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Relevant FAQ says you could.
Relevant FAQ says you could.
I disagree on the relevance. That FAQ says it would count as a one-handed weapon when using feats. It doesn't say that it would count as a one-handed weapon when selecting feats. I don't see anything in the FAQ that says it counts as a one-handed weapon for the purpose of meeting the prerequisites of a feat.
I said they could use the feat.
Never said anything about selecting it. (I should've, but it never occurred to me.)
With that being said, the feat would work if Elven Curved Blade was a valid option for the feat. Which it isn't.
Ok, I see your point. If you could take the feat then you could use it. My thinking was that you can't use the feat because you can't take the feat.
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I think it works. Another relevant FAQ;
The first FAQ says to treat it as a one-handed weapon for A, B, "and so on". The second says to do so for "other effects". Thus, the question is whether feats fall under those generic categories. I'd say yes. You can use it as a one-handed weapon so it works with one-handed weapon feats.
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If you can treat a Two-Handed Weapon as a One-Handed Weapon, you can use One-Handed only feats when wielding the weapon as a One-Handed Weapon.
If the rules say you can treat a Two-Handed Weapon as a One-Handed Weapon, you get to treat a Two-Handed Weapon as a One-Handed Weapon. I don't understand why people try to argue this.
There is no written rule stating "does not count when selecting feats."
because ECB isn't a one handed weapon. Just like how mithral breastplate isn't light armor.
If you can treat a Two-Handed Weapon as a One-Handed Weapon, you can use One-Handed only feats when wielding the weapon as a One-Handed Weapon.
If the rules say you can treat a Two-Handed Weapon as a One-Handed Weapon, you get to treat a Two-Handed Weapon as a One-Handed Weapon.
The argument arises because those two sentences are different. That the first is true does not make the second true.
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because ECB isn't a one handed weapon. Just like how mithral breastplate isn't light armor.
Yet a mithral breastplate is TREATED as light armor for character abilities.
So, if it is really "just like" that, then a two-handed weapon used one-handed would be treated as a one-handed for all character abilities... just not for physical aspects (e.g. it would still cost 180 gp to coat a two-handed weapon in alchemical silver).
Physical alterations/features are based off the physical nature of the item. Usage alterations/features are based off the, potentially modified, usage of the item.
This physical/usage split is spelled out both for armor (above) AND for weapons;
For class abilities, feats, and other rule elements that vary based on or specifically depend on wielding a one-handed weapon, a two-handed weapon, or a one-handed weapon with two hands, the bastard sword counts as however many hands you are using to wield it.
For example, if you are wielding it one-handed (which normally requires the Exotic Weapon Proficiency feat), it is treated as a one-handed weapon; Power Attack only gets the one-handed bonus, you cannot use Pushing Assault or Shield of Swings (which require a two-handed weapon), and so on.
If you are wielding it with two hands (whether or not you have the Exotic Weapon Proficiency to wield it with one hand), it is treated as a two-handed weapon; Power Attack gets the increased damage bonus, you can use Pushing Assault or Shield of Swings (which require a two-handed weapon), and so on.
An unusual case of the handedness rule is an ability that allows you to treat a two-handed weapon as a one-handed weapon. For example, the titan mauler's jotungrip (which allows you to wield a two-handed weapon with one hand) allows you to wield a bastard sword in one hand even without the Exotic Weapon Proficiency, and (as the ability states) treats it as a one-handed weapon, therefore it is treated as a one-handed weapon for other effects.
While the question there was specifically about bastard swords, the text also refers to handedness changes for weapons in general. Feats are based on the number of hands you are actually using... not the physical nature of the weapon.
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If slashing grace said "While wielding a one handed weapon" you'd be right CBDunkerson.
The trouble is that the feat says "Choose a kind of light or one handed slashing weapon" and elven curve blades are not a type of one handed slashing weapon, even if you can wield them with one hand.
The trouble is that the feat says "Choose a kind of light or one handed slashing weapon" and elven curve blades are not a type of one handed slashing weapon, even if you can wield them with one hand.
My character is treating Elven Curve Blades as one handed weapons, so It's a legal choice.
For specifically that character an Elven Curve Blade IS "a kind of light or one handed slashing weapon."
But the second he stops treating it as a One-Handed Weapon he looses the benefits of Slashing Grace
The trouble is that the feat says "Choose a kind of light or one handed slashing weapon" and elven curve blades are not a type of one handed slashing weapon, even if you can wield them with one hand.My character is treating Elven Curve Blades as one handed weapons, so It's a legal choice.
For specifically that character an Elven Curve Blade IS "a kind of light or one handed slashing weapon."
But the second he stops treating it as a One-Handed Weapon he looses the benefits of Slashing Grace
The feat and you are not the same entity.
You need to pick a light or one handed weapon. You can treat it as a one handed weapon, but it does not become one for the purpose of qualifying for feats, only in the way it interacts.
There is no workaround.
You need to pick a light or one handed weapon. You can treat it as a one handed weapon, but it does not become one for the purpose of qualifying for feats, only in the way it interacts.
There is no workaround.
I disagree, feats are part of my PCs entity.
Please show me an official source of your interpretation of the rules, because nowhere is it stated "except when selecting feats."
I don't think it works. PRD says:
"At 2nd level, a titan mauler may choose to wield a two-handed melee weapon in one hand with a –2 penalty on attack rolls while doing so"
Nowhere did it say that the weapon is now treated as a one-handed weapon.
This
It never becomes a one handed weapon, you just get to use an ability to use it in one hand.The power attack clarification is about how the weapon is being used, not about what kind of weapon it is.
mithral armor is still medium armor for a trait that says it works for medium armor and it it not light armor if there's a trait that worked for light armor. ECB is still a THW and not a OHW, so if you need to pick a one handed weapon it doesn't count.
