Ok, remember that these answers are tentative and could change with the official recruitment...
- I would probably allow the original (con based) scarred witch doctor as long as you can post it, or a link to it, somewhere for reference (the pfsrd has updated it to the errata version).
- we will be using the errata'd version of wild arcana.
- eldritch heritage can't be used to pick up wildblooded bloodlines.
- there will be times when you're unable to use a mount. Keeping one alive will be challenging, but if you do you should be able to use it a fair bit of the time.
- yup, emerging firearms. There should be a sense that guns are unusual and that people will react differently to them... but with the right character I think that can fit pretty well (more so than the occult classes probably). If you want to pitch a gunslinger/monk you're gonna have an uphill battle... A gunslinger/alchemist would feel pretty natural to me (something like inquisitor could work really well with a God interested in science or progress, or a character that's into crafting and inventing, maybe a dwarf or gnome).
I'm interested in the changed to core elves and half-elves. My magus/wizard (or possibly magus/arcanist) just feel like a pointy-eared sort.
Early firearms only. I do wonder how our GM feels about guns though. I often feel that guns clash with the feel of the rest of pathfinder. Are they like the occult classes, unlikely to make it in, or are they as good as anything else? Obviously they are a better fit in some settings than in others though.I should ask, has he told anyone or can Nate tell us how firearms are being handled?
I'm considering playing two classes I very very rarely use. Gunslinger/inquisitor.
Often I feel like their absence is more out of place than their presence.
Here is the old version of the pfsrd though I note that this says that bonus spells per level is not based on constitution, is still based on intelligence? The old version of the pazio site says the same thing. I'm not sure if I'll actually go for it if that's the case... What changes will you do to half-orcs?
Bonus spells were never based off of constitution - that was part of the trade-off. It was still a nice trade-off.
- yup, emerging firearms. There should be a sense that guns are unusual and that people will react differently to them... but with the right character I think that can fit pretty well (more so than the occult classes probably). If you want to pitch a gunslinger/monk you're gonna have an uphill battle... A gunslinger/alchemist would feel pretty natural to me (something like inquisitor could work really well with a God interested in science or progress, or a character that's into crafting and inventing, maybe a dwarf or gnome).
There is actually a deity with a firearm as their favored weapon, I just can't remember which one it is. And Inquisitor even has access to a Domain based around guns (the Black Powder Inquisition). It fits pretty well.
Was really going to go more with someone who spent some time in Alkenstar spreading the word so to speak.
Sooo... I just discovered a major plumbing issue where I live... My posting rate is going to drop quite a bit for the next couple days. If you have questions please feel free to continue asking them (I know there's a couple waiting on race info already) and I'll try to get to them after noise ordinances prohibit me from working at night.
So Weapon Attunement and certain class features like a Warpriest's Sacred Weapon seem to be either redundant or extremely powerful. Do you have an idea for how features like that would interact?
LEadership???
Thinking of going hardened guard out of magnimar. Him and his partner retire to Sandpoint for the easy life by the sea.
What are you thinking of as far as modifications to gnomes?
More tentative answers/info:
- there's only one god with a firearm as a favored weapon and its evil... Probably not a great choice... but, like I said, inquisitors definitely have some options for blending naturally with gunslinger.
- if you're going to be a gunslinger from 1st level, being from Alkenstar might make more sense than someone who traveled there after already having an inquisitor level.
- weapon attunement replaces normal magic weapons. Things sacred weapon/arcane pool/divine bond/etc stack with it just like they would with a standard magic weapon.
- no leadership. Sorry.
- races (remember these are tentative)
Dat Half-Elf doh
Think I found my race.
Are we able to choose abilities from two different paths? I'm creating an arcane warrior, and would like to mix Champion and Archmage abilities. However, it seems that the only way to accomplish that is to adopt the Trickster path and repeatedly take Path Dabbling. My character is going to be a Hellknight Signifier-Errant, and nothing about her says 'trickster.' Thoughts?
You can only take Path Dabbling once. You could however just take the Dual Path Mythic feat.
