Candlejake's page

Candlejake wrote:

Jalmeray Heavenseeker Dedication was declared as legal in lost Omens impossible lands (the lost omens version, not the AP version). There is still no Boon to actually get the archetype though, as its uncommon. So its legal but cannot be picked.

This is no longer true.

Could you elaborate which part is no longer true? I still dont see a boon for it.

Jalmeray Heavenseeker Dedication was declared as legal in lost Omens impossible lands (the lost omens version, not the AP version). There is still no Boon to actually get the archetype though, as its uncommon. So its legal but cannot be picked.

Elemental Mystics first focus spell feels quite unwieldy. You kinda have to do this before combat, because your ally needs free hands. Honestly id rather it enhances an existing weapon

Right now the soldier looks very strong but is kept very limited by being super MAD.

primary fire is really strong but it doesnt key off your main stat. Area Fire does use your main stat since it uses CON, but your save proficiency grows slower than your attack proficiency (at level 7 instead of 5 for example.)

And Close Quarters is just the MADest thing ive ever seen. You want high STR for your melee weapons, high dex for primary fire because you likely still want some range and high con for your saves

Im not opposed to Soldier being a CON class but as of now they are unbelievably MAD. Especially Close Quarters.

Close Quarters mentions still being to wield ranged weapons. There is also this very cool level 16 feature that allows you to hold a twohanded gun in one hand and a twohanded melee weapon in the other. But for that to work you need high STR, high CON AND high DEX.

Primary target needs to key off main stat, be it CON or STR. otherwise the class will always need DEX. It would make sense for primary Target to not have dex scaling since the guns are unwieldy and you are able to ignore it and you can flavour that as being able to ignore it with body strenght alone.

Making it a strenght class would also fix the MADness of Close Quarters.
Then again it wouldnt REALLY matter as long as primary fire keys off main stat.

I also kinda think the "melee area fire" feat should be the Close Quarters bonus and the RS the first level feat.

Giving a hazard encounter just one possible skillcheck and that at expert is just rude honestly. if you dont have that you can whack a hazard for half an hour

Id rather get content for the classes that are already out. More Champion causes (though i understand we get a new one), more monk stances, more ranger hunters edges, more Magus studies, more feats for everyone.

Monk is one of the few classes I feel like I'm missing out by not being human for the extra class feat. I see what monk can get and I want everything.

Hard agree. Would be nice if Monk just got an extra level 1 class feat for picking a stance or monastic weaponry.

Its nice that monks get crit specialisation for fists automatically, i think that was stated.

Other that that i agree with most people that a damage buff for monk and a way to make FoB unique to them would be nice. I would love some feats that improve FoB, like stunning strike. Maybe an action that improves the next FoB, adds some damage or debuffs or sth like that. Many special actions that monk gets kinda have the problem of competing with FoB.

Id also, personally, would love a d12 strenght based stance

(P.93) The Giant Wasp animal companion has an ability that seems like it should be one action, not two.
The ability "Darting Stab" seems similar to the Dromeasaurs "Darting Attack" where you can step 10 feet and attack or attack and step 10 feet as a single action.

The riding was has the ability Darting Sting or sth like that and allows to fly 15 feet and attack or attack and fly 15 feet, but its listed as 2 actions.

That would kinda make no sense to me because you would spend to actions to move less than you could if you just spend an action to move and then to attack, since the wasp has a 40 feet fly speed.

Congratulations to Zachary and Jess!

Excited for the new books! Im still hoping for a Boon for the Heavenseeker dedication though. The second iteration of it from Lost Omens was declared legal for PFS but since it is uncommon you would need a boon for it and there is none...

A boon to access the updated Jalmeri Heavenseeker archetype from Lost Omens Impossible Lands.

PFS entry to that book states that the updated version of this is now legal, but since it is uncommon it needs a boon to be accessed and it doesnt have one

Interested to see how it works out because for the premise, i just cant imagine my players to not instantly side with the Forest against the forces of civilisation. Maybe my players just arent the "peacebrokers" type and instead would rather encourage chaos and bloodshed lol. And i can inagine many players wanting to pick a side. Hope the adventure factors that in somehow.

