Equipment: Item Quality, Item Potency, and Item Bonus

[ShadeRaven]

Okay, for the life of me, I am struggling to really understand Item Quality, Item Potency, and Item Bonus as they exist now and as they interact with each other.

So in Doomsday Dawn, the Lost Star, a creature has with it an Expert Longsword. Looking at the Rulebook, here’s what I find:

(Page 180) – Longsword, 10 sp, 1d8 S, 1 bulk, 1 hand, Versatile P
- Simple enough. A basic longsword worth 10 sp, not frills other than versatility.

(Page 190) – Item Bonus: Weapons and skill-boosting items of expert, master, and legendary quality add the listed item bonus to attack rolls with the weapon or skill checks using the item (see Table 6–19).

Table 6-19: Item Quality
Expert, +1, 350 sp….

Okay. So that should mean an Expert Longsword is 350 (or 360 as I would probably rule) sp and is +1. I am guessing it’s therefore really a +1 non-magic Longsword that does 1d8 damage but is +1 to hit? Because if we look at page 178, we see this:

(Page 178) – Magic weapons add one or more weapon damage dice to your damage roll. These extra dice are the same die size as the weapon’s damage die.

An expert weapon isn’t magic, just well made.

To make it magic, we head to:

(Page 370-371) – Runes, Weapon Potency: A weapon potency rune grants two offensive benefits. The weapon’s wielder gains an item bonus to attack rolls with the weapon equal to the potency value…Second, on a successful attack roll, the weapon deals an additional number of weapon damage dice equal to the potency value.

Okay, so our Expert Longsword needs a +1 potency rune added to it to get the damage dice, although it’s already a +1 weapon from expert. I guess. Anyway, this costs 650 sp and is a level 4 feature.

So our +1 longsword is now around 1000 sp and can do the +1 attack rolls and 2d8, but that Expert Longsword must only be a +1 with 1d8 at 350 sp. Right? Both could have a Property Rune etched on it, if desired. So I could have a Ghost Touch Expert Longsword (non magic) worth 450 sp or +1 magic version worth 1100 sp.

Is that actually right? Am I getting this correctly? This stuff jumps all around and there’s not always a lot of clarity involved.

I also wish we had a little more clarity on a pricing mechanism for Adventuring gear that can be expert or master as there doesn’t seem to be rhyme nor reason behind which are worth 2500 sp and which are worth 7200 sp at the same level and quality.

[Draco18s]

The +1 item bonus from Expert quality applies to the d20 roll.
The +2 magic potency bonus applies to the ndY roll.

That is, a non-magical Legendary Longsword in the hands of a random level 0 commoner:

+3 to hit, 1d8 damage

A +5 standard-quality* Longsword in the hands of the same level 0 commoner:

+0 to hit, 6d8 damage

*Ignore for the moment the fact that this can't exist. Shush.

[Edge93]

Draco18s wrote:

The +1 item bonus from Expert quality applies to the d20 roll.

The +2 magic potency bonus applies to the ndY roll.

That is, a non-magical Legendary Longsword in the hands of a random level 0 commoner:

+3 to hit, 1d8 damage

A +5 standard-quality* Longsword in the hands of the same level 0 commoner:

+0 to hit, 6d8 damage

*Ignore for the moment the fact that this can't exist. Shush.

Actually, no. Page 371, referenced in the OP, clearly states that potency gives an item bonus to attack rolls as well, and this doesn't stack with the item bonus from quality.

To the OP, from what I can see you actually deduced everything just right. Gg.

[ShadeRaven]

Still struggling to figure out why some gear is much more expensive than other gear at the same quality level... some guideline would be nice because I will always want to expand on what's available and what a crafty character might be able to come up with through their own research, etc.

But, man, that was a mess to find...but I expect a final product will be much better organized.

Now the question is will the +1dx per potency last through playtesting into the final version...

[nick1wasd]

Few things

• A. Property runes can't be etched on to something that doesn't have any Potency
• B. Potency adds it's value to the attack roll and grants that many additional damage dice, the Potency and Quality bonuses are both "item" so you only use the higher
• C. I can't see anywhere that certain quality items cost different amounts from each other aside from Special Materials, unless you're referring to skill items like crafters sets and thieves tools, in which case I'm not too sure about them being priced weird

I do agree that they need to consolidate all this math and terminology in the final product, but if you just spend an extra 10 minutes parsing the playtest book, it does make SOME sense, it just sucks having to spend extra time just to understand how special item stuff works.

[ShadeRaven]

Yeah, it was the difference between an Master Heavy Musical Instrument and a Master Disguise Kit (4700 sp price difference there), for example.

Sort of makes it weird to decide if a character invests research, becomes highly trained in a craft/lore type deal, and I decide they are going to have the chance to create an unique item like say an Expert Backpack that can hold 5 bulk, etc.

Not that I can't just houserule the cost just like I houseruled the ability to make it to begin with, but looking at what comes before is often a nice baseline and those numbers are all over the place.

[Gortle]

I agree that the area is very complex. I'm not really sure what it is adding to the game. I'd be happy enough if the weapons were reduced to just +1,+2,+3 and it lined up with the item quality. Effectively removing the distinction between quality and potency.
Its the extra properties that make them interesting. Not the pluses.