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Satio, I second Sysryke's suggestion about using reach and combat reflexes. Being a large & strong PC with a reach weapon (thus 20' reach), high DEX, and Combat Reflexes will massively increase your PCs average damage output and will ALSO reduce incoming damage. One typically sees about a ~50%+ increase in damage output, front-loaded to early in the fight when it's most important. One typically sees about a 10-15% reduction in incoming damage, because you'll sometimes slay things before they can get close enough to attack. The protection provided by reach typically exceeds the protection provided by a shield.
This combo typically provides several extra attacks per fight. While you don't NEED Combat Reflexes to get AoOs it helps a lot. The big benefit is getting an AoO even when you lose initiative. That 16 DEX also provides lots of AoOs with Combat Reflexes. The key item to understand is that your PC will inflict damage when it's NOT YOUR TURN.
No other feat will provide such a huge damage increase. Plus your PC has a larger "zone of control" and is more effective at controlling the battlefield. Here's an example of how using reach tactics works in play. This approach also protects your squishy allies, as foes who try to get close enough to attack a squishy ally must first reckon with your AoOs. This provides a protective screen around your allies.
A falcata, like most swords, is a sidearm. As a rule, sidearms are less effective than are battlefield weapons like the polearm, longbow, or long gun. Sidearms have the advantage of being attached to your body and thus always available. A sword is to a polearm as a pistol is to a rifle. Many places & situations (inns, some cities, diplomatic conferences, etc) don't allow battlefield weapons but do allow sidearms. Plus it's a BOTHER to always carry a long stick and you'll be tempted to put it down.
Perhaps carry a battlefield weapon and keep that falcata sidearm handy for when the battlefield weapon fails you. As a GM I've noticed that martials who specialize in a single weapon often build themselves a trap that reduces their effectiveness. Flexibility wins out.
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I'm planning to go 2Handed Fighter (All Ready Locked this in witu the GM and going with A Falacata as My main weapon
Starting with the obvious... A falcata is not a two-handed weapon so you're not going to get to use it with a lot of the Two-handed fighter's archetype abilities. Couldn't quite figure out if your GM was letting you count it as one or not.
You've got several build routes with a large character. The first is a battlefield control build as previous posters suggest. Another, which works well with the two-handed fighter archetype, is just to get the most damaging weapon you can (butchering axe, if available) and proceed down the Vital Strike path.
Weapon Focus is always helpful but Weapon Specialization is actually just a tiny bit of damage compared your other damage bonuses. If you need to drop a feat to pick up something else, Weapon Spec would be my first drop. The following is personal preference: but I like to pick up the Improved Critical feat if at all possible. It saves a ton of money over keen in the long run and lets you get the weapon all the way up to +5 faster.
Gearwise, Gloves of Dueling are a no-brainer. Mithral Breastplate +5 and a ring of protection +2 will get you to AC 25. (You can save 7,000 gp if you go to a +4 breastplate, +2 ring, and +1 amulet of natural armor but you use up your neck slot to do that.) Cloak of Protection is obviously a top buy.
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Another, which works well with the two-handed fighter archetype, is just to get the most damaging weapon you can (butchering axe, if available) and proceed down the Vital Strike path.
Belafon speaks truth. I play weekly with a two-handed fighter who fights with a big axe and Vital Strike. He is very effective. That said, for tactical reasons he sometimes prefers a reach weapon (usually a boarding pike aka longspear, since we're pirates) and finds that reach AoOs add an extra ~20% to his damage. He carries a reach weapon, takes his early AoOs when it's not his turn, then drops it and switches to his axe on his own turn.
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Well in pf1 most melee classes benefit from dipping in other frontloaded melee classes.
Fx. 4 levels of Blood Conduit black blood bloodrager gives you blood rage a swift action frost on your weapon after you get hit and 5 extra ft reach. And a free improved Trip feat without pre requests.
This will improve a reach build a lot and open up for bloodrager spells through wand and scrolls.
