Hey paizo,
I already know about this:
"Succeeding on a Saving Throw: A creature that successfully saves against a spell that has no obvious physical effects feels a hostile force or a tingle, but cannot deduce the exact nature of the attack. Likewise, if a creature's saving throw succeeds against a targeted spell, you sense that the spell has failed. You do not sense when creatures succeed on saves against effect and area spells."
That is not what my question is about. I want to know what you feel if you fail your saving throw against a spell that has no obvious physical effects or if that spell simply has no saving throw. I know that a "Terrible Remorse" should be obvious because it makes you feel terrible, but what about a spell that gives you bad luck like "Ill Omen"?
Picture this: A witch with silent spell, still spell, and eschew materials (or a Psychic with none of these feats) casts "Ill Omen" on someone. Does the creature somehow know that it was afflicted with a negative effect?
I want to know what you feel if you fail your saving throw against a spell that has no obvious physical effects or if that spell simply has no saving throw.
You'd at least feel as much as you feel if you successfully saved: "a hostile force or a tingle".
If the GM wants to tell you more, then they could add flavor beyond that. Personally, I'd add a bit more, at least enough to make the character anxious about what just happened
Hey paizo,
I already know about this:
"Succeeding on a Saving Throw: A creature that successfully saves against a spell that has no obvious physical effects feels a hostile force or a tingle, but cannot deduce the exact nature of the attack. Likewise, if a creature's saving throw succeeds against a targeted spell, you sense that the spell has failed. You do not sense when creatures succeed on saves against effect and area spells."That is not what my question is about. I want to know what you feel if you fail your saving throw against a spell that has no obvious physical effects or if that spell simply has no saving throw. I know that a "Terrible Remorse" should be obvious because it makes you feel terrible, but what about a spell that gives you bad luck like "Ill Omen"?
Picture this: A witch with silent spell, still spell, and eschew materials (or a Psychic with none of these feats) casts "Ill Omen" on someone. Does the creature somehow know that it was afflicted with a negative effect?
All spells have a visual effect. So people know you are casting magic. It isn't explained in any of the books, but was errata'd in by an [url]FAQ[/url].
What exactly do I identify when I’m using Spellcraft to identify a spell? Is it the components, since spell-like abilities, for instance, don’t have any? If I can only identify components, would that mean that I can’t take an attack of opportunity against someone using a spell-like ability (or spell with no verbal, somatic, or material components) or ready an action to shoot an arrow to disrupt a spell-like ability? If there’s something else, how do I know what it is?
Although this isn’t directly stated in the Core Rulebook, many elements of the game system work assuming that all spells have their own manifestations, regardless of whether or not they also produce an obvious visual effect, like fireball. You can see some examples to give you ideas of how to describe a spell’s manifestation in various pieces of art from Pathfinder products, but ultimately, the choice is up to your group, or perhaps even to the aesthetics of an individual spellcaster, to decide the exact details. Whatever the case, these manifestations are obviously magic of some kind, even to the uninitiated; this prevents spellcasters that use spell-like abilities, psychic magic, and the like from running completely amok against non-spellcasters in a non-combat situation. Special abilities exist (and more are likely to appear in Ultimate Intrigue) that specifically facilitate a spellcaster using chicanery to misdirect people from those manifestations and allow them to go unnoticed, but they will always provide an onlooker some sort of chance to detect the ruse.
So, if you cast a spell on someone, that means the spell has a visual effect and they can realize they were cast upon. Stealth Mages wept in October of 2015. As for feeling something? Ask your GM, rules aren't clear on that, but you can definitely see it.
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Though the manifestations ship has sailed, I think the implication of the rule saying that you feel a hostile force or tingle if you successfully save is that you don't get that if you fail the save.
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It all depend on the effect of a failed save.
Starting from the extremes:
- If you are charmed you don't realize you have been hit by a spell.
- If you are hit by a fireball you know very well that you have been hit by it. ;-)
For other spells it depend on the GM adjudication.
A few examples of how I will adjudicate <8sll witch spells):
- Beguiling gift: a failed save is not noticed, you think you are accepting the "gift" by your free will (I have some serious trouble with some of the possible applications, mercury is a liquid at room temperature, but this spell should not make you dink it. But that is another matter).
- Ill Omen: it give a specific system to notice the effect "A target who can speak and has at least one free hand and who is aware of the spell and its effects (such as from a Spellcraft check to identify the spell as it is cast) can negate one reroll by spending a move action to utter a brief prayer or good luck charm to appease the spirits of ill fortune." so, at least for the first roll, a target that failed the Spellcraft check (or some other appropriate check if the origin is a supernatural ability) will not know what has hit him.
After the first failed check it is possible to give the target a check to notice the effect, but that would reduce the effect of the spell, so I think it is not a good idea.
- Feast of ashes: the target realize that he has been affected by a spell or supernatural ability.
Hey paizo,
I already know about this:
"Succeeding on a Saving Throw: A creature that successfully saves against a spell that has no obvious physical effects feels a hostile force or a tingle, but cannot deduce the exact nature of the attack. Likewise, if a creature's saving throw succeeds against a targeted spell, you sense that the spell has failed. You do not sense when creatures succeed on saves against effect and area spells."That is not what my question is about. I want to know what you feel if you fail your saving throw against a spell that has no obvious physical effects or if that spell simply has no saving throw. I know that a "Terrible Remorse" should be obvious because it makes you feel terrible, but what about a spell that gives you bad luck like "Ill Omen"?
Picture this: A witch with silent spell, still spell, and eschew materials (or a Psychic with none of these feats) casts "Ill Omen" on someone. Does the creature somehow know that it was afflicted with a negative effect?
Well, unless you take very specific feats to hide your spell casting Silent Spell and Still Spell don't hide your spell casting. They make it so that you don't need to move your hands or need to speak so you can cast the spell. However, the spell still manifest magical energy around you as you cast it that is obvious to anyone who can see.
What does this mean? While they may not know the spell you used (although if they can use spellcraft to identify it) they do know you just cast a spell. They may not be able to deduce its affects, but knowing something has happened may be enough.