Haha. Fair enough.
I've messed around with my character a bit - he's now a Varisian, because tattoos are fun, and much more... interesting.
If there isn't order on the ship, it would be constant mutiny!
... Kind of. But mutiny is necessary to raise the ranks, sometimes, aye?
>_>
We have a LE type, another potential one, but two Chaotic folks. Oh, this is gonna be fun!
Hmm. Folks...
The current discussion first gave me second thoughts about playing Thor who I so much enjoy. I could play him more chaotic hedonistic without his moral anchor. But what other character might be better for this group? Wolverine? So I drifted off into character creation bliss for awhile, before I hit upon a question:
What will keep our characters together and prevent us from killing one another? It's more a question for Crusty, but maybe others have thoughts.
cheers
Why not Loki, Jubal?
Go evil! GO EEEVVVIILLLL!
Why not Loki, Jubal?
Go evil! GO EEEVVVIILLLL!
Yes. I am considering it, but there are so many great villains out there. However, is it possible to answer my campaign question before I settle on a character concept?
cheers
I have absolutely no idea what will keep you guys from killing each other, beyond the possibility of the Undead Lord turning you into one big happy undead family or the Lycanthrope doing the same with whatever affliction he ends up getting.
This is why I wanted you guys to talk things over before the campaign starts. You will be stuck on an island together, stranded.. until
So perhaps that alone will get you guys to bond?
OK. Guys!? Thoughts?
What will keep this evil party from becoming a parody of Lord of the Flies?
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So Crusty has been trying to rope me into joining the reboot, and I'm seriously considering it. I've got it in my head to maybe make a Hellknight (possibly of the Coil since they have a strong presence here) and Crusty recommended I pop over to see what's what.
Seeing some of the other choices here makes me wonder, could we get away with doing an entire Hellknight party? Basically throw everyone into one particular Order and bring ORDER TO THE HIGH SEAS WITH AN IRON FIST?
If you guys end up going that route, I'll have to modify my prologues to start you off in Cheliax instead of Andoran. Would certainly be more believable with so many evil peopulz.
I'm game for all hellknights. But my Thor concept needs a complete review and probably change...
What about everyone else?
Sounds intriguing, Rob... Remind me, how varied are the Hellknights racially?
I think I'd love to keep my character so far, of course, but I've yet to write a backstory for him, so it's relatively easy to change... On the other hand, he's focused primarily on death and the undead, so I don't know whether this is the campaign for him. xD
Oh! But if I changed Sarenrae to Iomedae, who does have a small presence in Cheliax, I could use my old character! *Celebrations!*
Nothin' wrong with a necromancer in the Shackles. I mean Raugsmauda has an entire ship crewed by the dead, not to mention there being juju zombies, ghost ships, etc.
As with everything on Golarion, humans are the most common Hellknights - but anyone who is dedicated to law can become one. Doesn't have to be evil, either - while LN and LE Hellknights vastly outnumber them, there are LG Hellknights too. Even a Paladin can become a Hellknight, though it would be.. rare, to say the least - not to mention difficult.
As mentioned to Rob, the Order of the Coil would be the largest group in the Shackles, followed closely by the Scourge. Other ones with a presence in the Shackles include the Nail, Chain, and Pyre, though individual members of the other Orders may be in the region on a case by case basis.
Would the characters eventually have to join the prestige class?
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Hellknights make up all sorts of races and classes, and any biases are largely dependant on the Order. The prestige classes (Hellknight and Hellknight Signifer) just represent very focused and elite members of the organization that likely move on to leadership positions. Like how not all Eagle Knights need to take the Iron Falcon or Golden Legionairre prestige classes to be considered Eagle Knights.
Iomedae also has representation in the Hellknights as well, vis-a-vis the Order of the Godclaw which worships a unique conglomerate of Abadar, Asmodeus, Iomedae, Irori, and Torag (which will be featured in the upcoming Inner Sea Gods book.)
Heck, we could be a motly crew of Hellknights from different Orders united under a single banner to bring the most all-encompassing law to the seas!
Absolutely.
... Now I'm debating. Infernal sorcerer/cleric of Iomedae combined or my more neutral dirge bard?
Dunno much on hellknights, are they fine with necromancy if used to bring about Order?
If so, I could EASILY tweak my thoughts on my character.
As for my backstory and description: I will get that together as soon as I finish up this move. Unpacking and fighting with my utilities.
Cliff's Notes version of Krovax's Personality:
Personality: Views undeath as a means to an end, when it comes to the mindless variety that is. Intelligent varieties, however, he feels have evolved to a higher form of evolution, essentially attaining immortality (in a sense). He doesn't just murder people to make undead servants, as he understands that even life has it's own uses. But if any look to oppose him or his goals, he would go to any length to see them fall.
