So I have this character with both extremely high strength and intelligence scores. (18 STR, 18 INT).
I want my character make use of the Bruising Intellect trait and Intimidating Prowess feat in order to make a Intimidate/Demoralize build.
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Magus or alchemist would probably benefit the most from those scores, and I don't see why either wouldn't be able to do what you're looking for.
A Magus uses intelligence to cast, and can use strength to hit and hurt (I know a lot of people say the dex based dancer magus is better, but strength is still a lot of fun).
I can't think of a class that makes amazing using of that, though an alchemist is probably a decent choice.
You can use extracts to really pump your strength and could got beastmorph to have a lot of attacks that will deal a lot of damage.
Throw in power attack, cornugon smash, hurtful, and the Cruel enchant on an Amulet of Mighty Fists and you will be sending enemies to pain town.
Magus and Alchemist have already been mentioned. Investigator also has a lot of potential, for most of the same reasons as alchemist.
Well, by far the best class (or just one-level dip) for an Intimidate build is the Thug Rogue. Because making someone Frightened is just so much better than making them Shaken.
Possible build:
Unchained Rogue (Thug, Scout, Bruiser)
1: Sap Adept, Enforcer
2: Intimidating Prowess (rogue talent -> Strong Impression)
3: Two-Weapon Fighting, Power Attack
4: Weapon Focus (sap) (rogue talent -> Weapon Training)
5: Sap Master
6: rogue talent
7: Dazzling Display
8: Shatter Defenses (rogue talent -> Combat Trick)
9: Hurtful
10: advanced rogue talent
11: Skill Focus (intimidate), Furious Focus
However, that doesn't make much use of the high Int, besides being super-duper skilled. As others suggested, you could go Magus or Investigator and just do a one-level dip into Thug.
Investigator (use a long spear, prepare size and strength buffing extracts)
So I have this character with both extremely high strength and intelligence scores. (18 STR, 18 INT).
I want my character make use of the Bruising Intellect trait and Intimidating Prowess feat in order to make a Intimidate/Demoralize build.
Occultist. Armored int caster with martial weapon proficiencies.
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So I have this character with both extremely high strength and intelligence scores. (18 STR, 18 INT).
I want my character make use of the Bruising Intellect trait and Intimidating Prowess feat in order to make a Intimidate/Demoralize build.
A magus would probably do the Best. They can really stack the De-buffs more than just Demoralize. Back before Slashing Grace was Nerfed I used a Whip magus that used Enforcer + Cruel weapon and Stacked so many Debuffs the Enemy just Couldn't function anymore. All from the safety of reach. I also Used the True Strike + Trip, Disarm, and Steal to impose more penalties. A Fighter with lot of feats dedicated to a weapon has a hard time fighting when you take his Great sword from him.
But since slashing Grace nerf I have put him on the shelf...I feel as if when it got nerfed it really limited a Magus on the types of combat they do.
I only mention this because you too can do it with a STR build. But I got hosed cause I was built for dex and couldn't redistribute any points, gear and such. But if you build from Level 1 you can accomplish very similar.
If 3pp is ok the Battlescion is an option.
investigator, magus and Occultist are the ones that come to mind that fight and make use of int.
investigator, magus and Occultist are the ones that come to mind that fight and make use of int.
Re Occultist: Archetype Battle Host...
Frostbite/enforcer magus right?
Thats pretty much exactly what he's looking for. Strength to hit with a sword charged with frostbite to do subdual damage and get a free intimdate check? Rime spell to add entangle?
Basically any melee character that uses Int as a "casting" stat or for most class features.
So for sure Magus, Alchemist, Investigator, Occultist, but there might be other options with feats, archetypes and prestige classes (for example the Duelist adds Int to AC as a Dodge bonus, or Artful Dodge allows you to use Int for fulfill TWF requirements and go for STR in damage and hit)
The Inspired Blade is another good choice, since it uses Int, and (like all swashbucklers) can demoralize as a swift action.
Slayer debuff (and insta-kill) DCs are based off Int as well.
Basically any melee character that uses Int as a "casting" stat or for most class features.
So for sure Magus, Alchemist, Investigator, Occultist, but there might be other options with feats, archetypes and prestige classes (for example the Duelist adds Int to AC as a Dodge bonus, or Artful Dodge allows you to use Int for fulfill TWF requirements and go for STR in damage and hit)
Honestly, with Artful Dodge's existence you could just go straight Fighter, picking archetypes that compliment intimidate builds. It's not terribly hard, and you can pick up a lot of nifty feats that normally go unused.