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Yes I'm starting level 7 with a large impact Butchering. Axe and going vital strike as my main plan
I have 46000 gold spend and my axe is like 21065. I think
Including material costI'd like Advice on my other equipment with what I have left to spend
So, 24,935 gold left to spend. My first pass looks like getting to AC25 is going to eat up almost all that gold, and one feat.
10 + 3 (dex) - 1 (size) = 12. You are looking for 13 more AC.
(+1 deflection) Ring of Protection +1 (2000 gp)
(+1 natural) Amulet of Natural Armor +1 (2000 gp)
(+9 armor) Mithral Breastplate +3 (13200 gp)
(+1 insight) Dust Rose Prism Ioun Stone (5000 gp)
Armor Focus (breastplate) feat - increases AC bonus of breastplate by +1
That's 22,200 gp. Leaving you with 2,735 to spend on all your other gear. Personally I'd drop the AC a bit so I could buy more gear.
(+9 armor) Mithral Breastplate +3 (13200gp)
Does a monstrous humanoid count as humanoid for armor pricing? One might assume that humanoid refers to bipedal, with two arms.
Since the trox has extra arms protruding from its torso, one might rule it as non-humanoid for armor pricing, which would increase the cost to about 15.800gp.
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You are correct. I forgot about the multiplier for non-humanoid AND the multiplier for being large. Total of x4, so the mithral breastplate alone would be 16,800. Plus another 9000 for +3, for a total of 25,800 for a +3 mithral breastplate.
Back to the drawing board.
Best armor (assuming you don't want to be slowed) is likely going to be Lamellar Leather (no special materials) for 390 gp (with masterwork). Significantly cheaper than 16,800 :) (4 Armor)
If you are OK being slowed you can get a masterwork breastplate (6 armor) for 950 gp. Or masterwork full plate (9 armor) for 6150 gp, but you won't be taking full advantage of your Dex bonus with the full plate.
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Please note that with a 12 Int before your -2 racial adjustment, this character is likely to have a serious communication issue if you don't put a rank or two into the Linguistics skill:
Source
Inner Sea Races pg. 253, Bestiary 4 pg. 264
Trox Racial Traits
+6 Strength, –2 Intelligence, –2 Wisdom, –2 Charisma: Trox are very strong, but they can be dim, unreceptive, and inhospitable.
...
Languages: Trox begin play speaking Terran. A trox with a high Intelligence score can choose from the following: Common, Dwarven, Giant, Orc, and Undercommon.
...
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@ Taja the Barbarian
My stats to start before Adjusting for race are
18,16,15,14,12,10
How would you suggest i do them?
Your basic options are:
Put your 14 into Intelligence so you end up with one bonus starting language, orPut your 12 into Intelligence and acquire a +2 (or higher) Intelligence boost item that includes Common as a bonus language, or
Put at least one skill rank into the Linguistics skill.
Source
PRPG Core Rulebook pg. 100
Learn a Language: Whenever you put a rank into this skill, you learn to speak and read a new language.
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The last option is almost certainly the easiest (assuming you don't already have specific needs for all of your extremely limited skill ranks).
The cost modifier for mithral is 4k for medium armor.
It looks like +2 full plate and boots of striding and springing would total up to just about what you have here (10,150 for the armor, 5,500 boots for 15,650gp total), same total AC bonus (w dex factored in) and movement speed.
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Can some tell me if these numbers are correct?
Mithral Breastplate +3
Base cost: 200 gp
Mithral cost modifier: +1,500 gp
Total base cost: 1,700 gp
Large/non-humanoid multiplier: x4
Adjusted base cost: 6,800 gp
Nope.
Breastplate is a medium armor, so the mithral cost is 4000 gp.
Mithral Breastplate (made for a medium humanoid) = 4200
Large non-humanoid multiplier = x4
Adjusted base cost for Mithral Breastplate (made for a large non-humanoid) = 16800
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Ok I talked to my Gm and I am going Move Toward AoO build that was mention in this thread.
