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First of all, thank you for working to improve the boards. It's definitely needed and appreciated.
I do have to echo the feedback of others, however. I thought it was just me, but apparently others are also experiencing headaches from the new font. It's really not pleasant for the eyes, my eyes, at least. I think the base font size also needs to be larger.
Some issues from the previous site also persist, like not being able to 'list' the first post in a thread, making it impossible to track threads that way.
I also would very much like quick links at the top of the site to my campaigns tab and the forums tab. There was something similar before and it made navigating the site much quicker.
I can't say definitively whether or not the site is faster or slower. The fact that I can't tell leads me to believe it's probably about the same for now. Hopefully that will improve once more kinks have been worked out.
I do think the new site layout has the potential to be more aesthetically pleasing, but it's hard to say for sure at this point.
Also, all of this feedback is coming from a Chrome user, so I hope that helps.
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A lot of my feedback (good and bad) has been mentioned elsewhere here, but I haven't seen this one come up. On the old forums, if you'd opened a thread and it had no new posts, it would appear greyed-out. Now, there's no indication of which threads one has and has not opened.
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I think the messageboards link is broken. I pressed messageboards from "My Profile" and it brought me to the main page. I'm still trying to find my way back to the messageboards.
The only reason how I managed to find this thread was by tracking another user. I think somewhere something went wrong.
Mind you all this is done from an android, which I am stuck on for like 80% of the forum time. I would not be surprised if the site looked different on desktop.
But please spare some thought for us poor phone users!
In the (sort of) table of contents of the Forums page, Rules Questions is listed under Starfinder but not under Pathfinder RPG. The Rules Questions Sub-Forum of the Pathfinder RPG forum actually does exist, but you wouldn't know it unless you search for "Rules Questions" within the page. Not sure off-hand what other Sub-Forums that actually still exist are missing from this listing.
Also, the Forums page is really slow to load. This was always true, but less of an issue when we had the Recent Posts sidebar.
I love the new look, and I am so grateful to have the performance improvements. (At least, for me, it's suddenly a lot less laggy.)
Other than the campaign/organized play links others have mentioned, my only complaint (and it's more of a nitpick) is, in the online campaigns, it no longer seems to default in each campaign to posting as your alias in the campaign. Though, I'm sure I can get used to that, it was a handy feature on the old boards.
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(Apologies if these are multiples of earlier comments, maybe these are particular to my system...)
Issues I have found:
* Aliases now are only appearing in Black, without distinguishing between a main alias, and others. (They were blue and purple-ish before).
* In Safari the front page was mostly product information with no way to get to Forums/Messageboards. When I finally found it, can't remember how, clicking on Forums took me back to that Product-y front page.
* In Safari, I can't click on the various tabs in my PbP games (as a player) nor can I sign in.
So I'm currently in Chrome, where I don't have any of my PbP bookmarks, which is annoying. :)
N.B> I understand some of these could be features, not bugs; or features-to-be that are currently bugs.
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As to the new look, I'm thinking that after the six or so years I have been here, it is kind of amazing it didn't happen before. I loved the old site, and this kind of looks like the WoTC DND site which I don't like, but I'm sure, in time I'll forget the old one. ;)
Also, I liked the old font better. Then again I like Century Gothic, so I shouldn't really complain.
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Why would you feel that would be an improvement?Apart from PFS (which likely should retain its forum for obvious reasons) and PbP, the boards are pretty much down to jaded, hyperinvested nerds like myself. Which means Paizo is spending disproportionately lot of time and energy policing the boards while getting mostly grar and entitlement in return.
The way I see it, most casual non-invested gamers have shifted towards discussing their gaming on Facebook and other social media. I've used to have to spend an hour catching up with a day's worth of posts at Paizo boards, nowadays it's 10 minutes or so. At the same time, Paizo's business seems going strong, so I guess it's more a change in how people chose to interact with the company and less a reduction in overall scope of the business.
That's likely why WotC and BioWare axed their boards, and I believe Paizo should follow them.
If the view of Paizo employees is that the people who remain on the boards are "jaded, hyperinvested nerds" and that we give them "grar and entitlement", then a problem certainly exists.
