Where would I have seen this decision or announcement to know that I should have scheduled games?
I believe it was in the blog post (or one of the blog posts, if there were more than one) that announced PaizoCon.
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Keep in mind all, the Banquet hall will not be available for afternoon slots this year.Thanks for letting everybody know Majuba. This turns a pet-peeve of PaizoCon of mine into a full-blown irateness.
I've called out the Seattle VOs before, and I will continue do do this. This is seriously not cool. You are responsible for conventions in your region. If Paizo cannot support sessions convention-long, you should be filling in the gaps.
If you came to Con of the North and we were like "yeah, you guys have to arrange your own stuff, we want afternoons to get to play stuff", we'd get tossed to the wolves.
One last comment, then I'm out, as I'm tired of being yelled at and blamed for things.
Paizocon is NOT a regional convention. The Seattle officers are not in any way involved it its organization. We were specifically asked by Paizo not to take the lead, as they wanted GMs to work with them.
If you want to see the Seattle officer team at work, please come to Norwescon, Dragonflight, Geek Girl Con, Emerald City Comic-con, or any of the game days we put on.
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Keep in mind all, the Banquet hall will not be available for afternoon slots this year.Thanks for letting everybody know Majuba. This turns a pet-peeve of PaizoCon of mine into a full-blown irateness.
I've called out the Seattle VOs before, and I will continue do do this. This is seriously not cool. You are responsible for conventions in your region. If Paizo cannot support sessions convention-long, you should be filling in the gaps.
If you came to Con of the North and we were like "yeah, you guys have to arrange your own stuff, we want afternoons to get to play stuff", we'd get tossed to the wolves.
One last comment, then I'm out, as I'm tired of being yelled at and blamed for things.
Paizocon is NOT a regional convention. The Seattle officers are not in any way involved it its organization. We were specifically asked by Paizo not to take the lead, as they wanted GMs to work with them.
If you want to see the Seattle officer team at work, please come to Norwescon, Dragonflight, Geek Girl Con, Emerald City Comic-con, or any of the game days we put on.
Then its a failure of Paizo and the OP staff for not making this abundantly clear.
The failure of the Seattle Area VO team was not also making sure this was abundantly clear to everyone as well.
Earl...it's not our region. It's the responsibility of the region to support conventions.That makes sense. I guess I was viewing this as a Paizo community convention (that just happens to be in Seattle) supported by the Paizo community, rather than a Seattle area convention supported by the Seattle area VOs. But I can agree with what you're saying.
This is how I've always felt, both before and after becoming a Seattle local. PaizoCon is about the biggest fans running and playing with the biggest fans, not one local region putting on a show. I want to see that guy from Kansas who just LOVES running 2-17 to get his chance to run it, or the gal from San Fran who has every prop and voice down for 4-9.
But back on target as Hmm said: I've got time to run Monday - PM or email me with your oddball suggestions. No tech or pirates (sorry Hmm!).
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Paizocon is NOT a regional convention. The Seattle officers are not in any way involved it its organization. We were specifically asked by Paizo not to take the lead, as they wanted GMs to work with them.
If you want to see the Seattle officer team at work, please come to Norwescon, Dragonflight, Geek Girl Con, Emerald City Comic-con, or any of the game days we put on.
A list of conventions you participate in is still not a valid excuse.
This is not a new complaint. You've had a year to work with Paizo to figure out a solution, and frankly to show some initiative. This didn't have to turn into me coming in here guns a-blazin' again. If you feel that you don't need to participate in the convention because it's a fan-con and not part of the region, then work with Paizo to figure out a better solution than what's now been par for the course with afternoons open.
If Paizo isn't going to schedule afternoons, you guys can really shine by actually pulling it together. Really it's nothing more than another game day where you don't even need to GM, just send out the request for the GMs to everybody here on the forums. I can think of dozens that would help out, including myself.
This is not a new complaint. You've had a year to work with Paizo to figure out a solution, and frankly to show some initiative.
You're just as capable of doing so Slanky, probably more so as a more established boardmember - don't put things on others you're not taking on yourself.
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You've had a year to work with Paizo to figure out a solution, and frankly to show some initiative. This didn't have to turn into me coming in here guns a-blazin' again. If you feel that you don't need to participate in the convention because it's a fan-con and not part of the region, then work with Paizo to figure out a better solution than what's now been par for the course with afternoons open.
Despite my previous statement that I was out, I will respond. You're being polite even if I think completely unreasonable.
We did show initiative. We suggested and were turned down. We were asked not to organize, so we did not organize.
