I have added a Google Drive folder for the upcoming game. I have already added a few docs and once I complete the house rules I will post them.
Old School Greyhawk Campaign Folder
SD
Keeping an eye on this. Got a greyhawk character I would love to run through the glory days.
Never played in these classic scenarios. Most interested.
I have added a Google Drive folder for the upcoming game. I have already added a few docs and once I complete the house rules I will post them.
Old School Greyhawk Campaign Folder
SD
Your Fighter rework mentions "Combat Expertise Feat" at 1st level in the level progression table - is that a typo? Combat Expertise makes no mention of this in its ability description...
Also, your class ability descriptions should be listed by level as they appear in the progression table, which should also list them alphabetically.
Still liking the Fighter, having 4 skill points/level should be a bit more versatile. Looking to make a Human Fighter...
I have added a Google Drive folder for the upcoming game. I have already added a few docs and once I complete the house rules I will post them.
Old School Greyhawk Campaign Folder
SD
Thank you very much for taking the time to come up with all this information. It is a lot of work putting a game together for others to enjoy and I for one appreciate the time you have put into it. Thank you again and I look forward to the recruitment thread.
I have added a Google Drive folder for the upcoming game. I have already added a few docs and once I complete the house rules I will post them.
Old School Greyhawk Campaign Folder
SD
Your Fighter rework mentions "Combat Expertise Feat" at 1st level in the level progression table - is that a typo? Combat Expertise makes no mention of this in its ability description...
Also, your class ability descriptions should be listed by level as they appear in the progression table, which should also list them alphabetically.
Still liking the Fighter, having 4 skill points/level should be a bit more versatile. Looking to make a Human Fighter...
The fighter receives the COMBAT EXPERTISE FEAT. The combat expert is a special ability the fighter receives in conjunction with the combat expertise feat that scales as he gains levels starting at 1st level. Hope that makes sense.
Combat Expert (Ex)
The fighter is a combat expert and is a master of tactics in warfare. His understanding of small unit warfare makes him a dangerous asset to his allies in combat.
At 1st level whenever an adjacent foe attempts to take a 5-foot step away from you, you may also make a 5-foot step as an immediate action so long as you end up adjacent to the foe that triggered this ability. If you take this step, you cannot take a 5-foot step during your next turn. If you take an action to move during your next turn, subtract 5 feet from your total movement. This can be used in conjunction and is cumulative with the Step Up Feat.
At 3rd level you are considered to be flanking an opponent if at least two of your allies are threatening that opponent, regardless of your actual positioning.
At 5th level when you and at least two of your allies are adjacent to an opponent, you can attempt the aid another action as a swift action instead of a standard action.
At 10th level he becomes an Inspired Combat Expert and every ally of the fighter within 20 feet gains a +1 attack or CMB each round they are in the inspired area. This is due to the fighter coordinating the group's efforts in an engagement and the bonus does not apply to the fighter himself.
At 15th level the fighter has improved his ability to inspire his allies in combat. As an inspired combat Expert, the area improves to 30 feet and the bonus is now +2 for his allies.
I have also greatly reduced the feat tax so that gives the martial characters a lot more flexibility in developing a style concept more efficiently for the fighters and martial characters in general.
Hope that makes sense.
SD
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The old faith, the classic Greyhawk deities, the Olman deities, the Touv deities and the Creator deity... The only accessible deities for players is going to be the Old Faith, Classic Greyhawk, and Logos.
You're not down with the Suel pantheon, eh?
Would Vecna count since he doesnt technically advance as a deity until Vecna lives module.
No non humans then?
I was thinking something of Pholtus of the Blinding Light.
I am thinking a Cleric/Mage/Thief of DALT god of Portals, Doors, Enclosures, Locks, and Keys.
@ALLENDM: Ah, ok, that makes sense! I should have worked that out...and reducing feat taxes will help a lot...
The old faith, the classic Greyhawk deities, the Olman deities, the Touv deities and the Creator deity... The only accessible deities for players is going to be the Old Faith, Classic Greyhawk, and Logos.You're not down with the Suel pantheon, eh?
More about consolidating down the pantheons. So I decided to go with the original pantheon. If you like I can put some of the Suel deities in there that blend with the currant ones. Not something I would fall on my sword about :)
SD
Would Vecna count since he doesnt technically advance as a deity until Vecna lives module.
I went ahead and put Vecna in as I am not following the exact timeline and I wanted him in the pantheon.
SD
The old faith, the classic Greyhawk deities, the Olman deities, the Touv deities and the Creator deity... The only accessible deities for players is going to be the Old Faith, Classic Greyhawk, and Logos.You're not down with the Suel pantheon, eh?More about consolidating down the pantheons. So I decided to go with the original pantheon. If you like I can put some of the Suel deities in there that blend with the currant ones. Not something I would fall on my sword about :)
SD
I remember collecting the "Gods of the Suel Pantheon" articles in Dragon back in the day. Without referring to them I can only remember Phaulkon and Kord the Brawler... I liked those Deities a lot, or maybe it was just that they gave each one quite a bit of treatment.