With 46000 GP
I want a +3 Adamnatine Lucerne hammer
And put the rest in boosting saves and Armor class
How high can I get my Ac with what left of my gold
Likes is a +3My trox will have 16 dex and I like to try to Benfit from that if possible or if not do a the best armor I can get with decent magic bonus
I guess I'll ask what is highest i can get my Ac with my character race and size and what gold I'd have left after my weapon is bought
46,000g - (((15g Lucerne Hammer + 3,000g Adamantine) * 2 [large size]) + 18,000g [+3 enhancement bonus] = 24,030g) = 21,970g remaining
Your general options would probably be:
Mundane Armor:
Large Mithral Full Plate would give you +9 armor with a +3 Dex cap for (1,500g [base item] + 9,000g [mithral]) * 4 [large non-humanoid modifier] = 42,000g but this will reduce your base speed to 20'
Large Masterwork Tatami-do would give you +7 armor with a +3 Dex cap for ((1,000g [base item] * 4 [large non-humanoid modifier]) + 150g [Masterwork]) = 4,150g but this will reduce your base speed to 20'
Large Mithral Agile Breastplate would give you +6 armor with a +5 Dex Cap for ((400g [base item] + 4,000g [Mithral]) * 4 [large non-humanoid modifier] = 17,600g) but with no reduction to your speed.
Enhancement Bonus to Armor:
Enhancement bonuses to Armor are [Bonus Squared] * 1,000g
Deflection Bonus To AC:
The Ring of Protection grants a Deflection bonus to Armor for [Bonus Squared] * 2,000g
Enhancement Bonus To Natural Armor:
The Amulet of Natural Armor grants an enhancement bonus to your Natural Armor for [Bonus Squared] * 2,000g.
Suggestions
Honestly, the x4 cost multiplier for being a large non-humanoid makes most special material armors too expensive for you*, so we'll assume you go with Large Non-Humanoid Masterwork Tatami-do base armor for 4,150g, which should leave you with 17,820g to spend on magical bonuses:
Cloak of Resistance +2 for 4,000g
+2 Enhancement Bonus to your Armor for 4,000g
Ring of Protection +1 for 2,000g
Amulet of Natural Armor +1 for 2,000g
Your final AC should be 10 [base] - 1 [size] + 9 [+2 Tatami-do] + 3 [Dexterity] + 1 [Deflection] + 1 [Natural Armor] = AC 23 (before feats, spells, or other oddities at least).
You will also have a +2 Resistance bonus to all saving throws from your Cloak.
With your remaining 5,820g, you could spend 5,000g to upgrade either your Cloak or Armor Enhancement bonus to +3, but you almost certainly going to want a Belt of Giant Strength +2 for 4,000g instead.
Non-Gearing Afterthought: As the player of a large size character, be certain to familiarize yourself with the Squeezing rules: Source
PRPG Core Rulebook pg. 193
Squeezing: In some cases, you may have to squeeze into or through an area that isn’t as wide as the space you take up. You can squeeze through or into a space that is at least half as wide as your normal space. Each move into or through a narrow space counts as if it were 2 squares, and while squeezed in a narrow space, you take a –4 penalty on attack rolls and a –4 penalty to AC.
When a Large creature (which normally takes up 4 squares) squeezes into a space that’s 1 square wide, the creature’s miniature figure occupies 2 squares, centered on the line between the 2 squares. For a bigger creature, center the creature likewise in the area it squeezes into.
A creature can squeeze past a creature while moving but it can’t end its movement in an occupied square.
To squeeze through or into a space less than half your space’s width, you must use the Escape Artist skill. You can’t attack while using Escape Artist to squeeze through or into a narrow space, you take a –4 penalty to AC, and you lose any Dexterity bonus to AC.