It's not a "fan-con", it is a convention put on by Paizo. If Paizo specifically doesn't want us to be involved, how is it our place to do it anyway?
Lots of people, including some of the officers, very much wanted to take the point as we did last year. Please don't assume we just walked away because we had no interest.
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This whole argument reminds me of our current mantra at work. "You wanted responsibility, now you're accountable for it."
Am I completely missing something?
Where did the Seattle Venture-Corps ever say they wanted responsibility for scheduling 2017 games?
They asked Paizo two years ago if they could set up midday games. Paizo says "we want people to use our event scheduler." Seattle says "OK." Paizo says to the world at large "Who wants to run games? Submit your events!"
And people are upset because the Seattle Venture-Officers didn't submit events that they would GM for everyone else? Anyone could have volunteered to GM. The only people who have anything close to a reason to be upset are those who did volunteer to GM events and submitted them to Paizo, only to find out that no one else did.
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Here - take it out of this thread.
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We did show initiative. We suggested and were turned down. We were asked not to organize, so we did not organize.
It's not a "fan-con", it is a convention put on by Paizo. If Paizo specifically doesn't want us to be involved, how is it our place to do it anyway?
Lots of people, including some of the officers, very much wanted to take the point as we did last year. Please don't assume we just walked away because we had no interest.
Then there's a miscommunication between you and Paizo. I refuse to believe, even for a second, that Paizo wouldn't say, "sure, if you want to help GMs get things submitted as afternoon events, please do so!" Because not running Warhorn, and getting things into Paizo's system is not stepping on Paizo's toes. If anything, it eliminates a significant chunk of your game day prep (not needing to worry about tables and players, where, etc.) and Paizo gets more events in their system. You can help make sure the events are appropriate, thematic, and not duplicative. There's much you can do without putting into Warhorn.
I would strongly not suggest bringing "last year" into it either, since this exact complaint was made then too, which is why I'm fairly verbal about it this year.
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They asked Paizo two years ago if they could set up midday games. Paizo says "we want people to use our event scheduler." Seattle says "OK." Paizo says to the world at large "Who wants to run games? Submit your events!"This is nothing more than Paizo saying, "please use our system", which is what they relayed last year as well. That's a huge leap to, "don't help".
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Paizocon is NOT a regional convention. The Seattle officers are not in any way involved it its organization. We were specifically asked by Paizo not to take the lead, as they wanted GMs to work with them.
If you want to see the Seattle officer team at work, please come to Norwescon, Dragonflight, Geek Girl Con, Emerald City Comic-con, or any of the game days we put on.
A list of conventions you participate in is still not a valid excuse.
This is not a new complaint. You've had a year to work with Paizo to figure out a solution, and frankly to show some initiative. This didn't have to turn into me coming in here guns a-blazin' again. If you feel that you don't need to participate in the convention because it's a fan-con and not part of the region, then work with Paizo to figure out a better solution than what's now been par for the course with afternoons open.
If Paizo isn't going to schedule afternoons, you guys can really shine by actually pulling it together. Really it's nothing more than another game day where you don't even need to GM, just send out the request for the GMs to everybody here on the forums. I can think of dozens that would help out, including myself.
Ok, I found where it was announced how the middle slot was going to be handled. It was a paragraph buried in the OPC's call for volunteers, titled, "OPC wants you for Paizo Con 2017." It was the 5th paragraph in a wall of text.
Since I wasn't planning to volunteer for Paizo Con, I largely ignored this blog. I have largely started ignoring most announcements that do not pertain to me. When I was a VO, I paid attention to almost all announcements so that I could be aware for other people.
I'm not sure why this "change of how things work" did not go out in a more visible way.
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So.... on the topic at hand.
I'm still interested in a Thursday evening game, but would prefer not to run. (I'm running Thursday afternoon and Friday morning....)
I'm also around Monday, and am interested in finding jolly and fun things to do then as well.
I will bring the materials necessary for my "Stranded in Deep Space" Fudge one-shot. That has room for eight (!) players, and generally takes only 2-3 hours to run. I've run it a couple of times before. If folks are interested I could set that up. (Zero Fudge knowledge is necessary. The game focuses a lot more on roleplaying, and interactions between the PCs, than on combat or most things game-mechanicy. And Fudge is extremely easy to pick up. The premise is that you're all people on a small interstellar cruise ship, when all of a sudden you drop out of hyperspace and everything goes silent. You need to figure out what's going on, and the mysteries pile up as you investigate.)
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This whole argument reminds me of our current mantra at work. "You wanted responsibility, now you're accountable for it."Am I completely missing something?