I have several ideas, having had a really good Saltmarsh game that we only got into town (my second favorite game played on the boards, in fact), though my ideas can flux depending on who is playing what.
My initial idea is a Cleric(Pelor)/Wizard(Life), aiming for Theurge, though I'm flexible.
*waits patiently for recruitment*
Bloodragers can be fun too
More about consolidating down the pantheons. So I decided to go with the original pantheon. If you like I can put some of the Suel deities in there that blend with the currant ones. Not something I would fall on my sword about :)
I have a few Suel favorites. On my initial read through I didn't notice you'd included Wastri, who is one them. I love that the god of bigotry is also the god of self-deception, just to make sure his followers can convince themselves that they're better than everyone else. If the racial elements of the gods are removed in your campaign, who/what exactly is Wastri bigoted against?
Your deity selection isn't going to make or break my interest, I'm really just making conversation - it's rare these days to run into fellow Greyhawk enthusiasts! If you do decide you're going to try and pull this off, I'll definitely submit a character in the recruitment.
Ok, I have added the House Rules. If you have any questions please feel free to post.
I will have a character creation and recruitment up in the next few weeks. Give everyone time to read and if interested in joining creating a character.
Somethings not included:
In this campaign, you have three options for your characters basic background.
1) Arrived on the last Merchant wagon train that followed the Wagon Folk Caravan into Saltmarsh for the upcoming spring festival. You can be a part of the merchant caravan either as a guard for hire, part of the baggage train (cook, wheelwright, animal keeper, cook, bookkeeper and such). If a halfling you can be a part of the Wagon folk caravan as well.
2) Just got off a merchant vessel from Gradsul as part of the crew.
3) Saltmarsh Local (a son/daughter of a fisherman, shepherds, or inn/shopkeeper). You could also be a young acolyte of the local churches or temples (more to follow on that).
Backstory and more additional info when I set up Recruitment page.
Old School Greyhawk Campaign Folder
SD
Are you using the Multi-class from the Greyhawk days or as it is now in pathfinder. Cleric/Mage/Thief would split XP 3 ways. It would take longer to level up but you would have the benefits of all three classes...Since this is old school...I thought I would ask. LOL
I was thinking a Saltmarsh local, a cousin of the Stoutlys... ;)
[EDIT - If they are in this Saltmarsh of course...]
Aaaand that's a hefty house-rules packet! I like the Class/Race table - definitely generates that oldskool ADnD feel.
I like the shields as AC bonus AND DR, and the flanking rules. In my old ADnD games we restricted the number of foes your shield could actively protect you from depending on the size of the shield.
Two questions
1: in the Combat Feats and Options Table, in an (Option) something you can do without needing a feat if you qualify for it? Like Power Attack (which I definitely do not think should be a feat, but an Option).
2: are there any changes to the Paladin?
I'm still heavily leaning toward a Human Fighter, either Spear and Shield or Trident and Shield - all those illustrations in the early Basic/Expert and Advanced rule books and modules of heavily armored or loincloth'd, shield holding spear/trident warriors made quite an impact on me.
Are you using the Multi-class from the Greyhawk days or as it is now in pathfinder. Cleric/Mage/Thief would split XP 3 ways. It would take longer to level up but you would have the benefits of all three classes...Since this is old school...I thought I would ask. LOL
Like pathfinder, one class at a time.
SD
I like the shields as AC bonus AND DR, and the flanking rules. In my old ADnD games we restricted the number of foes your shield could actively protect you from depending on the size of the shield.
Two questions
1: in the Combat Feats and Options Table, in an (Option) something you can do without needing a feat if you qualify for it? Like Power Attack (which I definitely do not think should be a feat, but an Option).
2: are there any changes to the Paladin?
I'm still heavily leaning toward a Human Fighter, either Spear and Shield or Trident and Shield - all those illustrations in the early Basic/Expert and Advanced rule books and modules of heavily armored or loincloth'd, shield holding spear/trident warriors made quite an impact on me.
Power Attack is an option.
The rest are feats that have been combined so as you gain levels you gain additional benefits. What we noticed is it allows the martial classes to expand their combat capabilities greatly or take feats in other area to make them more versatile.
No changes in paladin but we can discuss it.
SD
I have no ever played in one, and I cant quite figure out if this is the requirement for this or not. If so, I'd love to join in. If not, hope all go well, as this sounds awesome
One note and I will update the HR doc when I have a moment.
There are no campaign traits. So you get (2) additional racial traits to flesh out your character. Sorry about that.
SD
I was thinking a Saltmarsh local, a cousin of the Stoutlys... ;)
[EDIT - If they are in this Saltmarsh of course...]
Stoutly’s will be there.
SD
I have no ever played in one, and I cant quite figure out if this is the requirement for this or not. If so, I'd love to join in. If not, hope all go well, as this sounds awesome
I am now working on getting the recruitment page up and finalizing the first three modules.
Once I do we will start getting players choosen.So in the nutshell no this is not the recruitment thread but it soon will be :)
SD
Cool
I'll definitely make a character for this when you're ready to recruit.
Houserules comments:
Can cowering creatures act however they like? Does "drowsiness", mild or otherwise, have any in-game effects? It seems like they don't, or at least, they're not described anywhere in the houserules.