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You need to pick a light or one handed weapon. You can treat it as a one handed weapon, but it does not become one for the purpose of qualifying for feats, only in the way it interacts.
There is no workaround.
I disagree, feats are part of my PCs entity.
Please show me an official source of your interpretation of the rules, because nowhere is it stated "except when selecting feats."
Indeed. And nowhere do the rules state that Humans on Golarion can't shoot 100d6 laser beams out of their eyes at will, so my Human characters can.
Nowhere did it say that the weapon is now treated as a one-handed weapon.
At 2nd level, a titan mauler may choose to wield a two-handed melee weapon in one hand with a –2 penalty on attack rolls while doing so. The weapon must be appropriately sized for her, and it is treated as one-handed when determining the effect of Power Attack, Strength bonus to damage, and the like.
Power Attack is a feat, so feats are effected - that would be the "and the like"
Indeed. And nowhere do the rules state that Humans on Golarion can't shoot 100d6 laser beams out of their eyes at will, so my Human characters can.
But it does say "is treated as one-handed when determining the effect of Power Attack, Strength bonus to damage, and the like"
Your lasereyes situation is neither here nore there, and quite frankly irrelevent.The arguement being made by the for side isn't "the rules don't say I can't" the arguement is "the rules say I can, but those against are saying it can't in this specific circumstance, please provide evidence for this reasoning"
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I don't think it works. PRD says:
"At 2nd level, a titan mauler may choose to wield a two-handed melee weapon in one hand with a –2 penalty on attack rolls while doing so"
Nowhere did it say that the weapon is now treated as a one-handed weapon.
Actually, the very fact that there is a penalty to wield it so would prove that it is NOT treated as a one h weapon.
Thats a bit of a leap in logic, I could easily state the opposite - The -2 is the cost for the benifit of wielding the weapon one handed.
Indeed. And nowhere do the rules state that Humans on Golarion can't shoot 100d6 laser beams out of their eyes at will, so my Human characters can.But it does say "is treated as one-handed when determining the effect of Power Attack, Strength bonus to damage, and the like"
Feat prerequisites are not effects of feats.
This is not a blanket qualifier like the Elvish ability to treat Elven Curve Blades as martial weapons. This qualifier only applies to the effects of feats under the specific situation that you are presently wielding the weapon one-handed.
Your lasereyes situation is neither here nore there, and quite frankly irrelevent.
The arguement being made by the for side isn't "the rules don't say I can't" the arguement is "the rules say I can, but those against are saying it can't in this specific circumstance, please provide evidence for this reasoning"
It was hyperbolic, but hardly irrelevant. You said
Please show me an official source of your interpretation of the rules, because nowhere is it stated "except when selecting feats."
You are arguing that this is permitted unless someone can show you where it is specifically prohibited. That isn't the way that the rules normally work. The burden of proof is on you. Where do the rules state that either the Jutungrip abiity or the FAQ changes the status of the weapon with respect to anything other than the effects of feats and special abilities?
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FAQ
"For class abilities, feats, and other rule elements that vary based on or specifically depend on wielding a one-handed weapon, a two-handed weapon, or a one-handed weapon with two hands, the bastard sword counts as however many hands you are using to wield it."
So... a bastard sword wielded in one hand qualifies as a one-handed weapon for Slashing Grace AND a bastard sword wielded in two hands qualifies as a two-handed weapon for Pushing Assault.
Everyone agree?
Further in the same FAQ;
"An unusual case of the handedness rule is an ability that allows you to treat a two-handed weapon as a one-handed weapon. For example, the titan mauler's jotungrip (which allows you to wield a two-handed weapon with one hand) allows you to wield a bastard sword in one hand even without the Exotic Weapon Proficiency, and (as the ability states) treats it as a one-handed weapon, therefore it is treated as a one-handed weapon for other effects."
This says that any two-handed weapon wielded in one hand (e.g. due to a special ability like Jotungrip) is treated as a one-handed weapon. So an Elven Curved Blade wielded in one hand would qualify for Slashing Grace just the same as the bastard sword would.
Bastard Swords are special.
Put me in the camp that says the Elven Curve Blade is (always) a two-handed weapon (when properly sized for the wielder). Jotundgrip is like the special rule that allows lances to be wielded in one hand while mounted. Just as you cannot add a light armor only enchantment to a mithral breastplate, neither can you select it for a feat that requires a one-handed weapon.
This says that any two-handed weapon wielded in one hand (e.g. due to a special ability like Jotungrip) is treated as a one-handed weapon. So an Elven Curved Blade wielded in one hand would qualify for Slashing Grace just the same as the bastard sword would.
Trouble with your comparison:
Bastard Sword qualifies for Slashing Grace because it actually has an entry under 'one handed' in the exotic weapons section.
Pushing Assault is fine because it only requires you to make a two handed weapon attack.
The trouble with Slashing Grace is that it requires you to "Choose a type of light or one handed slashing weapon" ... and if you look up Elven Curve Blade on the weapons table, it's under two-handed, not light or one handed.
That you can wield the weapon with one hand doesn't change what the weapon actually is. Similar to how you couldn't wrap an elven curve blade in effortless lace.
If it is a two handed weapon, it works with Jotungrip.
If it is a two handed weapon, it is not eligible for Slashing Grace.
It cannot work both ways unless the ability specially says you can treat it as a one handed weapon for feat prerequisites. It doesn't, it specifically says that it's still a two handed weapon and that you can use it in one hand.
Jotungrip allows you to use 2h weapons 1h style, it doesn't turn them into one handed weapons.