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Honestly, unless the GM can come up with a good excuse, I think keeping players from knowing when their spells succeed/fail is a bad play on the side of a GM. It just detracts from the game play over all, "foul play" if you will. Also it's sort of like common sense. There are several feats and things, and a good example is the "once per day" abilities that exist everywhere. If it can only affect a target once per day, how is the player suppose to know?

I'm trying really hard not to bluntly say, any GM that does this is a jerk, but really..come on guys. This game is designed to have fun, not cause people to get upset.

Sometimes people may get this confused. This does -not- mean the player is entitled to know WHY their ability failed, only that it failed.


Hmm, what you're saying makes sense, Quantum Steve. That said, I guess the only question remaining now is, if an ability goes against a normal rule, which one do you go with. And depending on the answer, is the answer the same for every instance where an ability and rule clash, or is it on a case to case basis? I'll have to devote some time in searching more upon that later.


It may be a little exaggerated on my part to believe things work that way, true. But I can't think of any specific examples that allow you to use a dancing bow, or defending arrows, or a mighty cleaving sling. Such things aren't normally possible, though in this context any perhaps some others, the Divine bond ability is pretty straight forwards about you being able to use any of those enchantments, and goes on to list the pre-reqs for doing so. The weapon must have at least a +1 enchantment first, the + enchantments can stack with the existing ones but only up to a +5, etc.

Specifically I want to point out the enchantment for the base +1 in the Divine bond description. Don't you find it odd they call out that the max enchantment stacking caps at +5, even though that's the normal rule for weapons? It's because without it people might argue that the enchantment could override that limit. Yet, they don't call out the ability enchantments like that, which is what leads me to believe that things like disruption could be placed on a weapon that isn't bludgeoning.


A good rule of thumb to know also is that, generally, class specific abilities or effects override normal rules. For example, and please do correct me if I am wrong, but the Divine Spirit bond lists disruption as one of the bonuses you can get. However, disruption calls out the weapon needing to be bludgeoning to work. Because it's a Paladin class feature however, I believe this allows you to get disruption on your sword, bow, or whatever other weapon the Paladin happens to be holding at the time.

The Divine bond ability states "or they can be used to add any of the following weapon properties" not "or they can be used to add any of the following weapon properties, so long as the enchantment could be used normally."


Shield Bash Attacks::
You can bash an opponent with a heavy shield. See "shield, heavy" on Table: Weapons for the damage dealt by a shield bash. Used this way, a heavy shield is a martial bludgeoning weapon. For the purpose of penalties on attack rolls, treat a heavy shield as a one-handed weapon. If you use your shield as a weapon, you lose its AC bonus until your next turn. An enhancement bonus on a shield does not improve the effectiveness of a shield bash made with it, but the shield can be made into a magic weapon in its own right.

Ring of Force Shield:
An iron band, this simple ring generates a shield-sized (and shield-shaped) wall of force that stays with the ring and can be wielded by the wearer as if it were a heavy shield (+2 AC). This special creation has no armor check penalty or arcane spell failure chance since it is weightless and encumbrance-free. It can be activated and deactivated at will as a free action.

Let me know if I got this correct.

My character is wielding a 2 handed great sword. He also has on a ring of Force shield. My turn plays out as thus, Free action turn off ring of force shield, full round 2 attacks with greatsword, end of turn reactivate Ring of Force Shield while holding greatsword with one hand(holding, not wielding so I can't make AoO with my greatsword.)

Enemies turn, they do something adjacent to me that provokes an AoO seeing as I only have 1 hand on my greatsword and can't swing it at him. He provokes and I use my ring of force shield as a weapon, shield bashing them and forgoing it's bonus to my AC for the rest of the enemies turn and round until my turn comes back around. Repeat previous steps.


Waldham wrote:

Hello,

Is it possible to obtain improved cover with a tower shield ?
And if yes, how ?

Thanks for your future answer.

You can spend a standard action to plant your tower shield onto the ground and grant yourself total cover in the direction the tower shield is facing. Were you looking for improved cover specifically?


An interesting thought came to me today. If I'm not mistaken, spellcraft is rolled for one spell caster to identify the spell being cast by another spell caster. Sounds simple, but I had a few questions.

