Contributor
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So, I have a bit of a controversial thought. Since we're looking at goblins being a Core ancestry, it would be interesting to see goblins added back into the boon rotation for the final year of PFS1. It'll help the idea of goblins being present in the Society ramp up as we approach a potential "Goblins are Always Available" future.
Just a thought - agreement and disagreement welcome. ^_^
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Are you not planning on moving on to Pathfinder 2.0?
I see many benefits:
• Playtest PFS 2.0 and you get Boons for when the Campaign goes live.
• The material won't change much from Playtest to finished product. Learning it now gives you a jumpstart to being a competent player and GM.
• Contribute feedback in the Playtest Forums. I've playtested a handful of games in my years and sometimes you bring up an idea or critique nobody else thought of.
• All the cool kids are doing it! Honestly, how many people do you know who still get together regularly for D&D 1st Ed?
Regional Venture-Coordinator, Appalachia
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I think given the reaction to goblins and the lines along which that debate has broken out that bringing them in as a boon race is just asking for trouble. For people want to remain behind in 1E land, the lack of goblins looks like it may well be a motivating factor.
Let goblins be a 2E only thing.
• All the cool kids are doing it! Honestly, how many people do you know who still get together regularly for D&D 1st Ed?
As an interesting aside, I am literally running PFS at a con this weekend that is PRIMARILY dedicated to a bunch of old grognards playing OD&D. It's pretty unusual though I grant!
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RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16
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Despite me saying this, I wouldn't mind them in boon rotation. It should feel special to play a goblin and be done by a player who knows how to not be disruptive at the table.
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It is no guarantee if they are in RSP/Convention GM Boon rotation that the players are going to be responsible playing *any* character, much less goblins.
There is this mythology that springs from the 'gating' of races via Boon that folks will be polite and respectful with them, but I've seen several subtle abuses from player-side.
In essence, players 'daring' GMs to try and take their 'special' character out.
If we're going to do this, it needs to be in S10's Guide.
Straight up, race allowed, done.
Don't gate it behind a 'BoonWall' that players will give kidneys or other vital organs for.
Venture-Captain, Minnesota
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I just wonder how many are currently still floating around.
There were 34 originally issued. I know that Durvin Gest (Bob Jonquet’s goblin) is still around, as is Mr. Slanky’s Captain Rumlugger. There may be only one or two of the original boons left unclaimed by now. I can confirm that there’s at least one unclaimed one left, because I know the GM that has it, but there may be a couple others.
They’re vanishingly rare.
Hmm
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I can confirm that there’s at least one unclaimed one left, because I know the GM that has itI shudder to think what people would give for it, though the value goes down quickly the closer we get to 2E (assuming goblins remain in the core after the playtest).
$460 two years ago from a bidding population of around 100 nerds.
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It is no guarantee if they are in RSP/Convention GM Boon rotation that the players are going to be responsible playing *any* character, much less goblins.There is this mythology that springs from the 'gating' of races via Boon that folks will be polite and respectful with them, but I've seen several subtle abuses from player-side.
In essence, players 'daring' GMs to try and take their 'special' character out.
If we're going to do this, it needs to be in S10's Guide.
Straight up, race allowed, done.
Don't gate it behind a 'BoonWall' that players will give kidneys or other vital organs for.
If it's just in the guide I'd still say limit it to one goblin per player, but no boonwall.
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I would not want to see goblins opened up in PFS. We have the playtest campaign coming up which is the perfect place to test-drive goblins in general playspace. If 2E is released with goblins as a core race, then IMO we owe it to the community to not pretend like we know better than the designers. I prefer consistency in the organized play rules to the core rules as much and whenever possible. Blocking evil characters and crafting are reasonable accommodations given their impact on the campaign and how GMs would have to adjudicate their inclusion, but banning a core race is a bit more than necessary, IMO, even if personally I would rather they not be part of the core races.
Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Martinsville
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I just wonder how many are currently still floating around.There were 34 originally issued. I know that Durvin Gest (Bob Jonquet’s goblin) is still around, as is Mr. Slanky’s Captain Rumlugger. There may be only one or two of the original boons left unclaimed by now. I can confirm that there’s at least one unclaimed one left, because I know the GM that has it, but there may be a couple others.
