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Is this new? (Not that I'm complaining, of course; this is as it should be.)
You must inform the GM that you plan to use additional resource material before play begins and allow the GM to use your material to familiarize herself with any new material.
That shifts the onus back onto the player somewhat, but I foresee it potentially becoming an issue at loud, crowded conventions where time is a premium, and a GM is trying to keep things moving.
Now a GM has to read through *every* item that may be 'new/different' for a given player, with six potential players at the table... that could take a bunch of time...
Unless 'allow', in this case, is 'have available *IF* GM wants/needs to read' versus 'MUST PRESENT ALL MATERIAL to GM'?
Owner - D20 Hobbies
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This, like a great many lines in the guides, are for special needs/cases of the play groups in need of these requirements.
Put another way, if the GM has an issue with a problem player and would prefer to appeal to leadership "rules" to solve the issue, the guides give them the rules.
This rule is great for the player (an actual player I've had) that would have a wyroot sword. I'd tell him isn't on additional resources. He'd change it to normal. A month later I'd tell him the same. This allows a GM to get all these repetitive issues out of the way at the start of a game, and if the player complains about he/she being unfairly targeted, the GM can point to the guide.
Well, at least I think that type of scenario is why. I just know I'm over 170 played games I've never seen a GM use this type of checking. I have seen players tell me or the GM "so I have some obscure stuff" and it's usual handled well.
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The first time someone comes in with something illegal, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. They change it, and we game on.
The second time, they can no longer claim ignorance. They are cheating, and I will be more than happy to report them as such, to be "prosecuted" (so to speak) to the fullest extent of PFS rules.
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I just re-read this thread... Core Campaign is looking more and more interesting. Just need to get more players to play in around here...
Standard game ... 5 minutes per player to "inform the GM that" the player "plan to use additional resource material before play begins and allow the GM to ... to familiarize herself with any new material" times 6 players = 30 minutes game time before the briefing.
Core game... 30 more minutes game time to play.
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The first time someone comes in with something illegal, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. They change it, and we game on.
The second time, they can no longer claim ignorance. They are cheating, and I will be more than happy to report them as such, to be "prosecuted" (so to speak) to the fullest extent of PFS rules.
The fun one is when the player is getting "corrected" by two different judges at different times... We can assume that one of them (the judges) is wrong, but not always... maybe the "rule" is not real clear, or maybe it changed, or ... so many different things.
...
Which type of person do we (as judges) assume the player is? Perhaps we should take a minute and review the other side.
(more good thoughts, cut for space)
If there's room for alternate interpretations, I really do try to be flexible.
When a lawful good aasimar tetori rolls up to my table with a religion trait tied to Ydersius, though, there's not a lot of room for alternate interpretations. Especially since the "source" he tried to use was d20pfsrd (which scrubs religion data) and he "left his copy of Inner Sea Gods at home".
In this case, benefit of the doubt was all that let him stay at my table.
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I tried to use my Wand of Infernal Healing on the Eidolon... Didn't work. Sorry man.?
Ok, I'll bite. Why didn't it work?Some people believe that because Eidolons don't heal naturally that they cannot benefit from fast healing.
I am not one of them.
Ah! thank you.
Interesting... I'll have to watch for it.(thought it might have been a Good or Silver weapon wound, or something like that)
edit: "Fast Healing: A bloody skeleton has fast healing equal to 1 per 2 Hit Dice it possesses (minimum 1)."
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If there's room for alternate interpretations, I really do try to be flexible.
When a lawful good aasimar tetori rolls up to my table with a religion trait tied to Ydersius, though, there's not a lot of room for alternate interpretations. Especially since the "source" he tried to use was d20pfsrd (which scrubs religion data) and he "left his copy of Inner Sea Gods at home".
In this case, benefit of the doubt was all that let him stay at my table.
Technically that is permitted, deserving of a "I'm not angry, I'm just disappointed" conversation, but still permitted...
Contributor
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Technically that is permitted, deserving of a "I'm not angry, I'm just disappointed" conversation, but still permitted...
If there's room for alternate interpretations, I really do try to be flexible.
When a lawful good aasimar tetori rolls up to my table with a religion trait tied to Ydersius, though, there's not a lot of room for alternate interpretations. Especially since the "source" he tried to use was d20pfsrd (which scrubs religion data) and he "left his copy of Inner Sea Gods at home".
In this case, benefit of the doubt was all that let him stay at my table.
???
Worship: In this context, worship refers to a
relationship held between a PC and a deity where the
PC, in exchange for his dedicated worship, gains a
mechanical benefit (e.g. a cleric’s spells and abilities, a
deity-specific feat or trait, special functions of magical
weapons, or prerequisites for a prestige class). PCs may
only worship one campaign-legal deity and must always
be within one step of their chosen deity’s alignment. See
page 24 for more rules on worshiping a deity and how to
change the deity a PC worships.