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If the view of Paizo employees is that the people who remain on the boards are "jaded, hyperinvested nerds" and that we give them "grar and entitlement", then that's certainly a problem.Why would you feel that would be an improvement?Apart from PFS (which likely should retain its forum for obvious reasons) and PbP, the boards are pretty much down to jaded, hyperinvested nerds like myself. Which means Paizo is spending disproportionately lot of time and energy policing the boards while getting mostly grar and entitlement in return.
The way I see it, most casual non-invested gamers have shifted towards discussing their gaming on Facebook and other social media. I've used to have to spend an hour catching up with a day's worth of posts at Paizo boards, nowadays it's 10 minutes or so. At the same time, Paizo's business seems going strong, so I guess it's more a change in how people chose to interact with the company and less a reduction in overall scope of the business.
That's likely why WotC and BioWare axed their boards, and I believe Paizo should follow them.
I hope that Paizo employees are more optimistic and less misanthropic than I am. But my view of where the boards went in the recent years is quite pessimistic.
If it's any consolation, you (and several others) keep posting funny/interesting/insightful stuff that keeps me coming back (that, and of course, the fact that I enjoy a good fight). But these numbers are dwindling.
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* Links aren't very clear that they are links.
This is a link to my profile, bolded.
This is normal bold text.
Actually, the more I am using the site, the more I appreciate the new crisp look. And wow, I already don't mind the font. I've completely migrated to Chrome, and may head back to Safari if the site improves functionality, for some reason I prefer it to Chrome.
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The issues I noticed in 10 minutes:
- navigation is not intuitive, the only way I could get to FAWTL was through my own profile. I think that COMMUNITY button at the main screen should be split into FORUMS button opening forums menu like it does when you are already in the forum section and community covering other parts of community site (guidelines, use, etc). Main page should also get PAIZO BLOG button.
- which leads to a second issue - I had no idea that I am actually logged in until I clicked on "My Account". I half expected it to show me log in screen but apparently I was logged in the whole time
- the font is nice but it's too small, straining the eyes during the reading
- the page numbers on threads don't show on which page you are at all, on the old thread you could at least see the difference in color between the current and all the other pages (because the rest were links), now you don't even get that
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Liking the cleaner new look, as others have said there are teething problems and it does seem less intuitive than before - how much of that was muscle memory of favoured pathways and familiar threads/functionality probably has merit.
Know much of my innate concerns is due to being a creature of habit lol.
Do miss the "Welcome [User Name]" strapline rather than the generic "User Profile" tag. Side bars are also a loss, as like others mentioned, posts and threads popping would often pique my interest on a whole gamut of stuff.
Font is too small, and large posts with walls of text could be a challenge...
Overall though I'm looking forward to exploring this new realm and rediscovering my familiar roads...
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- The fonts is far too small, I should not have to zoom beyond 100% to not have my eyes hurt after 10 minutes of trying to read the boards.
- Placing links at the top of the page and generally expanding the vertical space that those items take is the opposite of efficient screen space use - now I can no longer see all my campaigns at a glance (on a 24" monitor!) because they are pushed down by the top bar.
- Really missing the sidebar
- Can no longer access my profile with one click
- Can no longer see at a glance if I have new PMs
- "My Account" is super generic and boring, can't even tell if I am logged in or not
- Right clicking on some of the top bar items ("Forums", "PaizoCon") does not give the option to interact with the links. They act like they are not links and just page elements
- The home page/root of the forums is a giant unorganised mess. I had to scroll for 17 and a half screens on a 27" monitor to get from top to the bottom of the forums and subforums listing.
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Another issue - navigating the forums from home seems to be impossible. Clicking community button loads a blank page. I had to enter my profile and go via posts tab to get here.
- The fonts is far too small, I should not have to zoom beyond 100% to not have my eyes hurt after 10 minutes of trying to read the boards.
I'm not noticing this.
- Placing links at the top of the page and generally expanding the vertical space that those items take is the opposite of efficient screen space use - now I can no longer see all my campaigns at a glance (on a 24" monitor!) because they are pushed down by the top bar.
Not noticing this on a Mac, but my phone and tablet are a hot mess.
- Really missing the sidebar
Yup. Super bummed about this.
- Can no longer access my profile with one click
Yep. Annoying.