You can only take Path Dabbling once. You could however just take the Dual Path Mythic feat.
Well, whaddaya know. That solves my problem. Thanks!
A bonus combat feat? I guess I'm picking up improved initative if I'm going for half-orc, though my character will probably be looking to be primarily a caster so I guess I'll have to consider other options more strongly. That half-elf bonus is how I've always played with them in gestalt, it seems like a clarification more than anything. It's still good, but doesn't seem as great as the other options.
It may not be the greatest thing in the world, but it's quite nice, and something I've wished I had in Gestalt games before. There are some very god racial favored class bonuses, and even if you don't take those, Fast Learner for free essentially gives you the Skilled racial ability and/or Toughness, so that's nice. Might roll with something that uses an Exotic weapon with the Helf.
I have wanted to do an Illusionist for ages. Probably going to play a crazy gnome.
Except for humans, each race's extra boon benefits some classes more than others... Partly that's just the nature of giving these kind of buffs, and partly it's sort of intentional because they're supposed to play to what were already that race's strengths (and/or flavor). A bonus combat feat may seem underwhelming if your primarily (or exclusively) a caster, but for martials and gishes it can be pretty nice (and the fact that it's changeable could be pretty handy).
To clarify FCBs- everyone (except half-elves) only gets 1 favored class (not one per 'side' or anything like that). They can't gain 2 FCBs at any level because they can't take 2 levels in the same class. A human (or half-Orc, or aasimar with scion of humanity) that takes the eclectic feat and levels both favored classes can choose any one of the normal FCBs for their primary favored class and also gain a hit point or skill point for their secondary favored class (per the feat). If they also have the fast learner feat they can choose either to gain both a hit point and skill point or to gain the racial FCBs for their primary class (per that feat), and they also gain a hit point or skill point for their secondary class. A Half-elf with multi-talented that takes eclectic gains a 3rd favored class and any time they level 2 of their favored classes together can choose to either gain the benefits described by their racial boon or those described above.
- regarding epic advancement... I'm still working on nailing that down- it'll be quite a while before it comes in to play. We might just use the rules posted on on pfsrd. The other alternative is I may develop a handful of epic prestige classes and from 21st on you'd have to level in one of those... Even if we go with the 'standard' epic rules I might introduce a couple prestige classes that aren't available until level 18+...
All this talk of half elves gave me another idea... Would you allow combining wild caller with synthesist? They both modify eidolon, but the modifications are compatible. Would you consider allowing other archtypes that modify the same thing, for example for oracle dual cursed and spirit guide? Another thing that could be cool would be if it was possible to get negative variant channeling (rulership) with the life oracle relevation. I'll totally understand it if you won't allow any of these though.
What about an elf that is magus/arcanist? half int to each pool?
Sorceror/Brawler
Summoner/Brawler
Summoner/Brawler
Summoner/Brawler
Summoner/Brawler
Summoner/Brawler
Summoner/Dragon Disciple
Summoner/Dragon Disciple
Summoner/Dragon Disciple
Summoner/Dragon Disciple
Summoner/Dragon Disciple
Campaign starts here at 11.
Summoner/Dragon Disciple
Summoner/Dragon Disciple
Summoner/Dragon Disciple
Summoner/Dragon Disciple
Summoner/Dragon Disciple
Summoner/Brawler
Summoner/Brawler
Summoner/Brawler
Summoner/Brawler
That way I get some sorceror casting and nearly full summoner casting with some tricks from brawler and the awesome strength boosts from dragon disciple. And unlike other summoners, mine will be a skill monkey so he can cover the rogue/scout role if need be.
Guardian path all the way.
Don't you need some sorcerer casting to start with in order to advance it with dragon disciple? I'm not 100% sure on this, but it's how all the other PRCs work.
Yea I have a level of sorceror before dragon disciple.
Yea I have a level of sorceror before dragon disciple.
So you do. With this, and other blunders, I'm starting to wonder if I need new glasses. Sorry.
Its okay, it happens. :)
I would be interested, with so many options not sure what I would build. I'll put more thought into it once you start recruiting.