After reading a bit on Hellknights, I think Krovax could fit into the order very well, if they were accepting of necromancy. Also, if we went as an all Hellkniht group, his style of olay would be far less driven by personal power gain, but for the good of the Order.
...he probably would still think he was best fit to rule though. Lol
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Thron, check out the listing of Major Hellknight Orders. By and large they're fine with necromancy as an organization (Pyre would likely be more case-by-case basis since they hunt down witches and cultists). It's definitely more a member-by-member concern as to who is okay with undead and not. That paladin member of the Pyre would probably be frownieface about it, but he's a rather unique case.
Alright, I could work with the Hellknight Order, shouldn't have to change too much to keep my Alchemist idea. I'm not sure about the Order of the Coil however, it doesn't sound like something my character would be interested in, and I think since we'd be coming from Cheliax anyway we don't necessarily need an established order in the area.
Rather I think that we could be sent by one of the other Orders (or perhaps a coalition of different orders if we want some variety) to establish a new location/castle/beachhead (or maybe our own order) to bring order to the chaos of the shackles now that Cheliax has a foothold there.
Looking through the orders on the wiki some suggestions...
Order of the Chain - Manhunters and enforcers of social order.
Order of the Crux - Destroyed Order resurrected by 3 graveknights if we want an undead focus...
Order of the God Claw - Religion focused order
Order of the Pike - MOnster Hunters (if we want to focus on the dragons and other terrible things that lurk in the shackles rather than the more 'civilized' folk)
Order of the Scourge - Seems like the most 'policey' hellknights.
Those are my suggestions anyway. There are also two similar sounding ones which hunt down witches, heretics, forbidden knowledge and things like that which sound interesting, but not sure how well they'd work in the Shackles.
OK. Thor won't work as a Hellknight.
I'm thinking about a tiefling Blockbuster wizard. I'll weave his backstory into one or all of the other characters. Since tieflings are largely discriminated against in Cheliax (I think), maybe he would be indentured to another character or entered the/an order to control/monitor him.
Crusty, would you mind be using the Society play rules to trade the Scribe Scroll feat of Spell Focus?
cheers
I could picture Krovax as either a member of the Order of the Scourge or the Chain.
Not against either idea of being from the same Order or being a collection from many organizations.
I kind of like the coalition idea. Makes me think of the Deathwatch RPG (not that I've played that, but have read the rulebook)
Alright, I could work with the Hellknight Order, shouldn't have to change too much to keep my Alchemist idea. I'm not sure about the Order of the Coil however, it doesn't sound like something my character would be interested in, and I think since we'd be coming from Cheliax anyway we don't necessarily need an established order in the area.
Rather I think that we could be sent by one of the other Orders (or perhaps a coalition of different orders if we want some variety) to establish a new location/castle/beachhead (or maybe our own order) to bring order to the chaos of the shackles now that Cheliax has a foothold there.
Looking through the orders on the wiki some suggestions...
Order of the Chain - Manhunters and enforcers of social order.
Order of the Crux - Destroyed Order resurrected by 3 graveknights if we want an undead focus...
Order of the God Claw - Religion focused order
Order of the Pike - MOnster Hunters (if we want to focus on the dragons and other terrible things that lurk in the shackles rather than the more 'civilized' folk)
Order of the Scourge - Seems like the most 'policey' hellknights.Those are my suggestions anyway. There are also two similar sounding ones which hunt down witches, heretics, forbidden knowledge and things like that which sound interesting, but not sure how well they'd work in the Shackles.
Order of the Crux wouldn't really work as it is technically an extinct order.. those three undead nutjobs wouldn't really count.. unless Rob would say otherwise.
The rest, however, sound like an excellent idea!
@Jubal: Yeah I'll allow that if you wish to go that route.
Wow, go out to get some food for some half hour and it progresses this far? o_o
*Giggles*
Well, in any case, I think I'll stick with my Varisian dirge bard... For now. I would imagine a great deal of Varisians fled the return of... whatever his name is. Karzoug? The Sin-Mage fellow. Perhaps some fled south to Cheliax. Mine was promptly enslaved, because, well, why not?
Unless I'm messing up my chronology. Which I may be doing - I suck at that.
Karzoug (the Reclaimer? or is that someone else's title), Runelord of Greed emerged... about 8 years ago now I think in RoP chronology.
So he's a Hellknight servant then?
That escalated quickly. I will have to do some brainstorming. May go with a cavalier.
Didn't it just?
Saranaja: Maybe. I think he was probably at one point, but then the Hellknight realized for some reason that he'd be a pretty useful Hellknight for some reason.
I have a feeling this group is going to bring a tear of joy to Marcellano's eye.
Working on fluff, have description and personality done.
Question to the gurus of RoP:
Are the Hellknights in support of either side of the Cheliax civil war?
What was their contribution to Cheliax's previous jaunt into the Shackles?