Does/Why does this skill work for different classes? For example, even if a high intelligence wizard rolled a spellcraft and got a high result, should he know the ins and outs of that Holy word spell the Cleric is casting, or just the name of it? Why would someone who had dedicated his time studying wizardy and arcane spells know anything about a divine cleric spell, let alone any spell not on his own spell list or closely associated to his school of expertise?

Flip that coin. What's the logic behind a sorcerer who gets his magic innately(and I would argue the majority of them don't study their magic, let alone other schools or sources aka gods rather than bloodlines) having any business knowing about a spell from a different spell list?

Now, I'm not saying all spell casters are the same, and surely there are those out there who gladly dedicate their time in researching every single spell known to man, but I doubt every spell caster, or even the majority of them, do. Am I missing or over thinking something here?

Edit: Oh, after making this post, I realize it would probably be better in the general discussion threads.


Jurassic Pratt wrote:

Take abundant step and look up the Dimensional Agility feat chain.

You'll thank me later.

Thanks!!!


Hey all. So I'm having a little trouble deciding what ki power to pick up for my level 8 unchained monk. Personally, I'm torn between Abundant step and Wind Jump. I like the idea of being able to fly around with Wind Jump and fight things like a Saiyan, but since I have to land on solid ground, and I can't attack/move/attack without investing my few monk feats into the spring attack tree(I think since it's flying I would need fly-by-attack anyways and PCs can't take it AFAIK) it's usefulness seems less. Abundant step lets me teleport long distances, albiet my turn ends once I do it.

Is Wind jump as bad as it sounds or is there some tricky way to use it effectively?

Is there another ki power you would suggest over these two?


I think the wording in this is very important. As in, if i'm so ENRAGED at you, that I must attack you, and I can't think straight, I'll take my coin pouch and throw it at you and make a "ranged improvised attack" at you.

It may be silly, but there's a lot of factors to think of here.


Rule wise, classes that have to follow certain tenants usually have code of conducts listed on their class stat blocks or somewhere close. It tells you what they must uphold and any consequences that could happen if they don't.

Also, as a DM, don't feel bad to enforce the gods beliefs to his followers. Any divine caster gets their powers from a god(AFAIK), so it's not out of the question to bar said divine caster from using their spells or abilities if they go out of their way to spit in the gods face, so to speak. Gods aren't stupid.

It's also not out of the question to expect the player to play accordingly. It may just be my personal opinion, but anyone who takes on a divine class and starts taking levels in that class has made a life altering decision to live it, not just have it. It's a way of life, not a job occupation.


Does this spell in fact allow my paladin to deal -double damage- for the round, or simple x2 the weapon dice like on a critical hit?

What exactly does "double damage" mean and what is or isn't doubled when calculating the damage?


Beneath the beast rider archtype for Cavalier, it states this.

Mounts:
Exotic Mount (Ex): At 1st level, a beast rider forms a bond with a strong, loyal companion that permits him to ride it as a mount. This mount functions as a druid's animal companion, using the beast rider's level as his effective druid level. The animal chosen as a mount must be large enough to carry the beast rider (Medium or Large for a Small character; Large or Huge for a Medium character).

The beast rider does not take an armor check penalty on Ride checks while riding his mount. The mount is always considered combat trained, and begins play with Endurance as a bonus feat. A beast rider's mount does not gain the share spells special ability.

Each time the beast rider increases in level, he can choose to select a new, more impressive mount better suited to his increased power.

Small-sized beast riders can choose a pony or wolf mount at 1st level. At 4th level, a Small beast rider can also choose an allosaurus, ankylosaurus, arsinoitherium, aurochs, bison, boar, brachiosaurus, elephant, glyptodon, hippopotamus, mastodon, megaloceros, riding dog, snapping turtle (giant), triceratops, or tyrannosaurus. At 7th level, he can also choose a dinosaur (deinonychus or velociraptor).

