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ways to get more charisma

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im looking for some templates that boost charisma

only peramiters are +4cha per 1 cr increase
no saling cr templates(so half fiend and half celetial are out)
no undead templates
nothing with hefty penalties

i already know about advanced

also acepting other ways to get charisma besides belt/wish book/leveling

Mutant
Increases two ability scores by 4, reduces two by 2. Don't know if that is hefty.

Fey Animal
But you're not an animal, are you?

Getting personal with a Succubus.

But seriously, you get +2 to a stat of your choice.
Lady-J wrote:
also acepting other ways to get charisma besides belt/wish book/leveling
Blymurkla wrote:

Mutant

Increases two ability scores by 4, reduces two by 2. Don't know if that is hefty.

Fey Animal
But you're not an animal, are you?

interesting on the fey animal dm allows templates all kinds of templates regardless of creature type so i might give it a go, mutant is a no go tho dm stated alredy all effects gained would be randomized.

VRMH wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
also acepting other ways to get charisma besides belt/wish book/leveling

would the ion stones stack with the headband of charisma? and is there a non artifact vertion of the talasmand? finding an artifact is highly unlikely

A level of exciter spiritualist gives you a sort of bloodrage which can give +4 dex & +4 cha as morale bonuses.

A level of mindchemist alchemist allows you to make a cognatogen which can add +4 to cha as an alchemical bonus.

I think VRMH confused something like a crimson sphere ioun stone with the one they linked. Most ioun stone enhancement bonuses don't stack, and there isn't a stacking one for charisma.

Also they're only specified to stack with other ioun stones of the same type, not in general.
avr wrote:
A level of exciter spiritualist gives you a sort of bloodrage which can give +4 dex & +4 cha as morale bonuses.

is there a way to key their casting off of charisma and can they cast spells of any type while using the ability?

avr wrote:


A level of mindchemist alchemist allows you to make a cognatogen which can add +4 to cha as an alchemical bonus.

is there a way to key casting off of charisma for this aswell?

For the spiritualist take the fractured mind archetype as well to cast using cha (it's compatible), but no they can't cast in that state, at least until they have 4 levels in the class and then only a few. It does look great as a dip for someone using Desna's Shooting Star and/or supernatural abilities with cha-based DCs.

For the alchemist... sort of. There's a Method to the Madness discovery which I think requires you to be a derro. You'd need a second level in alchemist to get a discovery too. It might be better to write off the casting.

What are you trying to do with all this charisma, exactly? Knowing a bit more might help us find options more tailored to your needs.
My Self wrote:

Getting personal with a Succubus.

But seriously, you get +2 to a stat of your choice.

Just be sure to not piss her off. Ever.

My Self wrote:

Getting personal with a Succubus.

But seriously, you get +2 to a stat of your choice.

Until she gets bored with you and takes it back... which results in a net Charisma drain.

Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
My Self wrote:

Getting personal with a Succubus.

But seriously, you get +2 to a stat of your choice.

Until she gets bored with you and takes it back... which results in a net Charisma drain.

Could always just murder her immediately after she gives the gift. Death of the critter doesn't remove the gift after all. (I'm sure all Grand Theft Auto players approve of this)

VRMH wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
also acepting other ways to get charisma besides belt/wish book/leveling

Most if not all of those give enhancement bonus' to Charisma and therefore do NOT stack.

And the Artifact Talisman is probably not readily available at your local retailers.
Tarik Blackhands wrote:
Could always just murder her immediately after she gives the gift. Death of the critter doesn't remove the gift after all. (I'm sure all Grand Theft Auto players approve of this)

Removing the gift (and thus causing the penalty) is a free action. Best to make sure that you arrange for someone else to do the deed, long after you are out of sight and out of mind.

Brew Bird wrote:
What are you trying to do with all this charisma, exactly? Knowing a bit more might help us find options more tailored to your needs.

well the gist of the build is hevens oracle color spray and then multiclass to beable to effect literally everything and then spell reserch to add color spar to all spell lists i have that dont have color spray for all of the castings of color spray/other 1st level spells but not really having any higher spell levels so oracle sorcerer mesmerist base line add more as we go charisma increases the dc increases the castings per day and increases the ammount of hit die i can effect with color spray

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The Genius Avaricious spell is up to a +5 bonus.

