Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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Well yes, I don't believe Sara did anything wrong, but still we don't really know. People under serious stress can do things no one would suspect. I have seen people that couldn't manage stress break and act in a way no one would ever suspect. Anything is possible and it was reported that...
I can't disagree. Part of me feels bad that I'm making assertions that Paizo can't dispute without putting Sara in a negative light or subjecting them to liability.
But the bigger part of me sees a toxic manager abusing their power. And the limited information I have access to paints that picture pretty clearly.
And I expect better of Paizo. More accurately, Sara is Paizo to me. Losing her is a problem.
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After taking time to process, this is what I think:
1. I don't intend to cancel my subscriptions, not only did my group basically tell me they have no intention of switching from Pathfinder 2e (and its literally the best game system for us, period) I ultimately want to support the people on the ground that have made this game and community inclusive and great.
2. Of course, this means that my own staying is contingent on those same people pushing to make the game the best it can be, if I see them left helpless to make their workplace better and have to leave, there's nothing here to stay for and we could switch to homebrew or be lured away by someone else.
3. Aaron you mention several suggestions and announcements in terms of making things better, I'm not going to poo poo your statement because I understand that even at the best of times Paizo is financially a fairly tight ship, but I want to impress upon your bosses the gravity of the situation and that they better be prepared to go a long way with that-- they may have to make real sacrifices to do it right. As things unfold, that might mean that individuals who are responsible for the problems may need to step away from power.
3.5. This may mean that the owners of the company may need to strongly consider alternative management solutions, I'm aware that's easier said than done, but I like to think there are individuals within Paizo who are trusted by the staff who would be capable of taking on greater responsibilities in steering the ship, I strongly urge Paizo to give employees a directly democratic voice in these proceedings. The formation of a Union would be a MASSIVE show of good faith and I feel that if Librarians can have them, so can game designers, failing that (for whatever reason, maybe they can't work everywhere) I would suggest that the company be organized to have employees elect some members of the administrative team or something similar, some kind of half unionization solution. I am 200% sure that budget transparency with such a body would yield fair conditions for employees that are also sustainable financially for Paizo. These are already compromises, the real BIG MOVE would be for Paizo to become a coop, but that's probably a pipe dream for obvious reasons.
4. I trust Erik Mona's statements about his own hobbies and that he isn't a Nazi, and that leads me into noting that Jessica in particular seems to have a tendency of trying to play things up in order to strengthen her position once she's decided her opposition 'deserves it' for opposing her, which is a major red flag for me-- between her statements on Erik Mona, her initial painting of Diego as a 'POC being fired' and the intent that carries, her earlier comments disparaging the PF2e itself and the people who designed it, and her intentionally cryptic allusion to the mob despite the irrelevance and innocence of Paizo in that story, in tandem with her problematic history suggest to me that she's problematic and very likely to be abusive in her own personal life-- which FYI for others, people lie for the same reason rapists and sexual abusers do what they do despite potentially negative consequences for them: power and control, not everyone makes the most rational decisions, and lying about a target is a recognized form of abuse.
4.5. That doesn't say anything about whether or not Sara's termination was wrongful (morally) the latter situation seems mishandled, given that Diego resigned over it and I'm willing to take that as evidence that something is wrong with Paizo's personnel practices. As for Crystal's Allegations, they seem serious and we need greater transparency SPECIFICALLY on the terms freelancers and employees are given, as well as Paizo's practices in terms of lodging. We need to know that Paizo's internal policies offer greater protection than the minimum required by the law.
5. If you guys come out swinging and nail this whole thing with the right steps, I want you to understand that the company can come out from it stronger internally, AND in terms of the fandom's love and trust. We're past the point where I trust any company to be morally pure, even the queerest and the most radical talk-the-talk and walk-the-walk indies I half expect to go down in the flames of allegations and inappropriate behavior someday, so this needs to be about the steps Paizo takes to make themselves better for the people who work there.
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Gonna pull some random thoughts together here.
All conjecture so anyone who wants to say 'but you don't know' Let me start by saying I have no idea if any of this is true.
Of the rumors I hear, the one that is most believable right now in Washington is that someone, probably the new Director of Community as that would Sara Marie's direct supervisor, or their Direct Supervisor which would likely be Jeff Alvarez got it in their head that it would be a good idea to tell the entire CS team they have to come back to the office to work.
This is a problem. In Washington the delta variant is running rampant, not as bad as Arizona or Florida, but it isn't good. I personally have friends who are being turned away for elective procedures that they NEED because they don't have the rooms.
Sara Marie, who advocates for her team, would likely say 'this is dumb' and repeat this until someone hears, or she is fired. We know where that path lead.
Now we have another member who they possibly thought could take over as 'lead CS' because it costs less to have a Lead than a Manager and now that we have a new Director of Community you no longer need the middle manager. So lets save some bucks and make the next in line tell the team to get in the office.
Enter Diego, who says, 'seriously? you guys fired her for that? I QUIT!' and then heads to social media to announce it.
Now we are here, after a random person spilt tea about the company which honestly just added some flavor to the already spicy mixture.
The people in charge of this situation created it for themselves. We are running out of ICU beds in Washington, doesn't help that Idaho is now shipping their sick to Washington because they are already at triage capacity where their doctors are making the decisions on who is more likely to live with care vs who needs it more.
If this isn't what happened, anyone at Paizo is more than welcome to come on in and fill in the details. No? Well this is literally the least offensive scenario I can come up with, it only gets worse from here.