They’re vanishingly rare.
Hmm
Me and my friend was in the special that got the boons handed out for winning the tier. We should have gotten one for each player at the table, but our GM scored us on the wrong tier. (Should have been 1-2 tier instead of the 3-4 tier he forced us to play because a character leveled up between part 1 and 2)
I made my halfling that thinks he is a goblin soon after that.
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Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria
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At this point, I want to see a lot of text and various examples of those very unusual Goblins that explains not only why the Society has allowed a sizeable number of Goblins to their numbers (as if our reputation was not bad enough already) but also explains why they are not kicked out of every city.
Adventurer's Guide did quite a bit of work when in the Lantern Bearer's section when it came to Drow, and at least on the surface, Goblins have a much worse rep. Someone with writing skills like that is needed to tackle that issue.
I am very curious about the playtest and how that writing ends up, but I would not be sad to hear that the would not end up in the release version of the CRB for PF2.
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While I appreciate Kalindlara suggestion , players really need a better framework that what we currently have, otherwise players will play them like Goblins.
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The original intention was to award a goblins boon to each player and the GM at the table that “won” (scored the most points) in each Tier range of part two of that competitive special. In reality, there were some additional “honorary” boons issued to people like the campaign coordinator, the author of part one of the special, the overseer, and a few others. So the actual number of goblins is somewhere in the 40’s IIRC.
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There is one in my area, actively played.
This is my son's fleshwarped goblin alchemist, who I'd like to think he plays very responsibly - and entertainingly. He won the boon in a charity auction as a fundraiser to support someone's cancer treatment, and he wants to respect its origins.
While I agree that adding goblin PC's into the final season makes sense from a story perspective, to help smooth the transition to PF 2.0, I strongly agree with the idea of keeping 1.0 a goblin-free zone. So far, I think the story of how goblins have changed and are now suitable as player characters is a pretty flimsy one, and it won't get any stronger if they have less time to craft it.
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Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Martinsville
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Tier 1-2 did not get any boons as all the tables that was scored in 1-2 died during the special.
We ran after a second try at the pipes, having only gotten on pipe down and the other still at 3/4's hp.
Hardness for 1-2 tier characters with a 3rd level mage is nigh impossible.
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Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Martinsville
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One of those Higher Tier tables was because of time constraints, and the GM allowed the players to only use PP for a body recovery instead of the raising character that was still alive.
It was a rushed and poorly executed part of the special, and it is better that it not be ran again.
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In Race for the Runecarved Key - part 2, the every PC at a tier 10-11 table died as well.
Yes, for 3 reasons that I'm still pretty bitter about.
1) Mustering was really terrible. Our table didn't sit until 45 minutes into the slot, so we lost 45 minutes of time to complete the mission. We would have likely completed the mission just fine if we'd had that 45 minutes.
2) Our GM was late, sick, had no voice, and generally did not have enough energy to truly run the game in a timely fashion. Secondly, it was fairly obvious that the adventure was not fully written, and the GM had trouble understanding much of it. I'm not sure how many GMs essentially ran this cold because it wasn't given to them until pretty late in the process. But not being able to hear the GM (cause he was sick with no voice) and the GM not being prepared enough (probably no fault of his) made for a fairly poor experience.
3) Boxed Text killed all characters if they didn't make it out in time. Even if they had methods like Plane Shift or Shadow Walk that could have done so. So we lost 45 minutes, had a GM that wasn't prepared and was unenergetic to keep things moving, and we died to boxed Text.
Otherwise, it was one of my favorite scenarios because of the puzzles! I love puzzles. We solved all the puzzles. And then to have it end so anticlimactically, largely due to the fact that we started late and were not given that time to finish, really sucked.
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Boxed Text killed all characters if they didn't make it out in time. Even if they had methods like Plane Shift or Shadow Walk that could have done so.
This was actually a misunderstanding by the GM. IIRC there were three or four, mostly at the high-tier tables, that made this mistake. Planar travel to escape after the gate closed was permitted, though admittedly it was not really well spelled out in the text. I know of one table that was reconned the next day due to that issue, but only with respect to the cost they spent to escape and the related resurrections. Though that did not earn them the goblin boon AFAIK.