Medium beast riders can choose a camel or horse mount at 1st level. At 4th level, a Medium beast rider can also choose an allosaurus, ankylosaurus, arsinoitherium, aurochs, bison, brachiosaurus, elephant, glyptodon, hippopotamus, lion, mastodon, megaloceros, snapping turtle (giant), tiger, triceratops, or tyrannosaurus as his mount. Additional mounts might be available with GM approval.

In addition, a 7th-level or higher Medium beast rider can select any creature whose natural size is Large or Huge, provided that creature is normally available as a Medium-sized animal companion at 7th level (like a bear). To generate statistics for such a mount, apply the following modifications: Size Large; Ability Scores Str +2, Dex –2, Con +2. Increase the damage of each of the mount's natural attacks by one die size. A beast rider cannot choose a mount that is not capable of bearing his weight, that has fewer than four legs, or that has a fly speed (although the GM may allow mounts with a swim speed in certain environments).

Anytime a feat or ability allows a mount to make a hoof attack, it can make a claw, slam, or other analogous attack instead.

This ability replaces the standard cavalier's mount and expert trainer abilities.

Big cats are medium sized until they hit their level 7 advancement as shown on the Druid's animal companion chart. However, they are quite clear that this choice is a mount for the cavalier. Can a medium sized Beast Rider Cavalier use a medium sized creature as their mount at level 4?


Thanks for the quick reply!


More specifically, I was looking at buying myself A ring of delayed Doom.

What it does:
Aura moderate conjuration; CL 9th
Slot ring; Price 45,000 gp; Weight —

Whenever the mind or body of this ring’s wearer first becomes subject to any harmful effect that allows a saving throw to resist or mitigate it, he may, as an immediate action, choose to delay the onset of that effect for 1 minute, after he fails the saving throw but before its effects occur. This activation causes one of the ring’s nine garnets to turn to powder. When that minute passes, the wearer may continue to delay the onset of this harmful effect an additional minute as an immediate action by willing the ring to do so, which destroys another garnet, thus repeating the cycle for another minute. The delayed harmful effect occurs when the wearer falls unconscious, when the ring is removed, or 1 minute after the last time the ring’s power activated; rounds spent delaying the effect do not count toward the effect’s duration (for example, a curse that lasts 5 rounds takes effect for a full 5 rounds, even if the wearer delayed its effect several minutes). Effects that protect against or negate the harmful effect work normally while it is delayed. The price of the ring is reduced by 5,000 gp for each of its garnets that has been destroyed.

The last sentence is of importance. Specifically, it says the word price, not value, which leads me to believe if I wanted to buy a 1 charge ring, I could for the price of 5,000.


Looking through the number of goodies that one can buy once they have enough Fame, I started to notice that there were a few items where in the description it says something along the lines of "This item costs X less gold for each charge missing."

When purchasing magical items, am I forced to buy the full-priced and fully charged version, or can I purchase a cheaper and used version?

Some of these magical items have nice benefits, but I hardly see myself even using up half of the charges in my characters PFS career.


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Hold on, to argue for the OP, I thought one could not take a five foot step in the same round he uses a move action to move. Specifically, if he uses that move action to cast a spell, fly, shift, teleport, or any other version of movement. Since DD is an ability that moves you, you should not be able to 5 foot in the same round. Is this correct?

Edit: This is copy and pasted from the Paizo website concerning 5 foot step.

Spoiler:
Take 5-Foot Step
You can move 5 feet in any round when you don't perform any other kind of movement. Taking this 5-foot step never provokes an attack of opportunity. You can't take more than one 5-foot step in a round, and you can't take a 5-foot step in the same round that you move any distance.

You can take a 5-foot step before, during, or after your other actions in the round.

You can only take a 5-foot-step if your movement isn't hampered by difficult terrain or darkness. Any creature with a speed of 5 feet or less can't take a 5-foot step, since moving even 5 feet requires a move action for such a slow creature.

You may not take a 5-foot step using a form of movement for which you do not have a listed speed.

You cannot take a five foot step in any round where you move from your current spot, regardless of how you do it or what action you take that moves you. Special abilities that specifically say you can move, override this rule and are usually accompanied by the text along the lines of "even if you have made a 5 foot step this round."


