RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 8
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Star Voter Season 6, Dedicated Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8
aka WalterGM
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| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Aura moderate transmutation; CL 9th
Slot shield; Price 17,533 gp; Weight 6 lbs.
Description
This greenwood quickdraw shield is made from a stylized spiral of woven sticks, twigs, and vines. Despite its fragile appearance, thornweave is surprisingly sturdy, and functions as a +2 throwing quickdraw shield.
In addition, thornweave can be removed and thrown three times per day as a swift action. If the attack hits, thornweave bursts apart upon impact, dealing damage as normal while engulfing the target in a spray of splinters and brambles. The target must succeed at a DC 17 Reflex save to avoid becoming entangled as a mass of briars and vines wrap around the target. These bonds are not anchored and do not prevent the subjected creature from movement. This condition persists for one minute before the animated vines unravel and reform into a functioning shield once more, dropping at the targeted creature’s feet.
While wearing thornweave, the wearer may cast plant growth into it, as if it possessed the spell storing ability. Rather than the normal effects of spell storing, the wielder can choose to discharge this casting of plant growth as a free action whenever thornweave threatens the entangled condition to increase the DC of that ability by 4.
Construction
Requirements Craft Magic Arms and Armor, creator must be a dryad, entangle, plant growth; Cost 9,033 gp
I really liked the visual of this item—throwing a tangle of vines at someone to entangle them. It's very evocative (actually not too far from a vague idea I had, though executed far better here than with my "root bomb"). I would totally buy this if I played a plant-focused druid or ranger.
Congratulations Walter!
I liked the thrown entangle aspect of this shield. I have seen a lot of thrown shields since a certain blockbuster last summer, but this one seems like it has been around for a lot longer than that. Entangle is an under-utilized spell in my opinion, but you avoided worst part of it by targeting a single creature and the not hampering movement shows a designer's eye. The entangle and plant growth ability have a really nice synergy as well in the 'why haven't I thought of this before?' way!
Good luck on maps, monsters, and all your future rounds.
Congrats on making it into the Top 32. My druid character would love to have one of these shields of sticks and vines. Well done! Good luck in the rest of the competition.
Congratulations, Walter!
Charging up an item with a specific spell ability is an intriguing design space. I could think of a number of other items that could utilize that mechanic, so props for potentially sparking a trend in later item development. I would advise you to look at Paizo's standardized text, though - "subjected" is not a word I recognize from many Pathfinder products.
Can't wait to see how you grow in round 2!
I voted this one both up and down.
It feels a little SIAC to me, though I do like the imagery.
It would be nice if it had more of a shield-y sort of effect. As it is, it's main effect doesn't have much to do with being a shield. It could be any sort of thrown item. Like giving it a disarm when it's hit, the attacking weapon being tangled in the vines or something. Though disarming shields aren't really innovative at this point. But you can see what I mean. An effect closely tied to its primary function.
Or with the thrown entangle, do something with the vines once their on the target. They burrow roots into it or whatever. Just something additional that elevates it a bit.
I do like the mechanic of charging it with a stored spell. You were on to something there.
Congrats, Walter! Really liked the imagery on your item. Keep bringing that into your designs and you could go far.
Congrats on making top 32!
I have a soft spot for shields, and this one did not disappoint. With the Shield Champion archetype coming out, and the fixes it got in errata, I have had an even bigger soft spot for shields that are designed to be thrown. I have to imagine that archetype is the reason you added quickdraw to the shield, and I applaud your knowledge of the mechanics for that. You clearly have also thought about the donning a shield time involved in throwing and catching a shield, and the design is much stronger as a result. I also like the spell storing type effect for a power-up to the item's abilities.
One complaints come from the first line in your second paragraph. Since it is a quickdraw shield we already know it can be removed and thrown normally as a swift, and this introduces some uncertainty about how it works if you have the quickdraw feat. I get that this is meant to be a free extra attack, but since you already lay out the quickdraw and throwing aspects on the shield I would rather you just say "three times per day when the shield is thrown..." This gets away from adding swift action extra attacks messing with action economy, and uses what you already have in the design.