This nice lady can give up to a +6 profane bonus to charisma. Of course the removal penalty is a bit steep.

Luthier's Rapier can grant a +4 sacred bonus to Charisma for 10 minutes.

Silver will boost the DC of color spray by 1, although I guess that isn't charisma but worth considering.

This Drug and this one can both increase Charisma and are untyped! Although your GM might rule that it's alchemical.

Since you're considering color spray as your main attack method,Deific Obedience Mahathallah
Deific Obedience Mahathallah grants +2 DC to illusion spells.

Some of the below may have been posted up above, but reposting the list for ease.

On the topic of buffing spell DC's:

Eldritch Heritage Greater
Arcane Bloodline
Eldritch Heritage, Greater (Ultimate Magic) This can only be taken at character level 17 and you need charisma 17, but by selecting Arcane bloodline's 15th level ability, you can net +2 DC bonus to a school of magic. (Feat)

Bloody Tears and Jagged Smile
Bloody Tears and Jagged Smile (Rasputin Must Die!) Spells with the fear descriptor increase the dc by 4 (profane bonus). (Spell, wizard/cleric 2)

Arcane Concordance
Arcane Concordance (Advanced Player's Guide) 10ft emanation centered on you, gives arcane spells within the area a +1 enhancement to their DC, and allows a couple of free metamagics to be applied to it. (Spell, Bard 3)

Sharesister
Sharesister (Pathfinder Society Field Guide) Both targets have to be same gender, but allows you to give someone bonuses to CL and Spell DC's, at the cost of negative levels. A bit risky, best used if you like buffing people. (Spell, Cleric/witch 3)

Coward's Cowl
Coward's Cowl (Agent's of Evil) +1 to DC of readied spells aslong as you don't move closer to your enemies. (Spell, Alchemist/wizard/cleric/bard/mesmerist/shaman/psychic/witch 1)

Sacred Space
Sacred Space (Advanced Race Guide) Good spells, spell-like abilities, and channeled energy to damage evil outsiders, gain +2 to the DC. If the space contains an altar, shrine, or permanent fixture to your diety, it increases to +4. (Spell, Paladin/cleric 2)

Silver
Silver (Alchemy Manual) used as a material component will increase the DC of illusion spells by 1. (item)

Deific Obedience Mahathallah
Deific Obedience (Inner Sea Gods) Mahathallah grants +2 DC to illusion spells. (feat)

Dead Man's Headband
Dead Man's Headband (Ultimate Equipment) will increase the DC of any fear effect you create by 1. Note: it takes the headband slot, maybe see if you can combine it with a headband of int. (magic Item)

All-Seeing Eye
All-Seeing Eye (Giant's Revisited) +1 insight bonus to the DC of divination spells you cast. (magic item)

Dragon CraftingPerfume
Draconic Perfume (Dragonslayer's Handbook) increases charm subschool DC by 2 (Rosewood and Myrrh) or compulsion subschool by 2 (Sulfur and Honeycomb). (item)

Oakstewards' Favor
Oaksteward's Favor (People of the River) increases the DC of any enchantment spells the wearer casts against animals by 2. (magic Item)

Serpent Belt
Serpent Belt (Ultimate Equipment) increases poison by 4, whether your GM takes that to mean DC is up the them. (magic item)

Elemental Focus Greater
Elemental Focus/Greater (CRB) adds +1/+1 DC of spells with the energy type you select. (feat(s))

Outlander, Lore Seeker
The trait Lore seeker (campaign trait for ROTRL) lets you pick 3 spells to increase the DC and CL by 1 each. (trait)

Eastern Mysteries
The trait Eastern Mysteries (Guide to Pathfinder Society Organized Play) allows 1/day to increase a spell DC by 2. (trait)

Spell Focus Greater
Spell Focus/Greater (CRB) Increase the DC of a chosen school of magic by 1 (stacks with elemental focus). (feat(s))

Barbed Pentacle of Asmodeus
Barbed Pentacle of Asmodeus (Gods and Magic) Increase the DC of spells that are augmented by writing by 1. (Magic item)

Rod of the Wayang
Rod of the Wayang (Ultimate Equipment) +1 DC to spells of the shadow subschool. (Magic item, Rod)

Scarf of the Suggestive Dance
Scarf of the Suggestive Dance (Pathfinder Module: Murder's Mark) increases a bard's fascinate and suggestion bard performance DC's by 1. (Magic Item)

Perfect Golden Lute
Perfect Golden Lute (Ultimate Equipment) Increase all bardic performance DC's by 2 if using the lute. (Keep in mind this is an artifact, and up to GM territory if it's ever seen or owned) (Magic item, Artifact)

Player's Prize
Player's Prize (People of the River) Scribe it with a person's name and drop it into that person's pocket, they take a -2 (will save) against your bardic performances. (Very pricy option if you really can swing it) (Magic item)

Honorable mentions:
Below we have misc stuff that may not directly increase a spell's dc, but still worth noting.

