Hello guys,
I'm looking for some advices/opinions on a possible houserule. I play with between 3-5 of my friends each week, as the GM. We are using 25 points buy and a few houserules:
- Weapon Finesse and Slashing Grace are the same feat. (For Rapier and light weapon one handed only.)
- All movements provock attack of oppotunity. (Bullrush, Grapple, Magic that pushes people away...)
- When you do just one thing (one attack, one spell...) you can take your action during your movement as you like and then finish your movement.
- No multiclassing except for a PrC with my approval.
- Automatic progression for magical items, and true magical items are rare and powerful (generally speaking one or two top for each player at the end of the campaign.)
All those rules are for them and my monsters.
My players are not mix-maxers. They build decent characters but that's it, and we all find the difficulty of the encounters really good until they reach level 7-8. That's where I've got an issue with the game.
Magical bonuses, or buffs, wrecked the game. If my NPC or monster has enough time, his CR is way more powerfull than what it should be. Same goes for them. When they have enough time, the fight is like a piece of cake for them (Blood Rager with Long Arm, Enlarge Personn and Abberant Bloodline...). When I have enough time, it's the other way around (Blur, Mirror Image...). And when they cast spells like that for a minor encounter and it goes to waste I can see sadness in their eyes.
The other issue is that sometimes we have an hard time keeping record of all those spells and we make mistakes (in both ways).
Finally, I hate when they go berzerk rush inside the dungeon just because "time is runing out" on the buffs.
So I was wondering if it could be a good idea to limit the number of buffs you can have at the same time. Like 2 or 3. I ask about this here because I've no clue if that's an issue for other people. I think it could be a good idea but I'm scared that some classes could lost a lot on a houserule like that.
Or to allow some of these spells to be cast immediately something like a few times a day? Like the warpriest's fervor?
Any insights is good to take. (We generaly don't go farther than level 12-14. This campaign is going to be finished at 13).
Depends on the classes being played saying a fighter can only have 2 buffs active is probably not to big of a deal
Haste and ...
but an inquisitor, divine power, heroism, judgement, Bane are like standard for them so it would be a big nerf for them.
And then a wizard.... with just sooo many
I dunno it seems like a bad idea to me
I think for one thing you'd have to exclude class features that can be used limited times per day as buffs like judgement or smite from the limit.
Limiting the number of buffing spells one can have up might not be terrible but i think it might make sense for different chassis to have different limits on the buffs they can have up because full casters and 3/4 classes depend quite heavily on buffing spells whilst barbarians and fighters don't really care too much.
Three things:
First, if you let players buff up while their opponents can't, of course it will be a cakewalk. If both of them get to buff up, the game turns into rocket tag, whomever goes first wins. So try and arrange situations where the players don't have time for full buffs. If the PCs start buffing up, the monsters should interrupt them and/or spend the time doing something useful. Readied actions to interrupt spell casting are also very useful.
Secondly, dispel magic is a thing. Use it from time to time.
Third, stretch out the day. Use more encounters, so PCs have to ration out their buffs instead of using them all together. PCs at higher levels can do more than four encounters per day!
Agree with Tonyz, further add that long running battles are also a thing. Skirmishers harass from range but do not engage, hopefully drawing out individuals from their support. Running out the durations on buffs has been a time honored tradition for both PCs and NPCs since before Pathfinder was a thing. If you can encourage the enemy to spread out to the point they cannot effectively support each other, focused attacks on the softer targets becomes possible.
As long as your players understand those houserules before making their characters none of them are particularly harmful.
For buffing specifically, I would consider a few things:
1: Duration. The reason spells like Mage Armor, Heroism, Overland Flight, etc. are amazing isn't because of their bonuses, as they are outclassed by shield, channel vigor/haste, and fly in that regard. Its because you don't have to spend time in combat (or other time-crunched challenges) using them. So maybe limit it to 1 hour/level buff (because by level 8 or so they can fairly easily be up for functionally all of the time), 2 10 min/level buffs (these are a lot harder to have up for surprise encounters, but are still good for dungeon-crawls especially if you are packing 2-3 of them to refresh) and then 3 minute or round/level buffs (these you usually have to cast either right before kicking in doors or after the fight has started).
2: Source. Most buffs are spells, and putting a limit on these can help considerably limit either side stomping the other. But others are class/monster abilities. I would not limit buffs beyond spells in this way because it is generally harder to get non-spell buffs than it is to get spell-buffs. In addition, many classes hinge on the use of such non-spell buffs if the character goes into melee(Judgement/Bane, Inspire Courage, Mutagen, Bloodrage, Arcane Pool enhancing, etc).
3: Number of targets. Usually a group buff will be less potent or shorter-duration than a single-target buff. For example, Haste boosts all allies by a good bit, but channel vigor boosts yourself by a good bit more in terms of adaptability. Similarly bless effects everyone a bit, while enlarge person helps one person a lot. Consider allowing 2-3 group buffs as well as a number of single target buffs, because most group buffs will take up valuable combat time and not last terribly long.
4: Plot-buffs. If you have a certain dungeon level which requires magic to handle, like an aquatic level where the party needs to be able to breathe water at a minimum (and probably also needs a swim speed/Freedom of Movement) then buffs needed to complete the adventure should be tracked separately.
5: Special Sense buffs. Things like Bloodhound, See Invisibility, Echolocation, etc. rarely are game breaking, considering special senses at best simply allow a PC or two to know what is going on, and at worst are a waste of their time to use because there was no need to notice anything hiding. I would consider 1-2 of these being "free" as well.
Alright I got a lot of interesting point of view here! Yes of course I was only speaking about Spells, no extraordinary or SP abilities from classes races or monsters or things like bardic inspiration.
Alirght I'll try to keep the group more busy and to avoid that "one encounter" a day feeling. And yes definitely 2 is not enough.
But yeah I got a few good advices to consider here thanks!