| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
I'm considering reviving a game that went on for a few years and about 4,000 posts. Here are the basic premises. Here's the link if you want to take a look.
Basically, I ended up customizing my version of Athas so much it became it's own setting, which I eventually explained as Dregoth having achieved divinity and recreated the universe with a copy of Athas that had some variations from the published setting.
Here are some considerations:
-I made up a bunch of additional 'power sources' for magic -- geomancy, solamancy etc.
-All the city-states are larger and more complex polities (several hundred thousand - more than million inhabitants instead of 20,000).
-Serinbáʿal has several additional city-states in addition to the canonical 'seven cities' of the Tablelands.
-The continent of Carcharoth, which holds the Seven Cities, incorporates the expansions to the setting made on Athas.org -- the Deadlands, the eastern side of the Sea of Silt, etc.
-There is a kind of 'necropunk' tech in the setting -- there's still no metal, but there are obsidian automatons/warforged and guns made out of animated bone, etc.
-The distant history of Serinbáʿal is the 3rd party Violet Dawn setting: Here's a link if you want to take a look at it.
-Defiling and Preserving are related to the paracausal powers from the MMO Destiny: the Traveler and the Darkness. There are spheres and pyramids floating around if you know where to look.
-The flora and fauna are much stranger. I'm drawing on the Snaiad and Birrin xenobiology speculative worlds for weirder creature ideas.
-There are many more elemental planes in this cosmology than just the standard inner planes and paraelemental planes.
-While there are currently no true deities, there are elemental powers in drake form that grant spells: basically the Blood Storm dragon gods from the Rifts MMO. There also also a plethora of other elemental powers, and clerics of transitive forces like shadow, the ether, mirrors, dreams, etc.
-There are other polities in this setting besides the Seven Cities: there is theocracy of elemental clerics/elemental lords to the west, a land dominated by tareks to the south of the Tablelands, and a region dominated by assassins and merchant houses, as well as city states ruled by an avangion council.
-There are more varieties of advanced beings -- there are advanced beings that use alternative power sources like cerulean avangions and shadow magic and gray magic dragons.
TSR almost published an introductory adventure about the Deadlands called the Emissary where a messenger from Dregoth visits one of rulers of the Deadlands to make an alliance. I was thinking of structuring perhaps using that as a germ for campaign idea, though it would only be using the basic concept.
So, if you're interested in a Dark Sun game that isn't exactly slavish to canon, I'm going to let anyone who will play along design their own build rules as long as you can all agree as a group what they will be -- here's your ultimate chance to do anything you ever imagined at whatever level, just play nicely and work out some benchmarks for AC, BAB+, etc. that are mutually agreeable.
Ooh!
Which edition are you going to be running this in?
I always thought Athas was cool.
If you're looking for create-a-class guidelines I made a Freeform Class Selection homebrew years ago that I still tinker with.
I never got around to adding all of the Occult classes or finishing the Spheres conversion.
Ooh!
Which edition are you going to be running this in?
PF 1e
In that case, I found a PF1E conversion for DARK SUN made by Bodhizen. Do you think this would be an appropriate conversion to use? Or did you have something else in mind?
I don't think we really have to confine ourselves to that, though it can be a source for ideas. As I indicated in the first post, I've expanded and altered the setting quite a bit, so there are some concepts and ideas that are possible that this document doesn't reflect.
There are some interesting suggestions, but there are multiple ways to make a defiler -- you could use a casting tradition from spheres, etc.
Also, I've altered some of the lore sufficiently that this doesn't completely represent the range of options -- this document doesn't even have pterrans or aaracockra.
I was always a fan of the Dark Sun setting.
I will say that build your character however you want, as long as everyone agrees, might be a bit problematic. I feel creativity needs restrictions, but that might just be me.
For my part, I'm partial to the standard zero-to-hero/despotic overlord/whatever style of game play, so I would be inclined to start at low level.
Looking at the original recruitment, it seems like you were going for super busted high power characters. Is that the desire this time around?
I was always a fan of the Dark Sun setting.
