New Player Druid Build Suggestions

[Nicolas Paradise]

I will be running a Kingmaker 2E game soon and one of the players my fiance will be new to the system. The only class she has shown interest in at the moment is a druid(she plays and alchemist in a different 1e game otherwise she would have wanted to be a bomber).

Trying to get more than 'druid' out of her she expressed she would like to do stuff like nymphs from mythology like hiding in and out of trees and manipulating plants.

Was wondering if anyone on here has played anything like that and has a build suggestions that would help that along. In my quick flips through my books and aon a lot of that flavor doesn't hit until 7+ level.

[cavernshark]

Do note that many canonical powers of a nymph naturally won't be available to any class in the extreme until later levels. That said, tree shape is a level 2 primal spell available to any primal caster so there's lots of options here. The primal list generally is going to give you that plant manipulation feel. Tanglefoot seems like a default choice for a cantrip. Lose the Path and Protector Tree are good thematic 1st level options. Entangle, Tree Shape, Barkskin, all become available at 2nd level spells. Wall of Thorns and Soothing Blossoms at 3rd, Murderous Vine at 4th, etc.

Leaf Order Druid is the most obvious pick emphasizing plant spells and magic. The familiar and Goodberry order spell set the leaf druid up to do the primary things you're looking for. At level 8 she could pick up Fey Caller to add some more fey like magic to spells available. She can also expand into the Wild Order or just pick up the Plant Shape feat later to also be able to turn into plants.

The Fey and Nymph sorcerer bloodlines also grant a full primal spellcaster with fey flavor. You could make these the primary class or perhaps select the Nymph bloodline on your Plant Druid as a multiclass dedication. This path emphasizes more of the charismatic nature of the fey while still having all the magical access a Druid would have.

A third direction you could take this is a Summoner with a Fey eidolon themed after a nymph or a Plant eidolon themed as a companion to the Summoner who is a bit more 'druid/nymph-like'. This will be more mechanically complex so may not be a good first choice but definitely a way to capture some of what she's looking for especially if she wants a companion to be a part of the fiction.

[Nicolas Paradise]

cavernshark wrote:

snip

Some good advice here thanks. Another player IS going to be a Nymph Bloodline Sorcerer so that wouldn't be an option but I expect the two will play off each other.

[Guntermench]

Plant related Rituals could be fun for her. Probably have time in Kingmaker for them.

[Gortle]

I have some basic suggestions here

Mechanically I'd recommend that she starts as a Leaf Druid and then decides to either
a) take an animal companion, or
b) look at going wild shape for some savage melee options, or
c) pick up an offensive focus spell from Storm or Water orders via Advanced Elemental Spell

Pretty much always take Order Explorer to get into a second order. It rounds out your options.

But she probably needs to sort out her character concept and ancestry a bit first.

[Lucerious]

Sprite ancestry with Leaf Order Druid would go a long way to fill that concept.

[Nicolas Paradise]

Thanks for all the advice some of it will be useful but we ended up in a slightly different place. She ended up deciding on Elf(Tiefling) Wild order Druid. She decided she wants to eat faces as an (Owl)Bear instead of be a pretty plant lady.

[Taja the Barbarian]

Nicolas Paradise wrote:

Thanks for all the advice some of it will be useful but we ended up in a slightly different place. She ended up deciding on Elf(Tiefling) Wild order Druid. She decided she wants to eat faces as an (Owl)Bear instead of be a pretty plant lady.

I don't know the Kingmaker campaign, but I get the general impression it might not fit very well with Druids in general.

The Wild order in particular has an additional anathema that seems awkward at best:

Druidic Orders / Wild wrote:

Source Core Rulebook pg. 132 3.0

The savage, uncontrollable call of the natural world infuses you, granting you the ability to change your shape and take on the ferocious form of a wild creature. You are trained in Intimidation. You also gain the Wild Shape druid feat. You gain the wild morph order spell. Becoming fully domesticated by the temptations of civilization is anathema to your order. (This doesn’t prevent you from buying and using processed goods or staying in a city for an adventure, but you can never come to rely on these conveniences or truly call such a place your permanent home.)

Now I'd give a fair amount of leeway for typical 'murder-hobos for hire', but a campaign based on actually building a kingdom/civilization sound like something a Wild Druid would not approve of...

Even the other orders might have issues with this campaign:
Animal and Leaf orders have restriction on 'unnecessary' killings that should make you question 'is expanding/developing the kingdom truely necessary for survival???'

The Storm and Wave orders have an issue with pollution, which seems unlikely to be a problem but might come up.

The Stone and Flame order anathemas don't seem like they would be problematic.

[Nicolas Paradise]

Taja the Barbarian wrote:

Nicolas Paradise wrote:

Thanks for all the advice some of it will be useful but we ended up in a slightly different place. She ended up deciding on Elf(Tiefling) Wild order Druid. She decided she wants to eat faces as an (Owl)Bear instead of be a pretty plant lady.

I don't know the Kingmaker campaign, but I get the general impression it might not fit very well with Druids in general.