Love the 5-15 range though and big fan of the theme

Im necromancing this thread again. Do i have to give up on this archetype ever becoming available? Got a monk ready for it for the longest time now.

Still no love for dual wielding or throwing.

Two actions to pull out a weapon with each hand, unless you use two hands to grab one weapon, same for swapping, not to mention the tax of extra runes or gear to duplicate runes and returning tax on throwing.

It's already more effective to use big sword, no need to bully the duals.

I dont think dualwielding in pf2e is that bad. Dual Strikes is pretty damn strong and afaik a dualwielding fighter was always considered the pinnacle of damage. I remember the reddit post from a GM where the whole party was fighters dual wielding flickmaces...

Maybe a slight buff to dualwielding if you have to draw something else like a potion: i heard if you interact to draw something you can stow something with the same action.

On theme of dislikes: cantrip changes are a huge miss for me mostly. No cantrip comes close to EA once again and EA got nerfed effectively. I REALLY hate that they tacked on the "must have both hands free" unto that wind cantrip that attacks two people. Why. Just why.
Daze is still H2?
On the other hand all traditions have access to needle darts which is a good one.

I somewhat like the change of removing spell mod to damage for cantrips in favour of dice because most of my players literally always forget what a spell modifier is even after finishing a 1-20 campaign and now being level 7 in the next one.

It seems like they didnt want to change too much, which i guess i understand but it seems like a missed opportunity to at least create one alternative on par with EA. Maybe in PC2...

Not a huge fan of winter sleet as well, because i like abilities more self contained. Winter sleet is weird because it hinges on interpretations of balance and uneven ground and therefor has this weird static DC as well that doesnt increase with levels.

MAkes the ability feel like it being THAT strong wasnt intended.

Would prefer it using class DC and a Reflex save instead.

The shadow remains cast,

Bayonetta reference?

Cant wait to see the whole picture of the new witch!

There is a feat called wind seeker that gives additional Options. I strongly suspect there will be more of those for higher level battleforms. Given that druid also needs to invest feats to improve wild shape that would seem fair

some way to gain medium armor would be necessary, otherwise strenght exemplars become really bad. And tbh if i think of the classic demigods and heroic figures they seem mostyl strenght based in my head.

I like the idea for a scarcely armored Exemplar, but a feat or feature that equates to medium armor would be real nice for that. As Vamp said, something like Titan scales, a feat that lets your skin be real hard etc

The Exemplar has lots of cool Ikons and i really like the modularity of the class but there is an ability that stood out to me. The Transcendence ability from the Victors Wreath worn Ikon "One Moment till Glory"

You rally your allies, carrying them from the brink

of disaster to the verge of victory. Each ally in your aura
immediately makes a new saving throw with a +2 status
bonus against one ongoing negative effect or condition
they are currently affected by, even if that effect would not
normally allow a new saving throw.

So at first this seemed very useful to me in combat. Your ally gets hit with a nasty spell, say they crit fail against overwhelming presence. You give them another save with a +2 even if the effect doesnt normally grant one. Or you free them of being slowed or paralyzed or stunned.

Yeah i was at the start so happy about magus that i didnt give summoner the propper attention but honestly both classes are fantastic. Summoner is super versatile and allows both caster and melee gameplay. The damage is good, the roleplay opportunities are great and there are lots of different styles you can play them as. Evolution surge is also fantastic! Combats where you have to climb or swim dont happen often but can be super annoying when they happen. You are prepared for all of that and more.

As much as i love the magus, i even have to say summoner is better designed. The difference between subclasses for the magus is just a bit too much and i am still disappointed how bad inexorable iron is (if only the focus spell was usefull...)

Playing a plant summoner currently and am already excited to hit the levels where the build fully takes of (from level 6 on every level will bring me closer to being the high reach AoO monster i want to be)

Thermal Nimbus: I think this is better than you're rating it, thanks to the synergy with Fire's Aura Junction. Note that your allies will usually be safe since they're gaining DR = level and taking damage = 1/2 level resulting in no damage, but in niche circumstances like an ally with a fire weakness you could potentially add Safe Elements.

