Breaking Down A Door With A Gun


Rules Questions


I know there are rules regarding "appropriate" weapons for damaging objects. I'm wondering if a gun would be considered appropriate for breaking down a heavy wooden door with iron bands for reinforcement. It's a barred door, so you can't just shoot out the lock.

Any ideas what is allowed in such a situation?


Shoot out the hinges?

I'm being silly though. If it's barred on the opposite side, there's nothing a firearm smaller than a seige weapon is gonna do against it. The bar is gonna anchor it to the wall, you need the raw force to push forward through the door's support and the bar, or hope the bar isn't anchored to the door itself and try to have it fall in. However, if it's in a position to fall in the hinges would have to be on your side, which they wouldn't on a one-sided bar.


If you have access to guns, you have access to blackpowder. Bullets may do nothing, but explosives usually work for breaching barred doors.


VoodistMonk wrote:
If you have access to guns, you have access to blackpowder. Bullets may do nothing, but explosives usually work for breaching barred doors.

100 doses for a bomb though. I got called out on that one in a previous game. Dumped out a powder horn to destroy a damaged pillar. 10-20 doses doesn't go much.


You should have made a Know:Engineering check, put a full water skin between the door and your charge, the hydrostatic shock will amplify even relatively small explosions to splitter even the toughest doors.


There is very, very little chance for your gun to be an 'appropriate' weapon.

Even if I was being generous, the gun that would be closest to 'appropriate' would be the blunderbuss (because it hits multiple times, thus it would do more structural damage and dig out more than a single small bullet hole). ...but pretty much no one actually uses those because theirs stats are not good. Maybe you use the advanced version with the shotgun (but most games that use those are higher level and you would have better options by then... or at least enough money to let you spam powder kegs).

But generally, people either use the rifle or the hand gun.


Cool. Thanks. I have a gunslinger in my game that pretty much shoots first, and second, and third, and fourth and asks questions never. I'm expecting him to put up a bit of a fuss when he hits a problem he can't solve with high velocity lead in massive quantities. Just wanted to make sure I'm interpreting it right.


It will be good to have to think outside the box.

Although, I thought there was a grit feat or deed called something like can't stop me or Run through anything, allowing you to shoot an unattended object in your way as you ran... doors do have a pretty much set HP and hardness, right?


I mean, enough bullets will take down a tree if you want to. You'd need to be doing enough damage to prove you were basically piercing the whole door (probably double the DR of the door just to be sure) and then he'd want to fire enough rounds to effectively carve a hole in the door big enough to see the bar and cut that too (or lift it from this side). It's basically something that would take a good half hour, or four clips from an Uzi. If he has all day, trapped alone with no other choice, he can probably manage the task and not just die trapped in a room under these circumstances, if he has the ammo. It should be immediately evident he's not going to succeed in enough time for it to matter though, and I'd say it's definitely time to get him thinking about something other than being a pistol with a body attached to it.


It's part of a module. A scene where the party has ten rounds to get a door open while under attack and keep the door open for some NPC that will be arriving in ten rounds.

Another scene involves destroying a bunch of siege equipment while under some significant time pressure. I'm guessing the gunslinger may struggle with that too. Would it be appropriate to allow partial damage from a gun?


I'd say no. He needs to be a character, not a weapon. A spear (another small surface area piercing weapon) would do next to nothing to a door. Punching it (a bludgeoning weapon) wouldn't have much effect without a sunder attempt. I wouldn't give the gun a pass. Make him and the party work together and think it through.


If (and this is a big if) he has adamantine flaming burst or sonic boom bullets I might allow it.

Grand Lodge

As mentioned, the door has a hardness rating. The bullets would have to get damage through the hardness before you could start actually exhausting the hit points (also specified in the player book, by material and thickness if the module doesn't list it). Sort of like Damage Resistance. And like damage resistance, it can be penetrated with preparation. The way through hardness is adamantine bullets (60 gp each!) or bullets with the adamantine blanch, much more reasonably priced.

If your gunslinger is not a planner, then he probably doesn't have cold iron or silver blanched bullets, let alone the adamantine ones. So unless the gunslinger crits, he's pretty well stopped by the hardness rating.

BTW, the fastest way to destroy most siege weapons is to pour lamp oil over them, then light them up with a flask of Alchemist's Fire.


Also, ranged attacks do halve damage to objects, before worrying about hardness, even if you do allow it.

I am firmly in the camp of a gun being an ineffective weapon for breaking down a door, however. You could certainly put a hole through one potentially, which could be useful, if it were watertight or airtight. Breaking it down, I wouldn't allow it without a compelling reason.


The most useful thing that the gun brings to the table is its gunpowder. If physics exist in this game make it so it's harder to swing bludgeoning weapons underwater, then water is still thicker than air in this game. That means a hydrostatic breaching charges will still work in fantasy land.

Powder Horn + Water Skin + fire/fuse


Make a shape charge with gunpowder in an Ale Mug or a Bucket, glue it to the door with some Animal Glue, and blind them with science :)

Grand Lodge

Quote:
Powder Horn + Water Skin + fire/fuse

Add an Air Bubble to that and you're good to go.

Quote:


Make a shape charge with gunpowder in an Ale Mug or a Bucket, glue it to the door with some Animal Glue, and blind them with science :)

Sadly, if the door is as difficult as specified, the ale mug/bucket are going to shatter first. Stand well back, or you'll be picking splinters out of your face...

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