Aye, but there's also mature ways to work around that.
Maybe the spell does not actually force them into service, but rather allows them to return for a limited time if willing.
Or Brolins version actually calls wispy servants doing that akin to the classic unseen servants - not crewing the vessel with corpses but rather the memories of sailors returning for a brief glimpse into the world of mortals.
*shrug*
As long as it's mechanically identical, I'm certain one could find a way that lets it work without the flavor offending a party member.
^_^
A reflavored version of the spell would work fine. Perhaps treating it as a more advanced, specialized version of Unseen Servant: no souls involved, just force of magic and the caster's will.
Aye...the original spell needs corpses as targets - probably an economic reason to prevent mages from simply crewing ships entirely with free labor.
But I think it could still work, with the overall flavor of the captain - in that he allows the memories of sailing linger in the form of unseen servants. No souls involved, no undead, but the spirits "draw" their expertise from the left-behind memories of the departed while fading away over the course of a few days - maybe they even have a resemblance to their original versions, but with no more than a memory of sailing, that is all they can do, as there is no fragment of soul lingering behind that would give them free will nor are they animated by necromantic energies that give them 'independent existence' and the ability to follow more orders.
They are purpose-bound willing magical spirits drawing upon lingering memories for their skill.
(so as to keep the mechanical aspect of targeting identical)?
Would that seem acceptable to Mel?
Agreed that reflavoring could work as long as it doesn't make the spell more useful. So corpses still required.
Good thoughts, Kazador. We've got a good group with no selfish jerks to throw things awry. The dwarven loot question is very likely to be a practical one if you guys succeed at this quest! XD
GM, does the elf ship we've captured have a longboat? Maybe we should take that and hide the ship somehow?
Idk if that's possible, but maybe? Meta, Turion has a rod of extend spell (I didn't read your background, just the build) and Brolin can cast pretty much any wizard/cleric spell of level 3 or lower I believe.
Just how far from Kazad Gravr are we, anyway? I seem to recall that we were just a few miles from it, but I'm doubting my recollection now.
You misread then, Fyrtor. While Turion has Rods, extend is not among them.
However, I realized that I do have a bookkeeping mistake. The one you likely mistook is the Persistent Rod...which I have listed as 3000, while it IS valued at 9000.
A conundrum. I have not, of course, made use of it yet - but defer to GM for resolvement. Should I keep it and my 'share' of treasure is simply lower? Swap it out for one of the cheaper rods? Remove it from my inventory for now and find it in the Ruins?
(or mayhaps the so-far unclaimed staff was indeed a Rod? *gg*)
@Mel: I think it's also about keeping the Ship save and use it to move back, which is easier if the ship is "with" us, not anchored in orcish wilderness miles from us.
Ah yeah. I read the persistent as extend, my mistake.
Is it even equipped with oars? We don't have anyone who can generate wind the way the original owners were, and in the absence of wind that just happens to always be blowing the direction we want to go, we're all going to be singing "row, row, row your boat".
Well you can sail a ship into the wind just not directly, how closely into the wind is dependent on how the ship is, but a decent ship should be able to point fairly close to into the wind. That said sailing a ship in a small river is not generally done, especially with something that would be seaworthy, the draft would be too deep.
Tacking requires lots of open room. Here's a diagram. It just won't work on a river, alas.
If you noticed how small the eleven ship is, you might anticipate that my question is no to the longboat. It's a small caravel and doesn't have oars. The river is indeed prohibitively narrow to tack into the wind.
You are only about six miles from Kazad Gravr, though.
Turion, is the conundrum that you have a rod in your inventory that you can't afford, given your other purchases? If so, I would simply remove it and adjust your gold back up to what it should be without it. Perhaps you'll find one later. ;) No promises.
You can cut closer to the wind than 45 degrees in a decent ship, and as long as the wind isn't directly upriver you could, with great skill and patience beyond what we have available, work your way slowly upriver assuming your draft allows. Either way it's probably not going to be an option for us. Hence I asked if they had a longboat.
That said this does offer another interesting option. We could move the ship into the middle of the river and scuttle it. If we did we would be out of a ship, but it would prevent another ship from coming up river. Magic aside it would be a nightmarish task to remove a sunken ship if you were traveling in another seaworthy ship.
GM, what time of the day is it now?
~16:00.
Oh, is that all? I thought it'd be dusk by this time.
