Part of the reason people are pushing bard is because of the Archaeologist archetype. It loses the performance abilities, but gains a lot of rogue abilities. Including rogue talents every 4 levels.
Pathfinder Delver, archaeologist, investigator, ranger, and gunslinger all work for this to differing degrees.
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Yeah, but there is barely any magic in indiana jones' world (outside of magic items/locations, and that one movie with KALIMA!). So he doesn't have much chance to use magic. That doesn't mean he WOULDN'T learn magic (as compared to characters like Conan, who hate spell casters).
I am sure an dedicated archaeologist would love to have the shift spell. And detect and read magic seem like must haves when the historical items might also be highly magical.
Archaeologist bard is good as a fairly neutral caster that is also fight-y. It loses the sing-songy aspects, and it is mostly about 'being good' at adventure stuff. I can at least see taking a dip into it-since you need to find ways to extend performance rounds anyway, and you can grab fate's favored to boost it to +2 to attack/damage/saves/skills at level 1, it is a great dip. Just think of it as night classes in minor investigative casting.
The problem taking a character from a different genre without adapting them is they often end up significantly weaker than the original character. The setting Indiana Jones is from is a very low magic setting, so of course he does not use magic, nobody does. He does however use any technology available to him. If the character you are building comes from Golarion it would be logical that he may use magic. Don’t think of what Indiana Jones did in the movies, think of what Indiana Jones would do if he were raised in Golarion. To me it makes perfect sense that he would dabble in magic.
Also consider that Indiana Jones use few if any magic items. Are you going to similarly restrict your character? If so you are going to have a very difficult time.
It’s very hard to go wrong with a slayer if you want to play a martial character with no casting abilities at all.
Dude, you need to boost your Wisdom more than that or your Will save is going to be HORRIBLE! The only good save Rogues have is Reflex, so you need to boost Will and Fort more.
No one is saying that Bard is better than Rogue. We're just pointing out different options. And you can always multiclass to get various class features.
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What do I gain from going archaeologist that I lose as an unchained rogue?
From an Indiana Jones standpoint?
- Whip proficiency (without burning a feat or your only combat trick on it or requiring a racial feature/trait to get it)
- Indy's ridiculously good luck, which stacks with a buddy's bardic performance (now I'm picturing Short Round or Sallah following behind him with a trumpet playing the theme song....)
- Bardic knowledge, lore master, and jack of all trades, which together stomp unchained rogue's skill point advantage (though not its built-in skill unlocks) in a thematically-appropriate way
- Sweet, sweet spells
A suggestion, though: Why choose? There's always multiclassing.
Honestly, I would make a swashbuckler. With slashing grace you can use a whip for pretty much all swashbuckler abilities. You can get it at third level if you are a human, then go for pirahna strike and all the whip feats. Also, you may want to use a scorpion whip or even an urumi instead of a normal whip.
What do I gain from going archaeologist that I lose as an unchained rogue?From an Indiana Jones standpoint?
- Whip proficiency (without burning a feat or your only combat trick on it or requiring a racial feature/trait to get it)
- Indy's ridiculously good luck, which stacks with a buddy's bardic performance (now I'm picturing Short Round or Sallah following behind him with a trumpet playing the theme song....)
- Bardic knowledge, lore master, and jack of all trades, which together stomp unchained rogue's skill point advantage (though not its built-in skill unlocks) in a thematically-appropriate way
- Sweet, sweet spells
A suggestion, though: Why choose? There's always multiclassing.
Yeah, as I said, archaeologist is great for dipping. You can get a mechanic that gives +2 to attack/damage/SAVES/skills with just 1 level. It might eat some resources though- to make it good, you need to get the lingering performance feat (this means you only need to spend 1 performance round, and it lasts for 3 total rounds) and fate's favored (it gets the luck bonuses to +2). But once you do that, you can easily get 18 rounds of performance per day- that is basically 6 uses of a 3 round effect. That is enough to get some luck in every fight during the day.
Anyway, I think grabbing at least some cantrips would be very in character.
Remember when Jones faced a 'duel' with a sword user? He did the pragmatic thing and just pulled out his gun. He is often about doing what works, rather than necessarily sticking to an aesthetic.
And casting works- I outlined how some basic cantrips can be invaluable to a researcher. I can understand that you don't want him to be serious into casting- that is a particular flavor. But I can at least see Jones learning some "essential" spells that are highly useful throughout the day.
investigator, new archetype "Natural Philosopher"
Old Spice D & D character, make him the most interesting man in the world...
Archeologist luck stacks with heroism to give you a huge boost on almost anything you do. When you do this a single point in a class skill will mean you have a decent bonus. Heroism last 10 min per level and lingering performance with a moderate CHA will give you enough luck to do what you need.
The archeologist bard is actually better at dealing with traps than rouge. Clever explorer gives you a bonus to all perception checks, not just those to find traps. It also allows you to disable devices in half the time.
He also gets Lore master so when he really needs to make a knowledge skill he can take 20. At 10th level he can attempt all skill untrained. He actually has a decent chance to make untrained skills because he can use Archeologist Luck and Heroism to boost the roll.
He has better will saves than a rogue.
And most importantly he gets spells. This allows him to boost his already impressive skill. If you think rouge has a good stealth try and bard with a higher bonus and invisibility.
The unchained rouge has a few things he can do that an Archeologist Bard cannot do, but not many. About the only thing the unchained rouge has over the bard is skill unlocks.
This was my attempt at Dr Johnes for a gestalt game. I liked the flavour, too bad the game didn't last.