A chaotic evil deity is a little ways from lawful good. But just a little.
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Your only option is to shackle them in chains and auction them off to the highest bidder.I believe that would require a Profession (Slaver) check and we can't roll those anymore. Profession (Kidnapper), on the other hand... so ransom them off to the highest bidder.
You can roll Profession (Slaver).
Just not for a day job.|
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You can roll Profession (Slaver).
Just not for a day job.
Good to know. I didn't think we were allowed to have ranks in Profession (Slaver) anymore... and it's a trained-only skill; I'll have to go back and parse John Compton's ruling more closely. Thanks.
EDIT: I believe my original reading of John Compton's ruling was correct; players cannot take ranks in Profession (Slaver).
Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Martinsville
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I tried to use my Wand of Infernal Healing on the Eidolon... Didn't work. Sorry man.?
Ok, I'll bite. Why didn't it work?Some people believe that because Eidolons don't heal naturally that they cannot benefit from fast healing.
I am not one of them.
Eh, to each their own. The evolution is a higher level ability and the Summoner does have Rejuvenate Eidolon. Cure spells still work as well as channeling and such.
Just can't add to something that isn't there, thats all.
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You can roll Profession (Slaver).
Just not for a day job.Good to know. I didn't think we were allowed to have ranks in Profession (Slaver) anymore... and it's a trained-only skill; I'll have to go back and parse John Compton's ruling more closely. Thanks.
EDIT: I believe my original reading of John Compton's ruling was correct; players cannot take ranks in Profession (Slaver).
Ah, you are correct. I thought they had left room for infiltrators to have Knowledge of slaving business practices, but I guess not.
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Ah, you are correct. I thought they had left room for infiltrators to have Knowledge of slaving business practices, but I guess not.
I had hoped they would have, but I understand and accept why they didn't. I have a Liberty's Edge character who used Profession (Slaver) to infiltrate and undermine slaving operations (know your enemies, right?), but no more.
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I tried to use my Wand of Infernal Healing on the Eidolon... Didn't work. Sorry man.?
Ok, I'll bite. Why didn't it work?Some people believe that because Eidolons don't heal naturally that they cannot benefit from fast healing.
I am not one of them.
Eh, to each their own. The evolution is a higher level ability and the Summoner does have Rejuvenate Eidolon. Cure spells still work as well as channeling and such.
Just can't add to something that isn't there, thats all.
As I've explained to you multiple times in person, of course you can. Because magic. Do eidolons have a natural enhancment bonus to their ability scores? No. But Bull's Strength (and other spells) can give it to them. Long story short, the spell says it works so it does.
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I tried to use my Wand of Infernal Healing on the Eidolon... Didn't work. Sorry man.?
Ok, I'll bite. Why didn't it work?Some people believe that because Eidolons don't heal naturally that they cannot benefit from fast healing.
I am not one of them.
Eh, to each their own. The evolution is a higher level ability and the Summoner does have Rejuvenate Eidolon. Cure spells still work as well as channeling and such.
Just can't add to something that isn't there, thats all.
How would you feel about using the spell Infernal Healing on undead? They don't heal naturally, so by your ruling on the spell and Eidolons ("...don't heal naturally that they cannot benefit from fast healing..."), Undead could not benefit from the Fast Healing granted by the spell. But ... don't some Undead have "fast healing"?
"Fast Healing: A bloody skeleton has fast healing equal to 1 per 2 Hit Dice it possesses (minimum 1)."
Does this mean that you would rule that a bloody skeleton doesn't actually heal damage?
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Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Martinsville
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Having the ability from another source, such as a higher level evolution, or from an ability that gives the target the effect, is not the same as the spells augmenting the particular for a short time.
The Bloody Skeleton, in particular, has that ability which overrides the Undead Traits.
Using Cure Light Wounds on it will still damage it...
I tried to use my Wand of Infernal Healing on the Eidolon... Didn't work. Sorry man.?
Ok, I'll bite. Why didn't it work?Some people believe that because Eidolons don't heal naturally that they cannot benefit from fast healing.
I am not one of them.
Eh, to each their own. The evolution is a higher level ability and the Summoner does have Rejuvenate Eidolon. Cure spells still work as well as channeling and such.
Just can't add to something that isn't there, thats all.
How would you feel about using the spell Infernal Healing on undead? They don't heal naturally, so by your ruling on the spell and Eidolons ("...don't heal naturally that they cannot benefit from fast healing..."), Undead could not benefit from the Fast Healing granted by the spell. But ... don't some Undead have "fast healing"?