Exactly, yes, I mispriced it at 3000 Gold, but since it is a +2 Modifier, it is clearly among the 9000 Gold ones, leaving a 6k Gold difference.
Which is unfortunate because I have nothing else of that much value that I could forgo, only the cloak of resistance +2 at 4k comes even close, but I can't fit the remaining 2k in.
I suppose I may have looked at both Bouncing and Persistent, then picked at wrong price.
That said, I would probably have taken a different rod instead.
Probably Authoritative, Bouncing, or Focused.
Guess Focused it is.
That said, Persistent is a tool that gives a lot of reliability, and allows lower-level spells to maintain competitive for quite a bit longer. I would appreciate a chance to re-gain such a Rod in-game in the future :)
We'll see what we find, Turion. I do like giving people tailor-made items now and again when I think of something fun. E.g. the ring of gravity bow Mel still hasn't used. XD
Alright, GM is getting antsy to keep the action moving forward. I love letting the party talk and deliberate but it often ends up taking days or weeks IRL to settle on something as people talk through all the dimensions of a question.
Next two players to voice the same opinion in gameplay decide our course of action by the rule of two! The PBP rule of two. Not the Sith rule of two instituted by Darth Bane in the Old Canon. 1/10 of a Hero Point rounded down for whoever gets this without googling. ;)
There can only be two -- one master, and one apprentice.
Except that sometimes there's only one master on account of the apprentice killed the former master and hasn't yet had an opportunity to recruit a fresh apprentice.
Ok, I can be persuaded to sleep, but I think we should trek the 6 miles today, speed will be in our favor I think. I don't mean to be contrary, I just think that that is for the best.
If we aren't going to scuttle the ship the best we can do is leave it there and hope to hurry back.
How long do we expect to have to stay in Kazad Gravr? I know plans change, but if nothing went awry (not likely) when could we be back here?
No idea what awaits us in Kazad Gravr. Kazador and the GM are the only ones who know anything about it.
No idea what awaits us in Kazad Gravr. Kazador and the GM are the only ones who know anything about it.
So I'm not the only one in the dark then, that makes me feel...better I guess? lol
Also, not a big fan of scuttling - it would take time and effort for probably little effect - where they can either bypass it or frontally breach through in a ramming maneuver for little damage to the hull.
Plus if it remains seaworthy, it's an easy way downriver towards the Sonder.
Also, not a big fan of scuttling - it would take time and effort for probably little effect - where they can either bypass it or frontally breach through in a ramming maneuver for little damage to the hull.
Plus if it remains seaworthy, it's an easy way downriver towards the Sonder.
Well I'm not saying that it's the best idea out there, cause it does mean looking a lot of loot, but scuttling doesn't have to be hard. Basically if we just anchor the ship in the middle of this very narrow river and punch a few holes in it below the waterline it will sink whike we leave to go do other things. The river is a treatcherous place to be moving any ship near this size and scuttling to block rivers is a historicaly used tactic. The river is so narrow you aren't going to be able to just go around it with a ship of similar size. That said history didn't have wizards who can blow stuff up or teleport so it doesn't really compare.
In the end how effective it would be would be up to the GM.
Gee, if we had Control Water we could just flood the ship until it sinks -- and then unflood it the same way when we got back.
Ah, well.
Well, be the time we get back I likely will have control water, and if we are careful how we damage the ship it shouldn't be too hard to repair. Breathing water is trival. Hmmmm...
That is what I meant. It's basically established that you NEED magic to navigate the river. So if a ship makes it there, we should assume they HAVE magic. That would let you do lots of things such as strafe to the side of the river and inch forward narrowly avoiding stranding.
Or just rushing over the sunken ship full speed with a readied action of casting make whole. Or summon some maritime creatures that smash a path free. Or move earth below the sunken vessel. Or Elven vessls may have a shallow-draft hull designed for speed that allows navigation in waters only one meter deep and permits arbitrary beach landings(as per longships), and they don't really care about a scuttled ship all that much(because they can move over it or close to the river sides)
Just saying I doubt we should invest the time to place, anchor and sink it...if no one pursues, we are basically just sinking a valuable asset for nothing. If someone pursues, they will have access to powerful magic and likely be able to bypass it easily or recklessly.
Sound logic for sure.
Any PC who makes it back from Kazador Gravr will definitely be level 8, Fyrtor. No worries there.