- Can no longer see at a glance if I have new PMs
Yep. Super, super annoying.
- "My Account" is super generic and boring, can't even tell if I am logged in or not
Agreed.
- Right clicking on some of the top bar items ("Forums", "PaizoCon") does not give the option to interact with the links. They act like they are not links and just page elements
Plenty of links seem to be snafu.
- The home page/root of the forums is a giant unorganised mess. I had to scroll for 17 and a half screens on a 27" monitor to get from top to the bottom of the forums and subforums listing.
Didn't notice this.
On the , in the Subforums list at the top, where is the link to Third Party Products subforum? I can see the Third Party Starfinder products link, but not the Third Party Pathfinder Products link.
Plus, links still need to be much more visible in posts. Whether they were before or not. ;)
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I'm still getting use to the layout.
So far I do like the new look better overall, but I do have 2 things I would like to change.
1. Slightly bigger font.
2. I liked the sidebar on the side that showed the most recent most. I found it to be useful. Maybe an option to hide it or show it might work for those who don't care for it.
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As for other things, the site overall feels faster so yay! Though I do miss the colors and sidebars :3
Also the little red dot that you let know someone sent you a PM, it always made me so happy seeing that ^w^
As for a request, for the dropdown on My Account, can a link to Campaigns be added to it please?
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Another issue - navigating the forumsfrom homeseems to be impossible. Clicking community button loads a blank page. I had to enter my profile and go via posts tab to get here.
*sigh* On phone, from the main page
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Yeah, I had to actually google my campaign journal on mobile to access it under the new layout. Navigation is definitely borked - opening the subforums via the menu gives a blank page and pretty much forces you to access old threads through your posting history. Checking again, I don't even see an option when the forum menu comes up for campaign journals under any of the subsections.
Font is subtly headachey. Something about the spacing.
URL text should probably be a different color than regular text, or underlined, or something to differentiate it. Conversations are bound to get confusing when there is no visual indicator that a link is a link.
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The font is giving me a headache. I can barely skim fifty posts before I'm in physical pain.
It's also giving me eye strain. There's not enough to it to pick it out easily enough from the white background.
Navigation I can learn, but this font is a nightmare.
Also, can the links be fixed so they look like links again?
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What features were added?
I can see the things that went away, and what is slower, and more difficult, what takes more effort to find now, but where is the ROI?
I never saw one thread from posters thinking the site was broken or hinting they thought it was held together with, "spit and baling wire."
Granted, I do not cruise EVERY thread and subject, but again -- never saw ANY complaints, much less a dearth of complaints.
I get people worked hard to do this, I am not dismissing their effort; bugs can be fixed and in time things will level-off.
But what has IMPROVED by this change (other than just saying, "the old site was broken?")
Is there a thread on that? Can someone point it out?
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My Two Coppers:
1) The font is . . . well, it's a definite "feel-bland". I don't care much about it one way or another. It would, however, be amazing if we could get a few more color options to utilize! Y'know, red, green, blue, maybe orange or brown? That could help make some gameplay posts in PbP *really* POP!
2) We've transitioned from a somewhat tetrachromatic world to a nearly monochromatic one . . . . Even ignoring my wishful thinking in item #1, this is a massive downgrade -- contrast is a great tool!! We should find a way to make more use of it.
3) I further reinforce the comments regarding the importance of a PM alert insignia. It would be very helpful to have one!
4) Thus far, this is my single greatest gripe: I no longer have a way to get a single-page focused view of the unified content/threads I follow here on the boards. As has been mentioned a few posts above -- not being able to track the activity on the Off-Topic Discussion threads and the Online Campaigns threads simultaneously has been a little off-putting.
5) The products/merchandise pages look nice! . . . . or whatever pages those were to which I kept being redirected while I was seeking my 'unified focused messageboards page' view . . . .
SUMMARY:
The new look has a great deal of potential, what with the sharper lines, higher visibility of marketable items, and the clearer contrasts at the top of the page. However, this new look also lacks some of the very best elements of the former version altogether -- I hope a way to bring those back can be soon found!
Thank you for all your hard work!! :) You are appreciated!!!!!
For those of you, like me, experiencing distress while looking at the new forum, one partial solution is to use the "F12" function.