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Sadly, no. Regardless of Titan Mauler or not, elven curve blade is a two-handed weapon. The feat specifically says it applies to a one-handed weapon. Just because you can wield a two-handed weapon in one hand, does not make it a one-handed weapon.

The only way around this is to find the text "may treat two-handed weapons as one-handed for the purpose of taking feats" which doesn't apply here.


A good question came up today at our PFS event. A baddie moved away from a monk who was in the party, and the monk said they wanted to use a trip in place of their AoO. There was a bit of a discussion on what happened next, as different people had experienced different rulings in the past. The way this particular event played out was, the trip hit, but the baddie was allowed to move to where they wanted, and then was knocked prone afterwards.

With my understanding however, AoO are interrupts that happen before the triggering action. For example, this is why if someone provokes an AoO for drinking a healing potion, and then they take damage that would drop them, they get dropped without receiving healing because they never got to drink the potion. Or is this wrong and the events happen simultaneously?

So, a few questions!

1. If the monk doesn't have improved trip, can the baddie make an AoO in reaction to the monk's AoO trip? If the Baddies doesn't have improved trip, can the monk? Can this create an infinite loop?

2. If successful, does the trip happen before or after the baddie moves? If before, does the baddie lose any movement spaces he had left in that move action? If not, could he choose to use the remaining movement spaces to crawl?

3. Can the baddie use his standard action and attempt the same movement?

4. If he chooses to do the above, does this count as the same action or a different action for provoking AoO?


I think the archtype is made as intended. Sure, you start off with penalties, but since you're a monk focusing one sort of style(improvised weapons) most of your feats should follow that tree anyways. With enough feats, not only will you negate penalties for using ANYTHING as a weapon(eventually) you'll also increase the damage by entire dis. Dices? You'll hurt more.

As a player, I too agree that perhaps he shouldn't have any penalties, but we must also remember that a level 1 adventure is nothing more but an enhanced commoner really. We can't all start off as level 20 monks of badassery that have mastered every single utensil in the universe and can use it as fluently a weapon as any other object ever.

If anything, I think this particular archtype should get said improvised feats added to their bonus feats list.

@Kobald Cleaver: At level 3 they can spend a swift action to make their weapon do different damage types for 1 round unlimited times per day. Piercing, slashing, or bludgeoning. As for "true" improvised weapons, well..an empty hand monk can just grab any weapon and say it's improvised for them since they don't have the weapon prof.


The spell is what it is. What's the question for this exactly? You can cast it ON a square with an undead vulnerable to it, but they won't take damage unless they leave and move back into the square. It clearly says move into. If the party members FORCE that undead to move into that square it's their choice. It's a stationary 5 foot square pillar of positive and/or divine energy. If the undead is foolish enough to position himself so near to it or to not try and move away from it, it's their fault.

Pro: No saving throw

Con: Can't cast it on a square with an undead already on it to deal damage.

Looking at the dimensions of the spell, it looks like it's a spell made to be a barrier for a door or something anyways, not a weird version of searing light.


You are reading it correctly. You may use the armor, weapon, or mount, but once chosen you're stuck with it. It does say can, not must, and if you read more on the archtype, the divine defenders bond does not replace the normal paladins bond, simply offers a third bonding option. If it did in fact replace the other two bonding options, it would say so as it does with many other archtype abilities.

Bondage, it's a Paladin thing.


To the OP: The main counter to intimidate is to use things that are immune to fear or fear effects. You can fluff it anyway you want, but intimidate will always be a fear effect.

Don't get me wrong, intimidate is great and all, but it's just a one shot pony, succeed or fail. If you're really having trouble with it, just slap on the undead template things or make them run into oozes or things that are just too mindless to be intimidated.

Also, I -think- intimidate is a mind affecting effect? Not sure, but if it is, anything that gives you immunity to that works as well.


I agree with the "elaborate more please" thing. If the negative conditions are applied because of, or through a disease effect, or if the ability in question had the disease keyword on it's descriptor, than the paladin is immune to the disease and it's negative effects.

Otherwise, yeah. You can creep the Paladin the f out if ya want.


Watch the end fight of Kung Fu Panda 2 where the Panda(monk) is deflecting and then redirecting(Deflect arrows/Snatch Arrows) the fireball-fireworks(Bombs) from the ship cannons. It's a good visual example.

