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What have people found for optimizing performance of various classes and their abilities? Below are some of my finds. Some Wizard feats will carry over to the Sorcerer (and maybe Cleric) but not the Bard.
Spellcasters using cantrips or other ranged spell touch attacks: The magic item Spell Duelist's Wand gives +1 through +4 bonus to your attack roll. I haven't found a similar spell DC item (yet?).
DC maximization: Wizards can take the Empowering Focus feat to get a +2 bonus to the DC when draining their arcane focus. Only once per day, sorry generalists. They also Spell Penetration to get rid of the +1 conditional save bonus that lots of strong bestiary foes have.
Nova spells: Quickened Casting feat (Wizard and Sorcerer) removes a casting action once per day, allowing you to cast two big spells in one round. Note the synergy of this with a Wizard's Empowering Focus - if your first spell fails, activate Quickened Casting and cast it again with a +2 DC bonus.
Extra spells: Wizards, wizards, wizards. (1) Focus Conservation feat lets you chain extra uses of your arcane focus, great for generalists who have expended lots of spells. (2) Makeshift Wand lets you store three charges for a spell from your spell book (NOT necessarily one you prepared!) in a wand. Spell level must be max -2. (3) Superior Focus feat allows you to drain your Arcane Bond an additional time per day.
Note that the above tricks let a 20th level universalist wizard who took a 10th level spell slot use up to (3 basic + 3 makeshift wand + 2 drain focus + 1 Focus Conservation drop from 10th) nine 8th level spells in one day! Also applies as early as 14th level to max level -2, so you can have 9 of your third best spells (5th level spell at 14th Wizard level) from then on.
A 10th level raging elf can move 180' before making a single attack.
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Bards optimizing Performance will want the Virtuosic Performer skill feat (pg 173) for a +2 circumstance bonus to a specialty within Performance, as well as either a Persona Mask (pg 400, Dancing Scarf (pg 386), Maestro's Instrument (pg 396), or Virtuoso's Instrument (pg 413).
The Persona Mask boosts Performance based on acting, singing, comedy, and similar noninstrumental performances that don't take up hands. It only grants a +2 or +4 item bonus, but the greater version can 1/day reroll a failed Performance.
The Dancing Scarf gives similar bonuses to dance performance checks, and also grant concealment and screening when performing.
The Maestro/Virtuoso's Instruments gives a +3/+5 bonus, respectively, but requires two hands. Mundane high quality crafted instruments can also give +1 to +2 bonuses (pg 186). I don't know if there's a similar mundane tool for noninstrument performances.
So your performance specialization choice at high levels influences what your top bonus is. If you go handless you can only get a total of +4/+6 in item/circumstance bonuses, instrumental can get +5/+7, and get item bonuses early from cheaper mundane boosts.
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Note that the above tricks let a 20th level universalist wizard who took a 10th level spell slot use up to (3 basic + 3 makeshift wand + 2 drain focus + 1 Focus Conservation drop from 10th) nine 8th level spells in one day! Also applies as early as 14th level to max level -2, so you can have 9 of your third best spells (5th level spell at 14th Wizard level) from then on.
Because of the changes in how save DCs work (all spells have the same DC, regardless of spell level), is the fact that it's your "third best" even relevant any more?
*Looks at the spell lists for Arcane*
There isn't even a single 8th level damage spell...
8th-Level Spells
Antimagic field(R)
Discern location(U)
Divine aura
Divine inspiration
Moment of renewal
Spiritual epidemic
Wind walk
We could heighten Finger of Death (and do a flat 60 damage; nat1 "instant death") or...we could heighten +2 Disintegration for 16d10, average 88. Or heighten +3 Cone of Cold for 17d6 average 59.5 (aoe).
Wow, Cone of Cold is the clear winner here. I did not expect that.
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You’re missing Polar Ray and Horrid Wilting at the very least.
Edit: Yeah, that's the Divine list, not the Arcane 8th level list.
Antimagic fieldR
Disappearance
Discern locationU
Dream council
EarthquakeH
Horrid wiltingH
Maze
Mind blankU
Monstrosity form
Polar rayH
Power word stunH, U
Prismatic wall
Scintillating pattern
Uncontrollable dance
Unrelenting observation
Yeah, that's the Divine list, not the Arcane 8th level list.