I would love to play my Gyronna worshipping, CN, half elf witch with this.
Remember that regardless of Mythic or not, Vital Strike is still a Standard action. So you "merely" did 147 damage with that first shot, and did not get the remaining 3 attacks. Unless you burnt a point on Amazing Initiative (which at 1st Tier we don't have yet).
Mythic Vital Strike is more reasonable using the not-stupid interpretation (and/or the re-write in that book Rednal has, they're the same thing). It's just a Vital Strike that adds your static modifiers each time your dice are multiplied (so Improved Vital Strike multiplies your damage by 3 for one shot).
Remember that regardless of Mythic or not, Vital Strike is still a Standard action. So you "merely" did 147 damage with that first shot, and did not get the remaining 3 attacks. Unless you burnt a point on Amazing Initiative (which at 1st Tier we don't have yet).
Mythic Vital Strike is more reasonable using the not-stupid interpretation (and/or the re-write in that book Rednal has, they're the same thing). It's just a Vital Strike that adds your static modifiers each time your dice are multiplied (so Improved Vital Strike multiplies your damage by 3 for one shot).
Oops. Like I said, I haven't used Mythic Vital Strike before. However, it was a critical hit, and a tetsubo has a x4 critical multiplier. It is still a standard action. Let's amend the totals...
Had some time today to think about builds, i am thinking about a halfling and have some questions. What are the tentative race mods? Are you going to house rule that the halfling race trait warslinger will work with the halfling sling staff?
@Amazing Red and The Dragon: if I understand Gestalt properly, usually you have to have all prereqs for a certain prestige class on the same path you are. Other words, the Sorcerer level to give access to Dragon Disciple would have to be replacing one of the Brawler levels, not Summoner. Obviously (and I imagine this is the intention) the extra caster levels in Dragon Disciple would be applied to Sorcerer.
I'm thinking of a human fighter/oracle (metal), sort of a iron warrior.
Oops. Like I said, I haven't used Mythic Vital Strike before. However, it was a critical hit, and a tetsubo has a x4 critical multiplier. It is still a standard action. Let's amend the totals...Remember that regardless of Mythic or not, Vital Strike is still a Standard action. So you "merely" did 147 damage with that first shot, and did not get the remaining 3 attacks. Unless you burnt a point on Amazing Initiative (which at 1st Tier we don't have yet).
Mythic Vital Strike is more reasonable using the not-stupid interpretation (and/or the re-write in that book Rednal has, they're the same thing). It's just a Vital Strike that adds your static modifiers each time your dice are multiplied (so Improved Vital Strike multiplies your damage by 3 for one shot).
Remember also that Vital Strike's extra damage dice are not multiplied on a critical. Neither, I believe, is the extra damage from Mythic Vital Strike, but that's ambiguous.
Best-case that crit comes out to 9d8+1245 extra damage (Not 27d8+1245), but more likely it comes out to 9d8+315 extra damage, and I would say it's probably MEANT to come out to 9d8+105 (the base 3d8+static x3).
@Amazing Red and The Dragon: if I understand Gestalt properly, usually you have to have all prereqs for a certain prestige class on the same path you are.
Nope. In Gestalt, you're not actually getting two levels - you're getting one level that happens to have all the benefits of two levels, so there's no "paths" to qualify for anything on. This is noted in the rules' section on prestige classes, where it explains that because it's possible for a character to meet the requirements earlier than normal (or it was possible in 3.5, at least), a GM was perfectly justified in not allowing access to prestige classes until after 5th level, regardless of their normal requirements.
@Amazing Red and The Dragon: if I understand Gestalt properly, usually you have to have all prereqs for a certain prestige class on the same path you are. Other words, the Sorcerer level to give access to Dragon Disciple would have to be replacing one of the Brawler levels, not Summoner. Obviously (and I imagine this is the intention) the extra caster levels in Dragon Disciple would be applied to Sorcerer.
'Paths' don't actually exist. Look at the gestalt rules themselves. Note that 'side', 'sides' or 'path' are not words that are relevant - they aren't even mentioned. They're not game terms. Class is a game term, and so is level. Having a sorcerer//dragon disciple level does nothing to stop you from having a sorcerer//ranger level, even if you also have a ranger//dragon disciple level.