Monk rule of thumb: If it looks cool, you're doing it right. =)


Thanks to a small mention, I find myself being drawn back to this question. My DM for PFS and I settled on "No, it doesn't work" but I never actually took the time to clarify it or get an official ruling.

If I have a paladin 9/Cavalier 1...

Do their levels stack for my Mounts total level?

If I choose bonded weapon, can I still get a Mount from the Cavalier?
- Does the mount use my total levels or just my Cavalier levels?

Do I only get 1 mount of my choice(Paladin or Cavalier) or do I technically get 2, 1 from each class?
-How does my ACs levels calculate then?


LoneKnave wrote:
Quote:
I myself would LOVE it if things like this stacked, but sadly, they don't. I was heartbroken when I learned that my Cavalier and Paladin abilities wouldn't stack as far as my mounts level goes. :(
I'm uh... I'm not sure how to break this to you, but they do. They both give you effective druid levels. As long as you pick an AC that's available to both, they stack.

Sorry, I had forgot to mention that my Paladin chose the bonded weapon. So he was no longer eligible to get a mount unless he wanted it to be level 1. :(

Edit: Scratch that. I'll make another thread to question it.


:
Using something as something isn't the same as BEING something. Using a door as a shield is still a door. Using a stick as a sword is still a stick. Using Warpriest levels as monk is still a warpriest.

Because people want to argue it so much, when I read the text it clearly and obviously means IMO, that you simply use his levels as monk levels to determine your unarmed damage. I.E. they are saying use the monks unarmed damage chart because it's common sense. They are not saying "The war priest counts as a monk in all regards for being a monk" if that were the case why does the warpriest's AC modifer re-state itself word for word instead of saying "Is exactly the same as the monks AC modifer"? Simple. It's because Warpriests are NOT monks. The Magic item works for monks. It's pretty clear to see that it doesn't stack. I mean..it's in the literal words of the magic item. Also, the ability in question says "Treat levels as monk levels for unarmed damage" not "treat all effects that effect monks to effect the Sacred Fist Warpriest".

I myself would LOVE it if things like this stacked, but sadly, they don't. I was heartbroken when I learned that my Cavalier and Paladin abilities wouldn't stack as far as my mounts level goes. :(

Tl;DR The ability in questions says to use your levels to adjust your unarmed damage equal to that of a monk of the same level. It does not say count the warpriests levels as monk levels for determining magical items that effect monks. No more, no less.


No where does it say a Sacred Fist is or acts like a monk. They simply get abilities that are similar to a monks. The Robe specifically says "Monk or not monk" therefore the Robes will only give the Sacred Fist Warpriest unarmed equal to a level 5 monk. no lower, no higher.


Banners come in many sizes, shapes, and styles. From the huge stick like ones to flags on your lances and horses armor to the markings that Samurais wore. Basically it's saying "Your Banner needs to big enough to actually mean something to your allies." Get creative with it, make it fancy, intimidating, awesome, whatever. You're a Cavalier/Samurai who embodies an Honor or Code, and you dang well make sure everyone knows about it!


You pretty much have it right. The effects overlap but do not stack. The AC would negate eachother out(assuming both effects are happening at the same time or the per rounds are overlapping) and the bonuses that are different would apply as normal.

If you were to apply both of those effects to a single target, the target would get +2 Str, +2 Con, +1 attack, and +1 damage. The AC cancels itself out so it isn't applied. (+1 and -1 to AC)

To Clarify, the reason why it overlaps but does not stack is because all parts of the ability are morale bonuses. It isn't just "A single morale bonus" blanket effect, it's "Morale bonuses" from this effect.


For ranged combat, you suffer a -4 to hit anyone that is engaged in melee combat, unless that enemy is ten feet or more away from the nearest friendly ally. I.E. if the enemy is using a reach weapon for 10 feet and no allies are adjacent to that enemy, even though that enemy might have attacked an ally with a melee attack, you don't suffer a -4 to hit that creature.

Also! If the square of the target you are shooting at passes through a hard corner or another creature's square, that creature you are trying to hit has a +4 to their ac due to cover.