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I'm so glad I've played and run Race for the Runecarved Key at smaller cons where the stakes weren't so high. I've seen a lot of people really enjoy it. It is still my favorite special and I'm so sorry that it's initial implementation ruined our chances to have another like it.
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Regarding goblins, I think we will have a more than sufficiently diverse group of races around the tables in the coming years without them. Especially as those of us who have been accumulating race boons realize we don't need to make any more characters to finish the campaign and instead hand them out to the newer players.
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I'm so glad I've played and run Race for the Runecarved Key at smaller cons where the stakes weren't so high. I've seen a lot of people really enjoy it. It is still my favorite special and I'm so sorry that it's initial implementation ruined our chances to have another like it.
They're referring to part 2 of the special, which AFAIK was only run at the Grand Convocation and not available elsewhere. Part 1 is still available to run and play if you can get enough tables.
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I'm so glad I've played and run Race for the Runecarved Key at smaller cons where the stakes weren't so high. I've seen a lot of people really enjoy it. It is still my favorite special and I'm so sorry that it's initial implementation ruined our chances to have another like it.They're referring to part 2 of the special, which AFAIK was only run at the Grand Convocation and not available elsewhere. Part 1 is still available to run and play if you can get enough tables.
Partially correct. The Grand Convocation 4712 was a special that was run exclusively at Paizo Con 2012. It had some play acting to set up the scene in Blakros Matrimony.
Race for the Runecarved Key, Part 2 was run exclusively at Gen Con 2012. And the only people that got to play it were the tables that won Part 1 the day before.
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Regional Venture-Coordinator, Baltic
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In Race for the Runecarved Key - part 2, the every PC at a tier 10-11 table died as well.Yes, for 3 reasons that I'm still pretty bitter about.
1) Mustering was really terrible. Our table didn't sit until 45 minutes into the slot, so we lost 45 minutes of time to complete the mission. We would have likely completed the mission just fine if we'd had that 45 minutes.
2) Our GM was late, sick, had no voice, and generally did not have enough energy to truly run the game in a timely fashion. Secondly, it was fairly obvious that the adventure was not fully written, and the GM had trouble understanding much of it. I'm not sure how many GMs essentially ran this cold because it wasn't given to them until pretty late in the process. But not being able to hear the GM (cause he was sick with no voice) and the GM not being prepared enough (probably no fault of his) made for a fairly poor experience.
3) Boxed Text killed all characters if they didn't make it out in time. Even if they had methods like Plane Shift or Shadow Walk that could have done so. So we lost 45 minutes, had a GM that wasn't prepared and was unenergetic to keep things moving, and we died to boxed Text.
Otherwise, it was one of my favorite scenarios because of the puzzles! I love puzzles. We solved all the puzzles. And then to have it end so anticlimactically, largely due to the fact that we started late and were not given that time to finish, really sucked.
I had a similair experience.
We lost 60 minutes due to mustering.
It was very hard to hear everyone at the table.
Near the end the GM said that because we started late, he'd allow us to do another encounter. We succesfully completed it, time was called, but the GM gave us the extra time he promised us in which we escaped. He went to HQ to report the table and came back telling us we had all died.
Some of the players were so upset they didn't realise they had enough prestige to get raised due to a certain boon. They left the table and never played Pathfinder Society again.
I really enjoyed the scenario...
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I guess lessons WERE learned, because my first Interactive Special
It may have been an interesting experience, but the cooperative Specials have a better 'feel' to them, imo?
There will be an inverse paradox come PFS2. Goblins will be as common as dirt, so what now-common race will be the rarest in PFS2?
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Are there more than 4 pre gen goblins for We Be Goblins? I had heard there was Buggy Bugeye and Stumpbiter, but I can find anything official to confirm this.They are fan creations, and not legal for use in Pathfinder Society play.
Technically, they were co-created by Jason Bulmahn so not entirely "fan" creations. Most who have seen the goblins agree they are much more optimized than the original four, but since Jason was involved in their creation it certainly lends some legitimacy to their builds.
When I was a VC, I was given permission by both Mike Brock and Tonya to use them in my area, though that may have been done verbally as I cannot locate any emails in my archive as such or any forum posts. So, my recommendation would be to consult your RVC.