I know we are starting at minimum level 1 gold, having sold off our gear as refugees. Is that still our stance as for the low wealth, or is that gonna change? Reason I ask is because Hellknights have a very strong connection to their armor, and I figure it would have to be a %$&! good reason for a group of them to sell that off.
They are DEFINITELY on the queen's side of the civil war.
The invasion fleet of the Shackles saw Paralictor Valeria Asperixus of the Order of the Scourge as basically the second in command of the invasion - and personal guardian/servant (and lover) of Admiral Druvalia Thrune, who is a cousin of the current Queen of Cheliax and leader of the invasion fleet.
I'm actually considering changing up the starting situation for money - I'll have more on it later when I give it thought. I might still stay with it, saying that while you kept your armor, you might have lost it when you guys shipwrecked. Effectively, your starting money is a combination of whats left after selling it for the voyage and what survived the shipwreck.
Also, would we PC's hold any particular rank within the Order?
Hmm.. in all likelyhood, you guys would be veteran Armigers - not quite fully-fledged Hellknights, but on the cusp of becoming one.
If the group is all in agreement with being Hellknights, I might need to modify a few things in the starting situation - certainly, you'll still get stranded and all that, but instead of being refugees.. perhaps something else might be better.
I'll brainstorm some ideers.
Does anyone want to connect backgrounds to my tiefling blockbuster wizard?
I may. I would need to see more on your backstory idea s.
I might need to bring back a few of the crew from the Dominator in both my S&S campaign and Marcellano's background - that Elf Wizard I had that flamed the Ghoul's Grasp I really wanted to have in mah story :D
..he was a Spellbinder/Diabolist. Love that prestige class :D
Heh. Well, I'll try to write up a backstory and personality for Vorsan at some point this week - today was oddly pressure-free, but I expect that to change.
Diabolist. Love that prestige class :D
Me too. I was going to ask if Mabelode could have used a scroll to satisfy the binding a devil prereq before the campaign starts, so he could go Diabolist at level 6th...
Crusty, I'm working on my background now, involves fighting Druids in the Barrowood. Would it be okay with you if my Undead Companion was a Skeletal Lion that was once actually a Druid's former animal companion (he didn't know that).
Would just take a lion and give it the Skeleton template. Unless you'd rather I not start with an Undead Companion, which is fine. Could totally make one after game start.
But let's be real, a Skeletal lion that also doubled as a mount is pretty awesome.
@Mabelode. As long as you don't mind having submitted yourself to invasive examinations and tests you could certainly tie your background into mine! See below for more info :p
@Thron. Sounds like it would be an uncomfortable ride
Yeah Crusty, a group of Hellknights as refugees makes a lot less sense :p I was thinking we were the vanguard/reinforcements for a new Hellknight position in the Shackles and most of our stuff (and any senior Hellknights sent along with us) was lost/damaged in a wreck. Would change the direction of the campaign somewhat I suspect but shouldn't affect the initial circumstances too much.
AS to my own character looking at the prereqs for the two hellknight prestige classes he doesn't really qualify for either without multiclassing and largely giving up on Alchemist abilities. I'm not really sure how the Hellknights would feel about him as a whole... Given the new campaign focus I'm thinking maybe he's trying to become Fiendish/Half-Fiend instead of a full Lycanthrope... He doesn't terribly mind how he gets it, he's just all about unlocking the secrets of transformation for self empowerment.
Originally this would have been through enhancing his lycanthropic blood to become a full werebat, or some other form of lycanthrope, but after he fled Ustalav he ended up in Cheliax instead and his studies turned towards infernal creatures which brought him to the attention of the Hellknights. I think his goals would align most closely with the Order of the Pike, but by the same measure I'm not sure how ambivalent they'd be about his own monstrous nature :p Any thoughts on that Crusty or Rob?
...comfy saddle?
Edit: getting frustrated with finding something suitable as an Undead Companion. Also, considering ditching the Archetype all together, but keeping the same overall concept.
So, still an "Undead Lord," but not an Undead Lord, savvy?
Question on animating dead...
If I animate a 1 HD Medium humanoid into a zombie, it gains a +1 HD in the process. So does it count as 2 HD against my limit? I assume so, but don't wanna cheat myself later.
Enter Krovax, the Underwearmancer.
You drop all hit die gained from classes down to 1, then add 1 more HD. So yes, a medium, humaoid zombie would be 2 HD against your limit. Its the outcome of the zombie/skeleton that determines how many HD it 'costs', not the starting HD.
Lets see.. I would recommend a Level 1 (Something) Skeletal Champion, but you need to be level 6 in order to do that..
Skeletal Lion? :D
Bloody Skeletal Riding Dog?
Bloody Skeletal Horse?
Lots of ideas :P
Anti paladins? Too far or perfectly acceptable?
Not acceptable if you guys are going the Hellknight route.. they're CE, quite the opposite of the L-ENG of the Hellknights.
Acceptable enough for a Pirate, though.