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The ARG released a half-elf feat "Human Spirit".
Benefit: You receive 1 bonus skill rank. Whenever you gain another Hit Die, you gain an additional skill rank. You cannot gain more than four skill ranks in this way.
Here is my confusion with the bolded section...Which of these is it saying?
1. you will only ever gain 4 skill points from it (1 bonus point for levels 1-4)
2. you can only place the bonus skill point from this feat into a particular skill 4 times (i.e.: 4 ranks of Diplomacy, then 4 ranks of Stealth)
I read it as you can take this feat multiple times. A max of 4 though.
You acn only take the feat once as it has a requirement of Character Level: 1st.
The feat gives you 4 skill points spread over 4 levels.
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You acn only take the feat once as it has a requirement of Character Level: 1st.
The feat gives you 4 skill points spread over 4 levels.
I'd call that a complete waste of a feat...
This isn't a bad feat actually. I started writing my post and in doing convinced myself this actually isn't bad. It's not something I'd take on every character but this feat does give you 4 ranks not just +4 to the skill. So if you were short on skills and looking to qualify for a prestige class or feat this would be great feat to pick. It's either that or wait a couple levels to cover all the per-requisite skills if you don't have the skills per level to cover all the bases.
This isn't a bad feat actually. I started writing my post and in doing convinced myself this actually isn't bad. It's not something I'd take on every character but this feat does give you 4 ranks not just +4 to the skill. So if you were short on skills and looking to qualify for a prestige class or feat this would be great feat to pick. It's either that or wait a couple levels to cover all the per-requisite skills if you don't have the skills per level to cover all the bases.
How is this not a bad feat? At level 1 you can take this and gain 1 extra skill rank at levels 1, 2, 3, & 4. After level 4, the feat does absolutely nothing.
Compare this to Toughness, where you gain 1 HP every level without a cap.
In terms of "point value", 1 HP is roughly equal to 1 skill point (based on favored class bonuses). So in terms of "return on investment", you get MUCH less for taking this feat than you would get for taking Toughness.
This isn't a bad feat actually. I started writing my post and in doing convinced myself this actually isn't bad. It's not something I'd take on every character but this feat does give you 4 ranks not just +4 to the skill. So if you were short on skills and looking to qualify for a prestige class or feat this would be great feat to pick. It's either that or wait a couple levels to cover all the per-requisite skills if you don't have the skills per level to cover all the bases.How is this not a bad feat? At level 1 you can take this and gain 1 extra skill rank at levels 1, 2, 3, & 4. After level 4, the feat does absolutely nothing.
Compare this to Toughness, where you gain 1 HP every level without a cap.
In terms of "point value", 1 HP is roughly equal to 1 skill point (based on favored class bonuses). So in terms of "return on investment", you get MUCH less for taking this feat than you would get for taking Toughness.
It can get me into Prestige Class 2 levels earlier than I would normally be able to. Take shadow dancer for example with dumb fighter that 1 skill point per level. I'd have to take stealth from levels 1-5 then Perform dance for levels 6 and 7 and at level 8 I'm a Shadow Dancer. If I take this feat at 1st level I use it get Perform Dance 2 and put the other 2 in perception. Then at level 6 I'm a shadow Dancer and I still have toughness at first level as well.
Still I could have gone Human and done it easier but maybe I wanted those Half Elven racial traits like Drow Blooded for the Darkvision since I'm all about the shadows.
The feat is weak but it can be used to your benefit in the right circumstances. Personally I think I'd house rule this feat to be no more than 4 ranks in one particular skill. So you could put 4 ranks to 5 skills over progression of 20 levels. As written it seems more like a trait. I mean 4 ranks over 4 level vs +1 Trait Bonus to a skill and the skill always a class skill works out a +4 bonus on skill at level 1.
I think it's probably a typo and they meant for option (2). Otherwise it's terrible.
I think it's probably a typo and they meant for option (2). Otherwise it's terrible.
Same here, if they meant that the feat actually only gives you 4 ranks over 4 levels then it's a complete waste of space.
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Thought of a third possibility for interpretation...
Perhaps the skill rank cap of 4 means that if you play a class that already gains 4 or 6 skill points a level that the feat does nothing? So classes like Clerics, Fighters, Paladins, etc would gain 3/level with this feat?
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This isn't a bad feat actually. I started writing my post and in doing convinced myself this actually isn't bad. It's not something I'd take on every character but this feat does give you 4 ranks not just +4 to the skill. So if you were short on skills and looking to qualify for a prestige class or feat this would be great feat to pick. It's either that or wait a couple levels to cover all the per-requisite skills if you don't have the skills per level to cover all the bases.How is this not a bad feat? At level 1 you can take this and gain 1 extra skill rank at levels 1, 2, 3, & 4. After level 4, the feat does absolutely nothing.
Compare this to Toughness, where you gain 1 HP every level without a cap.
In terms of "point value", 1 HP is roughly equal to 1 skill point (based on favored class bonuses). So in terms of "return on investment", you get MUCH less for taking this feat than you would get for taking Toughness.
It can get me into Prestige Class 2 levels earlier than I would normally be able to. Take shadow dancer for example with dumb fighter that 1 skill point per level. I'd have to take stealth from levels 1-5 then Perform dance for levels 6 and 7 and at level 8 I'm a Shadow Dancer. If I take this feat at 1st level I use it get Perform Dance 2 and put the other 2 in perception. Then at level 6 I'm a shadow Dancer and I still have toughness at first level as well.