I will say that build your character however you want, as long as everyone agrees, might be a bit problematic. I feel creativity needs restrictions, but that might just be me.
For my part, I'm partial to the standard zero-to-hero/despotic overlord/whatever style of game play, so I would be inclined to start at low level.
Looking at the original recruitment, it seems like you were going for super busted high power characters. Is that the desire this time around?
I tend to do higher power things.
I'm happy to come up with some build rules -- but the last few times I've done that I've had way too much 'you said the rules are this, but can I have this exception, etc.' posts immediately.
If I lay out the rules, then I don't want push back on stuff, and I want everyone to make a good faith effort just to deal with whatever I've laid out even if you seriously disagree with things.
This looks like it could be fun.
I do have some suggestions for the rules, assuming we're to make them up ourselves. I'm not getting into setting specific things like races and how to deal with arcane casters simply because I don't have solid ideas there. Other than races have to be setting appropriate.
My suggestions, also besed on what I've seen from Seb so far.
I think that covers all the non setting specific things.
I tend to do higher power things.I'm happy to come up with some build rules -- but the last few times I've done that I've had way too much 'you said the rules are this, but can I have this exception, etc.' posts immediately.
If I lay out the rules, then I don't want push back on stuff, and I want everyone to make a good faith effort just to deal with whatever I've laid out even if you seriously disagree with things.
That seems fair to me. You have a feel for the type of game you want to run and the types of characters that would fit in your vision. I say lay out the specifics with a big old 'no exceptions' notice.
From my end,I'm generally not too worried about the framework for the crunch and will work with whatever, if I get inspired. I'm usually more on the hunt for the campaign intro details: location, motivation, etc, to the get the creative juices flowing.
Gestalt or Tristalt, either is fine with me.
Max 1 "normal" Paizo class, regardless of whether it's Gestalt or Tristalt. By "normal" I mean any non-PrC by Paizo with the exception of the Omdura or the Vampire Hunter, though the latter seems out of place for Athas to me.
No building 1 man armies. All classes must be picked to create a cohesive unit based on a single them. This would be a flavour theme, not a purely mechanical one.
At least free Weapon Finesse for all and at BAB+1 Combat Expertise and Power Attack and it's equivalents. Full EitR is also ok with me. If the 3rd part scaling versions of those feats are used those would still cost a feat to buy the progression.
I know Seb has a love for giving more feats which sounds fine to me. I would, however, like some sort of restriction on the feats gotten beyond base progression. Something like no Combat feats (unless also Teamwork, maybe)
Dice pool for stats, including rerolling 1's as per the link(easily simplified as getting to reroll up to six 1's).
I can agree to most of this, though I will add in my own comments/suggestions:
1) Personally, I prefer tristalt, though gestalt is fine if most want that instead.
2) I kinda wanna borrow from Seb's other concept, and only use 3pp classes. By not allowing Paizo classes, it lends to some more unique, interesting creations, which I believe fits the more exotic nature of Dark Sun.
3) I very much like the thematic restriction, though I would say it could be as broad as 'weapon master' or more narrow like 'shadow caster'.
4) I believe Seb normally runs with full EitR.
5) 1 feat per level(so 2 if gestlat, and 3 if tristalt) seems fair to me. For bonus feats maybe they need to be tied specifically to your theme? So like if you're playing the above weapon master, who is all about being awesome with several weapons, weapon specific feats would be okay, but not say whirlwind, spring attack, or shield focus.
6) Dice pool works, though I also like a solid point buy. Whichever the group prefers, honestly.
My own suggestions:
1) I don't mind Seb's all Paizo ban from his 3pp concept, but I would adjust slightly: If you class grants a spell or feat from Paizo, those are allowed. However, for the most part, stick to non Paizo stuff, including the scaling feats he mentioned.
2) I also like the idea of the bonus PrC, though if that's the case, Paizo PrCs might need to be allowed, as there aren't *that* many 3pp PrCs.
3) For race, what about gestalting two races together, to make something super unique? We can keep Paizo races, but maybe either require 1 race from Paizo and 1 3pp race, or two non core races?