Hard agree. This Impulse is amazing. I see the Fire resistance to friends as a minor bonus and also a way to not have to take safe elements with this. Paired with Aura Junction you essentially deal your level in damage to all enemies around you, without a save, every turn. That just is really great especially once you get shape Aura. The damage isnt super high but the value rises the longer a fight takes and the more enemies there are.

Fire Kineticits want to be close to enemies anyways, since they wanna trigger their Aura Junction so i honestly think every fire kineticist wants this.

I think for Weapon Infusion i'd mention how the thrown and propulsive traits are pretty nice for Kineticists that get an Armor option. Earth effectively gaining +3 damage on their EB if the enemy is in 20 feet range is pretty great, especially at low levels. Propulsive even INCREASES the range of all EB aside from fire and air while also giving it added damage.

The biggest draw back here is that it is a free action you can do before a blast. So you CANNOT use it for the blast you can do as part of Channel Elements. For some builds that might be the only kind of Blast they do if they focus on doing Overflow impulses most turns.

Candlejake wrote:

Its an aura and therefor competes with Thermal nimbus

Maybe I am missing something. But I am not seeing anything that says that you can't have two effects active for your Kinetic Aura.

Now, Thermal Nimbus is a Stance, and that would conflict with other Stance actions and abilities. You can only have one Stance active at a time. But a Kinetic Junction to the Aura is not a Stance.

As the other poster said, i misstyped. Both are stances, cant have two stances up at the same time. Most things that affect the aura like that are stances

Well probably no.

That's too good to be true (in general this rule is more to, if there's two ways to apply a rule, use the worse).

I dont know if its necessarily too good to be true. Its an aura and therefor competes with Thermal nimbus which is guaranteed damage. So in cases of many enemies and Shape Aura, which is not far off from kindle inner flames, it might be worse, since nimbus is guaranteed damage.

I think Fire and Earth work pretty well together. Thermal nimbus wants you pretty close (pre level 10) and armor in eath helps with that. You lose out on the Fire impulse junction for a while (since you wanna pick up aura junction at 5), but you gain damage to Elemental Blasts by being able to invest in strenght and a d8 blast. And weapon infusion gives you decent range while also allowing you to use STR at range. You can also gain Lava leap early which is amazing.

Less damage than mono fire, but a tankier spin on Thermal Nimbus+ Aura junction shenanigans and more options against fire resistant enemies (not all of those have the fire trait so Extract Elements doesnt solve all resistances) and also gaining some support via Spike Skin and Wall of stone.. Thermal Nimbus solves stones problem of being a great tank with no way to draw aggro. With your strenght investment you can even grapple foes or hit them with your Strenght Boosted elemental blasts

Access to damage types like Mental, Divine and Sonic would be useful too ^^;

Rumor has it about a Void kineticist coming later on, which would be very cool.

Number 1 is def a problem with golems and not kineticist. Because that is a problem every caster has with golems unless you, out of pure luck packed the right damage type.

Im still of the opinion that golem anti magic is the single most stupid and unclear thing in the game and i hope the bastion with spell resistance is how they are gonna fix it.

I know the general counterargument is to use golems sparingly and let players gather clues that one is coming up but let me tell you thats not how APs handle it. Extinction Curse has so many f&#$ing golem encounters, like i cant even tell you. Against very few there are clues that golems are coming up, so its pure luck to have the right spells and occult casters are f+%~ed anyways in most cases.

Found Luis's response in Discord screenshot from reddit.

Oof. I hope they dont stick with that. It leads to swingier damage and also, hilariously, to magus not caring about INT at all anymore.

I was hoping for a buff to cantrips, to elevate them to EA level. Casters being "too weak" is one of the complaints of the system that keeps some players out, so i dont know why you would nerf cantrips straight through the board. Even needle darts, that looks like more damage is pretty much produce flame damage. At higher range at least and being able to trigger weaknesses but still.

The other thing people talk about here. My players definately are still sometimes confused about spellcasting modifier. They are not gamers for the most part and all use pathbuilder.
Its different for physical attacks because there, you have your one trusty strike that always adds this ammount. Might grow over levels but not like you have to remember much. For spells, some add Modifier, most dont. Then they try to remember what their spellcasting modifier means. It happens more often than id like.

