I'm getting ready to run Rise of the Runelords for some friends in play by post. But it is rare for play by post campaigns to finish; it seems to me that Paizo's APs are designed for groups that play 4+ hours once a week. PbP groups, or groups that meet f2f less than weekly, should consider cutting out some of the content to have a shot at getting through it all.
So I'm looking to figure out which content I should cut, from single encounters, to entire areas, to whole chapters, or even books.
My question to you is, which of the above from Rise of the Runelords did you find added the least, dragged on the most, or felt the most like filler?
I'm fairly familiar with the first book, having run it before.
My goal is to get from level 1-20, using 2e, in 1-2 years of play by post on discord.
I've gotten some great feedback from GMs on discord servers already. Here's the outline I'm working with right now
Complete list of encounters:
* Goblin attack (severe multi-wave encounter)
* Empty crypt (no encounter)
* Tsuto + goblins single severe encounter
* Quasit, severe encounter in an otherwise empty dungeon
* Thistle top empties in multi-wave attack on Sandpoint (moderate building up to Extreme)
Cutting room floor (from memory):
* Storekeeper's daughter
* Hidden goblins
* Boar hunt
* Goblins as a separate glassworks encounter
* Most of the dungeon beneath Sandpoint
* Thistletop as a dungeon
Book 2
Complete list of encounters:
* Some investigating to do with murders
* Mental institute (non combat)
* Haunted manor
* Skinsaw Cult
* Clocktower
Cutting room floor (from memory):
* Burning farms
Book 3
List of locations (encounters will be pared down)
* Graul homestead
* Fort Rannick
* Flood
* Skull's Crossing (w/Bark Breakbones + hags)
Cutting room floor
* Shimmer glen (possibly included as pure RP before Skull's Crossing)
* Most of the Ferry town?
* Hook Mountain?
Book 4-5
Giants attack Sandpoint, including Mokmurian
Deeper dungeon beneath glassworks is uncovered, including Therrasic library
Clue leads to Scribbler's lair beneath The Old Light (the Flume)
Run Runeforge largely as-is (cut filler encounters)
Cutting room floor
* Jorgenfist
Book 6
Xin-Shalast
Edit: I would love feedback on that outline if it's not clear
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What I ended up doing was cutting out anything that was not important to the main plot itself. If you like an encounter, you can always find a way to incorporate it into the main plot. For instance, there are several side encounters in Reign of Winter Book 2 leading to Whitethrone. I combined the encounters to be part of the story - starting with the Winter Wolf encounter, then seeking out the Wood Wife to help get the Pelt enchanted, the cursed chapel of Desna where there was an important element needed to do the enchanting, and finally the Circle of Summer being where the Wood Wife enchants the Rime Pelt.
Likewise in another game I'm in, I'm rewriting the order of events and expanding on a part with street gangs because as written, there is little reason for the group to gain praise for actions that are hidden and most likely no one ever hears about. Instead, the group is going to "restore law and order" by eliminating what is essentially a new thieves guild being formed in the city. And this will allow for greater reason for a future NPC to hate on the PCs.
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While I can't speak to exactly how effective this is, I would hesitate for one particular trim you've done here - putting the Therassic Library underneath Sandpoint. These does change its nation of origin and render Mokmurian's backstory (the impetus for this campaign as well as its sequel campaigns) nonsensical.
Furthermore, there's simply no need to do it, when the specific information the party needs (Who was Karzoug? Where is Xin-Shalast? What is Runeforge?) can all be obtained via Brodert Quink or the Scribbler. I'd seriously recommend avoid mention of the library entirely unless the party performs a legend lore or similar on Mokmurian.
As a less-important note: A lot of what you've cut out is what connects the early game to Thassilon. I'd hesitate to do that if you want a smooth connection between the events of the first 3 books and the later 3 books (which will already be jarring, given condensing Book 4 essentially into 1-2 encounters).
What I ended up doing was cutting out anything that was not important to the main plot itself. If you like an encounter, you can always find a way to incorporate it into the main plot.
Yup that's what I'm going for.
While I can't speak to exactly how effective this is, I would hesitate for one particular trim you've done here - putting the Therassic Library underneath Sandpoint. These does change its nation of origin and render Mokmurian's backstory (the impetus for this campaign as well as its sequel campaigns) nonsensical.