*Squint*
You're right. I've never been a fan of how Paizo lays out spell lists.
Polar Ray... 8d8
What.
Finger of Death as a 7th level spell does more damage than this. I mean, sure, it's a Ranged Touch spell, but still.
Horrid Wilting... 9d10 ("aoe")
That's not bad.
Spell combinations that are synergestic to use with Wizard's Focus Conservation (must be 2 levels lower each time):
1. Polar Ray (8th) into Stone to Flesh (6th) into Enervation (4th). Why: Polar Ray inflicts Drained 2, which lowers your Fortitude save by 2, softening up for the Stone to Flesh and Enervation. The Enervation softens you up for the continuing effects of Stone to Flesh if it doesn't freeze you fast enough. Their Enervation save is itself softened up. If they somehow survive this combo your fourth spell will be up against some pretty lowered saves. There aren't any great 2nd level spells, certainly nothing that benefits from a severely weakened Fortitude save.
Disintegrate and Baleful Polymorph are also Fortitude saves at 6th level if you want a two spell combo.
2. Weird (9th) into any AOE (7th) into any AOE (5th). Why: Weird puts a lot of damage on enemies who fail plus Frightened 2, depressing saves for your first follow up - the third should clean up most of what's left after the first two even though the penalty is gone by then. (Make sure allied casters with better initiative order take better advantage.) Weird has big range and lots of target potential, so Chain Lightning is probably your best 7th level option.
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Yeah, that's the Divine list, not the Arcane 8th level list.*Squint*
You're right. I've never been a fan of how Paizo lays out spell lists.
Polar Ray... 8d8
What.
Finger of Death as a 7th level spell does more damage than this. I mean, sure, it's a Ranged Touch spell, but still.Horrid Wilting... 9d10 ("aoe")
That's not bad.
The point of Polar Ray is the Drained 2 condition, it inflicts and extra 2xlevel HP damage and a -2 to Fort saves until it heals over days.
The one good thing about the high level AOEs like Chain Lightning, Horrid Wilting, and Weird is you can hit A LOT of targets even if the damage isn't great.
The point of Polar Ray is the Drained 2 condition, it inflicts and extra 2xlevel HP damage and a -2 to Fort saves until it heals over days.
I'd missed that effect
The one good thing about the high level AOEs like Chain Lightning, Horrid Wilting, and Weird is you can hit A LOT of targets even if the damage isn't great.
Horrid Wilting is better at it (it's literally "target everyone you can see"). Chain Lightening looks that way, but a critical success on the save terminates the spell early.
But yes. You can hit a LOT of targets.
Let's take a 20th level Wizard with the following feats: Spell Combination, Quickened Casting.
In one round you can cast up to four Disintegrates: your 9th level combination is 2x8th level Disintegrates, and you quicken your 7th level combination slot to get both in at once.
Your regular damage on a failed save: 32d10 from the first, 24d10 for the quickened one. That's 308 average damage. A Pit Fiend has 300 HP, although your chances of missing or having a save are pretty high.
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Fiery Body allows you to cast Produce Flame (at +1 damage die) as a single action for 1 minute. Just as the other polymorph spells give you natural attacks you can use without expending resources, this one gives you a rapid fire cantrip (plus some defense/fly ability) to spam at more than triple effectiveness. Might be nice as an opener against fire using (but not resistant/immune) or cold weak foes when you expect the battle to go for a while and only want to spend a single (high level) spell.
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Since PF2 combats should go longer and critical fails/hits are so important to having meaningful spell effects and damage, debuffing rounds may make more sense as an opener for spellcasters, especially if there is more than one and they can benefit from debuff conditions inflicted by each other that fade on a round by round basis.
To aid those strategies, here are some relevant combat debuffing spells by condition and spell level:
Sick (Penalty to all checks, action and Fort save to recover):
1: Goblin Pox
1: Phantom Pain
1: Savor the Sting
3: Stinking Cloud
4: Divine Wrath
5: Mariner's Curse
Strangely enough, the low level versions are often better or at least much more efficient as a debuff.
Drained (penalty to Fort/Con checks, lasts):
5: Abyssal Plague
7: Leng's Sting
8: Polar Ray
9: Wail of the Banshee
Polar Ray is a pretty strong opener for a finishing Fort save like Disintegrate, Flesh to Stone, or similar. But these are generally too high level and too limited in debuff effect to be your go to options.