This response also makes "casters might be able to add mod to damage for all spells" a bigger cope. Really doesnt look like it.

Also the first time i read about the air cantrip requiring two free hands. That seems like a really unnecessary requirement.

Nice, free tieflings and aasimar! And cheaper geniekin. Im in heaven.

...concerning heaven, im still waiting for a boon for the heavenseeker archetype from Lost omens: impossible lands (since half a year now or sth? FAQ says specifically it is legal but there is no way of accessing it since its uncommon)

Kineticist seems definately compatible with current rules. Hell its out before the remaster. So i dont think that should be a problem.

Convincing of the remaster is a different idea. And probably will only work when that is out.

Void Kineticist sounds pretty cool, would be hype.

My current main idea is a Fire Earth dual gate kineticist. Invest in strenght and get the earth armor. Blast enemies with weapon infusion. Jump at foes with lava leap. Get the Fire Aura Junction and the Fire stance that does fire damage to enemies to be a continual, heavily armored damage tornado. You dont even need aura shaping for that.
A bit weaker in damage than single gate fire but with better defenses, being able to stay closer to enemies better for the aura damage. Weapon infusion makes it quite versatile, being able to EB at long range, or use thrown or propulsive to apply str to damage. Also getting some AoEs and mobility from impulses and later some walls for control.

I imagine the character as a kinda shy artist/blacksmith that in combat dons a black obsidian armor with flames spouting out of the gaps and becomes this intimidating figure summoning obsidian or lava weapons that fly at enemies. Id have most impulses flavoured as some sort of weapon related spell. Raining spears from above for aoe and the like.

The second idea is Air water dual gate. I kinda wanted solo air to work but i think it lacks some stuff. This one i havent characterized fully yet but i imagine some gozreh vibes and focus on weather related things. Dashing around with the thunder dash, hindering enemies with the frost stance and picking up enemies and dripping them with the composite spell ( this one seems so good, thats 2d6+20 damage and prone, though it gets limited hard when inside or against flying enemies). This one is less Blasting heavy as the first one but gains great mobility, some healing, some area denial. Will need aura shaping for the frost aura.

Why not both? I like true strike (especially since i like magus)

I actually fully believe something like Kineticists gate attenuator is coming for casters. They probably wanted to put it in the new core book though. Or maybe test it out a bit more.

I am bumping this again.

There is still no boon for the archetype. This is pretty frustrating. Is there a way to ask for stuff like this other than Posting in this forum? It really feels like an oversight that there is still no way to access this archetype, while it was specifically mentioned to be legal.

Thaumaturge is a fun class and a really good one but I dont think it should overshadow your group.

Rogue is a utility powerhouse with decent damage. Its squishier then others but actually so is Thaumaturge (though you mitigate that very well with amulet). You mention rogues damage being a bit less than yours but you have to spend an action to trigger your weaknesses. Unless you are facing Single strong enemies, they often go down after you Land one attack, making you need to do EV again on the next enemy. While you EV the rogue can get a second attack in, for example. Also for most levels their to hit Bonus should be higher than yours.

If the Ranger is ranged that is expected to deal less damage than a melee.

As others said you have gotten diverse lore wrong and accidentally made it much more powerful. Whoops. Its still a very powerful feat though.

Personally, while I like my thaumaturge, it has performed a bit worse than I thought. I play them in PFS where most fights are pretty quick and against multiple weaker enemies, so my EV is often over quickly and I get my AoO from the weapon implement rarely. There are whole sessions with multiple combat where it just doesnt trigger and im even using a reach weapon! (Mostly because my EV target dies)

It seems like the rest of your party is playing a bit suboptimal. Rogue for example is IMO one of the best classes in the game.
I feel like if your party saw another martial in action they would lose it lol.
Maybe if you really want to demonstrate that bring a dragon instinct barbarian if you have to switch classes. Now that is damage.

