As the title says, which AP's have you found to be the most difficult and which have you found to be the easiest?
I've never finished an AP but in my experience the first half of Rise of the Runelords can be pretty easy, the first book of Giant Slayers can be devastating to a party if run as it is in the book, and mummys mask I've only been to one session on the first book but i got to negative hp because of reckless behavior (wandering around without checking for traps)
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It depends on if we include the APs from Dungeon mag as well. If we do, Age of Worms is an absolute meat grinder. Savage Tide is no picnic, either.
Varies book by book, and definitely if the DM runs them as written or not.
We've had a lot of deaths in Skull & Shackles. Less deaths in Kingmaker. Also, I think my GM fudges rolls when we are really getting out butts kicked, so we probably should have had some TPKs.
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Mostly, it will depend on the party composition, player skill/system mastery, and character generation method. Even then, it can depend on how well the characters' abilities stack up against the challenges: The AP can be easier (such as a party with a cleric (positive energy), inquisitor, and paladin in Carrion Crown) or harder (several characters with weak Will saves in Reign of Winter); it can also vary from encounter to encounter within an AP.
Generally speaking, APs are designed to be somewhat challenging for a party of four moderately optimized characters generated using 15-point buy. Also, because there is usually a wide range of encounters and other challenges (ranged vs. melee, terrain features, skill checks, etc.), APs somewhat discourage over-specialized PCs ("one-trick-ponies"); characters "built" for only one thing will find themselves marginalized in several instances.
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Generally speaking, APs are designed to be somewhat challenging for a party of four moderately optimized characters generated using 15-point buy. Also, because there is usually a wide range of encounters and other challenges (ranged vs. melee, terrain features, skill checks, etc.), APs somewhat discourage over-specialized PCs ("one-trick-ponies"); characters "built" for only one thing will find themselves marginalized in several instances.
Yeah, Serpent's Skull can get kinda brutal at times for a sorc who specializes in fire spells or a lowish level (pre-7) pyrokinetic. When you keep running into things that are highly resistant or immune to the damage type you deal... Ouch.
From my experience King Maker run as is was pretty easy. Age of Worms on the other hand can be pretty rough at times. PC's better put their big boy pants on ;)
It all depends on what the DM does with it. There is all the difference in the world between a DM who uses clever tactics and one who... doesn't. Many DMs will "spice things up" or even radically beef up adversaries across the board, either because:
- he thinks the AP is too easy,
- he thinks his group of PCs are far more optimised than standard,
- he thinks a larger group of PCs requires additional opponents, or
- he thinks it's more fun to play on the edge of death.
I'm currently playing in Jade Regent, and the DM is coddling us, probably because most of the players are clueless newbs. Nice guys, but uninterested in learning how their characters' powers and abilities work.
Re: Age of Worms
One of the key examples of how party composition affects challenge level. If the party (3.5) doesn't have a cleric (or two!) focused on turn undead (Sun domain, good Cha; possibly going into a PrC like radiant servant of Pelor and/or sacred exorcist), they will have a much more difficult time.
APs that I have either run or played in.
Kingmaker - Almost TPK at the end of the 3rd(?) book, so we went on to something else.
Shattered Star - Finished. No deaths.
Serpent Skull - Finished. I had three of my characters die (played).
Legacy of Fire - Finished. No deaths.
Shackled City - Finished. One death.
Homebrew set in Forgotten Realms (1-18) - Finished. Two deaths.
Rise of the Runelords - Got thru 3rd book and group fell apart.
-- david
Mostly, it will depend on the party composition, player skill/system mastery, and character generation method. Even then, it can depend on how well the characters' abilities stack up against the challenges: The AP can be easier (such as a party with a cleric (positive energy), inquisitor, and paladin in Carrion Crown) or harder (several characters with weak Will saves in Reign of Winter); it can also vary from encounter to encounter within an AP.
Quite so. Just to bring up one example, when I GMed book three of Rise of the Runelords it was devastating to my party, because my dice were rolling very high while they fought lots of high-strength Ogres with x3 crit weapons, and folks were boosting other defenses over HP.
I haven't really found any of them to be all that difficult. Being the DM I constantly have to modify the adventures to give my players a challenge. We are playing Shattered Star right now with out a healer of any sort, so I'm wondering how that will work out. Almost to the end of the first module and not even close to any casualties yet. The later ones look a bit rougher, so we will see. Age of Worms was supposed to be bad, but I found it only moderately challenging.
Maybe Rise of Runelords etc. was more challenging when it came out. But with every rulebook, online guide and year of player experience PCs become stronger, while the old adventures stay the same.
Probably the APs could use a line 'If you want to make it harder...' for each encounter. I know it's additional effort, it could be compensated to removing one or two encounters.
APs that I have either run or played in.
Kingmaker - Almost TPK at the end of the 3rd(?) book, so we went on to something else.
Shattered Star - Finished. No deaths.
Serpent Skull - Finished. I had three of my characters die (played).
Legacy of Fire - Finished. No deaths.
Shackled City - Finished. One death.
Homebrew set in Forgotten Realms (1-18) - Finished. Two deaths.
Rise of the Runelords - Got thru 3rd book and group fell apart.-- david
You get to playe quite a bit! Feeling some jealousy...
APs I've actually played or run -
Kingmaker - most of the danger comes from the random encounter table, which can veer well above the ECL of anything encountered in the adventure.
Rise of the Runelords - generally not bad, though I could see fights in Book 3 being incredibly swingy because power attacking ogres.
Curse of the Crimson Throne - My PCs have having a pretty easy time of it so far, though we'll be going into Scarwall once that game resumes from its hiatus.
Carrion Crown - Gloriously mean. And easily lethal. This might be the hardest Pathfinder AP. (As opposed to the Dungeon-era 3.5 APs.)
Serpent's Skull - can actually be pretty vicious. SPIDERCROC will live on in our games in infamy.
Reign of Winter - Mean but not necessarily lethal.
Jade Regent - generally not that hard, but about half the deaths in the obituary thread can be summed up as "an oni confirmed a critical."
You get to play quite a bit! Feeling some jealousy...APs that I have either run or played in.
Kingmaker - Almost TPK at the end of the 3rd(?) book, so we went on to something else.
Shattered Star - Finished. No deaths.
Serpent Skull - Finished. I had three of my characters die (played).
Legacy of Fire - Finished. No deaths.
Shackled City - Finished. One death.
Homebrew set in Forgotten Realms (1-18) - Finished. Two deaths.
Rise of the Runelords - Got thru 3rd book and group fell apart.-- david
Heh. Only played one (Serpent Skull). Was the DM for the others.
-- david
Rise of the Runelords - generally not bad, though I could see fights in Book 3 being incredibly swingy because power attacking ogres.
Really, it's a common issue whenever lots of giants show up. They hit hard at baseline due to high strength, usually carry two-handed weapons, and most of them have power attack. If you run into one like a Frost Giant who swings an x3 critical weapon, a crit could drop even a level-appropriate frontliner. For reference, a CR 9 Power Attacking Frost Giant does 9d6+66 damage (avg 97.5 damage) on a crit.