Editted to Add:
If the reason you want people in the office is someone can answer a phone I suggest you pay 25 bucks and get a ring central number. They can install the app at home, or even on their cell phone. You forward the CS number to the ring central number and boom, you have a CS line now. 2 years later and you still haven't sorted this out.
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Gonna pull some random thoughts together here.
All conjecture so anyone who wants to say 'but you don't know' Let me start by saying I have no idea if any of this is true.
Of the rumors I hear, the one that is most believable right now in Washington is that someone, probably the new Director of Community as that would Sara Marie's direct supervisor, or their Direct Supervisor which would likely be Jeff Alvarez got it in their head that it would be a good idea to tell the entire CS team they have to come back to the office to work.
This is a problem. In Washington the delta variant is running rampant, not as bad as Arizona or Florida, but it isn't good. I personally have friends who are being turned away for elective procedures that they NEED because they don't have the rooms.
Sara Marie, who advocates for her team, would likely say 'this is dumb' and repeat this until someone hears, or she is fired. We know where that path lead.
Now we have another member who they possibly thought could take over as 'lead CS' because it costs less to have a Lead than a Manager and now that we have a new Director of Community you no longer need the middle manager. So lets save some bucks and make the next in line tell the team to get in the office.
Enter Diego, who says, 'seriously? you guys fired her for that? I QUIT!' and then heads to social media to announce it.
Now we are here, after a random person spilt tea about the company which honestly just added some flavor to the already spicy mixture.
The people in charge of this situation created it for themselves. We are running out of ICU beds in Washington, doesn't help that Idaho is now shipping their sick to Washington because they are already at triage capacity where their doctors are making the decisions on who is more likely to live with care vs who needs it more.
If this isn't what happened, anyone at Paizo is more than welcome to come on in and fill in the details. No? Well this is literally the least offensive scenario I can come...
I can agree that this is probable.
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they may have to make real sacrifices to do it right. As things unfold, that might mean that individuals who are responsible for the problems may need to step away from power.The "sacrifices" will be letting some people go, unfortunately. Wrong kind of people, I am afraid. People in power will not willingly step down, unless they are forced by their superiors.
If the owners want to see the company continue to be a relevant force in the TTRPG space, and recover its reputation, I suspect we could see real change. If the employees support one another, and management is aware the wrong moves will cause an exodus or for even more stuff to go public and essentially destroy the company, we could see real change. Paizo isn't activision blizzard, they can't afford to kill the two golden geese of their talent and reputation (in the long term.)
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Gonna pull some random thoughts together here.
All conjecture so anyone who wants to say 'but you don't know' Let me start by saying I have no idea if any of this is true.
Excellent summary of a picture I have in my head too and with the right focus on the particular issue at hand rather than old grievances.
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Should have added that if they really want a phone solution they can get ring central for 25 bucks and the people can install the phone at home and log in and answer it. You can forward the CS number straight to it.
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Should have added that if they really want a phone solution they can get ring central for 25 bucks and the people can install the phone at home and log in and answer it. You can forward the CS number straight to it.
Then managers don't get to watch you work though.
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Should have added that if they really want a phone solution they can get ring central for 25 bucks and the people can install the phone at home and log in and answer it. You can forward the CS number straight to it.Then managers don't get to watch you work though.
Well thank you for bringing this up!
This is one of the worse scenarios I was talking about. If your new Director of Community has such a complex that people must sit at their desks to be effective I now direct you to the fact that they managed to clear the insane back log from home. Which wouldn't have been as long had you just gotten a Ring Central phone number for 25 bucks on day 1 and forwarded the CS number and set Sam Phelan up with the app at home!
I mean, it is extremely antiquated to believe that you have to be the task master lording over your cubicle minions to make sure they aren't playing solitaire.
If they get their job done, let them do their job in peace.
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Can we focus on the topic at hand (Sara's termination)?
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So here is the thing. Having worked in Government for years. Also knowing people in state and federal HR. Companies/employers are allowed to say very little about former employees. They worked there, start, and
end dates of employment. They cannot discuss why someone is not there anymore without legal ramifications. So that fact that Paizo has not given reasons for why employees are not there is common HR
Practice. Former employees, however can say what they want about company. There can be some risk of slander however. One trend I have found disturbing is taking someone’s accusations as the facts. Just because an accusation is made does not make it true. There are often two sides. Often an investigation of an incident from one employee to another may come down to hearsay (He said she said). In those cases where not multiple witnesses of the incident or emails etc. often one what is done is talking to staff in general about said incident and documenting the training.
I will say this about something in Rpg.net. It describes how transgender staff were not allowed to share room with staff. It said that the transgender staff asked non transgender staff to share a room. The non transgender staff said it was fine. They transgender staff was not allowed to share room and go to Gen con. What is not know is the non transgender staff could have gone to their manager (behind closed doors) and said they were not comfortable staying in the room wi the transgender staff.
Finally looking at these allegations. We’re EEOC complaints done? If no it looses some credibility with me.
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Thank you Dave2 for your first paragraph. That's key information, as someone who has worked on the new hire process, as well as fielding calls on past employees.
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Can we focus on the topic at hand (Sara's termination)?She got fired. It sucks, but it happens. If that's all there was to focus on, this wouldn't be a thing, it would (generally) be the Jeremy Clarkson "Oh no... Anyway" meme and this thread wouldn't have almost 600 posts. Or exist probably.
They bring in a new CS manager who fires a well-known staffer, causes at least one other departure, and does this all before GenCon. Folks get fired all the time sure, but it takes a certain amount of ineptitude to clean house before your busiest time of the year. There's a reason WotC fires everyone after X-mas, because no one is paying attention. Putting someone like that in charge of your public facing department speaks to ineptitude up the chain.