A big gripe i have is gunslinger and dualwielding pistols. GnG features lots and lots of pictures of dual wielding pistols but the build itself is really clunky. Pistolero is maybe the Gunslinger way implied to enable that playstyle but actually has no support whatsoever for it. Doesnt even allow you to draw two pistols with the initiative free action.

capacity works with slingers reload only because the devs said so specifically. dual weapon reload doesnt work with slinger reload at all, which would be an okay trade off it it at least reloaded both weapons.

There needs to be an actual dual wielding gunslinger way.

Doesnt exist yet. Though since soon the focus will shift to Tian Xia, we might get it. I assume as an archetype though tbh

I can only give a PFS perspective concerning Magus:
I feel my spellslots are enough actually. Realistically i only need my highest and second highest for spellstriking, anything below is probably worse than a cantrip.
Sure magus doesnt get lower level spell slots, but through endless grimoire, studious spells, ring of wizardry and maybe an archetype you get all the lower level spell slots you need for filling them with true strikes.

That said PFS feels like a clear perfect scenario for magus. You can guesstimate how many encounters there are gonna be and you definately know when the boss encounter is coming. Therefor its easier to save your higher level slots for that and use the lower ones and cantrips for the encounters before. If they had more highest level spellslots they would probably be broken.

Has no one mentioned the barricade buster yet? That thing is goated.

Right? that thing seems pretty damn strong. I mean yeah the volley trait in combination with the short range makes spacing a bit awkward but id say it is pretty realistic to be able to stay in that range.

And because of the orc trait getting it down to martial proficiency is pretty easy via feats

Hey Guys,

A question since i'm Running Pathfinder Society i wanted to ask how exactly that works with the level up.

I know you dont really use your PFS chars for this, but do you have to use the Premades for Society play?

And how do you handle the level up mid session?

They plan scenarios months in advance. The developers may even have an adventure where they want to include access to this archetype in mind, but it hasn't been written yet.

Hmm

Damn, I hope the wait isnt that long. Got a monk waiting at level 3

I think that access will be gained from a scenario, much like the skelaton anstrey was add by an adventure. Well ACP but and adventure opened the way.

That would be interesting.

I assume a boon is to come, I just found it weird that the society character options specifically mention the archetype as now being legal and then there is no boon

With Impossible lands the Jalmeri Heavenseeker dedication finally got an update and is no longer OP. It has also been declared legal for society play.

Boons for the Ancestries of Lost Omens Impossible Lands have already been added but I cant find a boon for the Heavenseeker archetype. (Or the other archetype in that book for that matter)

Is that something that normally takes longer? Is there a way to access it without a boon, since it is uncommon?

Pixel Popper wrote:

Gortle wrote:

... Because wrestling are Athletic checks everyone can get Legendary proficiency in them and because they are again Reflex or Fortitude DC they are typically against a lower defence than AC. Fighters don't have an advantage here...

The clincher is that many of the Wrestler Archetype's moves are not Athletics checks, but are Unarmed Strikes with a wrestling move rider à la Combat Grab. For those, the Fighter's greater accuracy is a benefit, particularly for a routine like: Grab (Athletics check, no MAP) then Suplex (Unarmed strike w/ MAP vs Flat-Footed).

I mean yes Suplex is an attack. Another in Wrestler is Aerial Piledriver. If that is what you want to do then go for it. But you already have the enemy grappled so you are under MAP, and you let go of the target when you do, so if you fail the roll your enemy is not prone and not flat footed to anyone else. Personally it sounds cool, it just seems like you have added a 60% failure chance to what you have already down ie grappled them. I just don't think its a good tactic just a fun one. I'd rather just strike.

I mean we are talking about the wrestler archetype. If you don't want to suplex or areal piledriver enemies... you probably wouldn't pick that archetype.

And it's not just Suplex and piledriver that require Unarmed strikes. Running tackle, elbow breaker and strangle do as well.
It's only a couple that require Athletics checks

While Monk sounds like a no brainer for Wrestler, i think fighter might be the best fit for the archetype. Most of the Maneuvers that Wrestler gives do not require an Athletics check, but an unarmed strike. And fighter gets the best bonuses here.
Monks FoB doesnt work that well with the archetype, since generally youll want to do "Grab -> wrestler action" so there isnt really space for two attacks that advance MAP. mixed Maneuver and Flurry of Maneuvers are nice to get a grapple off, but both advance the MAP quite a bit.
Dont get me wrong, i love the monk class but it actualy doesnt seem to mesh that well with wrestler.