What you describe is a really common houserule, but it is still a houserule. It's just common, (and intuitive, which is how it got common in the first place) enough so as to be almost all-pervasive.
Nate said somewhere upthread that said houserule isn't in effect, although a bunch of others (probably good ones) are.
Maybe an odd question, but does Bane (ala the Inquisitor ability) work on an Alchemist's Bombs?
A Divine Chemist seems like it'd be neat.
Best-case that crit comes out to 9d8+1245 extra damage (Not 27d8+1245), but more likely it comes out to 9d8+315 extra damage, and I would say it's probably MEANT to come out to 9d8+105 (the base 3d8+static x3).
Yay for ambiguous language!
Maybe an odd question, but does Bane (ala the Inquisitor ability) work on an Alchemist's Bombs?
A Divine Chemist seems like it'd be neat.
Holy hand grenade?
Might be changing my idea to a half elf alchemist/witch.
Hey all, just worked 14.5 straight hours on my house, so I apologize if theses answers are overly brief:
- the only questionable archetype stacking I'll allow is the qinggong monk. Everything else has to be completely non-overlapping.
Like half of people's ideas: "all the pets!"
- no, if an ability specifically grants channel positive (or requires it for your alignment and/or god, you can't switch it out for negative.
- no, the elf's racial boon specifically does not grant any bonus arcane points if you take any magus levels; instead it lets you augment your magus spells with arcane points as if you were an Arcanist using arcane reservoir. Being an Arcanist too grants you that ability, but only for arcanist spells (only an elf can do it to magus spells, that i can think of right now).
- I think I might restrict alignments to any-G, LN, or N... The AP kind of assumes the characters are fairly heroic and CN might be tricky to keep motivated when things get rough (or ensure he won't change sides if a better offer comes).
- we will be using the common sense version of mythic vital strike, if we use it all... It is very powerful (basically an autocrit once a round, x3 multiplier at this level)... I'm still working on exactly how we'll handle that.
- halfling racial boon will have to wait, sorry.
- correct... No 'sides' in gestalt (well, at least not in this one).
- bane grenades, eh? I'm not gonna look that all up right now to make sure but I think that would probably fly.
If you think Mythic Vital Strike is a bit too much - even toned down, it's pretty nasty - you can always just ask people to pick something else instead. ^^
(If you do include it, I would suggest adding a clause saying you can only use it once a round - so no doubling attacks with Amazing Initiative or other sneaky tricks)
Mythic Vital Strike interpreted the logical (though RAW incorrect) way is fine, I think. It may be an "auto-crit", but it's a good way for mobile combat to be a thing, and multi-attack builds can be even more brutal with Mythic in-play, and there are a jillion options to move and full attack.
Plus it's fun rolling those big dice numbrs (like my Tetori's 24d8).
The toned down version of mythic vital strike seems just ok to me. It's now going to usually being much worse than full attacking. Sure it's great for those extra standard actions, but other things are as well.
Ehh, I wouldn't say it's worse than full attacking, especially for a 2H wielder.
At 11th level a full BaB class gets 3 attacks, +11/+6/+1, and each hits the same. So, 3 hits worth of damage, but chances are you'll only get 2/3 of that damage to connect unless your to-hit is way above average.
Mythic Vital Strike has a higher accuracy rate (+11) but the same damage, and better DR penetration. It's still QUITE good.
Where it falls behind is with things that grant extra attacks at full BaB (Haste, the Hurtful Feat, the Sudden Attack Mythic ability and so on), or grant loads of extra attacks (TWFing, Rapid/Manyshot, etc.) which are pretty good in core, especially archery, but can get INSANE with Mythic.
Essentially Mythic Vital Strike is as good as a normal full attack, but not as good as a highly twinked one. And it is nice to have DPR numbers that are incredibly simple to figure out. DPR essentially = Average damage (give or take a bit based on the 5% miss chance and different crit ranges/multipliers).