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Frostbite/enforcer magus right?
Thats pretty much exactly what he's looking for. Strength to hit with a sword charged with frostbite to do subdual damage and get a free intimdate check? Rime spell to add entangle?
Pretty much...Add in Riving strike for a -2 on top of Entangled, Shaken/frightened, and Fatigued.
Makes it so they have on them:
Can not run or Charge
–2 penalty to Strength
–6 penalty to Dexterity
–4 penalty on all attack rolls
–2 penalty on saving throws, skill checks, and ability checks.
–2 penalty on saving throws against spells and spell-like abilities
An entangled character who attempts to cast a spell must make a concentration check (DC 15 + spell level) or lose the spell.
If Frightened takes place this is Added: A frightened creature flees from the source of its fear as best it can.
If using a Cruel weapon this is added: –2 penalty on all attack rolls, weapon damage rolls, saving throws, skill checks, and ability checks.
Seems worth it to me LOL. Enjoy trying to hit anyone or Passing any saving throws. The -8 to CMD also allows you to use true strike to deliver Combat maneuvers with a extremely high success chance.
ftr(eldritch_guardian)/wiz(diviner/foresight)/eldritch_knight with (School Familiar: Divination) familiar archetype
What the eldritch_guardian will add to this build? I mean, Intimidate will be lost as class skill...
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Familiar gets to share your feats.
Yes, your familiar gets all your *Combat* feats... Intimidating Prowess is a Combat feat. And your familiar shares ALL your intimidate ranks. Etc. Etc. Etc. The fun is endless. Wiz_Div_Foresight level gives you an insane initiative. And School Familiar archetype for your familiar means you get to roll Initiative twice and pick the best one (you can use your familiar's initiative instead of yours, etc.) Plus your familiar gets a 0 level cantrip. Wizard and Ftr_eldritch_guardian levels stack for purposes improving the familiar. Eldritch Knight PrC lets you count its levels for the purposes of qualifying for Weapon Specialization (so you can have a decent martial guy with spells; however, if you don't care about spells, ditch Eldritch Knight and just go for Ftr_eldritch_guardian levels with just one level in Wiz_div_foresight...)
You can add back Intimidate as class skill via trait selection...
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Indirectly, the Lore Warden Fighter as well.
TWF Fighters using Artful Dodge to qualify for the necessary feats work, too.
Fighter. No, seriously: You need a 13 INT to get into the Combat Expertise feat chain, which has all kinds of cool stuff in it. You also need high Intelligence for skill ranks which give you lots to do outside of combat.
Dirty Fighting has replaced Combat Expertise for me for most builds.
Other than that, I recommend the Occultist. High INT isn't required (14 is enough for most things), but it's nice to have high. You're limited in spellcasting, but if you make the right choices (Occultist is perhaps the most fiddly class IMHO), you can make a beast. Grab Transmutation on level 1 and you'll be rocking a 20 in STR (possibly 22 if you put a racial bonus in it as well). I'm not a big fan of the Battle Host archetype, but others keep recommending it, so maybe I'm wrong.
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Fighter. No, seriously: You need a 13 INT to get into the Combat Expertise feat chain, which has all kinds of cool stuff in it. You also need high Intelligence for skill ranks which give you lots to do outside of combat.Dirty Fighting has replaced Combat Expertise for me for most builds.
Holy crap that's good!
Familiar gets to share your feats.
Can you point me to where this appears in the rules? I can't find it.
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Fighter. No, seriously: You need a 13 INT to get into the Combat Expertise feat chain, which has all kinds of cool stuff in it. You also need high Intelligence for skill ranks which give you lots to do outside of combat.
If you use Unchained and the Stamina Pool / Combat Tricks via the free Combat Stamina feat you no longer need INT 13 for Combat Expertise: (if you spend stamina points the feat actually becomes crazy good)
Combat Expertise (Combat): You can select this feat even if you don't meet the ability score prerequisite (Intelligence 13). You gain the benefit of this feat only as long as you have at least 1 stamina point in your stamina pool. If you spend stamina points to raise an attack roll using the Combat Stamina feat's benefits, ignore an amount of your Combat Expertise penalty equal to the number of stamina points you spent.
Fighter. No, seriously: You need a 13 INT to get into the Combat Expertise feat chain, which has all kinds of cool stuff in it. You also need high Intelligence for skill ranks which give you lots to do outside of combat.Dirty Fighting has replaced Combat Expertise for me for most builds.