4) For starting level, I would say between 6-8 is good, especially if we go with the bonus PrC.
5) Other stuff: 5 traits, 1 per category?
Background skills for sure, but maybe more than the standard 2, as they don't add *that* much to the overall power level of a PC.
WBL? Extra gold? Seb's 'equip with what makes sense' for your PC?
6) I also think each PC should be required to choose a source for their power, regardless of your classes. Even if you're playing something that fully lacks any sort of spells, powers, maneuvers, special powers, etc, you still must pick a source from the various drakes, forces, etc of the cosmology.
Intriguing concept, my one question is why all the hate for the Paizo classes and feats? As someone who has had limited use of 3pp material, I know their is a wealth of it out there, but feel like both access can be a challenge, and with limited knowledge, it could be harder to efficiently manage. If it's to balance power scaling, so that those with paizo classes aren't left in the dust, I can understand.
Intriguing concept, my one question is why all the hate for the Paizo classes and feats? As someone who has had limited use of 3pp material, I know their is a wealth of it out there, but feel like both access can be a challenge, and with limited knowledge, it could be harder to efficiently manage. If it's to balance power scaling, so that those with paizo classes aren't left in the dust, I can understand.
I don't believe there's any hate for Paizo classes. Certainly not from me, as the Sorcerer and Inquisitor are two of my all time favorite classes.
Seb just had a concept for a game that banned all Paizo content, more I think for the more interesting builds than any dislike for the material. At least, I don't think he hates Paizo stuff, lol.
That said, a flat ban on everything from Paizo also impacted a lot of 3pp material that had specific spell lists, or granted spell like abilities that included Paizo spells.
Hence my above suggestion: If you pick a class that has a specific spell list, and there's a bunch of Paizo spells on there(very likely) that would be okay, but if you go with a class that has more broad access(similar to a wiz/sorc), try to limit the number of spells that are Paizo only.
As I said in my first post, I believe using 3pp only classes, and limited Paizo material otherwise, will give us far more unique and interesting characters which fits the rather exotic nature of Dark Sun.
I don't necessarily think banning all Paizo is necessary, in part because Athas is going to put some serious restrictions on classes anyway, 3pp or otherwise.
I know the usual rules say wizards are mistrusted, but I've always figured it was meant to extend to other arcane casters.
As well, banning core spells and Feats is...silly. 3pp doesn't generally put in the work to replace them.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Honestly, I'm leery of doing anything 'Gestalt' or 'Tristalt' or similar stuff like that because of how easy it would be to create uber-characters. Even if the party takes extra care to ensure they don't hog the spotlight from each other or encroach on someone else's role, it's still going to be a headache for a GM, having to balance encounters with that character generation rule in mind.
One of the reasons I suggested to limit the use of Paizo classes and not outright exclude them was people's access and familiarity. Sure, D20PFSRD has a lot of 3rd party material on it but most of that is unfamiliar to people. Sticking a Paizo class in there would give many people a more familiar base to start from.
That and Paizo also has plenty of it's own obscure stuff, like the Omdura (which I still want to find a fit for).
I do think that pushing people to use 3rd party stuff sounds fun and that's why my idea was to limit Paizo classes. I'd also be a proponent of pushing other 3rd party things, though in general I'm less into 3rd party races as many of them are just a bit too silly for my taste (either mechanically or thematically).
Honestly, I'm leery of doing anything 'Gestalt' or 'Tristalt' or similar stuff like that because of how easy it would be to create uber-characters. Even if the party takes extra care to ensure they don't hog the spotlight from each other or encroach on someone else's role, it's still going to be a headache for a GM, having to balance encounters with that character generation rule in mind.
While I understand and somewhat agree I also know that Seb is quite used to working with that power level so I'm not worried in the slightest.
Intriguing concept, my one question is why all the hate for the Paizo classes and feats? As someone who has had limited use of 3pp material, I know their is a wealth of it out there, but feel like both access can be a challenge, and with limited knowledge, it could be harder to efficiently manage. If it's to balance power scaling, so that those with paizo classes aren't left in the dust, I can understand.