Frightened (penalty to all checks, fades by 1 every round):
Cantrip: Dirge of Doom
1: Call of the Grave
1: Fear
4: Dread Aura
4: Phantasmal Killer
7: Mask of Terror
9: Weird
Dirge of Doom is the standout as it's cheap, can be kept up every round, and allows a Bard to self debuff a target for a spell on the same round. Dire of Doom into Phantom Pain has a good chance of having the target down by -2 on all actions including saves next turn.
Fear is surprisingly good later on as a debuff as the DC scales.
Fatigued (penalty to AC and saves)
None! It's really nasty and hard to get rid of, so Enfeebled is the spell replacement. But we don't care about that as much since it doesn't tank saves.
Enervated (penalty to all checks with a proficiency modifer, also blocks off some class abilities)
4: Enervation
That's it, but it's a very nice spell, especially combined with a True Strike to get a crit and push those saves down a level.
Asleep (auto critically fail reflex saves; also other stuff we don't care about here)
1: Faerie Dust (crit fail only)
1: Sleep
Sleep gets better at 3rd, but 1st is pretty good.
Putting it together
You need to chain these together to get the best affects. Frightened and potentially the Sick condition fade relatively quickly, so unless you're a Bard maintaining Dirge of Doom as a single action you generally want to cast a spell that Frightens or inflicts Sick right before an ally or you casts the finisher spell.
Bards excel at debuffing and have the best affects here in a way that synergize. Open with Dirge of Doom plus either Phantom Pain, Enervation, or Sleep, depending on how much you want to invest and what you're trying to accomplish. A two round debuff of Doom of Dirge/Enervation into Doom of Dirge/Phantom Pain into your finisher (w/Doom of Dirge) can inflict up to -7 in penalties if you luck into full crit fails along the way, and probably an expected value of -3 or -4. At high level two casters of different lists can coordinate to lay down some pretty complex timing and contingencies on who they debuff and attack.
Spellcasters seem to be able to prepare/know as many as 12 cantrips if they want to blow the feats.
4 (base from spellcasting)
2 (Cantrip Expansion feat)
1 (familiar via class feat or gnome ancestry)
1 (via elf/gnome ancestry feat)
2 (Wizard or Cleric archetype dedication feat)
2 (Cantrip Expansion feat taken via Basic/Advanced Dogma feats or Basic/Advanced Arcana feats from archetype class)
It would cost you a minimum of 6 feats (4 from class) to do this, which would be crazy, but you can. Personally I think 6-8 cantrips is enough and much more feat efficient.
Since PF2 combats should go longer and critical fails/hits are so important to having meaningful spell effects and damage, debuffing rounds may make more sense as an opener for spellcasters, especially if there is more than one and they can benefit from debuff conditions inflicted by each other that fade on a round by round basis.
To aid those strategies, here are some relevant combat debuffing spells by condition and spell level:
I missed Sluggish, which reduces attacks, AC, and reflex saves, all very useful to the entire party.
There's only one useful spell, but it's a doozy: Synesthesia is 5th level and inflicts Sluggish 3(!). Huge boost to your ranged attacks and blast spells, as well as a huge debuff to an enemies attacks.
Synesthesia also does Hampered 10, makes the target treat everyone as Concealed, and it has to make a DC 5 flat check to not fail at a concentrate action or reaction. It's amazing and great for a Bard.
What have people found for optimizing performance of various classes and their abilities?
Thank you so much for doing this! It does seem like a fair amount of system mastery is required to optimize, but it's not impossible!
Sadly, I must hide this thread from my players. I need them to suffer for at least a little while.
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Been looking into ways rogues can set up sneak attack without flanking with an ally.
First, Expert Athletics is nice if you are a rogue with a good strength score. Grapple and trip both give the target flat-footed, Grapple means the target can't get away as easily and trip might do some damage. Probably worth raising to master and legendary if you continue being able to combat maneuvers on enemies.
Deception gives feinting, which isn't terrible if other options don't fit your concept, but isn't fantastic either. Only getting it on one attack unless you critically succeed isn't fantastic.