That's only any good for combat maneuvers. Int 13 is needed for others, while Int 15+ is needed for like one feat and the TWF chain with Artful Dodge.
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Indirectly, the Lore Warden Fighter as well.TWF Fighters using Artful Dodge to qualify for the necessary feats work, too.
Yes, that's extremely good for the OP's build, as he can dump DEX and use INT to qualify for TWF feat chain...
However if he uses Eldritch Guardian and familiar combo, the TWF chain is less useful as it's one of those combat feats that doesn't really translate well with animal familiars... however if he has Improved Familiar and has an imp devil or other creature with hands that can wield two weapons that could be interesting... (the Pooka comes to mind, as it wields daggers, but it's tiny, so you might need to bump it to small size via enlarge person with the share spells familiar feature/ability...)
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That's only any good for combat maneuvers. Int 13 is needed for others, while Int 15+ is needed for like one feat and the TWF chain with Artful Dodge.Fighter. No, seriously: You need a 13 INT to get into the Combat Expertise feat chain, which has all kinds of cool stuff in it. You also need high Intelligence for skill ranks which give you lots to do outside of combat.Dirty Fighting has replaced Combat Expertise for me for most builds.
That alone is worth the admission price to me:
Special: This feat counts as having Dex 13, Int 13, Combat Expertise, and Improved Unarmed Strike for the purposes of meeting the prerequisites of the various improved combat maneuver feats, as well as feats that require those improved combat maneuver feats as prerequisites.
That's only any good for combat maneuvers. Int 13 is needed for others, while Int 15+ is needed for like one feat and the TWF chain with Artful Dodge.Fighter. No, seriously: You need a 13 INT to get into the Combat Expertise feat chain, which has all kinds of cool stuff in it. You also need high Intelligence for skill ranks which give you lots to do outside of combat.Dirty Fighting has replaced Combat Expertise for me for most builds.That alone is worth the admission price to me:
Special: This feat counts as having Dex 13, Int 13, Combat Expertise, and Improved Unarmed Strike for the purposes of meeting the prerequisites of the various improved combat maneuver feats, as well as feats that require those improved combat maneuver feats as prerequisites.
I know what it does, but it also doesn't help if you take any feats that aren't combat maneuvers.
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I know what it does, but it also doesn't help if you take any feats that aren't combat maneuvers.That's only any good for combat maneuvers. Int 13 is needed for others, while Int 15+ is needed for like one feat and the TWF chain with Artful Dodge.Fighter. No, seriously: You need a 13 INT to get into the Combat Expertise feat chain, which has all kinds of cool stuff in it. You also need high Intelligence for skill ranks which give you lots to do outside of combat.Dirty Fighting has replaced Combat Expertise for me for most builds.That alone is worth the admission price to me:
Special: This feat counts as having Dex 13, Int 13, Combat Expertise, and Improved Unarmed Strike for the purposes of meeting the prerequisites of the various improved combat maneuver feats, as well as feats that require those improved combat maneuver feats as prerequisites.
I disagree. The main point of these annoying combat maneuver feats is not to bite an AoO. This feats takes care of ALL of them as long as you're flanking.
I know what it does, but it also doesn't help if you take any feats that aren't combat maneuvers.That's only any good for combat maneuvers. Int 13 is needed for others, while Int 15+ is needed for like one feat and the TWF chain with Artful Dodge.Fighter. No, seriously: You need a 13 INT to get into the Combat Expertise feat chain, which has all kinds of cool stuff in it. You also need high Intelligence for skill ranks which give you lots to do outside of combat.Dirty Fighting has replaced Combat Expertise for me for most builds.That alone is worth the admission price to me:
Special: This feat counts as having Dex 13, Int 13, Combat Expertise, and Improved Unarmed Strike for the purposes of meeting the prerequisites of the various improved combat maneuver feats, as well as feats that require those improved combat maneuver feats as prerequisites.
What Combat Expertise feats are you taking that aren't combat maneuvers? The Stalwart line is only really good for Barbarians putting everything into their DR.