Also, you don't say what type of shield it is. Thats a big oversight. You can go to the rules of quickdraw to see it can only be put on light shields, but you should not make the reader go through that type if investigation to determine something so fundamental to your item. along the same lines, while you say its a greenwood weapon, I would still want you to call out light wooden shield. that is the items name, don;t make people deduce it from other properties of the item.
I also dislike race restrictions item crafting if the item doesn;t have a direct effect for that race. Why not any other woodland fey, or even more importantly, why lock PC's like druids away from making it? Both fit the theme, and are locked out of making it. It makes the hard for the PC's to find acquire besides by GM fiat. Its an awesome item, so make it easier to find in your world for characters who want it.
All that said, this is an absolute favorite. With these changes it would probably be my favorite of the round. It's still definitely in the running for that spot. I really look forward to seeing what you can do with your map.
Best of luck in all future rounds!
I will be starting my reviews soon, and they can be bumpy at times, so here's a starter for 10 on Template ...
You almost nailed it! My eagles eye spotted some teeny weeny flaws...
The "creator" text of the requirements in construction should follow the spells, not precede them.
And I guess you didn't use the preview button or you might have noticed your item name was missing from the larger entry box - grin.
Here you go Fu, we found some food for you...
*munch*
Fu holds his hand out saying that not previewing deserves seconds...
*munch*
Full review to follow in due course.
As promised yesterday, the GB&U this year is courtesy of me rather than GM_solsprial (he is busy drawing furiously). So without further ado, our amazing and awesome top 32+4 get the first set of The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly critiques, and then on to everyone else who requested a critique in the CMI official thread, or in my shiny The GB&U Season 9 thread.
Thornweave
The Good: I freely admit, I loved this item. I have a soft spot for druidy planty throny items, and this is all three of those. Nature for the win!
The Bad: Losing the use of the shield for the entangle power hurts a bit.
The Ugly: The "must be a dryad" construction requirement means PC's can in all likelihood never craft this item. I understand the logic, but finding a dryad is hard enough, and no sane GM will ever let someone play as one, so that is a big concern for me.
Congratulation on earning your place among the Top 32 this year, Walter. Here’s my thoughts on your item:
- Great name
- “In addition” is unnecessary here. You’ve only just started telling us what it does!
- Very nice description. The shield bursting apart and showering splinters that then grow for a secondary effect…all of this serves to describe the function of the item in an engaging an exciting way.
- This item shouldn’t create too many questions about its use during gameplay.
- An enemy of the PCs (and the GM that plays that enemy) would have just as much fun using it against the players as they will have with it once they’ve looted it. I don’t expect they’ll want to sell it right away.
- You use a static DC as is typical of magic items, but include a way to boost that DC with a thematically linked spell. Brilliant! Alchemical power components set a precedence for this sort of DC boosting, and I think you’ve found a great way to implement that here.
- Two separate items in your description made me think of two separate Marvel movies.
- Needing a dryad to make it does seem like an inconvenience, but it’s a great way of subtly prodding the PCs into an adventure if they want one, or asking how a villain got one once they’ve looted it. This is the kind of detail that stirs my imagination without force-feeding me, and I love it.
Welcome to the Top 32, Walter! Your submission has overcome the magic item horde and the many culls to emerge at the top of the heap. Congratulations!
I'll be one of the judges for this first round, offering my humble commentary which I hope will be helpful to you moving into Round 2. I will be considering each item based on three factors: functionality (does the item fill a useful niche within the rules?), mojo ("wow" factor--would I point out this item to someone else, or immediately get some cool concept to go with it?), and writing (is the formatting and text clear and error free? Is the prose interesting and evocative?)
Combining these elements successfully is, I feel, key to defining that elusive "Superstar" quality that we all want to see.
So you know what I'm looking for, now let's move on to the good bit: your thornweave!