Ah good, Mel. So you've received Darth Bane? Not that one would need to to know the general gist of the rule of two. But I love the origin story.
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Listen, it would take a pretty damn cool light saber to get Mel to turn to the Dark Side.
(Purple, please.)
Listen, it would take a pretty damn cool light saber to get Mel to turn to the Dark Side.
(Purple, please.)
But what if it was a light saber bow...
Then it would have to make "pew pew pew" noises.
So, I gotta say this, just hit 12400, on seedship, though I average around 8000 :/
Wow, that's pretty good. Hey, we're both online. Wanna have a conversation?
I got very lucky. Cosmic enlightenment, apparently it's a thing. I'd love do a conversation, but I'm supposed to be asleep now lol. Isualy the best times for me are between 10am and 3pm MST.
Ah well, some other time.
I just got a Seedship score of zero. Take that!
I've done that too lol
I'm opposed to 1 encounter in a day for game balance reasons. So have fun getting used to working together as a party and not becoming a snack. ;)
Oh, I totally agree with the multiple encounter a day thing - in one other game we went up from Level 4 to Level 6 because we had to push on without rest...as in, gained 1.5 levels in a single, long, day.
I only object to the participants being largely not vulnerable to my current loadout :)
(plus I swapped out Haste for Suggestion after the previous battle, in case the party would have decided not to bring me along...*whistles innocently*)
Luckily, I can still contribute in a way, I hope. Well, Nelly. Here's hoping lady luck smiles on her - she'll at least eat up the AoO on approach considering it's dumb as can be. If lucky, more than that :P
I pre-posted for her turn as she gets her instructions from me, even if she executes them later. Mostly because I am not certain how much longer I will be awake :)
Also, the Touch AC is abysmal, so next round I'll try and scorch it.(I did not point that out in-game, but considering the size of the target, I think it's not a surprise...)
What natural dangers would Kazador know about?
Without spoiling too much of course
Well, this is a bit aside from the action, but is there anything in the loot pile that anyone is particularly interested in? I might enjoy a dagger, and mane one of the rings, but I'm not hard set on anything. We should be able to outfit Alrgric and Jelian better now as well hopefully.
+1 chain shirt
+1 dagger x 2
Normal daggers
Mwk composite longbow +2 str
Mwk whip
Belt of +2 dex Algric-Archers love these, unless a PC needs it
Boots of elvenkind
Mwk thieves tools
Cloak of the manta ray
Keg of black powder
Magnifying glass
Spyglass
Normal sap, garotte, and rapier.
Ring of sustenance Casters gets preference
Ring of protection +1 Algric wouldn’t say no
Ring of ferocious action
+1 greatsword
+1 keen shortsword
There are several things in there that Mel could benefit from. The DEX belt in particular, as she doesn't have a belt yet.
But she's deeply conflicted about the morality of using gear from slain opponents. I don't think she wants any of it.
But...they’re dead. Because they tried to kill us. Why not use them?
Fyrtor's a nice guy, but pragmatic, I'd like one of the daggers, maybe the ring of sustanance and the boots as well.
Fyrtor should take the ring of protection too. I don’t think he has one
Okay, so, these particular batches of loot came from the pirates and the Concordat ship.
The pirates were known criminals. They attacked people at sea and stole their stuff. Mel doesn't like people who do that. Which makes her keenly aware that what we did was seek out the pirates, attack them, and ultimately kill every last one except Captain van Beem. So, having done that, if she takes their stuff, then she's done the exact same thing that they did: attack and kill people at sea in order to take their stuff. It would make her exactly the same as the pirates.
As for the Concordat ship, that one's more personal to Mel. We were already in conflict with the Concordat, and they started it. Mel would ordinarily be fine with taking and using their stuff. She's currently wearing an Amulet of Natural Armor +1 she got from the orcs who attacked Brookside, and the Boots of Haste and Cloak of Elvenkind that came from Alric the Slow.
But -- the Concordat elves are her people. She hates the fact that she's fighting her own people. Using their stuff, wearing it, would be a constant reminder that she's a traitor. Hence she hasn't used that Ring of Continuous Gravity Bow that she's had since the middle of last July: it came from one of her people, whom she killed. The fact that he was trying to kill her doesn't make it feel any better.
I see. I applaud you sticking to character! Especially with that ring. 1d8->2d6 is no joke! We’ll need to have a discussion about this IC sometime
I have a ring of protection already so I place no claim there.