Barbarian is another option They also get some grab related feats and are bulky but fighter again beats them just for unarmed proficiency.

I also like swashbuckler, derring do is great for getting that grab off, but after that its back to unarmed strikes. Also derring do comes online somewhat late.

I'd say Grab an ancestry that Upgrades your unarmed strikes to at least a d6, or gives some d8 options (i like lizardfolk for that) and go for the fighter

Really excited for the jalmeri heavenseeker archetype Reprint that is supposed to be in there. Love the archetype but it has problems, lol.

The nagaji also look amazing, I love the Art.

Very excited for this book.

Candlejake wrote:

I guess what i was asking is if SoT expects you to fill half of a session or more with roleplay. Because i dont think i am able to improv that well, let alone my players.

Book 1 and 2 actually read kinda interesting so i think ill give those a try and see if the players and i enjoy it.

I would love to play AV, but i dont think megadungeon appeals to my players that much. Because opposed to the impression people got here they are not murderhobos. Not roleplaying that much isnt equal to murderhoboing. And they do like solving combat through diplomacy or creatively so i think that works out perfectly.

More than half of Book 4 is roleplay.

Wait what? That sounds insane haha. How does that even work

I guess what i was asking is if SoT expects you to fill half of a session or more with roleplay. Because i dont think i am able to improv that well, let alone my players.

Book 1 and 2 actually read kinda interesting so i think ill give those a try and see if the players and i enjoy it.

I would love to play AV, but i dont think megadungeon appeals to my players that much. Because opposed to the impression people got here they are not murderhobos. Not roleplaying that much isnt equal to murderhoboing. And they do like solving combat through diplomacy or creatively so i think that works out perfectly.

SoT is roleplay-heavy and has a focus on nonviolent solutions. You’re also only students for two books. I think your group would be better served with a different AP.

They are also up for being teachers.

And I might have misrepresented them, they are not combat hungry or sth and they do enjoy solving of avoiding combat creatively. They just suck at roleplaying and tend to be a bit antagonistic towards NPCs unless they are hot older men.

Edit: Also is the "combats are avoidable and diplomacy is more important" - theme stronger in later levels?
Ive read through book 1 and aside from the 1 pugwampi encounter that gives other options to solve it it doesnt necessarily seem that much less combat heavy than other boos ive read.
Or to say if i like the balance book 1 strikes, can i expect similar things from the rest?

Just started the last book of EC and some of my group are already pretty hype to play the "magic school" adventure.
I have already read through kindled magic and it does look fun.

My main question would be if the AP is also fun for a group that is less roleplay focused. The AP gets recommended often for groups that prefer to err heavy on the roleplay side.

We do roleplay some times and i like to speak as the villains but it really isnt the strong suit of either me or my players. For example they will roleplay with me speaking an NPC but very rarely among each other.

I worry that SoT is more for groups that have fun fully roleplaying an hour of shopping or basically play more like an improv group with occasional dice rolling.

Any light RP dms here that still enjoyed SoT? Are combats in this AP still fun?

A good thing I'm not doing this in PFS, I suppose.

In PFS you very easily have the gold as soon as you hit level 2 and can just buy it between games.

I think the problem is more with unexperienced, stingy or "realism" focused GMs that either hand out too little gold or just go "well this backwater town doesnt HAVE a magic items shop, sorry, no class essential item for you"

I like the concept of +0 Handwraps and think they would have been a more elegant solution. Since they dont give bonuses you could buy them at level 1 like you would a weapon and then have something that you can transfer runes to when you find a magic weapon that you dont need, just as you would for weapon using classes.

Its more of a problem with GMs that are more "gritty" or even antagonistic, in other games you will find handrwaps soon enough that it isnt a problem.

By RAW, no there are no basic handwraps that you can transfer a +1 rune to. But i would definately allow it as a gm.