A lot of adventure paths deal mainly with a good vs evil type of plot, I would like to see an AP dealing with Axis and the Malestrom with the PCs being forces of Law trying to prevent a Protean Lord from trying to perform a grand unmaking or something similar.
Anyone have other thoughts on a Law vs Chaos Adventure Path?
Personally, I would rather see the PCs represent the forces of balance as Law and Chaos go to war, or at least a powerful member of each.
I wonder how hard it would be to modify Hell's Vengeance to qualify: Victory of the Glorious Reclamation will unwittingly unleash Chaotic Evil equivalent to a second Worldwound, so they have to be stopped.
Or Kingmaker's "tame the wilderness" mandate if you prefer to be on the side of law...
Hell's Rebels is a law vs chaos AP.Well, Hell's Rebels is a chaotic good vs. lawful evil AP. The good vs. evil domain is pretty important.
Hey, I supported the violence, too. I mean, the rebellion. Something about mints? Let's kill people already. Freedom!
Or Kingmaker's "tame the wilderness" mandate if you prefer to be on the side of law...
Yea, Kingmaker is definitely a Law vs Chaos AP. Adventure 1, I made all of the Staglord's men be CN and it was no different whatsoever. You are bringing law to the untamed chaos.
I'd love to see a Maelstrom based planar AP. :)
Is something have been thinking about to work on. Need near alien CN adversaries.
They are doing the world Ill, but not intentionally. Just their very nature is bad
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Hey, I supported the violence, too. I mean, the rebellion. Something about mints? Let's kill people already. Freedom!Hell's Rebels is a law vs chaos AP.Well, Hell's Rebels is a chaotic good vs. lawful evil AP. The good vs. evil domain is pretty important.
I'm sure worshippers of Sarenrae feel the same way, except more with the saving from oppression than the slaughter.
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I'm sure worshippers of Sarenrae feel the same way, except more with the saving from oppression than the slaughter.Hey, I supported the violence, too. I mean, the rebellion. Something about mints? Let's kill people already. Freedom!Hell's Rebels is a law vs chaos AP.Well, Hell's Rebels is a chaotic good vs. lawful evil AP. The good vs. evil domain is pretty important.
Since when do Sarenites care about saving anyone from oppression? That's more Caydenites' or Milanites' bag. If anything, the goddess who teaches "temperance and patience in all things" would be for reform over revolution.
Then again, Sarenrae's faith is all but purged in the Night of Ashes, so speculation about their feelings is a bit moot.
Reading the title all i can think of is the Law and Order sound. Chung Chung!
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I wonder how hard it would be to modify Hell's Vengeance to qualify: Victory of the Glorious Reclamation will unwittingly unleash Chaotic Evil equivalent to a second Worldwound, so they have to be stopped.
OK, here's a go:
Whoever Thrune back in the day came into the possession of a SHARD OF ROVAGUG THINGY.
The THINGY is part of the reason that Asmodeus signed the deal to give Thrune the Hellfire Compact. It is currently (work out something from below):
a) being held by the Hellknight Order of the Rack, which is under siege at the beginning of Book 6;
b) somewhere in Westcrown, where the forces of the Glorious Reclamation might find it and destroy it;
c) requires the fealty of the rulers of several points in Cheliax every few years... if the Glorious Reclamation can hold territory in Cheliax, the THINGY's upkeep cannot be met;
IF the THINGY is tampered with, destroyed, or failed to be appeased, the resting SPAWN OF ROVAGUG known as ONIBABA will emerge from its slumber beneath the Menador Mountains and lay waste to Avistan.
You could have the Law vs. Chaos AP be the long awaited Galt AP everyone's been clamoring for.
It is difficult to make a Law vs. Chaos AP, because Law and Chaos are not meaningfully different in DnD. It is not even Blue vs. Orange difference, Lawful ("honor, trustworthiness, obedience to authority, and reliability") and Chaotic ("freedom, adaptability, and flexibility") traits are not mutually exclusive at all and it is not clear why exactly Lawful and Chaotic entities would ever be in a pitched conflict, unless one or both are also evil.