Functionality and Usefulness
My favorite parts of this item are the spell storing charge-up technique and the fact it is a thrown shield with nothing to do with a red, white, and blue superhero. Entangle is a fun, but annoying to use spell that you made better by making it single target. Well done there.
I'm just not sure a shield was the best item type to use. It has no defensive power and using its main ability doesn't even let you keep it as a shield for, at a 1 minute duration, the rest of the combat. This would make more sense to me as a bracelet of woven brambles or a removable, thorn-studded medallion. Or wacky druidic shurikens that burst into thorns. But I digress.
I think your entangle-style burst ability is very good on its own merits, though.
I don't really understand why only a dryad can make this. I think it makes sense for most sylvan fey to be able to make as well as druids. I don't see a real reason to exclude PCs from being able to craft this.
The Cool Factor/Mojo
The spell storing use to charge up entangle is clever and does not feel tacked on, but a completely sensible part of the item. That shows design poise.
I like the tweaks for a single-target entangle with some of the annoying bits removed. It's not hugely innovative, but it is a nice touch.
I do feel like there was a missed opportunity not making this a different item type. There seems like there was a desire to make a cool throwing shield and a cool entangle item and they got merged together with the shield not quite standing on its own.
Prose and Editing
What type of shield is this? That should always be in the item description. You also neglected to put your item name in the template. You also missed italicizing plant growth in the last paragraph. "Subjected creature" isn't really standard wording; here, you could just use "target".
Your writing is good, though, and I enjoy your descriptions interwoven through the item. This is a wonderfully visual item.
Overall
You have some real design potential here. I advise shoring up on your editing--don't get taken out because you overlooked something--and recognize when some part of an idea might not be doing what it needs to be. You made a shield that doesn't really do anything as a shield, turning it more into a once per battle ranged weapon. I'm not sure that was the best choice.
The ability you invented and your spell storing charging are really neat, though, and I enjoyed your writing. Keep bringing the creativity as you move forward.
I am honored to have been allowed to provide feedback this year. I look forward to your entry for Round 2, Walter, and expect a creative map that takes advantage of your evocative imagery.
Congratulations again!
Okay now that we have a few days before Top 16 reveals I've decided to comment on my competitors work. First, congrats one being a people's choice top 36. To me connecting more directly with the pathfinder community as an audience is even more impressive then clicking for a group of judges.
Really cool shield and it got plenty of upvotes from me despite its template issue and some of the more awkward wording. If you don't go the distance this year get a pit crew! Nice work and good luck with the next round.
Marathon Voter Season 8, Dedicated Voter Season 9
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I think my favorite part of this item is the unique synergy with plant growth. In many greenwood items I've seen last year and this year it didn't always fit the theme, but this one fits quite well.
Congrats and Good Luck!
The Ugly: The "must be a dryad" construction requirement means PC's can in all likelihood never craft this item. I understand the logic, but finding a dryad is hard enough, and no sane GM will ever let someone play as one, so that is a big concern for me.
Keep in mind the only requirement that absolutely has to be met in order to craft an item is the Crafting feat. All other requirements can be ignored by increasing the craft DC by 5 for each ignored requirement. (so it makes it harder than its caster level would indicate to craft, but certainly not impossible)
Another option would be finding a dryad to agree to help one craft the item, that could lead to some great story behind the crafting of one of these shields (other people can help you by providing spells ect for crafting spending just as much time as the crafter with the item).
Walter! Welcome...to the Top 32!
As one of the judges who'll be along for the entire ride of the competition, it's my duty (and pleasure) to offer up some commentary on your winning submission, as well as a bit of advice for the challenges to come. First up...your item...thornweave...
Okay. The name is unique. It comes off less like a name you'd call a certain type of magic shield, and more like the name you'd call a specific shield. What I mean by that is thornweave could just as easily be the name of a magic robe woven from thorny bramble. Or, it could be a type of magical, spiked armor. Or, even a pair of magic boots that let you weave through torns like you have the druid's woodland stride ability. In a list of magic items, the only way I'd know it was a shield is because it would appear on the armor/shields table. But on a character sheet or in an NPC's equipment list, I'd have no idea it was a shield until I looked up the item and read through its description. How to address this shortcoming with the name? Call it a thornweave shield and we're done.