Where did the Seattle Venture-Corps ever say they wanted responsibility for scheduling 2017 games?
They asked Paizo two years ago if they could set up midday games. Paizo says "we want people to use our event scheduler." Seattle says "OK." Paizo says to the world at large "Who wants to run games? Submit your events!"
And people are upset because the Seattle Venture-Officers didn't submit events that they would GM for everyone else? Anyone could have volunteered to GM. The only people who have anything close to a reason to be upset are those who did volunteer to GM events and submitted them to Paizo, only to find out that no one else did.
Except the announcement that mid-slot PFS games would be handled solely as 3pp event submissions was hidden in the OPC blog calling for volunteers. If you weren't planning to volunteer, you would completely missed this announcement as I did.
And why did local Seattle GMs, or the Seattle VO contingent not help gather some GMs to put together some 3PP submissions?
Did Paizo specifically not want anyone from Seattle putting in event submissions?
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I've written and deleted three posts, so I'll phrase this as a question and then be done.
MisterSlanky: are you willing to do what you are asking the Seattle VOs to do? Are you willing to send out requests and reminders to potential GMs in 2018? To gather their information, make sure the tables don't overlap, and hound them to submit the proper events to Paizo?
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I've written and deleted three posts, so I'll phrase this as a question and then be done.
MisterSlanky: are you willing to do what you are asking the Seattle VOs to do? Are you willing to send out requests and reminders to potential GMs in 2018? To gather their information, make sure the tables don't overlap, and hound them to submit the proper events to Paizo?
My opinion, is I stepped down as VC for a reason. Because I was burnt out on organizing things. So regardless who organizes mid-slot games, or helps to facilitate GMs submitting games as 3pp events, it should be a Venture-Officer of some sort.
It just makes the most sense, that those people would be from the region the convention is taking place in.
So if it isn't the job of the Seattle Venture-Corps to do this, and they have decided they aren't going to do this to help people facilitate things and make things run smoothly, then why hasn't another Venture-Officer stepped up to do so?
Why is it being left up to a random assortment of people who aren't venture-officers to help make this run smoothly?
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I've written and deleted three posts, so I'll phrase this as a question and then be done.
MisterSlanky: are you willing to do what you are asking the Seattle VOs to do? Are you willing to send out requests and reminders to potential GMs in 2018? To gather their information, make sure the tables don't overlap, and hound them to submit the proper events to Paizo?
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If the event was in a region that Mr.Slanky was the responsible VC for, I suspect he'd be all over it.
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I've written and deleted three posts, so I'll phrase this as a question and then be done.
MisterSlanky: are you willing to do what you are asking the Seattle VOs to do? Are you willing to send out requests and reminders to potential GMs in 2018? To gather their information, make sure the tables don't overlap, and hound them to submit the proper events to Paizo?
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If the event was in a region that Mr.Slanky was the responsible VC for, I suspect he'd be all over it.
Bingo, but I suspect there is a reason he resigned as VC in 2011. Because he didn't have time to be a VC anymore. And if he did have time to be a VO in his region, it is likely he'd be one again if he wanted to be one.
I'm still interested in a Thursday evening game, but would prefer not to run. (I'm running Thursday afternoon and Friday morning....)
Are you signed up for 8-20 yet Rob? I could run that Thursday night for you.
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MisterSlanky: are you willing to do what you are asking the Seattle VOs to do? Are you willing to send out requests and reminders to potential GMs in 2018? To gather their information, make sure the tables don't overlap, and hound them to submit the proper events to Paizo?
I did what a VO does, when I was a VC. I took the responsibility and accountability required of the position when I was in that role.
And then I got out because I didn't want that responsibility anymore. So as somebody NOT a VO - no.
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Oh yeah, back to the topic at hand...
Still recruiting for Thursday afternoon 1:00 Portent's Peril. Willing to change that up if the lack of interest is the scenario. Listed on Warhorn here.
Also know I'm planning on bringing some group-oriented board games for Thursday evening. That'll be on the fly though!
I'm still interested in a Thursday evening game, but would prefer not to run. (I'm running Thursday afternoon and Friday morning....)Are you signed up for 8-20 yet Rob? I could run that Thursday night for you.
If you're looking for somewhere around a 7:30 start time, I'd love to increase the amount of Robs that you've got.
If you're looking for somewhere around a 7:30 start time, I'd love to increase the amount of Robs that you've got.
That's pretty rough for getting up in time for 6:30am badge line. I'm unfortunately not know for fast runs.
Understood, I'm used to hard cutoff 4 hour slots in my region which makes 7:30 a perfectly reasonable time to start.