Dread Striker rogue feat 4 makes using demoralize setup sneak attack as well. Combos with You're Next, though I'm skeptical on the usefulness of You're Next given that you need to get the killing blow on one enemy and have another one nearby. Still, this makes getting skill increases in Intimidation a good choice.
The critical specialization for Swords renders targets flat-footed for the round, which means if you can access it somehow you can get sneak attacks ensured when you crit. Ways to get it include Footpad's focus (not hugely useful since the target is already flat-footed) and Battle Elegance (Better, Elf only though).
Hammers and Flails critical specialization both make the target prone, Hammers can be obtained by Dwarfs with Weapon Cunning, not sure about flails. Light Hammer is a sneak-attack approved hammer, Flails have Whips and Spiked Chains. You'll need help getting the proficiency.
Polearm critical specialization could be used to set up flanking, but I don't think any polearms work with sneak attack.
Fighter Multiclassing opens up a couple other options. The dedication feat itself is nice for strength-based rogues because it gives access to some new weapons and better armor. Dex rogues can make use of the new proficiencies too, but I don't really see any that are better than the rogue baseline personally.
Basic Maneuver for Combat Grab will do the trick. If don't care for Combat Grab, Double Slice is a fairly iconic choice to meet the Advanced Maneuver prerequisite should you want that. Sudden Charge helps setup flanks if the battlefield is working against you. Intimidating Strike is another good pick, works well thematically with an Intimidation build, but it does cut off the third attack every other round at best. Maybe the second if the fight is mobile.
Advanced Manuever has some options but you probably have enough from getting basic maneuver. Still, Improved Combat Grab isn't bad, going for Brutish Shove and Improved (Requires Spiked Chain or Elven Curveblade to work with sneak attack) does the trick, Shatter Defenses helps but only if you want to add the sluggish bit, you can get Dread Striker earlier. If you aren't going for these, probably should either abandon archetypes or grab Opportunist or Weapon Expert (if you use a weapon that rogue won't upgrade to expert) to round out the dedication requirements and pick up the next one.
Been looking into ways rogues can set up sneak attack without flanking with an ally.
You seem to be automatically flat footed when climbing inclines or ropes, when on uneven ground, or on narrow surfaces. So while risky you can possibly set up choke points where a rogue can engage people with tilted odds.
As far as I can tell (though weirdly enough its examples are in enemy rules not yours) you get to keep your surprise shankings when it becomes literally impossible for the target to see you. Invisibility is an obvious example (wizard multiclass or buddies go go go), but if you're against humans being a goblin should simply let you take the lights out (e.g. darkness spell from a buddy) and shank everybody in the dark.
Darkened eyes cleric power from a buddy might work? As would bottled lightning.
Of course, if teamwork is getting pulled in it might be a good idea to just multiclass fighter and dual wield rapiers or something (or a nunchaku with bludgeoner if your GM allows you to, some other d6 club if not) with double slice to pull your expected damage up slightly.
Edit: As of level 5, a dual rapier elf or half-elf seems like one of the better ideas depending on when that one round duration ends. Sword group weapons catch the target flat footed on a crit, so with allies helping out when you fail to crit, you can potentially chain. That said, I suppose it's likely that 1 round ends on your next turn, not at the appropriate point.
Spellstrike Ammunition (pg408) looks like a really cheap way at higher levels for casters to get their martial ranged allies in on the debuffing action and inflict a debuff spell before a condition like Frightened or Sick fades.
A level 1 (7gp) piece of ammunition seems like a very strong candidate for Goblin Pox (Sick 1 and possible Slow 1), Phantom Pain (persistent damage and Sick 1), Fear (Frightened 1-3), or Shocking Grasp (persistent damage to metal armored targets, but probably only worth it over other options if they're weak to Electricity).
At very high levels I can see buying some level 4-6 options as boss killers. Enervation, Synesthesia, and Feeblemind all have excellent potential to really ruin a tough foe's day when delivered by a martial as a single action before the caster's first spells.
For do it yourself fun a Bard (or other caster who acquired weapon proficiency or even just relies on an opening crosssbow shot) can craft his own Spellstrike Ammunition and then fire as his first action before following up with a spell to exploit the debuff.