Mojo. A quickdraw, throwable shield that bursts into a single-opponent entanglement effect, which you can boost by casting plant growth on the shield in a spell storing manner. Yeah. The idea behind that has some serious mojo.
Cinematic. Major visuals for this item. You can see the shield being thrown. You can see it exploding into thorny vines, surprising the heck out of your opponent. The one thing you don't really visualize as a result of this item's description is it actually being used very much as a shield.
Usefulness. I'm not as keen on the item here. It can be used as a shield, but doing so foregoes much of the cool abilities. It's only by throwing it that you're rewarded for all that extra coin you spent on it. Even then, you give up the protection of your shield for the remainder of the battle to impose penalties to movement, attacks, and Dexterity...as well as force concentration checks on a spellcaster...but just for that one individual. In a one-on-one BBEG battle...especially against a spellcaster...this shield would own the day. In any larger battle, you'd hamper one opponent while the others are free to close in on you. So, it's strategic in how you use it. And, you've included a way of boosting its effectiveness with plant growth. So, I'm kind of middle of the road on its usefulness factor. What would make it more useful is if there was a smaller, secondary ability the shield provided when you aren't throwing it.
Mechanics. There are some good things here. You've included a bit of innovation with the single-opponent entanglement. Charging it up with plant growth is thematically cool and interesting. This is where I think it would be more interesting if the shield benefited in some other defensive way while storing a plant growth spell. But, all in all, you're showing Superstar thinking here.
Polished. A handful of missteps here concern me. You definitely need to call out that it's acts as a light wooden shield. Some of the shield special abilities already imply that, but spell it out for the reader so they know right away what they're getting. You also missed italicizing plant growth towards the end of your description. I'm not keen on the creator needing to be a dryad, and that type of information usually follows the listed spells in the construction requirements. With the unique name and the dryad requirement, this item comes off feeling more like the "home campaign item" than one I'd see in normal play. What I mean by that is that often people will design stuff from their home campaign and they'll include elements that are specific to their campaign world and only think in those terms instead of more broadly and how an item needs to be able to exist across other campaign settings and in larger numbers rather than just a unique item crafted by a specific NPC or creature. You're not quite in that category here. I'm just saying it leans that direction because of the choices you made with your name and the dryad connection. It feels like it could be that type of design, and I'm only bringing it up here to caution others against going too far in that direction.
Other than that, this is still a really evocative entry. It might have a few holes here and there, but you did a solid enough job with it to get your foot in the door...and sometimes, that's all that matters. What's important now, is that you raise your game, watch your P's and Q's as you go forward, and continue to win people over with your ideas and improved execution. So, congratulations once more, and good luck in the competition! Let's see what kind of creativity and detail you bring us with your map in Round 2.
My two cents,
--Neil
Thornweave
Congratulations for making it into the Top 32!
Seeing as that's how I had to start this, you're already a potential "Superstar" so keep that in mind!
That out of the way, I'm going to treat your item the same as if I saw it in the Critique My Item Thread, which means I'll be using the following comments, and assuming you're submitting this item as your "sample" for an Open Call to Fat Goblin Game's Call to Arms book line.
Feel free to disagree with me and DEFEND YOUR CHOICES!
Publishable — This was an "alright" shield entry. The last power, of casting {i]plant growth[/i] certainly feels like a "one more thing" but the basic idea for it isn't terrible or anything. Its just also not incredible. For one, "X times per day" powers make something often less useful -- I imagine the fighter has this shield in his bag-o-holding for "just that right moment" but if its just "one more item" that he's carrying, it's not superstar.
Organized Play Line Developer
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Marathon Voter Season 8, Marathon Voter Season 9
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Congrats on making top 32!