There's no hate, I own the almost the entire PF1e line. However, if I propose doing a game with 3pp. material, I don't really appreciate the first replies being "Lulz no -- let me do something else".
How do you feel about Thunderscape: World of Aden? I can provide a legal copy of the PDF if needed.
You mentioned there's a "necropunk" theme here so playing a Golemoid might be neato.
I like Dark Sun, so I'd be interested.
I actually think a lower power level would be more interesting for Dark Sun. A big part of the whole thing is the world really, really wants you dead, so a party of badasses who can whip up food and water at will will take something from that.
Not that I'd be especially sad to play something stronger, but I think perhaps we should take some pains to make sure that the world can kick our ass?
I definitely think things that make survival easier should be limited (ban Create Water, etc.), but isn't pretty much everyone on Athas SUPPOSED to be a badass by normal character standards?
Obviously not to the extent proposed in this thread compared to the base lore, but that is sort of the point behind the "Athas rule" (everyone starts at minimum 3rd level in Dark Sun games because everyone who's lower level than that died before adulthood).
How do you feel about Thunderscape: World of Aden? I can provide a legal copy of the PDF if needed.
You mentioned there's a "necropunk" theme here so playing a Golemoid might be neato.
That's fine -- but it needs to be a golemoid made out of blood obsidian or magma or something else besides metal.
i'm interested. Eberron and Dark Sun are two of my favorite settings
I think looking at each person having an opinion is fine, but I don't think you should be resistant to put your foot down as the GM and say "these are the rules". If there are those who don't like them, they can play in some other game.
I am not very experienced in super overpowered things, so I'll just be honest that I would prefer lower power, but if you like higher power, that's fine. I don't mind trying for this. I think if we can find some happy medium between core and Monkeygod's post, or even between Cuan and Monkeygod's posts, that would be better. I would just say, do what you want, but whatever you decide, try to make it easy for us to find information and to build our characters.
I was able to find a lot of 3rd-party material, including prestige classes for my character last time I was looking. That wasn't the case for everyone. One of the struggles was the feats and Paizo content included in the classes. I would agree with Monkeygod that if the class calls for that ability, and it can't easily be replaced by something else, then it should be given.
I think if there is a spell list that 90% of the spells on it are from the core rulebook, you should take the 10% not found in the core rulebook/or are made up, and then look for other 3rd party lists that have spells of the same type (arcane/divine/psychic). Then just make your own "spellbook' as it were.
Nice. Very interesting.
I would be interested in bringing Amunet-Ra back!
Although i would prefer to use the old Paizo classes and stuff i had used for her.
Well, perhaps some DSP stuff could be used as well.
I'd love to get the old group back together!
So, if Hamza, Rokan, and Hayato want to come back -- what do you want to do with the story -- do you want me to just narrate what happened in Kalidnay, or pick up where we left off, or what. Are you intending to play the same characters?
I was planning on doing something in the Deadlands -- there's a module concept that TSR was going to release where Dregoth sends an emissary to one of the necromancer lords of the deadlands who used to be a student of Rajaat. I was going to do something around that.
I guess the essential question is if you want to rebuild the same characters with different rules, want to be higher level, or what --
I guess the essential question is if you want to rebuild the same characters with different rules, want to be higher level, or what --
As much as I love Hamza, he's way too OP for the vast majority of games, due mostly to the Horrifically OP feats, and their mythic counterparts. He would need a serious re-work to bring his power level down, and at that point, I would much rather make a new PC instead.
We all seem to like and want to use 3rd-party stuff. So let's have that be our first rule. In conjunction with this rule, we should strive, where we can, to use 3rd-party material, and not stress about it when we can't. Here are some other rules maybe we can agree on:
1) For the most part, we all want there to still be Paizo content available. Those who want to build with only 3rd party stuff, do so. Those who want to have a hybrid, do so, but the primary build should be 3rd-party content. So maybe lets have that be a loose rule? This would also include prestige classes. Due to the limited number of them, pick and choose from either standard or 3rd party, but perhaps there are features in the standard PrC that can be substituted for 3rd-party things? In that case, do it! :)
2) We are all open to point-buy or dice rolling (or so it seems), so lets offer both. Perhaps a rolling system such as 3d6+6 drop the lowest as an example, reroll ones, and then if you don't like your scores, you can do a 25-pt buy? That should give the GM the high-powered game he likes and for us not to be stuck into a certain build based on what we roll. What do you think?