That's what happens when you mindlessly copy an axis of cosmic forces that were nothing more than an attempt to make stand-ins for Good and Evil while being too pretentious to say that your book is about Good vs. Evil, and place it in the game which already has Good/Evil axis.
I see this as a really difficult concept to build a whole AP on. Yes, it's true that SOME groups like to have Evil characters in them... However, I think it's safe to say that between PFS and general advice threads, 'most' players chose 'non-evil' characters.
The 'Good' vs 'Evil' is a fairly safe bet when designing a game that will appeal to greatest majority of players... Players who are also subscribers. I know a few people who dropped the subscriptions when the 'Evil AP' was announced... Now look at the other Axis.
Monks HAVE to be Lawful, Druids are Neutral, Barbarians Chaotic... All fairly Core concepts.
To build something That is based on Law vs Chaos... There will (in most groups) be unavoidable friction. LG, N, CG, Can all get along just fine when there's 'the greater evil' that they need to fight. But building it on some kind of civil war where Half the group would want to side with Law and Half the group with Chaos?? Without a Good/Evil tiebreaker?
That would be a REALLY hard plot to write for 'the majority' of subscribers. I mean... It would really have to be written from both sides to do it justice so the pcs could go either way...
Now something on a smaller scale of a module, or something like Dragons Demand? That could have some potential... but a full AP? That doesn't seem very ideal.
Creative Director
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Hell's Rebels is essentially a Law vs. Chaos AP.
Although I prefer to think of it as a Chaos vs. Law AP, because Lawful is Awful. HA!
EDIT: Adding a :-) to let the internet know the "lawful = awful" comment is intended to be a joke and not to be taken as "The Creative Director hates paladins and dwarves BURN IT ALL DOWN!"
But really. Paladins and dwarves are kinda awful.
ELVES 4EVER.
And demons too.
On a more serious note, I could very much see us do another AP at some point that even further goes down the law vs chaos theme (from either side). We've done an evil AP, after all, and plenty of good APs. Those limit character options in the same way a law vs. chaos one would limit things. One of the benefits of having done 20 some Adventure Paths is that we CAN afford to get experimental and explore things like this without significant fear of the game crashing and burning, especially since the rate at which we publish these things typically outpaces most groups' capacity to play them.
The Shin Megami Games have definitely sold me on Chaos v Law (or Order) working mechanically as an ideal thing.
Our current Reign of Winter game takes this and uses it a lot, and I think its a good contender for Chaos v Law if you want to adapt one until an official CvL Campaign comes out.
We have a Cleric of Milani and a Witch of Irrisen and both are butting heads regarding ideals. One wants freedom from the oppression no matter the cost (even if it causes instability and a lack of a structure to produce food, defend against the other races nearby, etc) and the other takes a firm support of stability and the lack of death, protection and resources under this rule.
I'm enjoying it even if we've had to do a couple of modifications to the AP to make it more related to the kingdom and nation of Irrisen.
Or just adapt the Blood War.
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The Shin Megami Games have definitely sold me on Chaos v Law (or Order) working mechanically as an ideal thing.
Our current Reign of Winter game takes this and uses it a lot, and I think its a good contender for Chaos v Law if you want to adapt one until an official CvL Campaign comes out.
** spoiler omitted **
Or just adapt the Blood War.
eh. the Blood War has nothing on the MARCH OF THE MODRONS!
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ELVES 4EVER.
What an odd thing to say. The last product I've seen that featured elves came out over a year ago (yes, I bought it, no filthy pirate I). Am I looking in the wrong place?
** spoiler omitted **
< Lack of death;
< Streets literally paved with the bones of our victims.Yeah, you keep telling yourself that, lady :P
true law vs. chaos AP would have to be planar
ELVES 4EVER.What an odd thing to say. The last product I've seen that featured elves came out over a year ago (yes, I bought it, no filthy pirate I). Am I looking in the wrong place?
** spoiler omitted **< Lack of death;
< Streets literally paved with the bones of our victims.Yeah, you keep telling yourself that, lady :P
What nation isn't paved with the sacrifices of allies and the blood of enemies?