Nevermind, the rules on activating magical ammunition require you to do it in the same round you shoot, so this is only useful for gishes in limited circumstances. Cast + strike if your to hit vs AC is higher than your to hit vs. TAC and you're trying to avoid a multiattack penalty you'd otherwise have. Also works as a range extender for touch and short range attacks.
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Deception gives feinting, which isn't terrible if other options don't fit your concept, but isn't fantastic either. Only getting it on one attack unless you critically succeed isn't fantastic.
Notably feint does not have the attack trait so no multiple attack penalty when feinting unlike trip or grapple.
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Globe of Invulnerability is on every spell list, is uncommon (for good reason), and if heightened is a fantastic defensive spell against lower level magic, with decent utility against same level stuff.
You create an immobile globe around you that attempts to dispel any spell from outside the globe whose area or targets enter into the globe, as if the globe were a dispel magic spell 1 level lower than its actual spell level. Even if the dispel attempt succeeds, it prevents only the portion of the spell that would have entered the globe (so if the spell also had targets outside the globe or part of its area were beyond the globe, those targets or area would still be affected normally).
You automatically dispel effects less than your level, attempt a spell roll against the DC of same level, and take a -5 penalty to your spell level for every higher level.
So a 11th level caster who used a 6th level Globe would for 1 minute be immune to all 4th level effects and have a roughly 50% chance (depending on relative optimization between your spell roll and the opposing DC) against any 5th level effects, with a -5 penalty on 6th level and -10 to 7th. Very nice if you're facing multiple weaker casters, just cast Nope! and ignore them until you're ready.
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Lots of neat ideas and strategies in this thread! Seems like you guys are figuring out a lot of the same things that I've been using, or seen those in my group use.
Deception gives feinting, which isn't terrible if other options don't fit your concept, but isn't fantastic either. Only getting it on one attack unless you critically succeed isn't fantastic.Notably feint does not have the attack trait so no multiple attack penalty when feinting unlike trip or grapple.
For pure martials either intimidate or feinting seem almost mandatory as you will often be looking for worthwhile ways to use your third action (or usually first action).
The medicine skill feat that allows you to heal in combat seems attractive for the very same reason!
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Wizard Multiclassing for Grease opens up sneak attack, as maintaining balance makes a creature flat-footed generally. Also, grease got a stealth buff along with the nerfs. Can't target a lot of 2-handed weapons anymore but it isn't locked into a 10' square on the ground. Instead, it's just 4 contiguous squares opening up any of the tetris shapes on a battlefield.
Feather Token (tree) doesn't work for most of its old purposes since it can only be used where a tree existing would make since. But Feather Token (ladder) is cheaper, lower-level, and retains a lot of the old item's functioning. Resonance will make this more of an emergency-use item, but it seems to work in any situation where you suddenly need a sturdy 20' long ladder. My favorite is using it when swallowed whole because it lets you climb right on out of the monster's belly.
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At 20th level, a Fighter has access to an attack routine that looks like:
WEAPON SUPREMACY QUICK (STRIKE)
CERTAIN STRIKE
CERTAIN STRIKE
CERTAIN STRIKE
DESPERATE FINISHER (CERTAIN STRIKE)
You have an extra stride or strike each round due to weapon supremacy, and you get an extra press action each round due to desperate finisher (assuming you're willing to trade your reaction away). Certain Strike allows you to do minimum damage when you fail to hit (as if you'd rolled a 1 on each damage die).
The trick is using a weapon with forceful, which amps up the minimum damage by adding +X to each hit after the first (@20th level, a falchion will deal ~19 damage on a miss with your second attack, or ~25 damage on a miss on all subsequent attacks). Due to the low accuracy of later attacks you make in a round, this is a huge boost to your damage output, especially because forceful is a circumstance bonus, and it therefore stacks with all your other potential buffs.
You can actually start using this tactic from 10th level (when you pick up Certain Strike), though it doesn't become far and away the most effective damage-wise until higher levels when you have a pile of attacks at -10 to hit.
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Note that the above tricks let a 20th level universalist wizard who took a 10th level spell slot use up to (3 basic + 3 makeshift wand + 2 drain focus + 1 Focus Conservation drop from 10th) nine 8th level spells in one day! Also applies as early as 14th level to max level -2, so you can have 9 of your third best spells (5th level spell at 14th Wizard level) from then on.