3) I've seen a few of you post about Elephant in the Room feat taxes, and being that this is typically what Seb uses, let's just make this a rule? If anyone opposes, speak up now.
4) I'm okay with background skills. Even 3-5 is fine for me, as long as they aren't going into primary slots (such as perform for a Bardic class) but are truly for background building it doesn't matter a ton and only adds to the flavor of the game.
5) So we have some disagreement on either a low-level (0-1st) and a mid-low level campaign (6th-8th). I think we can agree that most here have not put forth a high-level desire (9th+), so unless someone particularly wants that, lets shoot lower. I am thinking because the goal of the game, mechanically, is to experience 3rd-party content and a higher powered game, the higher level the better. I would agree with the 6th level range. Any objections?
6) It seems there are a few voices for additional feats. I have support for this as well, but I wouldn't want it to go too crazy. I would vote we just have 1 additional feat per class only (not archetype or prestige class). If we do agree to a gestalt or tristalt, it would be 2 or 3 respectively per each class. If we are going to have free feats, there has also been a voice that we restrict this. No combat feats (teamwork okay), and I would even go so far as to say no metamagic as well since they have to deal with combat. I think this will keep some builds from going far to the extreme while leaving others in the dust. Thoughts? Objections?
7) On the subject of traits, there was only one voice. I don't personally care. I would agree with the monkeygod stating that there be 1 per category for a total of 5.
8) Wealth by Level: I would keep this as standard or perhaps you can explain the "equip with what makes sense" option? What are the restrictions? What is keeping someone from taking every wondrous item in the book if they "see" their character having it lol.
9) We all agreed on following a central theme for our character builds. This means lets make this a rule.
10) As for gestalt and tristalt, some were leery of doing them, some having a preference for tristalt, and most not caring either way. I say we meet in the middle and do Gestalt. Whatever you build, no one-man armies (I agree with this), and try to make it work with a group.
Your list looks good Smooshie and I agree with all except point 2. I barely prefer the dice pool method I linked to just rolling sets. This way you can actually arrange your dice and have more control than with rolling sets.
The backup point buy looks fine, though I think some suggested going beyond 25.
Your list looks good Smooshie and I agree with all except point 2. I barely prefer the dice pool method I linked to just rolling sets. This way you can actually arrange your dice and have more control than with rolling sets.
The backup point buy looks fine, though I think some suggested going beyond 25.
Sure, I'm fine with that myself. I don't think anyone had any input strongly on dice except there having be a point-buy alternative, so if you have a preference, then let's do that.
Perhaps with the point-buy, shoot for the 25. If those who are accepted to the game rolled very high, then if the GM wants the point-buy character, perhaps at that point Seb can balance the numbers by giving the point-buy character some extra points to spend.
Re: starting level, I've always found 3rd level is a great place to start. Each character has officially come into their own, but aren't slowly becoming nascent demigods yet.
Since this isn't all of the old crew, i would say let's start that adventure in the deadlands.
No need for extensive background stuff that happened before if not strictly necessary.
Would love to bring Amunet-Ra back, but i could simply do a similar character as one of her sisters, maybe even with the same name or another :D
Really liked that backstory with the elven tribe though, doesn't even have to have the snake vampire stuff.
I'm fine with adapting powerlevel to lower and level 3.
Probably would like to use either Paizo or DSP psionics, because i'm most familiar with that stuff and can still make very good and strong characters, as you have seen.
For everyone else we are coming from a tristalt 108 or so point buy game with something like 5 feats per level.
My suggestions are:
-5 times 3d6+6 rolling drop lowest, keep the best run.