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Okay, the cheapest 'Full Speed' Mithral Medium armor combination I can come up with is:
+125g Four Mirror Armor (Armor Bonus +6; Max Dex Bonus +2; Armor Check Penalty -5)
+4,000g Mithral Cost (Max Dex Bonus +2; Armor Check Penalty +3 Weight x0.5)
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=4,125g Base Mithral Four Mirror Armor (Armor Bonus +6; Max Dex Bonus +4; Armor Check Penalty -2)
*2 Medium Non-Humanoid Adjustment
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=8,250g Base Medium Non-Humanoid Mithral Four Mirror Armor (Armor Bonus +6; Max Dex Bonus +4; Armor Check Penalty -2)
+4,000g Enhancement Bonus (+2)
+2,000g Fitting Quality
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=14,250g Mithral +2 Fitting Four Mirror Armor (Armor Bonus +6; Max Dex Bonus +4; Armor Check Penalty -2)
+46,000g Starting Gold
-24,030g Adamantine +3 Lucerne Hammer
-14,250g Mithral +2 Fitting Four Mirror Armor
------------------------------------
=7,720g Remaining Gold After +3 Weapon & +2 Armor
-2,000g Ring of Protection +1
-2,000g Amulet of Natural Armor +1
-1,000g Cloak of Resistance +1
------------------------------------
=2,720g Remaining Gold
Your final AC should be 10 [base] - 1 [size] + 8 [+2 Four-Mirror Armor] + 3 [Dexterity] + 1 [Deflection] + 1 [Natural Armor] = AC 22, giving you slightly worse AC and Saves and no Enhancement bonus to Strength, but allowing you to use your full Speed and could catch up with the Tatami-do AC if you happen to get a +2 Enhancement Bonus to your Dexterity...
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...
As for other items I plan to start with a + 2 Belt of dex and a +1 Amulet of natural armor
The major drawback of the Dex Belt is that it takes the slot of a Str Belt (or at least requires you to get the more expensive multi-stat belts).
If you are intending to boost your Dexterity past 18, you might want to spend a little extra gold and use one of the 'Max Dex Bonus +3' options as your base armor:Mithral Non-Humanoid +2 Fitting Four-Mirror Armor [Armor Bonus +6; Max Dex Bonus +4; Armor Check Penalty -2] should cost 14,250g
Mithral Non-Humanoid +2 Fitting Lamellar (Steel) [Armor Bonus +6; Max Dex Bonus +5; Armor Check Penalty -2] should cost 14,300g
Mithral Non-Humanoid +2 Fitting Breastplate [Armor Bonus +6; Max Dex Bonus +5; Armor Check Penalty -1] should cost 14,400g
There's also Agile Breastplate and Mountain Pattern as base armor options, but neither bring you much of an advantage over Breastplate.
If you aren't planning to increase your Dexterity past 18, consider the Apron of the Careful Alchemist instead of a Dexterity Belt: It's slightly more expensive, but doesn't take up your precious belt slot...
Also, I would probably go with the Ring of Protection +1 over the Amulet of Natural Armor +1 since there's basically nothing that ignores a Deflection bonus but Touch Attacks ignore Natural Armor.
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If you aren't planning to increase your Dexterity past 18, consider the Apron of the Careful Alchemist instead of a Dexterity Belt: It's slightly more expensive, but doesn't take up your precious belt slot...
Also, I would probably go with the Ring of Protection +1 over the Amulet of Natural Armor +1 since there's basically nothing that ignores a Deflection bonus but Touch Attacks ignore Natural Armor.
Good call on fitting, Taja. And somehow I've never noticed the Apron before, but that's a pretty decent item. I could have used that on some of my characters who ended up buying a Deep Red Sphere ioun stone. Two-handed fighter doesn't get armor training, so they aren't going to be using Sash of the War Champion in the chest slot.
Agree on the Ring vs. Amulet. In addition, you get two ring slots but only one neck slot. If you choose the Amulet of Natural Armor and find something else you want to put in your neck slot you have to make a tough decision.