I sometimes forget that other places routinely run 5+ hours.
I'll probably just end up hanging out and munching Thursday night and turning in early.
Understood, I'm used to hard cutoff 4 hour slots in my region which makes 7:30 a perfectly reasonable time to start.
I sometimes forget that other places routinely run 5+ hours.
I'll probably just end up hanging out and munching Thursday night and turning in early.
Yeah, mostly around that here with weeknight games (*shudder*) - I was used to 12-13 hours for 2 slots (+ lunch).
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Torrent's Last Will is a 7-11, which generally means that it will tend to run longer than a 1-5. (I suspect, though, that scenario-to-scenario, or even table-to-table, variance is bigger than systematic differences between scenarios.)
Anyway, 8-20 would be cool.
I have to admit, when our local gamedays went from three 4-hour slots with only 1/2 hour between them to two 5-hour slots with an hour (or an hour and a half?) between them, I started enjoying the games much more. Games never got started completely efficiently, and we were usually cramming to finish in a slot. (Don't even talk to me about Bronze House Reprisal.) We were often rushing to finish when the folks who run the game day were cleaning up the garbage and generally hanging around us wondering why we hadn't left yet....
Customer Service Manager
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At PaizoCon we are conscious of a variety of factors that need to be considered when scheduling events, including Pathfinder Society. This convention is unique in that it is not just a convention at which Pathfinder Society is played, it is a convention celebrating our community and staff and run by Paizo. By closing the PFS hall during the 1p-6pm time slot Friday, Saturday and Sunday, we allow the community of folks who GM and who assist with PFS HQ, including many local venture officers, to get to experience of meeting employees & other community members, attend seminars, attending games and other convention experiences. It is not fair to ask the Seattle VOs/GMs to give up their convention off time to make sure there are GMs and calling them out for not giving up their chance to game with staff or friends, attend seminars or other events is inappropriate.
As we explore various formats for PaizoCon, we do know and keep in mind that there are folks who wish to run and play Pathfinder Society instead of attending other games or seminars. But ultimately, PaizoCon is not a convention designed to cram as much Pathfinder Society into a weekend as possible, it is a event for the community of Paizo fans and employees, gaming luminaries, authors, artists, 3rd party publishers, to gather and have a great weekend.
I currently have Friday and Sunday afternoon open on my schedule.
I am happy to go to various seminars, maybe visit Pike's Place during one of those slots.
I would like to play games during the other one.
My current options are:
Friday Afternoon:
Learn the Aventuria Adventure Card Game (Listed as a seminar)
That is literally the only game with space available that slot.
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Sunday Afternoon:
Legendary Planet: The Thanex Caper (currently 23/24)
Learn the Aventuria Adventure Card Game
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I feel like not only did Paizo choose to not organize events during this slot but that they actively discouraged local VOs from doing so as well.
Maybe it's just the problems with the lottery making me grumpy but I am quite unhappy with my PaizoCon schedule at the moment and don't currently see a way to fix it.
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Sara, the local VOs are not being asked to give up their middle slots. They are being asked to do the work leading up to Paizo Con to submit the middle slot events.
Paizo actively asking them not to do so, and then having horrible communication on what folks should do to get games scheduled for the middle slot, and now being unwilling/unable to add events post lottery makes this a really egregious situation.
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Sara, the local VOs are not being asked to give up their middle slots. They are being asked to do the work leading up to Paizo Con to submit the middle slot events.
Correct - in fact, I would consider it highly likely that one can find somebody to muster the small number of tables that would be organized; however, as no one attempted to do so, we shall never know.
As we explore various formats for PaizoCon, we do know and keep in mind that there are folks who wish to run and play Pathfinder Society instead of attending other games or seminars. But ultimately, PaizoCon is not a convention designed to cram as much Pathfinder Society into a weekend as possible, it is a event for the community of Paizo fans and employees, gaming luminaries, authors, artists, 3rd party publishers, to gather and have a great weekend.
And there are individuals that find their enjoyment with meeting other players and playing and running games with those that do so as well in a broader environment than local cons, but without the size of Gen Con. Nobody is asking to impugn on the enjoyment of those that want to go to seminars in afternoon slots, only to put in the pre-con effort to ensure that those that fall into the group that have been maligned, both in historical precedence and in a direct description here that excludes them, have the an opportunity.
I don't know about you, but I consider gathering around a game table, "gathering and having a great weekend". I sit in seminars for the conferences I go to for work - I'd rather eat tacks than sit through another one.