-tristalt
-3 extra feats per level, additional to the ones you normaly get.
-Automatic Bonus progression without magic items + normal wealth per level.
-->Nobody has iron or better items, everything i bone, wood, etc..Keeps the flavor.
-Level 3 seems like a good entry point. Then award XP or level-up when the party reached story key points or did something important.
That is a very good gaming incentive and a rewarding experience.
Things become more dynamic then and we are moving away from the purely theoretical character building then.
-Even though this is high powered make the dessert, heat, lack of water, food and resources overall a topic that isn't lightly solved with psionics or magic.
-Keep the restrictions on magic aka defiling etc. That's an essential of the world and beings with magical background should need to consider that as well.
-Keep standard Dark Sun races.
-Even though i love them too, no templates this time^^ Too unbalanced inside the party and for encounters. (Except i can make Amunet-Ra a half-succubus elf again :P )
-Things like magical flight etc. should be hard to come by and difficult to explain.
We can discuss the use of mythic rules, i actually liked them last time.
16
10
16
06
15
18
17
15
17
14
10
14
13
16
15
17
18
16
14
16
16
10
16
13
15
13
18
15
14
12
Most of this seems fine to me. I agree that starting level three is a good spot.
In terms of stats, I generally prefer a point buy system to rolling due to promoting consistency. If we go with a rolling method, how would people feel about a focus/foible system? (For those that don't know: you get an 8 and an 18, then roll for the other 4, traditionally 1d10+8, but could be tweaked.) I think characters with flaws are more interesting, but that might just be me.
I would really rather not start at what is essentially level 1 for Dark Sun.
Literally all PCs in that setting start at level 3, since the world is so hostile, you would be dead otherwise.
That would be why I suggested 6-8. Also because Seb had the idea in his 3pp game of prestige classes as tree options like in an MMO -- you'd get a prestige class in the same chassis in your build at 5th level for free.
I've been trying to keep to the same general ideas he put forth in that game for this one.
Unsure if people missed it or just ignored him, but Cuan posted the following Dice Pool method for rolling stats.
Seb used it for his FF game, and I got some solid ability scores(this is after racial adjustments, lvl 4 increase, etc):
Str 18
Dex 14
Con 16
Int 14
Wis 10
Cha 20
So, two really good stats, then some decent ones, and one rather low stat.
I think it worked out rather nicely for all of other the PCs as well.
Level: Monkeygod, if you still definitely want higher, perhaps can all work together and average at a 4th-level start? Would everyone who wants to start at 3rd be okay at 4th, or is this a "strong 3rd"?
Dice: Cuan, you suggested Dice Pool. How do you feel about 3d6+6 5 times take the best? Would that be a fair compromise? Should we include reroll 1s? How do you all feel about the focus/foible system? I myself would prefer the 3d6+6 x5 or the Dice Pool system, with accompanying available 25-pt buy. I would just say at this point, use either or. Dice pool or 3d6+5. Whichever you want. They seem to roll close to the same.
Gestalt: We now have more voices for Tristalt than the other two options (normal, gestalt). And since the old game was tristalt, we probably should go that route. Is everyone okay with that?
WBL: I also like the idea of automatic progression plus standard Wealth by level. I hate spending my character's wealth on standard big 6 items, so this would let me get what I see my characters using. I think all voices so far have been for more money than standard WBL, so this works.
Feats: If we are doing Tristalt, according to my suggested plan above, we are getting 3 bonus feats per level, so that seems on par for what is suggested by Hayato.
Special Materials: I'm okay with the no-iron rule. What is money made of? Are there other metals? Gold? Silver? Copper?
Allright then level 6 with Prestige Classes it is.
Do we get one on top for free, but have to fulfill the requirements?
Money is made of snails or shells in the original setting.
There is iron, but it is incredibly rare.
Note that bone, wood and obsidion etc. can all break and are brittle usualy.
What I really like about the dicepool method is that you don't roll sets, which you do do with 3d6+6. The three dice you roll are stuck together and are inseparable.