Lastly, if you wanted to reposition that goblin, after you had them in a grapple, into the way of the enemy archer and use him as a shield, you would indeed get +4 to your ac if the enemy archer shot through his allies square, he would also suffer a -4 to hit because of the melee rules. Do keep in mind however, repositioning an enemy with a grapple into a "dangerous" position, needs a successful CMB check by you to reposition them, and they get a free CMB check of their own to break the grapple. If you merely wanted to reposition them into a non-dangerous square, they would not get the free attempt to break the grapple.


You're right. A lot of people don't do this, but it's one of those "Never really thought about/used" things. I posted just a few days ago wondering about armor spikes myself(which include gauntlets) because I wanted to dual wield with a longsword/shield combo and not lose my shields ac bonus. :P


There's no specific rule in the book that says "This is the fireball's touch AC for going through tiny holes."

However, if you look up Splash weapons under combat, I would logically use those rules. It's a magically aimed spell, and you pick a square. You don't roll a touch attack against a creature so it can't miss the square you are aiming at, so no need to roll percentage chance for the fireball to land at an adjacent square. The Touch ac for the small crack would be 5. If you hit, it continues on to where the intended destination was. If you miss, it impacts the wall besides the crack and detonates prematurely.

Assuming what the fireball hits and what your damage roll is, it's entirely possible for the fireball to miss, explode, and blow through the wall it impacts on, hitting stuff on the otherside anyways at no reduced damage.(Reflex save baring)


blackbloodtroll wrote:
boring7 wrote:

How do you get to ignore the prerequisites for shield master as a level 6 ranger or slayer?

Dual-shielding isn't stupid.

Combat Style feats.

To go off of this. Ranger's specifically if you read their combat Style Feats can "Choose this feat even if they do not meet the pre-req to get this feat."

I.E. One of the better reasons why Fighters do not in fact make better rangers than the ranger class.

Edit: For the OP.

Shield Master:
Your mastery of the shield allows you to fight with it without hindrance.

Prerequisites: Improved Shield Bash, Shield Proficiency, Shield Slam, Two-Weapon Fighting, base attack bonus +11.

Benefit: You do not suffer any penalties on attack rolls made with a shield while you are wielding another weapon. Add your shield’s enhancement bonus to attack and damage rolls made with the shield as if it were a weapon enhancement bonus.

You are indeed correct. You suffer no attack roll penalties for attacking with your shield while wielding another weapon, regardless of what hand your weapon and shield are in. If you spend money to increase it's armor enchantment to +3 for +3AC, this combat feat will allow you to use that +3 Armor enchantment to increase it's to hit and damage.

However...

You will still need to make sure you have improved shield bash to not lose your shields AC bonus while attacking with it. Shield Master also only applies your shields enchantment value to hit and damage, but does nothing else to make the armor enchantment count towards it(such as counting the enchantment value towards upgrading the shield with a weapon enchantment).
I.E : If you wanted to get your shield to have flaming when you hit with it, you would still have to pay the cost to upgrade your shield into a +1 and another +1 for the flaming enchantment, paying the total cost of a +2 weapon enchantment. This is because you cannot place special abilities on items that are not at least +1, and you cannot place a weapon enchantment on magical armor.

Example:
The Cost Break down for a +3 light steel shield/+1 flaming light steel shield spike would be
light steel Shield: 9 gp
Master work shield: 150 gp
+3 AC enchantment: 9,000 gp
Shield Spike: 10 gp
Master work Shield Spike: 300 gp
+1 Spike enchantment: 2,000 gp
+1 Flaming Enchantment: 6,000 gp(Total weapon enchantment price of 8,000 gp)

Magical armor Value: 9,159 gp
Magical weapon Value: 8,310 gp
Total Value: 17,469 gp

With the shield master feat, you will get +3 to hit and damage(even though the weapon enchantment is only +1) +1d6 fire+STAT/MISC.


Oozes are immune to mind-effecting things and are also immune to any attack that requires the ooze to see you as they are blind. If you found a daze attack that passes both those criterias, have at that slimeball!