Looking in on this thread I want to make an offer: I'd be willing to GM one of the following PFS scenarios ( Citadel of Flame #1-39; Vetran's vault #4-18; Halls of Dwarven lore #4-22; Hall of the flesh eaters #6-06; or the overflow archives #6-15) if another GM stepped up and GM'd another scenario in an one of the open afternoon slots (obviously we'd guarantee each other seats at our respective tables)
I have Friday , Saturday (I can start at 11:45am on Sat.), and Sunday afternoons. If any GM's are interested in scheduling a pick up game and want to play a little more in the afternoon..let me know ..I know we won't have a problem recruiting players.
PS. I'm totally up for playing or GMing a core game! Also would love to play either Overflow archives or Vetran's vault as core player!.
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Sara Marie -- Thank you.
Everyone else -- Let's not blame Seattle here. I am getting supremely uncomfortable with this finger pointing. If we want games in the afternoon, we can create pickup games.
Otherwise, we can take naps, walk, get lunch, chat with people.... or even do a seminar. I am excited to have breaks in my schedule where I'm not gaming.
I also like the idea of putting our energy towards planning how to change things for 2018 rather than continuing along this unproductive line of conversation.
So... It sounds like so far no one wants to offer pirates? Ah, well! I'll have to see what else is offered for Monday.
Hmm
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If we want games in the afternoon, we can create pickup games.
Have you been to PaizoCon? No? Huh...yeah...
I also like the idea of putting our energy towards planning how to change things for 2018 rather than continuing along this unproductive line of conversation.
Good idea...in 2014, and 2015, and 2016...
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I sure hope so, Khelreddin. I hope more games get posted on Warhorn.
I want to join a PFS game Thursday evening, hopefully high level. And I want to join a PFS game Monday afternoon (also high level). I don't fly back to Florida until Tuesday afternoon.
(I'm taking my name off of any Thursday morning potential game; I've extended my stay in Vegas through Wednesday night and will be flying in to Seattle Thursday morning, arriving at 10:15.)
I could run something on monday afternoon/evening. But it would need to be somthing Ive already run once.
If we have enough people I could see what I could do
+1 for Monday evening.
I'd pay for the upgrade to +2
Torrent's Last Will is a 7-11, which generally means that it will tend to run longer than a 1-5. (I suspect, though, that scenario-to-scenario, or even table-to-table, variance is bigger than systematic differences between scenarios.)
Anyway, 8-20 would be cool...
Ah, I didn't see you were locked in until 6pm at least.
So looking at your pfstracker.net listing, you have these virgin 1-x's that I can be prepared to run:
#0-14 The Many Fortunes of Grandmaster Torch
#0-17 Perils of the Pirate Pact
#0-24 Decline of Glory
#2-15 Shades of Ice, Part I: Written in Blood (excellent, but 1 of 3)
#8-05 Ungrounded but Unbroken
or #8-20, at your preference
Other's comments welcome, but Rob's been such a great sport so many times, I'll be guided by his choice.
RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16
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If we want games in the afternoon, we can create pickup games.Have you been to PaizoCon? No? Huh...yeah...
I also like the idea of putting our energy towards planning how to change things for 2018 rather than continuing along this unproductive line of conversation.Good idea...in 2014, and 2015, and 2016...
Dude, chill. I'll defend HMM to my dying breath. And I have been to PaizoCon before, and there was plenty to do during afternoons, even if you missed the lottery completely. This year I'll be running my kobolds ACG special, so I don't really have a dog in the fight, but calm down and stop attacking people who are just trying to come to the con and have fun.
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@ Zach it looks like 0-17 takes place in Echo Wood, not on a riverboat in the River Kingdoms.
And the Taldor one by Tim Hitchcock, "Decline of Glory," also has no sailing.
But "Hrethnar's Throne" is in a handful of slots during the Con and it seems to take place on the ocean south of Mediogalti, so if you can get your PC into one of those events,....
I sure hope so, Khelreddin. I hope more games get posted on Warhorn.
I want to join a PFS game Thursday evening, hopefully high level. And I want to join a PFS game Monday afternoon (also high level). I don't fly back to Florida until Tuesday afternoon.
(I'm taking my name off of any Thursday morning potential game; I've extended my stay in Vegas through Wednesday night and will be flying in to Seattle Thursday morning, arriving at 10:15.)
I could run something on monday afternoon/evening. But it would need to be somthing Ive already run once.
If we have enough people I could see what I could do+1 for Monday evening.I'd pay for the upgrade to +2
Actually with my husband it's a +3.
I will say we don't have anything above lvl 6.