With the dicepool you roll 24d6, getting to reroll a 1 for every stat you have aka six times. Then you pick a total of 18 dice and assign them to your stats as you see fit. This way there is a lot more customisability than there is when you roll sets.
You could say this method sits between rolling sets, the standard rolling method, and point buy. It has customisability close to the levels of point buy but also has randomness similar to normal dicerolls. It's just that if you happen to have a set of two 1's and two 2's you're not stuck with a 5 (assuming 4d6) but could instead lower another stat to prop that one up (heck, you might even be able to ditch all those low dice if the rest of your rolls are good).
As for Focus - Foible, it's rather lacklustre if you ask me and not suitable if the aim is high powered characters. If anything it's a system that promotes SAD characters, favoring full casters over others.
As for flawed characters, I'm all for them but shouldn't that be RP instead of just stats?
As far as levels goes, 6 sounds fine to me, as would 5 for that matter.
On races, Darksun races is fine but I guess the Deadlands could also add options. Beyond that there are races that could easily fit. As an example, Trox would make a pretty good Thri-Kreen offshoot.
The "(almost) no metals" rule is part of the setting isn't it?
I'm fine with the other rule suggestions, though I'd prefer some restrictions on the bonus feats. Whether that is no combat other than teamwork and no metamagic or something else I don't really mind (perhaps a softer restriction, like at max half of them on combat/metamagic so that characters like a weaponmaster aren't left out in the cold).
I don't have super strong feelings about this.
Sure level 6, dice pool is fine.
18, 16, 14, 12, 10, 7, Seems fine.
Trisalt, sure. Would the prestige be in addition (so like quadsalt?)
3 bonus feats per level is bonkers, but I think that is what the campaign is striving for.
Automatic progression plus standard Wealth by level seems fine with me.
6,6,6,6,6,6,6,5,5,5,5,4,4,4,4,3,3,3,
Forgot about rerolling 1s: Which adjust things to 18, 18, 16 14 10 11, Which is much nicer.
Man, ya'll can't even wait for Seb to actually post his rules before ya'll start with rolls huh? lol
I have a few concepts in mind, but I'll wait for Seb to post official character creation first.
Well to fair, it sounded like Seb was letting us do whatever we could agree on. Just excited to see the possibilities.
There doesn't seem to be complete agreement -- I'll look through the suggestions and try to come up with a happy medium in the next few days.
You are right Sebecloki. However, credit where credit is due. It's hard to get this many people to agree on so many things, and look what we did! It does seem like we are in agreement on:
Level 6 3rd-party classes
3rd-party races optional
Paizo materials optional if in classes, but strive to make it as 3rd party as possible.
Tristalt+ A prestige class (3rdparty optional)
3 bonus feats per level (some noncombat/nonmetamagic)
Dice Pool rolled for stats
Almost No Metals rule.
Automatic Progression Bonuses + Standard Wealth by Level
No magic items making survival easier
Magical flight restricted or hard to come by.
A central build theme for each class to work together with.
Background skills 5 each level but no primary class selections (eg. CraftAlchemy for alchemist or perform for bard)
Elephant in the Room Feat taxes
Hopefully, that helps :) If you want to change anything, you are the GM.
I'm intrigued!
A few more world Qs (from someone who knows only a bit about the Dark Sun setting):
Why are we together?
- Do-gooders trying to stop an evil plot?
- Refugees who're just banding together to survive?
- ...?
Is desert (+urban +underground) basically the main/only terrain to expect?
What are the predominant races? And cultures?
Is magic less common than psionics?
Magic should definitely be less common than Psionics just due to the setting; widespread mistrust of magic, as Wizards (specifically Defilers) are the reason it's a shithole wasteland planet with no resources in the first place. Also I think the Sorcerer-Kings keep a bit of a rein on other arcane magic users as well.
I like the idea of being good guys with some particular plot. It's hard to sell "ragtag band of refugees" when we're all Tristalt demigods or whatever.
Oh! And what kind of animal companions/mounts would one expect in this world? And will companions get buffed a bit as well, so they aren't quite as squishy in a world of buffed PCs?