Giving weapon finesse a prerequisite of +2 BAB pretty much ruins a dex-based fighting character for levels 1 and 2. It's just silly. I don't understand why you'd want to do that. No dex-based fighters, rangers or magi because... reasons?
Other than that everything seems cool.
Cowering is handled the same as normal. As is drowsiness I just have a complete table I like to use for the modifiers when looking them up.
Weapon Finesse and Agile Manuevers is combined so waiting until BAB +2 is not that much to ask. UC Rogue gets finesse training at first level so he essentially gets both. I have used this for a while and it works.
SD
A lot. I actually ran a ranger/rogue using dex as a primary ability in our group. Several of our group runs dex based characters as well. Your character develops over time not at 1st and 2nd level.
UC Rogue, Swashbuckler get Weapon finesse /agile manuevers at first level so if you are looking to be a finesse based combatant it is simply not that hard.
SD
It's not about what's 'much to ask', it's about setting building.
Like, if you're trained at fencing, I'd say you have weapon finesse. Except in this world, only 1st level swashbucklers and unchained rogues are able to be trained at fencing.
So all the aristocrats who know how to fence are third level or above? No first level bards know how to fence? They're all brute-forcing about with their rapiers, strength-style?
The world this implies doesn't seem a little bit silly to you?
Like, in my mind, it's already a little silly that weapon finesse is a feat, and not just part of weapon proficiency for the relevant weapons themselves. I can sort of see why from a balance standpoint.
Putting a BAB requirement on something means that it's impossible to learn in the classroom, unless you have some actual battle experience first. This makes sense for whirlwind attack, for example, or weapon specialization or improved two-weapon fighting.
But weapon finesse is just so integrated into certain combat styles that going "a newbie can't do that" becomes silly. It's obviously the first thing anyone seeking to pick up a rapier or being a knife-fighter would learn, after proficiency itself. And of course not everyone who picks up a rapier is going to be a swashbuckler or rogue. There's bards, magi, and aristocrats for the most obvious choices, but also things like investigators, paladins and slayers, and even the odd divine caster. Heck, the current setup means no dex-based monks until level 3!
Anyway, I don't think I'll be playing something dex-based myself, so it's not that it would impact my character or anything. I'm just baffled by the worldbuilding implied here.
If you played AD&D way back when you didn't have finesse based unless you wanted to play a thief, maybe Ranger or Monk but that was it and it was all based on your DEX and not feats. You often had to multi-class to develop the type of player you wanted. That was the norm really even into 2nd edition.
If I want an aristocrat to be good at a rapier yep I would give him a level in Swashbuckler or Rogue. That is pretty normal in the groups I play in. We tend to multi-class to get the type of character we want mixed with the feats.
What I will do is give UC Monks WF/AM at 1st level. That way it broadens who has access to WF/AM early and we can see how it goes. Baffling as it maybe it has a purpose...to set the world setting in a specific way.
If you build out a 5th level finesse based fighter under these rules you might see my point :) Even a 5th level finesse based bard...even with the delay if your plan is to be finesse based it comes in time with a pure bard. Most would simply take a level in rogue or swashbuckler an then the rest in bard giving you a finesse based bard.
I get your point, I don't want you to think I am arguing with you for the sake of arguing...but the house rules are set up to build off each other for the world we are playing in. Like I said I don't mind adjusting them before we get started to give you a few more options.
SD
It's of course your world to do with whatever you like.
In the end, I still think that Weapon Finesse is too basic an ability to have a BAB requirement at all, and I don't get why characters would have to multiclass or spend two levels being bad at fighting before they get it.
But in the end, I only wanted to add something potentially productive, so I think I'll stop here now before it becomes arguing just for the sake of it. :)
I was wondering if you are using the folio version of Greyhawk or the later campaign setting. More to the point, if I just read the folio instead of the campaign setting, will I be up to speed on everything I need to be?
570 CY. Using the world of Greyhawk box set 1983
With additions in history that are in the house rules. There will also be a doc on the creation timeline shortly.
SD
Oh to dust off my old Paladin of Heironeous... those were the days.
I decided to not included the valley elf for now. Due to a portion of the story line.
The core racial traits stay put. You can add two more in the alternate racial traits.
That gives you a good deal of flexibility.
I am willing to work with you on developing those old concepts.
SD
Having just nearly finished DMing Tamoachan, I think Ill make an Olman cleric interested in human sacrifices and ritual warfare etc. I love the Olman pantheon/culture. Or maybe eagle druid.
Hehe, yeah you guys have like 2 fights to go at most.
Olman paladin sounds interesting now that I think about it: feathered headress, loincloth with macuahuitl blade...devoted to Quetzalcoatl. Going to see what kind of story I can work out.
We are basically starting in Saltmarsh? I suppose such a character could cross via Azure Sea and reach there by boat from the Amedio Jungle/Olman Islands easily enough.
I will adjust soon.
I will be posting the recruiting thread next Friday.
My plan is to let it run for two weeks. I am looking for six players for a long term ongoing campaign. I plan on it being a good mix of martial and magic in the party.
SD