Still I could have gone Human and done it easier but maybe I wanted those Half Elven racial traits like Drow Blooded for the Darkvision since I'm all about the shadows.
The feat is weak but it can be used to your benefit in the right circumstances. Personally I think I'd house rule this feat to be no more than 4 ranks in one particular skill. So you could put 4 ranks to 5 skills over progression of 20 levels. As written it seems more like a trait. I mean 4 ranks over 4 level vs +1 Trait Bonus to a skill and the skill always a class skill works out a +4 bonus on skill...
The problem is it says RANKS...so you can't put more than your class level in RANKS for a skill. While a feat that grants you +4 to a skill as a BONUS greatly outweighs is because it pushes you higher than what could be accomplished with RANKS.
Poorly worded feat is poorly designed if that is the case...hope its you just can't put it more than 4 times in one skill...
I don't think he's saying you get to put more pts into any one skill than normal- just that a class that has alot of feats but not many skill points (like a low PB fighter) could use this feat to snag 4 more points than they'd normally get.. which in turn allows that particular person to get into a skill intensive PrC earlier than normal.
(normally only having 1 rank a level vs geting 5 with this feat + your normal 1, if you dumped int)
-S
But for your specific example Selgard, if the Half-Elf Fighter takes the very next feat directly below Human Spirit (ie Multitalented Mastery) he would actually pick up 20 skill points and potentially some extra hit points (if he multiclasses more than once).
20 Skill Points + possible HP
vs.
4 Skill Points.
This would be a good trait, but it makes for a terrible feat.
But for your specific example Selgard, if the Half-Elf Fighter takes the very next feat directly below Human Spirit (ie Multitalented Mastery) he would actually pick up 20 skill points and potentially some extra hit points (if he multiclasses more than once).
20 Skill Points + possible HP
vs.
4 Skill Points.This would be a good trait, but it makes for a terrible feat.
I didn't say I thought it was a good idea. Just that I thought it was what the fellow meant.
As written this feat looks completely useless, imo. It needs a re-write or something.
-S
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Sorry to resurrect this thread, but has there been any development or clarification on this over the years? I seem to have a tendency to gravitate towards half-elves when I build characters and this'd be a handy feat if its restriction only meant that you couldn't invest more than 4 skill ranks in any single skill.
I don't believe there's been any clarification or update on this. So it just gives 4 skill ranks.
4 BONUS skill ranks.
Level 1. Take this feat and choose stealth. You put a rank in stealth and this feat grants a BONUS rank. You have two ranks in stealth.
Do the same each level after that until 4th (where the bonus' stop). You are level 4 with 8 RANKS in stealth (4 of which come from your own pool of skill points).
There are feats and prestige's you can qualify for much faster with this feat. You could write an entire optimization guide on where this would apply.
*blink-blink*
That... is a surprising conclusion to come to.
4 BONUS skill ranks.
Level 1. Take this feat and choose stealth. You put a rank in stealth and this feat grants a BONUS rank. You have two ranks in stealth.
Do the same each level after that until 4th (where the bonus' stop). You are level 4 with 8 RANKS in stealth (4 of which come from your own pool of skill points).
There are feats and prestige's you can qualify for much faster with this feat. You could write an entire optimization guide on where this would apply.
Uh, no. Absolutely nothing about this feat removes the normal limit on skill ranks (i.e. that no skill can have more ranks than your level).
Uh, no. Absolutely nothing about this feat removes the normal limit on skill ranks (i.e. that no skill can have more ranks than your level).4 BONUS skill ranks.
Level 1. Take this feat and choose stealth. You put a rank in stealth and this feat grants a BONUS rank. You have two ranks in stealth.
Do the same each level after that until 4th (where the bonus' stop). You are level 4 with 8 RANKS in stealth (4 of which come from your own pool of skill points).
There are feats and prestige's you can qualify for much faster with this feat. You could write an entire optimization guide on where this would apply.
Then why doesn't the feat grant a skill point? Why call out skill RANKS if that wasn't what they intended?
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Then why doesn't the feat grant a skill point? Why call out skill RANKS if that wasn't what they intended?Uh, no. Absolutely nothing about this feat removes the normal limit on skill ranks (i.e. that no skill can have more ranks than your level).4 BONUS skill ranks.
Level 1. Take this feat and choose stealth. You put a rank in stealth and this feat grants a BONUS rank. You have two ranks in stealth.
Do the same each level after that until 4th (where the bonus' stop). You are level 4 with 8 RANKS in stealth (4 of which come from your own pool of skill points).
There are feats and prestige's you can qualify for much faster with this feat. You could write an entire optimization guide on where this would apply.
Because "skill point" is not a thing in the game, they're always called skill ranks. Look at the prd, or if you have a hard copy, look at a class entry. Barbarians, for example, have this line:
"Skill Ranks per Level: 4 + Int modifier."
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Pbbttt!
You're no fun.
So one feat grants 4 skill "ranks" over 4 levels and can only be taken once.
It seems the designer of the feat over values skills.
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Pbbttt!
You're no fun.
So one feat grants 4 skill "ranks" over 4 levels and can only be taken once.
It seems the designer of the feat over values skills.
Paizo regularly has things that seem good at first, but in actual fact are not worth the investment put into it. It caters to giving players with system mastery a euphoric "Aha!" moment when they either find a really good option and select it or a really bad option and avoid it. The human brain gives a nice feeding to the pleasure centers when these things are found in the natural world, similar to that pleasant feeling when you've spotted a root you might otherwise trip over, or spot some nice berries in the wild.