Dying and the Family Tomb


Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion


Do characters at the Family Tomb die if another character anywhere dies, or only if a character currently at the tomb dies then anyone else there dies too?

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Krayden wrote:
Do characters at the Family Tomb die if another character anywhere dies, or only if a character currently at the tomb dies then anyone else there dies too?

I don't have the Family Tomb location in front of me- but if I remember correctly (not having the text), it is should a character at Family Tomb dies, all other characters currently at that location also die.

-- Steve


Family Tomb, At This Location wrote:
When a character dies, all characters at this location die.

I think the dying character has to be at the Family Tomb to trigger the deaths of the characters at this location.

But I can see an argument for saying a character death anywhere causes the death of all characters at the tomb. In particular, why doesn't it say, "When a character dies, all other characters at this location die"?

Silver Crusade

I always interpreted it that if any character at any location died, characters at the family tomb died. But I have a history of being wrong about this kind of thing.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I interpret it the same as Eliandra -- when a character dies (anywhere, not only at the Family Tomb), all characters at the Family Tomb die as well.


But, usually At This Location powers don't consider what happens at other locations. I can't think of another one that does so.


See this comment by Vic. It gives some insight into such things.

I've personally treated this one as if anyone dies anywhere, the characters at the Family Tomb die.


OK, I'm convinced. Tempest Cay is a similar location.

Tempest Cay, At This Location wrote:
If your ship is dealt structural damage, increase the damage by 1.

This was officially ruled to mean if your ship was dealt structural damage at any location, and Tempest Cay was occupied, then the structural damage increased by 1.

That's directly analogous to Family Tomb's effect being triggered by a character death at any location.


elcoderdude wrote:

OK, I'm convinced. Tempest Cay is a similar location.

Tempest Cay, At This Location wrote:
If your ship is dealt structural damage, increase the damage by 1.

This was officially ruled to mean if your ship was dealt structural damage at any location, and Tempest Cay was occupied, then the structural damage increased by 1.

That's directly analogous to Family Tomb's effect being triggered by a character death at any location.

I would add though that the Ship was considered a shared object between all party members, so damage to the ship is shared between all members, whereas a character death is a singular impacting event


NyteJKL wrote:
I would add though that the Ship was considered a shared object between all party members, so damage to the ship is shared between all members, whereas a character death is a singular impacting event

I think the relevant point is the At This Location power is influenced by something that happens at another location. If someone is commanding the ship at another location, and incurs structural damage, Tempest Cay will add 1 to the structural damage if it is occupied. That's similar to Family Tomb causing the death of all characters at the location if a character dies at another location.


Hawkmoon269 wrote:
I've personally treated this one as if anyone dies anywhere, the characters at the Family Tomb die...

Too bad, after elcoderdude's post, I really hoped that someone would contradict Hawk and say (just for the fun of it) :

"I've personally treated this one as if anyone dies anywhere and the Family Tomb is occupied, the characters at the Family Tomb die..." :-)

Then I remembered that Hawk is always right and that anyone who dares think otherwise ends up forever lost in Limbos...

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

Hawkmoon269 wrote:

See this comment by Vic. It gives some insight into such things.

I've personally treated this one as if anyone dies anywhere, the characters at the Family Tomb die.

Right.

Also, don't forget what Mike says: If your character dies, you die too. (Or maybe you'll just want to.)

Sovereign Court

Vic Wertz wrote:
Hawkmoon269 wrote:

See this comment by Vic. It gives some insight into such things.

I've personally treated this one as if anyone dies anywhere, the characters at the Family Tomb die.

Right.

Also, don't forget what Mike says: If your character dies, you die too. (Or maybe you'll just want to.)

You aren't supposed to tell them about that. It's more fun as a surprise !

Silver Crusade

My Rooboo died tonight. I'm getting my affairs in order. Who should I leave my boxes to?


Eliandra Giltessan wrote:
My Rooboo died tonight. I'm getting my affairs in order. Who should I leave my boxes to?

Meeeee! Although I already have all the boxes...

RIP Rooboo. :( At least we weren't all at the Tomb... >_>;;


Vic Wertz wrote:
Hawkmoon269 wrote:

See this comment by Vic. It gives some insight into such things.

I've personally treated this one as if anyone dies anywhere, the characters at the Family Tomb die.

Right.

Also, don't forget what Mike says: If your character dies, you die too. (Or maybe you'll just want to.)

Sorry if I write one year after the last post here, and sorry for my english (I'm from Spain). But I have been searching for an answer and this is the post that I've found about this card, Family Tomb.

The whole thread goes about how "At this location" works and finally all is clear. But my doubt goes a bit farter; the line "At this location in the reverse is driving me crazy!
I mean, there is a single, minor difference between those two texts, but it exists and I don't know why. The texts are:

Front: AT THIS LOCATION When a character dies, all characters at this location die.

Rear: AT THIS LOCATION When a character dies, all other characters at this location die.

What is the difference? What does "other" mean in that text? I would appreciate any kind of help. Thank you.


As far as I can determine, there's no difference. Sometimes, people just say the same thing in different ways.


Haides wrote:


Front: AT THIS LOCATION When a character dies, all characters at this location die.

Rear: AT THIS LOCATION When a character dies, all other characters at this location die.

What is the difference? What does "other" mean in that text? I would appreciate any kind of help. Thank you.

Well just for the fun of it, I would say that if you happen to die when at the Tomb (and not as the result of someone else dying), the difference is that if the Tomb is open, you die twice! :-)

Which as far as today I guess makes no difference although if dying was to trigger "immediately" some power in the future, that may make one (*).

A simple way to see the difference is to replace " dying " by " taking 1d6 damage". And then you see the case where you would take 1d6 damage again as result of taking a first 1d6 damage.

(*) Imagine a Necromancer character with a power like "if another character dies, you may immediately give your hand that must contain at least a card to that character. That character is no longer dead".

Scarab Sages

Rebel Song wrote:
RIP Rooboo. :( At least we weren't all at the Tomb... >_>;;

Not this time...

...cartmanbeck.


So, you say that they could write AT THIS LOCATION When a character dies, all characters at this location die. in both sides and it wouldn't change? So, why is it written in both forms? any errata, maybe?

Oh! And thanks for the answers :)

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

Hmm. Looking further into this, I have found that the text on the front originally included the word "other," which suggests to me that the design intent may have been "When a character at this location dies, all other characters at this location die." Verifying.

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

The wording in the above post is correct. Added to FAQ.

(Don't take this particular ruling as an indication of intent for similar wordings.)


Wow. How many needless deaths could have been prevented.....

But I liked the old way better. More dangerous. (Although, we don't play permadeath.)

Grand Lodge

elcoderdude wrote:

Wow. How many needless deaths could have been prevented.....

But I liked the old way better. More dangerous. (Although, we don't play permadeath.)

Were you talking character deaths? Or player deaths?

Scarab Sages

OH MY GOODNESS

Is this for real? This is crazy. We almost had a TPK just because of this one card; this changes everything. Lem thought he was the sole survivor of his party in organized play, but maybe he wasn't!


Vic Wertz wrote:

The wording in the above post is correct. Added to FAQ.

(Don't take this particular ruling as an indication of intent for similar wordings.)

Thank you very much, Vic Wertz, for this clear clarification and for the FAQ's adding. I'm happy this had served for something :)

Again, thank you, very much.

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