I don't think that works. Normal (non-makeshift) wands are capped at level 4 spells. I assume this also applies to makeshift wand.
If it doesn't for some reason, we need an expanded table for the spell roll cap of wands (see page 380).
Even capped at 4th level, Makeshift Wand is still my favorite Wizard feat. Three extra castings of Stoneskin, Dimension Door, Freedom of Movement, Fly, 4th level false life... All very nice things to have.
Note that the above tricks let a 20th level universalist wizard who took a 10th level spell slot use up to (3 basic + 3 makeshift wand + 2 drain focus + 1 Focus Conservation drop from 10th) nine 8th level spells in one day! Also applies as early as 14th level to max level -2, so you can have 9 of your third best spells (5th level spell at 14th Wizard level) from then on.I don't think that works. Normal (non-makeshift) wands are capped at level 4 spells. I assume this also applies to makeshift wand.
If it doesn't for some reason, we need an expanded table for the spell roll cap of wands (see page 380).
Even capped at 4th level, Makeshift Wand is still my favorite Wizard feat. Three extra castings of Stoneskin, Dimension Door, Freedom of Movement, Fly, 4th level false life... All very nice things to have.
It follows the normal wand rules "except...its spell level must be 2 or more levels lower than your highest-spell level." That's one of the exemptions, although I will grant that "must" can be read to make this an additional limitation rather than a complete override of the usual wand rules. The big hit from the normal wand rules that you don't avoid is resonance point cost to use the thing.
I think if Makeshift ignored the "Max level 4" rule, it would say so explicitely. The level -2 thing is only there to avoid wizards slinging three additional 4th level spells at level 8.
I'm extremely stingy when it comes to consumables, so I rarely use up anyting that doesn't recharge. I don't think Resonance will be a big problem for me personally. But it is something to keep in mind, for sure.
Just noticed Silence has no save, lasts 1 minute, and is a touch attack, so this is a FANTASTIC way to shutdown casting enemies, especially if you have Reach Spell or Spellstrike Ammunition. Bards can pull out an instrument (if it's not the heightened version), but other classes (and monsters) are going to have to try melee.
Check the target line. Only affects a single willing creature and has no radius unless it's hightened to 4th level. A barbarian with No Escape and that level 4 silence on him would be big trouble for a caster, though.
Just noticed Silence has no save, lasts 1 minute, and is a touch attack, so this is a FANTASTIC way to shutdown casting enemies, especially if you have Reach Spell or Spellstrike Ammunition. Bards can pull out an instrument (if it's not the heightened version), but other classes (and monsters) are going to have to try melee.Check the target line. Only affects a single willing creature and has no radius unless it's hightened to 4th level. A barbarian with No Escape and that level 4 silence on him would be big trouble for a caster, though.
Whew! That look crazy, glad I was wrong.
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Note that the above tricks let a 20th level universalist wizard who took a 10th level spell slot use up to (3 basic + 3 makeshift wand + 2 drain focus + 1 Focus Conservation drop from 10th) nine 8th level spells in one day! Also applies as early as 14th level to max level -2, so you can have 9 of your third best spells (5th level spell at 14th Wizard level) from then on.I don't think that works. Normal (non-makeshift) wands are capped at level 4 spells. I assume this also applies to makeshift wand.
If it doesn't for some reason, we need an expanded table for the spell roll cap of wands (see page 380).
Even capped at 4th level, Makeshift Wand is still my favorite Wizard feat. Three extra castings of Stoneskin, Dimension Door, Freedom of Movement, Fly, 4th level false life... All very nice things to have.
That's as intended, and I agree with you that it's still a really nice feat! There is never a time when you can't think of a 4th level spell you'd like to have three of in a pinch.
So Bards and Performance substitutions. Let's discuss.
First, the basics. Performance is a signature skill that you can boost via Virtuosic Performer skill feat to receive a +2 circumstance bonus on a Performance specialty. I recommend acting, as it it the only category that can be both auditory and visual. You will also likely want to keep your Charisma stat maxed for spell DC reasons, so every time you're substituting Performance for something you're getting the best possible proficiency rank (+1 at 3rd, +2 at 7th, +3 at 15th), the best possible stat bonus, and any item bonus you can scrounge up. Magic items are Persona Mask (Acting, Comedy, stuff like that) for a +2/+4, Dancing Scarf (Dancing), and a couple of different musical instruments that do a +3/+5, as well as mundane quality instruments that can provide a +1 or +2. But the two hands thing and auditory limitation kills those for me, so nevermind.
