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Is it possible to buy or make Handwraps of Might blows without a rune? Since Handwraps say you can transfer or upgrade as though it were a weapon, can you transfer off the basic Potency rune, leaving... Just cloth wraps? Do the empty wraps have a cost or crafting recipe?

Claxon |

Is it possible to buy or make Handwraps of Might blows without a rune? Since Handwraps say you can transfer or upgrade as though it were a weapon, can you transfer off the basic Potency rune, leaving... Just cloth wraps? Do the empty wraps have a cost or crafting recipe?
What are you trying to accomplish?
Normal (non-magical) headwraps wont do anything mechanically.

PossibleCabbage |

"I am wearing normal, non-magical handwraps" is much like "I am wearing socks". It has no mechanical effect, so you can pretty much just describe what your character is wearing however you want.
If your socks are magical, you might want to track whether you have them on or not, but if they stop being magical for some reason then you're still wearing (or not wearing) those socks.

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What are you trying to accomplish?
I feel that the motivation is immaterial - I'm trying to work out some specifics of low-detail items.
However, in case it matters...I am playing a character who focuses on natural attacks in an ongoing campaign at lower levels. I have not yet had the funds or opportunity to purchase HMB, but everyone else in the group already has a magic (i.e. basic potency) weapon. We just found a new magic weapon, which is surplus to requirements. I could sell the magic weapon, and put the funds towards handwraps, but I'd basically be losing half of the value, and still have to find the other half.
If I did not use natural attacks, I could either pick up the new weapon and use it, or I could transfer the rune from the new weapon to a preferred weapon. In my case, the preferred weapon is Handwraps. The rules for handwraps says you can transfer or upgrade runes on it just like a weapon. This implies the rune is separate to the actual wraps. So, what I actually want to do is transfer the rune from the found weapon to a new set of handwraps. If I have to buy them with a minimum of a potency rune to be able to transfer, then this won't work. But if there is some cost for a basic wrap, separate to the rune, it would be worthwhile.

Claxon |

Regarding selling magic weapons, you should. And remind your GM that you and group should have a certain amount of wealth by level and that if you're selling gear you can't use and you're not at the correct amount of wealth by level then the GM needs to drop additional loot to make that happen.
Regarding transferring runes, in order to put any property runes on the hand wraps, you would need to have a potency rune on it first.
However, I think you can transfer the potency rune first and then other property runes. Remember that it will require time and money (10% of rune cost) to do so. So it's cheaper than buying new, but not free.
But again, remind your GM that they should be making sure you're at WBL, even when you are selling items because you can't use them or have outgrown them.

Mathmuse |
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Having to sell inappropriate weapons for half their value in order to buy an appropriate weapon is part of the game design. My current campaign started with a druid, two rogues, and a ranger. The +1 weapons they found at 2nd level were martial weapons that only the ranger could use. At 3rd level, we gained a 5th player character, a champion who had Magical Crafting, so she transferred runes to the weapons the rogues already had.
Handwraps of Mighty Blows (+1) cost 35 gp. A Magic Weapon (+1) also costs 35 gp. The unarmed warrior is no worse off than a weapon-using warrior, except for having less chance of finding a useable item among random loot.
The rules on applying property runes to handwraps are described indirectly, "You can upgrade, add, and transfer runes to and from the handwraps just as you would for a weapon, and you can attach talismans to the handwraps." The weapon rule is:
The number of property runes a weapon or armor can have is equal to the value of its potency rune. A +1 weapon can have one property rune, but it could hold another if the +1 weapon potency rune were upgraded to a +2 weapon potency rune. Since the striking and resilient runes are fundamental runes, they don't count against this limit.
I believe that this means the limit on attaching property runes to handwraps is no more than the item bonus on the handwraps. A +0 handwraps could not have property runes.
+0 handwraps give no item bonus to attacks and cannot have property runes. They could have a striking rune but those cost 65 gp, beyond the budget of a character who cannot afford +1 handwraps. Upgrading a +0 handwraps to a +1 handwraps would cost 35 gp, the same as the price of a new set of +1 handwraps.
The only practical use of a +0 handwraps would be attaching talismans or attaching an available +1 weapon potency rune, perhaps from a looted martial weapon. I don't see any reason for a shop to stock +0 handwraps. On the other hand, I would allow a character with Magical Crafting and the formula for +1 handwraps to make +1 handwraps of mighty blows out of a +1 weapon potency rune already on hand, for only the 3.5 gp price for transferring the rune.

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Quote:What are you trying to accomplish?I feel that the motivation is immaterial - I'm trying to work out some specifics of low-detail items.
However, in case it matters...I am playing a character who focuses on natural attacks in an ongoing campaign at lower levels. I have not yet had the funds or opportunity to purchase HMB, but everyone else in the group already has a magic (i.e. basic potency) weapon. We just found a new magic weapon, which is surplus to requirements. I could sell the magic weapon, and put the funds towards handwraps, but I'd basically be losing half of the value, and still have to find the other half.
If I did not use natural attacks, I could either pick up the new weapon and use it, or I could transfer the rune from the new weapon to a preferred weapon. In my case, the preferred weapon is Handwraps. The rules for handwraps says you can transfer or upgrade runes on it just like a weapon. This implies the rune is separate to the actual wraps. So, what I actually want to do is transfer the rune from the found weapon to a new set of handwraps. If I have to buy them with a minimum of a potency rune to be able to transfer, then this won't work. But if there is some cost for a basic wrap, separate to the rune, it would be worthwhile.
if you spend any time on these forums, you'll run into the 'simple question' post where the answers given are technically correct but completely irrelevant because the poster's unstated plan was somehow fatally flawed in a different manner.
Your question gives off 'those vibes' and while it seems those 'vibes' were unfounded, it's generally best to explain your objective up front so posters can see the bigger picture.Also, responders might have a better solution to your broader issue, but they won't suggest it if they don't understand what your actual objective is...
As for your actual issue, there aren't any non-magical handwraps that I am aware of, but logically they must exist (presumably, you need to enchant non-magical handwraps to get the magical ones) and I doubt any GM would have an issue with you obtaining some and then transferring your runes onto it.

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Handwraps of Mighty Blows (+1) cost 35 gp. A Magic Weapon (+1) also costs 35 gp.
Y'know, that little reminder there cinches it for me. Nonmagical handwraps must exist (else how do the magical ones get made), and the cost of them is likely negligible.
A good thing I'm not doing this in PFS, I suppose.

Candlejake |
A good thing I'm not doing this in PFS, I suppose.
In PFS you very easily have the gold as soon as you hit level 2 and can just buy it between games.
I think the problem is more with unexperienced, stingy or "realism" focused GMs that either hand out too little gold or just go "well this backwater town doesnt HAVE a magic items shop, sorry, no class essential item for you"
I like the concept of +0 Handwraps and think they would have been a more elegant solution. Since they dont give bonuses you could buy them at level 1 like you would a weapon and then have something that you can transfer runes to when you find a magic weapon that you dont need, just as you would for weapon using classes.
Its more of a problem with GMs that are more "gritty" or even antagonistic, in other games you will find handrwaps soon enough that it isnt a problem.
By RAW, no there are no basic handwraps that you can transfer a +1 rune to. But i would definately allow it as a gm.