Furthermore, there's simply no need to do it, when the specific information the party needs (Who was Karzoug? Where is Xin-Shalast? What is Runeforge?) can all be obtained via Brodert Quink or the Scribbler. I'd seriously recommend avoid mention of the library entirely unless the party performs a legend lore or similar on Mokmurian.
Thanks, this is a great note. I'll probably incorporate it. I'm tentatively considering running the sequel APs in a similar fashion.
As a less-important note: A lot of what you've cut out is what connects the early game to Thassilon. I'd hesitate to do that if you want a smooth connection between the events of the first 3 books and the later 3 books (which will already be jarring, given condensing Book 4 essentially into 1-2 encounters).
I'm hoping to bring Brodert more into the forefront as an NPC, play up the Thassilonian virtue/vice aspects via haunts and the like, and emphasize Sandpoint as a Thassilonian site as the adventure goes on: I'm thinking of having the dungeon itself, as well as the ruined flume, be part of the impetus for Mokmurian to attack.
The Lamias more than hint that there's a Thassilonian mastermind behind their schemes. Is Jorgenfist that important to tie the second half to the first half?
Someone pointed me to this condensation which is almost exactly what I'm looking for. Now I'm curious if I could come up with a way to integrate Shattered Star and Return of the Runelords, if I indeed ended RotR as early as he suggests.
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The Lamias more than hint that there's a Thassilonian mastermind behind their schemes. Is Jorgenfist that important to tie the second half to the first half?
- While Xanesha and Lucretia certainly indicate there are Thassilonian symbols and concepts at work, a party would be less equipped to recognize them without learning about the Sidhedron and the two significant Runelords.
- I wouldn't say Jorgenfist is critical to the plot or to teaching the party about Thassilon. I'd actually recommend running Thistletop (a condensed version in which most of the goblins have fled), and specifically making sure your party sees the image of Karzoug found on the lowest floor. This not only shows them their villain early on, but it introduces them to the war between Bakrakhan and Alaznist - a rather big element of the lore for this trilogy (especially RotR).
I do think bringing Brodert to the forefront really helps contextualize the campaign, so I think that's a very good idea. I wish you the best of luck with this campaign - running a full Adventure Path via PBP seems like it'll be a big job!
In the spoiler tags, I'll put in some suggestions for when I'd recommend the party level-up.
Defeat Tsuto in the Glassworks - Level up to 3
Defeat Erylium and/or deactivate the Runewell - Level up to 4
Defeat Nualia (with Bruthazmus and her hounds) - Level up to 5
Discover Aldern is the killer & set out for the Misgivings - Level up to 6
Arrive in Magnimar - Level up to 7
Defeat Xanesha - Level up to 8
Take back Rannick (ignore Grauls entirely; Lucretia is not present) - Level up to 9
Conclude Heart of Sadness & Down Comes the Rain (Lucretia as boss of Skull's Crossing, along with ogres) as mostly RP - Level up to 10
Defeat Barl Breakbones - Level up to 11
Repel giants from Sandpoint - Level up to 12
Defeat Mokmurian & the Lamia Priestesses - Level up to 13 (I'd recommend this be more like a duel than anything, potentially over a ransom collected during the raid)
Enter Runeforge - Level up to 14
Forge a dominant weapon - Level up to 15
Reach Xin-Shalast (provide relevant information via Runeforge, both in the Shimmering Veils and the Vaults of Greed) - Level up to 16
Reach the Pinnacle of Avarice - Level up to 17
Conclude game at level 17.
Someone pointed me to this condensation which is almost exactly what I'm looking for. Now I'm curious if I could come up with a way to integrate Shattered Star and Return of the Runelords, if I indeed ended RotR as early as he suggests.
In this blog post (which I'm looking at using as an outline) the author suggests this will only get you to level 6 or so. I think I can stretch it to level 10 or so with milestone leveling (glassworks + dungeon earns a level; thistletop earns a level; haunted manor earns a level; Magnimar earns a level; book 3 is at least a couple of levels...) but that leaves them way too low level to fight Karzoug. I'm thinking of having them do a streamlined Shattered Star (with the phantom of Karzoug sending assassins after them) to collect the Sihedron Rune before taking the fight to Karzoug.
Having to deal with Xin back in Magnimar before/after Karzoug could be an interesting wrinkle. I'll play that part by ear.