In Chrome (what I'm using) it looks weird and scary if you're not used to that sort of thing, but part-way down, under "body {" you'll see a "font:" with a little sideways triangle pointing to the right. It'll say something like "normal 12px Verdana, Arial, Hevetica, sans-serif;" or something like that. Click on those words.
It'll highlight a bunch of them. Ignore all that, and click on the "12px" so you highlight only that part (like editing a word document) - switch it to a higher number, like 13px, 14px, or 15px. Then click the "X" in the top right of the pop-up menu to close it.
It will not fix everything (I still find the font unpleasant) but it makes for a lessening of the headache that grows behind my eyes, and hopefully it can help you, too!
Presumably, you can change the font entirely (I still try not to look at the screen while I'm typing), but I don't know how - I only learned this much thanks to NobodysHome and gran ray de los mono in FaWtL mentioning how they tried to fix it for themselves.
It's only a temporary fix, and ends if you navigate away from the page, and it has to be done for every page you have, so multi-tab browsing like I tend to do is still harsh and unpleasant, but it's something that can be used in the meantime.
Hope that helps!
I was trying to browse the store, see if there was something more I wanted to buy.
Using the navigation links from the home page, I got to here:
http://paizo.com/store/pathfinder
And tried the following links with no sucesss:
Campaign Setting
Player Companion
I didn’t go any further than that. I think you probably want to check every link there.
I just miss the sideboard, now i have to rotate through the forums to see if people are talking on a thread in a different section.
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...and I hope that you'll follow the one and only logical step, namely of doing away with the forum.
THAT'S NOT FUNNY!!! >8-O
For those of you, like me, experiencing distress while looking at the new forum, one partial solution is to use the "F12" function.
In Chrome (what I'm using) it looks weird and scary if you're not used to that sort of thing, but part-way down, under "body {" you'll see a "font:" with a little sideways triangle pointing to the right. It'll say something like "normal 12px Verdana, Arial, Hevetica, sans-serif;" or something like that. Click on those words.
It'll highlight a bunch of them. Ignore all that, and click on the "12px" so you highlight only that part (like editing a word document) - switch it to a higher number, like 13px, 14px, or 15px. Then click the "X" in the top right of the pop-up menu to close it.
It will not fix everything (I still find the font unpleasant) but it makes for a lessening of the headache that grows behind my eyes, and hopefully it can help you, too!
Presumably, you can change the font entirely (I still try not to look at the screen while I'm typing), but I don't know how - I only learned this much thanks to NobodysHome and gran ray de los mono in FaWtL mentioning how they tried to fix it for themselves.
It's only a temporary fix, and ends if you navigate away from the page, and it has to be done for every page you have, so multi-tab browsing like I tend to do is still harsh and unpleasant, but it's something that can be used in the meantime.
Hope that helps!
Going into the console, I get an error in the console messages:
May be something on my end, but I'll just throw it out there anyway.Failed to load resource: net::ERR_BLOCKED_BY_CLIENT
DevTools failed to parse SourceMap: http://paizo.com/include/terrainStylesheet.css.map
Hm. I don't know. I literally only edited the number to 13 or 14 or 15. It automatically changes, for me (as in, I don't hit "Enter" or anything).
Just in case it wasn't clear, I didn't go anywhere. I'm still under the "Elements" tab, instead of the "Console" one.
So just hit F12, look about halfway down the screen, and edit the number you see there. (At least, that's how it works for me).
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Well as much I am not liking the changes it could have been worse...I mean when first came here I thought they had gotten rid of the forums completely.
And now: headache. I'm going to take a break, for now.
But! Thank you all so much for your hard work! I hope you get some rest at some point! Sorry for the complaints!
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Also one thing I want to test...smurf.
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Lets have a big round of applause to the web team for the new website!!!
A couple of things I would like to see incorporated into the new schema:
1) Links are in a different color then the standard "black" or "blue" (perhaps red or green).
2) Font is slightly bigger. It is not so bad on my laptop, but on my mobile, it is downright horrible.
3) Install a PM alert (like the old one), next to the "account" tab on the top bar.
Number 2 & 3 are the most important to me.
thanks, -- david
When you get [u][color=red]A Round Tuit[/color][/u]