As you can see, your Performance bonus is likely to be higher (because permanent skill feat +2 and incentive to max all other inputs) than anything else you're likely to have. (And I haven't included here any generally applicable conditional bonuses like Guidance or Heroism.)
What can we do with it?
1. Counter Performance power lets you substitute as a reaction a Performance check for any save by you or an ally against an Auditory or Visual affect if your roll is higher. Your Cha is maxed, which Wis/Con certainly won't be for everyone (I haven't seen a Reflex save against one of these effects), and your skill proficiency is likely better than their save proficiency starting at level 7. Add in your skill bonus and near parity or advantage on item bonuses and you're not only giving them a second save chance, you're probably giving them a better save chance.
What does this work on? Not that many spells surprisingly (command, charming words, several pattern illusions mostly, as well as any disbelieve checks), but a lot of really nasty monster abilities. Gaze attacks can be thwarted by this, as can various scream, roar, or other (often mind rending) auditory attacks. The bestiary has more of them than I expected.
2. Versatile Performance lets you substitute your Performance check for Intimidate to Demoralize, Diplomacy to Make an Impression, and Deception to Impersonate. These are things you want to do, and while they are also things you'll likely want to be trained in anyway (because of other uses of these feats), and the Cha bonus is the same, your item bonus (if a Persona Mask for acting) and feat bonus will apply equally to them all.
A maxed Performance bonus (with a +4 item bonus and +2 Cha item) at level 20 is +36 (20 +3 +7 + 2 + 4). The will DC you target for a Demoralize action is 30 for a Pit Fiend, 33 for a Balor, 36 for a Grim Reaper, 32 for a Mu Sport, 34 for a Titan, and 38 for a Jabberwock. That's a 95% chance to succeed and a very good chance to crit (for Frighten 2) on every Level 20+ creature in the Bestiary. Drop that action then cast your spell. And pick up the Intimidating Glare skill feat so you don't suffer a -4 penalty for not sharing a language. (I'd really want to go all the way to Legendary Intimidation and Scare to Death, but it's way too wasteful in duplicated capabilities.)
3. Extend your Lingering Performances and enhance your Inspire Heroics. You start off with just a 45% fail/50% succeed/5% crit chance, but as you get your Virtuosic Performance feat and item bonuses that climbs up to 15% fail/50% succeed/35% crit late career.
A Demoralize for -1/-2 to a boss, followed up by a +2/+3 to hit/damage for the whole party, followed up by an attack, plus a "NOPE!" when they try to scream your sanity away isn't a bad round when you're trying to save spells. Make those Performance investments.
That is an excellent Performance analysis and is accurate on almost every point. However, the CR 20+ creatures are incredibly incredibly fearsome foes (especially since mostly only 20th level parties will ever fight a 23, for instance) and their DCs are 10 harder than you thought. You still have nearly a 50% chance against the most powerful monster in the book before taking into account buffs you might have active like heroism, which is still pretty excellent!
That is an excellent Performance analysis and is accurate on almost every point. However, the CR 20+ creatures are incredibly incredibly fearsome foes (especially since mostly only 20th level parties will ever fight a 23, for instance) and their DCs are 10 harder than you thought. You still have nearly a 50% chance against the most powerful monster in the book before taking into account buffs you might have active like heroism, which is still pretty excellent!
That makes sense, but where can I find the rule that establishes which opponents get this bonus?
So Bards and Performance substitutions. Let's discuss.
One I forgot:
4. Melodious Spell feat allows you to cast spells undetected if you beat observers' Perception DC with an Performance check. But this is a suckers bet, you have at best a 50% chance of success against same level opponents when you're optimized to the gills. I wouldn't bet a plan on those odds, especially since they still get the save attempt afterwards. Still, you're going to be a lot better at it than a Wizard who has to try two separate checks using skills he won't be nearly as good at.