I thought thornweave was really well built and tightly themed, and I voted for it quite a few times. You have lots of detailed but concise descriptions to help get your concept across and it works great. I love the modified entangle effect and that you can boost its DC with the plant growth spell storing. Super cool.
I agree with some of the critiques above, but any points I would mention have been said a few times already, so there's no need to repeat them.
Best of luck in the next round!
Assistant Developer
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Star Voter Season 6
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Hello, Walter, and welcome to the Top 32!
I'll be a judge for this round, and I'm honored and pleased to offer feedback on your thornweave. I hope this feedback provides some helpful insight to you as you move forward in the competition.
As an assistant developer at Paizo, I'll offer you three levels of commentary that approximate the development process: some first impressions, a deeper look, and some measured feedback.
So, let's get started!
First impressions: I've been eager to get to this item because the name has really made me wonder just what we're getting. I was expecting a wondrous item, probably -- and it's certainly fine that it's a shield, but I'd suggest combing through item naming conventions to instead be a bit more precise when coming up with names for design elements. After all, names of items shouldn't confuse players and GMs who aren't already familiar with what they are.
Deeper look: Very neat application of a wild nature theme here. In fact, with that and the dryad connection, I'd actually like to see this narrow in on that theme tighter and become a different type of item. Dryads without class levels aren't proficient in shields, so it'd make a lot more sense to make this a slotted wondrous item (or maybe even a dagger). Or, you could veer in the other direction and drop the dryad creation requirement altogether, and that would provide the added benefit of allowing PCs to craft these. Beyond that, the spell storing ability is nice and feels fresh, so kudos there.
Measured feedback: You have a lot of serious design creativity -- just be careful not to put the cart before the horse, mechanically speaking. Start with the basics; you didn't mention, for instance, that this is a light wooden quickdraw shield, and that's the mechanical basis of the item, after all. You did a nice job reconfiguring the effects of entangle, but you missed italicizing plant growth toward the end of the description. Keep in mind that your design needs to be a cohesive product of theme, concept, design, and execution, and you'll do well going forward.
That said, thanks for reading, and best of luck in the contest!
Not of fan of the "despite appearances" that made it into your item.
I also feel like it should have been a thrown weapon instead of a shield.
But I do like the concept of what the item does.
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RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 32
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Star Voter Season 6, Dedicated Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8
aka WalterGM
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Thanks for the feedback everyone. Lots of good advice to parse through here and I'm agreeing with most of it :)
I do like the current name, I just wish it could have been more shield-specific. Thornweave 2.0 might have been called something like briar buckler if I'd noticed it before submission.
No. Thornweave shield is far better than the alliterative briar buckler. Plus, you don't think about throwing bucklers as much as Captain America-style, straight-up shields. So, keep it a shield.
When I think up items, it almost always begins as a flavor > functionality thing and then I go from there. So for me, this item screamed "something that an NPC dryad would give the PCs!" which is why that line made it into the description. Given the feedback, I can see why this is a negative. Obviously if an item is cool, players might want to craft it, and that is something I tend to forget (damn you PFS!). Will definitely keep it in mind in the future.
I often take the same approach, Walter. Flavor/idea typically leads to the best designs rather than starting with functionality/mechanics and then trying to find a good idea and form to surround it.
Also, having an item created by an NPC dryad is exactly what I imagined for my last leaves of the autumn dryad from RPG Superstar 2009. I envisioned a dryad sorcerer or druid probably creating that item...at least the first time...but then its design likely got passed on to a human wizard or elven druid and, from there, it became possible to mass-produce it. So, the listing that we see in the item's stat-block had no need to say it required a dryad to create it. If you take a similar approach to the backstories you imagine for how an item came to be, and weed out such requirements while still gleaning as much inspiration as you can for the item's abilities, it'll take you further.
Another two cents,
--Neil
Walter! Congratulations on making it through Round 1!
I liked your flavour on this shield, even though I shared some of the same concerns that others have posted here. I voted for this more often than not because I thought it showed some cool potential and I hope you don't disappoint in later rounds!
Good luck in the rest of the competition!