"Fast Healing: A bloody skeleton has fast healing equal to 1 per 2 Hit Dice it possesses (minimum 1)."
Does this mean that you would rule that a bloody skeleton doesn't actually heal damage?
Casting Infernal Healing now comes with it's own problems for non-evil casters.
Casting Infernal Healing now comes with it's own problems for non-evil casters.What did I miss?
As per the new rules, casting it three times moves you one step towards evil.
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Contributor
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Which rule did that?As per the new rules, casting it three times moves you one step towards evil.Casting Infernal Healing now comes with it's own problems for non-evil casters.What did I miss?
She's referring to a sidebar on page 110 of Horror Adventures. It's a bit more nuanced than that, but the general point is accurate.
I'm waiting on an official statement from Leadership before I enforce it. There are arguments for both sides - I'm surprised we haven't gotten a five-page thread about it locked yet. (Still time, though.)
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Which rule did that?As per the new rules, casting it three times moves you one step towards evil.Casting Infernal Healing now comes with it's own problems for non-evil casters.What did I miss?
I am curious as well.
Would be nice to finally see some concrete resolution on this.
EDIT: 9 second ninja >.<
Ever? On the same target? in a day? Week? Month? Per session?
Seems a bit extreme.
As I read it... three times TOTAL in your career.
I see it as quite justified... as it is the spell is simply TOO GOOD not to use in between combats, and there hasn't been any reason for non-evil arcane casters to hang back from using it. I do think however that in exchange Celestial Healing should be changed so that instead of curing one hit point per 2 levels, it should cure one hit point per two rounds on a fixed total spell duration of 10 rounds. I don't think that using that spell should move you towards Good though.
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Which rule did that?
This section includes a large number of evil spells. Casting an evil spell is an evil act, but for most characters simply casting such a spell once isn’t enough to change her alignment; this only occurs if the spell is used for a truly abhorrent act, or if the caster established a pattern of casting evil spells over a long period. A wizard who uses animate dead to create guardians for defenseless people won’t turn evil, but he will if he does it over and over again. The GM decides whether the character’s alignment changes, but typically casting two evil spells is enough to turn a good creature nongood, and three or more evils spells move the caster from nongood to evil. The greater the amount of time between castings, the less likely alignment will change. Some spells require sacrificing a sentient creature, a major evil act that makes the caster evil in almost every circumstance.
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Thanks!
Don't we have a specific post from leadership saying that in PFS casting an evil spell is not considered an evil act for purposes of alignment change? I would think that for the moment that would override this rule.
That change wouldn't particularly bother me, I just wouldn't try to enforce it until leadership specifically changes their earlier guidance.
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Umm.... I'm going to make a new thread so this humorous one isn't lost...In that spirit...it's totally legal to hand your wand of Infernal Healing to an annoying character so that they turn evil and leave the campaign, right?
That would solve the problem with the summoner in the first post! And I can still kill his eidolon because the eidolon isn't the PC!
In that spirit...it's totally legal to hand your wand of Infernal Healing to an annoying character so that they turn evil and leave the campaign, right?
Conversely, if my Paladin gets the Big Evil Puppy Cannibal to cast Protection from Evil a few times, I should be able to make deals with him without falling, right?
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Without spoiling anything, i once played an series of online modules, where at one point, our Alchemist was having to try to kill our friendly Zen Archer. The kicker here, was that death was as much better outcome for our ally, then what would have happened if he wasn't killed.
The situation was stressful and bloody messy. PvP was mutually agreed upon by both Zen Archer and Alchemist, and the GM allowed it after concidering it to be a creative solution to what would have been an unrecovorable outcome. That was an... interesting day.
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Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Martinsville
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Which rule did that?This section includes a large number of evil spells. Casting an evil spell is an evil act, but for most characters simply casting such a spell once isn’t enough to change her alignment; this only occurs if the spell is used for a truly abhorrent act, or if the caster established a pattern of casting evil spells over a long period. A wizard who uses animate dead to create guardians for defenseless people won’t turn evil, but he will if he does it over and over again. The GM decides whether the character’s alignment changes, but typically casting two evil spells is enough to turn a good creature nongood, and three or more evils spells move the caster from nongood to evil. The greater the amount of time between castings, the less likely alignment will change. Some spells require sacrificing a sentient creature, a major evil act that makes the caster evil in almost every circumstance.
OK.
Is Infernal Healing considered an Evil Spell, or just one that has Evil tendencies?
Basically, I ask because, well, one, it's funny, but overall the only real effect is the target being seen as evil for a short amount of time (Gaining Fast Healing at that time*).