The Wild order in particular has an additional anathema that seems awkward at best:

Druidic Orders / Wild wrote:

Source Core Rulebook pg. 132 3.0

The savage, uncontrollable call of the natural world infuses you, granting you the ability to change your shape and take on the ferocious form of a wild creature. You are trained in Intimidation. You also gain the Wild Shape druid feat. You gain the wild morph order spell. Becoming fully domesticated by the temptations of civilization is anathema to your order. (This doesn’t prevent you from buying and using processed goods or staying in a city for an adventure, but you can never come to rely on these conveniences or truly call such a place your permanent home.)

Now I'd give a fair amount of leeway for typical 'murder-hobos for hire', but a campaign based on actually building a kingdom/civilization sound like something a Wild Druid would not approve of...

Even the other orders might have issues with this campaign:
Animal and Leaf orders have restriction on 'unnecessary' killings that should make you question 'is expanding/developing the kingdom truely necessary for survival???'

The Storm and Wave orders have an issue with pollution, which seems unlikely to be a problem but might come up.

The Stone and Flame order anathemas don't seem like they would be problematic.

I am the GM and am fairly permissive if the player can give reason. I advised her that she should when it comes to kingdom management time should work with the party to make it partially or entirely a wilderness settlement. Or at the very least cultivate a forest or druid glade within the borders of the kingdom. With one of the other players being a Nymph bloodline Sorcerer I don't see this being an issue.

If you care to know the whole Party is
Half-Elf Maestro Bard
Aasimar(Elf) Presision Ranger
Tiefling(Human) Liberator of Shelyn
Elf Nymph bloodline Sorcerer
Tiefling(Elf) Wild Druid
All alignments within one step of NG

[HumbleGamer]

The druid can easily sleep outside the settlement the other characters are living within.

No big deal with it imo.

ps: the attitude of cultivating a forest or druid glade within the borders of the kingdom feels more a domesticated thing though.

[Gortle]

Wild has one of these anathemas where it is clearly a spectrum. How extreme you want to play it is up to you. It could be a problem if you make it so, or if the party is really into slash and burn, but with reasonable allowances all around it can be fine.

[Taja the Barbarian]

Gortle wrote:

Wild has one of these anathemas where it is clearly a spectrum. How extreme you want to play it is up to you. It could be a problem if you make it so, or if the party is really into slash and burn, but with reasonable allowances all around it can be fine.

It's a fairly workable anathema in most campaigns, but when the entire campaign theme is actually building/expanding a kingdom, it just doesn't fit at all.

Druids kinda have to be treated like specific Clerics in that they don't always fit well into a campaign: Just like a Cleric of Milani doesn't fit well into a 'go enslave the world' campaign or a Cleric of Asmodeus in a 'free the slaves' campaign, Druids just don't fit very well into a 'expand civilization' campaign.

Technicalities and workarounds are probably fine for an adventure or two, but when they make up your entire career, you probably need to accept that your character doesn't actually believe in his/her 'faith' (for lack of a better term).

On a site note, I played a 5e wildshaping druid in the 'City of Danger' campaign a couple of years ago and it was just a terrible fit overall: My Druid had little connection to the city and really should have joined the 'bad guys' at one point (more along the lines of 'desperate and misguided' than 'bad' really, but still), and the plethora of low-level 'resistant to non-magical weapons' foes made wildshape damage really weak. Not every character works in every campaign...

I'll link this thread into the AP forum and see what people more familiar with the campaign think...

Addendum: AP Forum thread is https://paizo.com/threads/rzs43onn?Can-a-Wild-Order-Druid-PC-Work-In-the

[Gortle]

Taja the Barbarian wrote:

It's a fairly workable anathema in most campaigns, but when the entire campaign theme is actually building/expanding a kingdom, it just doesn't fit at all

Yes but it is a question of scope and balance. If civilisation means only 10-20% of the land in going to be made into farm land then a Druid could be OK with that, as just being a part of the overall ecology. If 90% of the land is cleared for farming or grazing baring only what is inaccessible (typical historically) then yes any Druid is going to have a problem. But that sort of decision lies with the players and the GM. Ecologically sound development is reasonable as a concept when you are coming from a low base.

Clearing out a few aberrant monsters is reasonably fine for a druid, wiping out herds of animals is not. It will very much depend on details that should be in the control of the GM. Maybe the Druid could accept that some civilisation is inevitable and they are merely trying to curb its excesses?

Not every druid will work, but some could if well thought out in a cooperative group. Is it a theme you want to engage?

[Squiggit]

Telling someone not to play a character because of an RP issue that might not even exist at that table just kind of feels like raining on someone else's parade.

Wild Order definitely needs some care and effort to smoothly fit in a campaign, but that's fine if that's the path the players and GM want to take.

[Nicolas Paradise]

So the way I try and think about things with my games is both my personal and that players perspective on the matters at hand even if that means applying modern ideals and morals(which I think is inevitable, if we were playing to the morals of the time periods we romanticize in these games women and girls wouldn't be players or if they were they could only be cooks and wives to players). I know that my fiancée is a modern eclectic pagan who loves and reveares nature. If being a magical witch or druid in real life was an option she would do it but at the same time she knows and accepts that society and technology have been a benefit to humans and when used properly are compatible with nature and can preserve it.

Look at the paid hunting safaris in africa where they let you hunt problem animals for big money and use that money to fund the conservation efforts and fund the reserves and pay the security that keeps the poachers away. This is been the most successful reduction of poachers in recent history.