Edit: Oozes are also immune to stun though. I can't quite remember where it is, but I'm fairly certain it's in the rules or FAQd somewhere where if you have immunity to a greater effect, you are also immune to it's lessers. That's why if you do something that removes exhaustion on something that is only fatigued, it works, for example.


Important to note if it ever comes up, you are considered your own ally for effects that say "Targets Allies". So if the spell ever says Target: 1 willing ally, feel free to get down with yourself on that battlefield.


Shield Spikes:
Benefit: These spikes turn a shield into a martial piercing weapon and increase the damage dealt by a shield bash as if the shield were designed for a creature one size category larger than you (see “spiked shields” on Table: Weapons). You can't put spikes on a buckler or a tower shield. Otherwise, attacking with a spiked shield is like making a shield bash attack.

An enhancement bonus on a spiked shield does not improve the effectiveness of a shield bash made with it, but a spiked shield can be made into a magic weapon in its own right.

That being said, I don't believe there is a way to make a heavy shield into a light. Maybe Mitheril? You'd have to look at the material specifically. I'm not sure how special material shields work either.

Do keep in mind that if you want to use a shield as an offensive weapon, you have to enchant it as a weapon to get any benefits to attack and vice versa for defense. I.E. To get a +1 to ac and hit/damage shield you would need to spend the gold to increase the shield(armor enchantment) by one and also spend the gold to increase the shield's spike(Weapon enchantment)by one.


Hey all. I had an interesting idea and wanted to see if it is viable and works. My Paladin character usually uses a greatsword so he can use LoH on himself and others. However, it's gotten to the point where I need more AC. I decided to ditch the greatsword, and now my paladin has a long sword, spiked small shield(So I can still use LoH), and armor spikes. According to the rules, I can bash with my spiked shield as a martial weapon, but I lose it's AC bonus for the time being. I can also use my armor spikes as a light weapon, off-handed or main-handed. If I took the two-weapon fighting feat, making my penalties for "dual-wielding" -2/-2, can I smite evil an enemy target, then attack him dual-wielding my main-hand longsword and light weapon off-hand armor spikes while still retaining my light shield's AC bonus?


AFAIK, this is a Paladin only spell. Then again, I've never played a Samsaran Oracle/Cleric/Shaman. Special conditions baring, only Paladins will ever get access to it.

As far as Paladin spells go, there's a TON of them that are worded a little strangely. Some use words that could mean one thing or another, some have flavor text that don't make sense at all, some seem hard to imagine being anything but personal but instead of target personal it's target creature, etc.

The main reason for me of why this spell isn't so great is, not because it's a third level spell, but because it's a third level spell for a class that gets their spells at a caster level of -3. At level 10-11, your basic attacks and general purpose buffs will do more on average than this spell will ever do. The Main thing about this spell I believe is the long duration of the sickened effect. Again though, a little bit more bang for your buck as a level 3 spell would be nice.

Edit: I was actually playing a session with some adventure captains that came to our pfs game one time. One of them actually had to stop playing and have the other one fill in for them because they had no idea paladin's had such first level spells and "those spells are over powered". I get the feeling that the Paladin spell list isn't a very widely discussed topic.


Some good thoughts going for and against. Our DM ruled it as it did damage, but not sickened. And yeah, as far as third level paladins spells go, this one is one of the more lack-lustered.

@ShroudB. This is true, though..a normal paladin(baring bonus spells) at the same level could just use his aura of justice and give said commoners, albiet it in a 10 foot burst range(or 20 foot range now thanks to the level 2 spells that doubles a paladin's aura range) smite evil using his bonuses(using 2 out of his 4 per day.) The smite only works against one target sure, and they have to be evil, but that generally lasts longer than a single round and gives you the whole nice package of attack, ac, damage, and bypassing all DR in the universe.


Holy Whisper:
School evocation [good]; Level paladin 3
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S
Range 30 ft.
Area cone-shaped burst
Duration instantaneous
Saving Throw Fortitude negates; see text; Spell Resistance yes
You whisper a single word in the primordial language of good that is anathema to the minions of evil and strengthens the resolve of good creatures. Evil creatures within the burst must make a Fortitude saving throw or become sickened for 1 round/level. Evil outsiders with the evil subtype, evil-aligned dragons, and undead in the burst also take 2d8 points of damage if they fail their saves. Good-aligned creatures in the burst gain a +2 sacred bonus on attack and damage rolls for 1 round.