For a martial class it seems pretty strong, by level 16 a fighter can pick up Graceful Poise "While in this stance, if you make your second Strike from Double Slice with an agile weapon or agile unarmed attack, it doesn’t count toward your multiple attack penalty for the turn." If you attack with double strike first than follow up with the level 14 feat 1 action Two-weapon flurry "Strike twice, once with each weapon. These do not count toward the multiple attack penalty until the second Strike." You can get 4 attacks in the turn all at full attack bonus without some form of haste.
If I recall, Two-Weapon Flurry requires you to have a -8 multiple attack penalty to use it, doesn't it?
I'm also confused what the "these do not count toward the multiple attack penalty until the second Strike" part of Two-Weapon Flurry is supposed to mean. I don't see how your multiple attack penalty isn't capped if you're at -8. So maybe I'm missing something about it.
That is an excellent Performance analysis and is accurate on almost every point. However, the CR 20+ creatures are incredibly incredibly fearsome foes (especially since mostly only 20th level parties will ever fight a 23, for instance) and their DCs are 10 harder than you thought. You still have nearly a 50% chance against the most powerful monster in the book before taking into account buffs you might have active like heroism, which is still pretty excellent!That makes sense, but where can I find the rule that establishes which opponents get this bonus?
They all do. Will DC is 10 + Will bonus. That happens to be 48 for jabby.
Not sure if it is intentional, but I think the most raw damage for a rogue is if they focus on strength. Elven Curveblade and Spiked Chain are 2-handed finesse weapons, the only 2-handed finesse or agile weapons I can find, and each do 1d8. Which means at +5 (the cap) they will be doing 6d8 instead of 6d6 (from a rapier or whatnot). But, finesse striker only adds dexterity to damage on 1-handed weapons, so you still need strength to damage for the curveblade/spiked chain. It is a very small bonus, but it means strength rogues can still do the most damage compared to their dex-based counterparts, and have to sacrifice feats on getting proficiency to do so as well as likely needing to spend feats on better armor to compensate a lower dexterity (unless you keep up with both).
Of course, this only works if the extra damage will outweigh the extra attack bonus from using an agile weapon like a shortsword. It also requires fighter multiclassing to keep accuracy on par before agile, so you can be an expert with the ECB/Spiked Chain. Without going into an in-depth math analysis (that I might do later, if I remember to), I'd guess forceful might counteract agile assuming the enemy isn't too hard to hit for your level. But I'm a bit skeptical.
20th level Bards who take Power Word Kill as a 9th level spell and Fatal Aria as their capstone can inflict 100 guaranteed damage (assuming no mental resistance) against a single tough opponent with two actions, one 9th level spell slot, and 2 spell points. Each leaves an opponent Bolstered, but only against itself. If you're facing three opponents you can hit them all over for 100 damage over the course of two rounds, assuming they're all in range. If there's only one, maybe shoot him with a bow as your last action.
It's not fantastic, especially compared to a 20th level Wizard using Quicken Spell and combination spell slots, but against high level opponents with high saves it might just be the most reliable contribution you can make to the group in combat. Certainly better than a 9th level level Magic Missile, which would take up all three actions, the 9th level slot, and only average 67.5 damage.
They all do. Will DC is 10 + Will bonus. That happens to be 48 for jabby.That is an excellent Performance analysis and is accurate on almost every point. However, the CR 20+ creatures are incredibly incredibly fearsome foes (especially since mostly only 20th level parties will ever fight a 23, for instance) and their DCs are 10 harder than you thought. You still have nearly a 50% chance against the most powerful monster in the book before taking into account buffs you might have active like heroism, which is still pretty excellent!That makes sense, but where can I find the rule that establishes which opponents get this bonus?
Oh, I guess that is implied by the skill DC rules in this circumstance. Makes this not that great (as with most optimized things in the playtest), seriously downgrades the utility of Versatile Performance, and elevates the worth of Dirge of Doom.
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How to store big amounts of currency for a rainy day, or take away a dragon's hoard: Purchase several Feather Token (chests) [pg 390] for 7 gp a pop. Each one can store 10,999 coins as zero bulk in the form of a key. Keep a zero bulk key ring with you money in 11k (or 110k) gp increments, and permanently expend each one when you're ready to buy a big ticket item.
Pro tip: always keep any keys you find on a traveling priest of Abadar, they aren't always utilitarian or holy symbols, he might be a courier doing interbank transfers.