Draconic Malice
Draconic Malice (Legacy of Dragons) Lets you cast fear spells on normally immune creatures. (Spell, Antipaladin/bard/wizard/bloodrager/cleric/inquisitor/mesmerist/psychic/sham an/witch 3)

Mesmerizing Tattoo
Mesmerizing Tattoo (Blood of Shadows) Whenever the bearer uses the hypnotism occult skill unlock, casts an enchantment spell that targets a single creature, or uses the hypnotic stare class feature, her target takes a –1 penalty on Will saving throws for the ability’s duration and the DC to affect the target with the hypnotism occult skill unlock is reduced by 1. (Magic Item)

Ability Focus
Ability Focus (RPG Beastiary) Increase a single special attack's DC by 2, check with your dm first. (Feat)

Sinner's Wage
Sinner's Wage (Champions of Corruption) If used as a focus component for a charm or compulsion spell below 5th level, the target takes a -2 penalty to resist acting against its nature. (Magic item)

Myrrh
Myrrh (Alchemy Manual) Spells of the abjuration school are cast at +1 CL for the purpose of CL checks and Dispel Checks. (item)

Genius Avaricious
Genius Avaricious (Pathfinder Adventure Path #30: The Twice-Damned Prince) Mammon's Mantle: grants up to a +5 untyped Charisma bonus which heightens DC's.

Psychic Vampires (from the "Occult Bestiary") gets +6 Charisma (though it's a +2 CR template).

The Feysworn prestige class (From "The First World, Realm of The Fey") can grant you a +4 sacred bonus to one ability score for a few rounds per day.

i also have another build that i could use instead death domain cleric that weaponizes channel negative energy just need to find a way to make it not be so bad like maybe finding a way to key cleric casting to charisma or something so i dont need to try and get wis up to high
Lady-J wrote:
i also have another build that i could use instead death domain cleric that weaponizes channel negative energy just need to find a way to make it not be so bad like maybe finding a way to key cleric casting to charisma or something so i dont need to try and get wis up to high

Elder Mythos Cleric casts using CHA instead of WIS, but can't select the Death domain. However, it is automatically eligible for Dreamed Secrets (which nets you some arcane spells) at 7th level.

If you like at-will are damage and spell-ish abilities, why not try a Kineticist?
My Self wrote:


If you like at-will are damage and spell-ish abilities, why not try a Kineticist?

i loath the way many of the kineticist class features work even though some abilities are neat the drawbacks out way the benifits in my oppinion

What exactly are you trying to build for?
My Self wrote:
What exactly are you trying to build for?

in which regard? im not entirely sure what your asking

also looking at maybe going as a low cr(1-4) monster race(no outsiders or undead)small-medium wish a decent base cha boost instead
Lady-J wrote:
My Self wrote:
What exactly are you trying to build for?
in which regard? im not entirely sure what your asking

What's your end goal? What kind of character do you want? What sort of campaign (if any?) Or are you theorycrafting?

My Self wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
My Self wrote:
What exactly are you trying to build for?
in which regard? im not entirely sure what your asking
What's your end goal? What kind of character do you want? What sort of campaign (if any?) Or are you theorycrafting?

making a fun build for a backup character my current back up was nixed by the dm saying no undead at this time so have to think of another one so i thought of a caster that hates combat and uses color spray to end it as soon as it starts and a cleric who utilizes channel negative energy to aoe kill most things we come across but im trying to get the most out of those abilities.was thinking about a fireball sorc but fireball is just so easy to counter either evasion or immunity and the build is toast even with the elemental change it only gets you so far, also though of a healing character but all the neat healing stuff is new content and dm has a rule were if they dont own the book we cant use the stuff from it.

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