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@Belafon
I've Moved on from two handed fighter to polarm master and and am focues on Attacks of opportunity via 20ft reach with a Polearm (Lucrene hammer)
If you’re still concerned about AC, you may want to consider an archetype that does NOT give up Armor Training. That way you wouldn’t need Mithral to move at full speed (and get more Max Dex) in full plate.
Have you looked at a Dragoon with a Sash of the War Champion? Plenty of reach weapons in the Spear Group.
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I'll take a look but I'm not sure how I feel about mounted combat
Dragoons actually aren't that great at mounted combat in PFS because they don't get an animal companion. So they generally have a generic horse with (relatively) low hit points. What you'd really be after is the Spear Training and Spinning Lance class features. Those would work really well with your reach/AoO build. And you keep Armor Training 1.
Historically, dragoons used their horses for fast transport from one part of a battle to another but fought on foot. Maybe one initial cavalry charge, but mostly fighting dismounted.
Just being large with a reach weapon you have a 50' (60' when lunging) circle of control. The skill and feat investment for Living Monololith would be hefty for you. So how often will a bigger threat area really matter?
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Would Dipping into Living Monolith be worth it to for me?
My Goal is To be able to cover as much ground as possible with what counts as an area I threaten.
Maybe worth it, given that goal. Costs you some feats, but gets you that sweet enlarge.
Read the section on big creature sizes and reach in the CRB. It's a little confusing but the short answer is that if you are large and using a reach weapon, you threaten at 15' and 20' but NOT at 5' or 10'. (Basically someone gets inside your guard when they get close and you can't get your weapon around to attack them.) That's where a special ability like the ones of the Polearm Master or Dragoon come in handy: you can attack as if your weapon did not have reach. (Threatening 5' and 10', but not 15' or more.)
Going up to Huge with the Ka Stone would make you threaten 20'-30'.
With a 16 dex you are spending two or 4 thousand gp (depending on the cost multiplier) for a net AC change of zero and a 1 point reduction of ACP. Sounds like a bad deal to me.
Class: Fighter (Two-Handed Fighter archetype)
Drops armor training for pure damage boosts—perfect since you’re going heavy on offense.
Two-handed use means +1.5x STR and great synergy with Power Attack and Overhand Chop.
(Recommended if not doing Intimidate build):
L1: Power Attack
F1: Weapon Focus (Falcata)
F2: Furious Focus
L3: Improved Critical (Falcata) or Critical Focus
F4: Weapon Specialization (Falcata)
L5: Critical Focus
F6: Greater Weapon Focus
L7: Improved Initiative
F8: Greater Weapon Specialization
If going Intimidate + fear route, sub in: Intimidating Prowess, Cornugon Smash, Shatter Defenses, and Dazzling Display
AC Base 10
+4 Natural Armor (Trox)
+8 Armor (Mithral Full Plate +2)
+2 Shield (if using a shield occasionally)
+2 Dex (DEX 14)
+1 Ring of Protection
= 27–29 AC, depending on shield
Gear
+2 Keen Falcata – 18,000 gp
Mithral Full Plate +2 – 13,500 gp
Belt of Giant Strength +2 – 4,000 gp
Ring of Protection +1 – 2,000 gp
Cloak of Resistance +1 – 1,000 gp
Amulet of Natural Armor +1 – 2,000 gp
Potion of Fly / Haste / Enlarge Person – situational buffs
Remaining: ~5k gp for scrolls, potions, backup gear
Optional upgrade: swap Cloak or Ring for Quick Runner’s Shirt or Boots of Striding and Springing for speed
Start with Overhand Chop and Power Attack—you’re smashing for 2d4 + 1.5x STR + PA + spec, with 15–20/x3 crit range
Use Cleaving Finish or Come and Get Me for AoOs and controlling battlefield (if you multiclass into Barbarian later)
If you go the Fear route, demoralize on-hit, make enemies flat-footed, destroy their action economy
JC
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+4 Natural Armor (Trox)
Trox do not get a natural armor bonus. Not sure where +4 came from.