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What Combat Expertise feats are you taking that aren't combat maneuvers? The Stalwart line is only really good for Barbarians putting everything into their DR.I know what it does, but it also doesn't help if you take any feats that aren't combat maneuvers.That's only any good for combat maneuvers. Int 13 is needed for others, while Int 15+ is needed for like one feat and the TWF chain with Artful Dodge.Fighter. No, seriously: You need a 13 INT to get into the Combat Expertise feat chain, which has all kinds of cool stuff in it. You also need high Intelligence for skill ranks which give you lots to do outside of combat.Dirty Fighting has replaced Combat Expertise for me for most builds.That alone is worth the admission price to me:
Special: This feat counts as having Dex 13, Int 13, Combat Expertise, and Improved Unarmed Strike for the purposes of meeting the prerequisites of the various improved combat maneuver feats, as well as feats that require those improved combat maneuver feats as prerequisites.
Whirlwind Attack, Gang Up, Pack Flanking, Moonlight Stalker, and Butterfly's Sting to name a few...
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Fighter/wizard/eldritch knight!
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Whirlwind Attack, Gang Up, Pack Flanking, Moonlight Stalker, and Butterfly's Sting to name a few...What Combat Expertise feats are you taking that aren't combat maneuvers? The Stalwart line is only really good for Barbarians putting everything into their DR.I know what it does, but it also doesn't help if you take any feats that aren't combat maneuvers.That's only any good for combat maneuvers. Int 13 is needed for others, while Int 15+ is needed for like one feat and the TWF chain with Artful Dodge.Fighter. No, seriously: You need a 13 INT to get into the Combat Expertise feat chain, which has all kinds of cool stuff in it. You also need high Intelligence for skill ranks which give you lots to do outside of combat.Dirty Fighting has replaced Combat Expertise for me for most builds.That alone is worth the admission price to me:
Special: This feat counts as having Dex 13, Int 13, Combat Expertise, and Improved Unarmed Strike for the purposes of meeting the prerequisites of the various improved combat maneuver feats, as well as feats that require those improved combat maneuver feats as prerequisites.
Here's the cut and paste of the whole Combat Expertise feat tree: (*=combat feat)
Butterfly's Sting
Elusive Redirection
Gang Up*
Team Up*
Improved Dirty Trick*
Greater Dirty Trick*
Improved Disarm*
Break Guard*
Disarming Strike*
Greater Disarm*
Improved Feint*
Deceptive Exchange
Disengaging Feint*
Disengaging Flourish*
Disengaging Shot*
Greater Feint*
Passing Trick*
Improved Reposition*
Greater Reposition*
Repositioning Strike*
Improved Steal*
Greater Steal*
Improved Trip*
Binding Throw*
Drag Down*
Felling Escape*
Felling Smash*
Fury's Fall*
Fury's Snare*
Greater Trip*
Ki Throw*
Binding Throw*
Improved Ki Throw*
Tripping Staff*
Tripping Twirl*
Tripping Strike*
Second Chance*
Improved Second Chance*
Swift Aid*
Whirlwind Attack*
DSP psionics
The Aegis is this. They benefit greatly from being smart but are fundamentally a martial class.
ThereFamiliar gets to share your feats.Can you point me to where this appears in the rules? I can't find it.
Ah. It's specific to the archetype. Not a general familiar rule. That's what I get for skimming.
Familiar gets to share your feats.Yes, your familiar gets all your *Combat* feats... Intimidating Prowess is a Combat feat. And your familiar shares ALL your intimidate ranks. Etc. Etc. Etc. The fun is endless. Wiz_Div_Foresight level gives you an insane initiative. And School Familiar archetype for your familiar means you get to roll Initiative twice and pick the best one (you can use your familiar's initiative instead of yours, etc.) Plus your familiar gets a 0 level cantrip. Wizard and Ftr_eldritch_guardian levels stack for purposes improving the familiar. Eldritch Knight PrC lets you count its levels for the purposes of qualifying for Weapon Specialization (so you can have a decent martial guy with spells; however, if you don't care about spells, ditch Eldritch Knight and just go for Ftr_eldritch_guardian levels with just one level in Wiz_div_foresight...)
You can add back Intimidate as class skill via trait selection...
Eldritch Knight has the problem that it won't progress your Familiar, and Boon Companion only solves 40% of the problem, and Familiar Bond only lets you use all your hit dice on your Familiar if you accept its restrictions on Familiar abilities and granted abilities.
Eldritch Knight has the problem that it won't progress your Familiar
It does if it progresses wizard caster level
Eldritch Knight has the problem that it won't progress your FamiliarIt does if it progresses wizard caster level
Nope, Familiar is a Wizard class ability, not a part of your wizard spellcasting. Eldritch Knight only progresses casting, not other clas abilities such as Familiar or Arcane School.