Raise a tome class feat - question and confusion

[drakinar 451]

So I am a bit confused by raise a tome. It is a flavorful ability and sounds cool but I have to ask, who is going to use it? It requires you to be holding a book. Slide casting specifies that your off hand is empty so unless you are going unarmed you can't use it ,and Sustaining steel is 2h style so both hands are already occupied. So you are left with shooting star specifically using thrown weapons as bows, and crossbows are 2h weapons as well. This seems a very niche and while flavorful not really useful.

[Inquisitive Tiefling]

drakinar 451 wrote:

So I am a bit confused by raise a tome. It is a flavorful ability and sounds cool but I have to ask, who is going to use it? It requires you to be holding a book. Slide casting specifies that your off hand is empty so unless you are going unarmed you can't use it ,and Sustaining steel is 2h style so both hands are already occupied. So you are left with shooting star specifically using thrown weapons as bows, and crossbows are 2h weapons as well. This seems a very niche and while flavorful not really useful.

Given the playtest I'm under the assumption that something was missed or otherwise got left out, and that (should Paizo keep the feat, as no such thing is guaranteed) come the full release it'll be changed or otherwise reworded to work in tandem with Magus' other feats and abilities.

[Evilgm]

It definitely feels like a cool idea for a Feat that belongs to a completely different class.

[Moppy]

drakinar 451 wrote:

So I am a bit confused by raise a tome. It is a flavorful ability and sounds cool but I have to ask, who is going to use it?

its a warhammer thing, especially when combined with the weapon scrolls.

mechanically, sure, there a problems as the magus needs a weapon and an open hand, or a twohander. i guess you could wield only the book and bash people with that.

[Cordell Kintner]

Book-Bound was an Arcana 1E, so it's probably a leftover from that. It would still work with Shooting Star Magus, but I hope they add a Book-Bound Synergy. Let us smack people with our spellbooks!

[Alchemic_Genius]

I feel this could easily be addressed by a line in the feat allowing it work with slide, although I do personally love the mental image of combining it with a thrown weapon using the shooting star synthesis, and just dismissively yeeting your weapon while reading a book in the middle of combat

[Oakblade]

Grab the weapon improviser at level 2 and bible thump for days.

[Milo v3]

This feat should be made to work with the rest of the class in regards to "need a hand-free" incompatiabilites, but it also.... is just a really bad feat in general? It's primarily "spend a class feat to get the raise shield action"... which everyone already has.

[Ressy]

Milo v3 wrote:

This feat should be made to work with the rest of the class in regards to "need a hand-free" incompatiabilites, but it also.... is just a really bad feat in general? It's primarily "spend a class feat to get the raise shield action"... which everyone already has.

Not even that, Magus already inherently has access to the Shield cantrip.

Which is superior, as it not only gives the AC bonus but also can be used as a reaction to block damage and doesn't require a hand!

[graystone]

I've been thinking about this feat and I think it it works better as an enhancer for the Shield Cantrip.

Raise a Tome

Your Shield Cantrip takes the form of a book filled with mysterious information. Whenever you Cast the Shield Cantrip, you can also attempt a check to Recall Knowledge as part of that action. If you are holding a book when you cast Shield, you gain a +1 circumstance bonus to Recall Knowledge on a subject relevant to the book (such as arcane magic if you’re using your spellbook) while it is raised. If you’re a master in the skill you’re using to Recall Knowledge, the circumstance bonus to the Recall Knowledge check is +2 instead.

With this, it's even useful to use out of combat [for the Recall bonus] and it could be used with the exploration activity Cast a Spell to have the cantrip ready and get a Investigate type Recall to boot.

[cheolkeong]

drakinar 451 wrote:

So I am a bit confused by raise a tome. It is a flavorful ability and sounds cool but I have to ask, who is going to use it? It requires you to be holding a book. Slide casting specifies that your off hand is empty so unless you are going unarmed you can't use it ,and Sustaining steel is 2h style so both hands are already occupied. So you are left with shooting star specifically using thrown weapons as bows, and crossbows are 2h weapons as well. This seems a very niche and while flavorful not really useful.

So I don't personally think the problem is with Raise a Tome at all. I think the problem is only having PARTIAL support for unarmed attacks. Spell Strike and Slide Casting, as well as a handful of other feats, specifically make the case for using an unarmed strike, but the Magus doesn't ever get beyond Trained in unarmed strikes. An unarmed Magus could use Raise a Tome every single turn while sliding. I want to try and make it work anyway. Pray for me.

[breithauptclan]

Milo v3 wrote:

This feat should be made to work with the rest of the class in regards to "need a hand-free" incompatiabilites, but it also.... is just a really bad feat in general? It's primarily "spend a class feat to get the raise shield action"... which everyone already has.

It isn't even 'raise shield' it is 'raise buckler'. Definitely not worth a class feat.

[Nitro~Nina]

cheolkeong wrote:

So I don't personally think the problem is with Raise a Tome at all. I think the problem is only having PARTIAL support for unarmed attacks. Spell Strike and Slide Casting, as well as a handful of other feats, specifically make the case for using an unarmed strike, but the Magus doesn't ever get beyond Trained in unarmed strikes. An unarmed Magus could use Raise a Tome every single turn while sliding. I want to try and make it work anyway. Pray for me.

Well obviously that's ridiculous, everyone gets-

*checks the playtest*
-wait. What?? I'm sure that'll be fixed; I'm pretty sure everyone's supposed to have unarmed proficiency scaling, especially since the Magus can get punchy crit effects at first level. Nevertheless, you're entirely correct as it stands. Maybe try Martial Artist?.. "Multiclass" is the answer to probably too many Magus problems, as much as I do like the class.

That said, Raise Tome taking an action means that you probably wouldn't be doing much sliding. It's more for turns wherein casting a spell into your weapon isn't the plan, which is unfortunate for a Magus who wants to tip the scales.

[Ressy]

This was clarified in another thread, they used an older Template for Magus and it's intended that their Unarmed proficiency scales alongside their Simple and Martial proficiencies.

https://paizo.com/threads/rzs436ga?Lets-Talk-About-Arcane-Fists-Athletics-a nd#5

[Nitro~Nina]

Ressy wrote:

This was clarified in another thread, they used an older Template for Magus and it's intended that their Unarmed proficiency scales alongside their Simple and Martial proficiencies.

https://paizo.com/threads/rzs436ga?Lets-Talk-About-Arcane-Fists-Athletics-a nd#5

Thank!

Also: Linkified!

[Temperans]

Raise tome really does seem like its not worth it. The value is way too little for all the action economy hassle and it being a class feat.

If it were a skill or general feat it would make a lot more sense as currently written.

To make it work more like a class feat I think it should allow a hand holding a book to count as a free hand (at least for magus feats and abilities). While making the bonus on recall more general.

[Decimus Drake]

I like the idea of it as a general feat as I think it'd make for an interesting look on a range of bookish characters.