+8 Armor (Mithral Full Plate +2)
That would be +11. (But see below.) Did you mean Mithral Breastplate +2?
Mithral Full Plate +2 – 13,500 gp
Mithral full plate +2 for a human would cost 14,500. But...
A large part of this thread revolves around the point that as a large creature of a type other than "humanoid" a Trox's armor costs 4x normal costs. Including special material costs. Mithral Full plate +2 would cost 44,200. Mithral Breastplate +2 would be 20,800.
And the OP is not going with a falcata any more. (Or two-handed fighter, they don't work together.)
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Ok i have ask
What all is factor in to increase cost of my armor
I know material
I know sizeIs magic bonus as well?
Trying to figure out the armor if I'm going Dragoon
The largest costs are the combination of Medium or Heavy armor with Special Materials and the 'Large Non-Humanoid' or 'Medium Non-Humanoid' multipliers: Mithral Heavy Armor costs +9,000g for a medium sized humanoid, but this becomes +36,000g for you after the 'Large Non-Humanoid' x4 Multiplier. Using the Fitting Magical Armor Quality brings this total down to a more reasonable +20,000g (+9,000g [Mithril] * 2 [Medium Non-Humanoid Modifier] + 2,000 [Fitting Magical Armor Quality]) but this is still really expensive.
Getting Armor Training will save you a lot of your starting gold, as it essentially give you most of the benefits of Mithral by 7th level: Source
PRPG Core Rulebook pg. 55
Armor Training (Ex): Starting at 3rd level, a fighter learns to be more maneuverable while wearing armor. Whenever he is wearing armor, he reduces the armor check penalty by 1 (to a minimum of 0) and increases the maximum Dexterity bonus allowed by his armor by 1. Every four levels thereafter (7th, 11th, and 15th), these bonuses increase by +1 each time, to a maximum –4 reduction of the armor check penalty and a +4 increase of the maximum Dexterity bonus allowed.
In addition, a fighter can also move at his normal speed while wearing medium armor. At 7th level, a fighter can move at his normal speed while wearing heavy armor.
+1 Fitting Mithral Non-Humanoid Fullplate: ((1,500g [Fullplate] + 9,000g [Mithral] = 10,500g) * 2 [Medium Non-Humanoid Multiplier = 21,000g + 1,000g [+1 Enhancement Bonus] + 2,000g [Fitting Magical Armor Quality] = 24,000g
+1 Fitting Non-Humanoid Fullplate: ((1,500g [Fullplate] + 150g [Masterwork] = 1,650g) * 2 [Medium Non-Humanoid Multiplier = 3,300g + 1,000g [+1 Enhancement Bonus] + 2,000g [Fitting Magical Armor Quality] = 6,300gThe 17,700g you saved could be used to improve the enhancement bonus:
+1 Enhancement Bonus is 1,000g (already included in the items listed above)
+2 Enhancement Bonus is 4,000g, or 3,000g added to the listed item prices.
+3 Enhancement Bonus is 9,000g, or 8,000g added to the listed item prices.
+4 Enhancement Bonus is 16,000g, or 15,000g added to the listed item prices.
Since bonus prices tend to go up exponentially, even the fairly cheap enhancement bonus to armor will get expensive after a little while so it is fairly important to focus on getting multiple small bonuses rather than one big bonus: For the 3,000g cost of going from a +1 enhancement bonus to a +2 enhancement bonus, you could get either a +1 Deflection Bonus ring or a +1 Natural Armor Enhancement bonus neckpiece for 2,000g and have the same AC with 1,000g left over.
General Armor Item Upgrade Progression:
+1 Armor for +1,000g (Mandatory for the Fitting Armor Quality)
+1 Ring for +2,000g
+1 Amulet for +2,000g
+2 Armor for +3,000g
+3 Armor for +5,000g
+2 Ring for +6,000g
+2 Amulet for +6,000g
+4 Armor for +7,000g
+5 Armor for +9,000g
+3 Ring for +10,000g
+3 Amulet for +10,000g