. We only need a visual of the area surrounding it - no full map of the layout - after all, the only purpose is to avoid getting shunted off-target - that would even work in pitch black conditions.
And since it can be targetted by clear definition("obvious one"), the basement level of the structure should be on point without any checks needed.
Let's get our mid-to-long term buff spells on, cast one or more clairvoyances, and then we'll have more information for our final deployments.
Note: I may be in-and-out of availability for the next couple days. I'm driving to Minneapolis for a wedding. And back afterwards, of course.
Enjoy! My sister and her family live in Minneapolis. It's a great city.
Sorry for the typo. I have to stop editing to fix little issues. I always seem to make it worse.
Question for all of you: How do you fee about switching from Google slides to roll20 for this game's maps? The main appeal for me as a GM is the smooth fog of war feature. Some of the other features are fairly helpful too. In the past 8 months or so, I've switched to using it for all my other PBPs I run and I quite like it but I don't want to switch if it will disrupt anyone's playing experience.
I haven't had the best experience with roll20, but if it helps our GM, then it's good for me. You do the heavy lifting, afterall.
Also, for dimension door, I think that I can bring up to 3 people. Who wants to come with me? Could do Fyrtor (he can stab people) and Hal (can he stab people?) while Turion and Mel come in behind us.
I didn't used to like it, but in the first Lockdown almost all my RL games moved to it. Once I got past the learning curve I found it pretty good, so I'm fine with it.
Two questions though:
1. do we track status (like hp) on here or on roll20?
2. do we move our tokens, or do we tell you (Brookside GM) and then you move them?
Either works, but some games answer this differently, and it can lead to confusion.
Roll20 is not my first choice of VTT, but it's perfectly suitable for this purpose, and I don't mind using it.
Considering this game is asynchronous, I'm inclined to think allowing us to move our own tokens makes sense.
And I think it makes sense to track our HP etc here -- keep the mechanics in one place and use Roll20 just for tactical positioning.
I don't think Hal is really a stabby-stab sort of person. So I'm inclined to think Kazador and Fyrtor first, as the melee-oriented types, with casters/ranged in the second wave.