Emphasis mine. Due to the word usage of "also", does the immunity undead have to sickened apply here, or does the ancient primordial words of power overrule that immunity?

Edit: Err, wait, do undead have immunity to sickened?


Draco hit the nail on the head in a manner of speaking. A Paladin must not only avoid doing evil actions, but he must also be weary in the way that he goes about doing the deed.

As a general rule of thumb, if you must justify your action so Mr.average Joe over there can agree with you, it probably wasn't a very paladin like one to begin with.


A paladin's actions to him, never justify the end. There is no "Doing evil for the greater good." A Paladin must try not do evil, even in it's smaller form, even if no other alternative route is available to them.

That being said, the helmet in question puts a curse on the victim. It also has a will save DC so the change is usually against the victims choice. There's nothing in the item or a paladin's code that says "This is evil".

But ask yourself, in the long line of history of all the paladins you know, how many successful ones forced their belief onto others with a magical item instead of changing their minds through hard work? How many stories of Paladins do you remember hearing where they overcame their adversary using the "honorable" tool of a curse?


Divine Transfer:
School necromancy; Level paladin 3
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S
Range touch
Target living creature touched
Duration instantaneous + 1 round/level (see text)
Saving Throw Fortitude negates (harmless); Spell Resistance yes (harmless)
With a single touch, you transfer some of your life essence to the subject, transferring your hit points and your resolve. When you touch the subject you can transfer up to a number of hit points equal to your Constitution score to the target. These hit points heal the subject, but cannot raise the subject's hit points higher than its normal hit point total. In addition, the subject gains DR/evil equal to your Charisma bonus (if any) for the duration of the spell.

It sounds like this spell was meant to be cast upon an ally, but unlike other spells the target doesn't specifically say "living creature other than the user." Can you cast this spell on yourself?

Edit: I was looking more into paladin spells. There are some such as Sanctify Armor, that's worded as a personal spell, but the target simply says armor touched, regardless of who's armor it is. There's a confusing difference on paladin spells that are RAW or RAI. I feel like I should take the spell description into consideration..but then I find myself second guessing me when I think about everything else in Pathfinder where you aren't necessarily suppose to take its description word for word.


1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.

If I was a Paladin, and I had the Aegis of recovery Item, Determination on my armor, and Hero's Defiance prepped, would all three of them activate as soon as I hit 0 hp for a "Super revive"?

If I died how would the other 2 heals work in combination with the Breath of life?

Edit: Can I choose to not activate any of these and save them for another revival?

Edit 2: If I were to get determination on a suit of armor and a shield, would they both work together?


Do be careful with how things are worded too. Just because one thing is immune to mind-affecting, doesn't mean it can automatically see through your own mirror imaged spell. The spell is affecting you after all, not it(I mean, it IS effecting it's chance to hit you, but it's a buff for you, not a debuff against it.)


Oh, I just remembered a fun little tip a DM told me once. If you could equate it to disarming a bomb, they cannot take a 10. If it's less stressful than a bomb, then they can. =D


What was the original argument again? That you couldn't hold a potion inside the wrist sheath? I kind of find this argument to be silly. Not because it obviously would or wouldn't work, but basically all the spring loaded sheath does compared to the normal sheath is making the one item in question drawn as a swift action rather than a move. It will still take a standard to drink the potion, and it'll still provoke as normal. You also can't grab or use the potion in that hand unless it's free. No weapons, no larger shields, etc. This really isn't game breaking in the least and to use it for a potion at the ready you're giving up a hand/weapon slot.


Orfamay Quest wrote:
SwiftyKun wrote:
Taking a 10, or 20, requires more time than usual. You're not under any stress, but you take your time to make sure you don't mess up.

Taking 10 requires no more time than a normal check.

You are correct. I just looked and it doesn't say it takes anymore time than usual. The "relaxing comfortable work area" still applies.

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