Background My goal is to build something like an Elven Wardancer. I don’t need to min/max a lot, I just want to make sure that the build doesn’t suck too much. I plan to take 2 lvls Ninja and then continue with fighter. Later I hope to get a celestial armor, so the fighter armor training will help a lot.
The build should be Dex based for to hit and damage. I’d like to take two light weapons like kukries or wakisashis for the TWF. Later the build will focus on scoring crits so these would be my weapons of choice.
Now to my question How do I get Dex to damage with two light weapons?
Below I have a list of thing that my google foo found me. As far as I understand them none of them gives me what I want (hope I don’t sound too much like a spoiled child). Of course chance are that I misinterpreted some of the rules/missed something. Please let me know.
The obvious slashing Grace seems to work only for one handed weapons, not for light ones.
Our DM doesn’t allow the agile enchantment. Also that would take quite a while to get two +1 agile kukris @ 8308 gp each. Based on WBL that’ll take to lvl 6 or 7.
Piranha Strike is a substitute for Mighty Strike, good thing for me but so solution.
Some Threads suggest that a swashbuckler could do this but I didn’t understand how.
Fencing Grace & Dervish Dance both need specific one handed weapons, not light ones.
Hope you can help me here.
If you can afford a 1-level dip, go Swashbuckler and apply Slashing Grace to the Sawtooth Sabre (if you have exotic proficiency counts as slight for TWF but is still one handed). Swashbuckler is needed because it can finesse all the piercing one-handed weapons and thus is not limited to light and finesse weapons. Slashing grace turns the one-handed slashing weapon into a piercing one so the SB can finesse it.
Otherwise depends on rules interpretation, but you can try using Effortless Lace on at least the off-hand rapier
Great, thanks!
Could I use the effortless lace with a katana?
Great, thanks!
Could I use the effortless lace with a katana?
You can but in that case if you don't want to dip Swashbuckler you need to lace both katanas instead of only the off-hand one
With the exotic katana proficiency from ninja would one lace suffice?
Contributor
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I did a build for a prominent NPC in Serpent's Skull along these lines, although she got to use sawtooth sabres. I just started her as a swashbuckler and multiclassed after level 2 (level 1 would have sufficed though). She's been extremely effective - maybe too much so for an NPC. :)
Just out of curiosity, is ninja essential to your build? Swashbuckler gets a lot of what I assume are the relevant class skills for you.
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how would you feel about a half-elf instead of full elf?
this build requires wasting a feat (though you should have plenty of those), but lets you get dex to hit and damage with (almost) all light blades... and doesn't require dipping swashbuckler at all.
feats: weapon finesse, weapon focus[sawtooth sabre], slashing grace[sawtooth sabre], martial versatility[slashing grace]
that last one is a human-only feat, which is why you would need to be a half-elf. sawtooth sabres are not finesse-able but they are part of the 'light blade' fighter weapon group... so when you take martial versatility it lets you apply slashing grace to the entire light blade weapon group (all of which benefit from finesse except the sawtooth sabre, lol). So you're wasting weapon focus because you'll never actually use sawtooth sabres but at 4th level you get finesse and slashing grace for all light blades (except the sawtooth, lol). Now you get Dex to hit and damage with kukri, wakizashi, and a dozen or so other blades.
also, martial versatility can be taken more than once, so if you wanted to you could always take it a second time to apply weapon focus to the whole group as well.
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@Christopk-K
There are other ways of getting damage with your weapons.
It might not be worth it for you, but it's worth mentioning that taking statistics like 14 STR, 18 DEX, might give you focus on Dexterity, yet sufficient damage output while doing it. Sneak attack and other types of precision damage also add some. Weapon properties also add some. Some traits like River Rat also add +1 damage with daggers. Specific archetypes might add additional damage.
If you are using TWF, you don't need a lot of damage. Moderate 1d6+2 on both attacks is sufficient in starting levels for example. It's not earth shattering damage output, but it's something. Choose slowly and don't be afraid to consult with GM. He should be your top N0.1 buddy.
Many thanks to all of you. There was quite a lot of option I had missed!
@Kalindlara - Ninja is not essential. It does have some class skills that our group would need like disable device. Also it has the ninja power shadow clone which works like mirror image. From a fluff point of view it’s very close to the hollow fields of the WH40K Harlequins. Those Harlequins are the SciFi Version of the Warhammer Wardancers. Writing this I admit it sound a bit farfetched but this build is centered around a lot of fluff. The ninja won’t wear black btw.
@ kestral287 - thanks for catching the need for the second lace!
There is a feat in the mythic handbook that does what you need, it is by no means owerpowered if you were to ask your gm to let you pick it for your non-mythic character.
Also there is no shame in havign a decent str, if you dex is 16-18 and your str 12-14 then think really hard if you really want to burn a feat for +1-3 damage depending on your ability scores
A couple of general hints:
- Use the same weapon in each hand. Pick up Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization for +1 attack/+2 damage on each hand.
- A dip into urban barbarian will let you rage Dex for another +2 attack and damage. (If you go the str route, regular barbarian or even bloodrager would work.) Even better, the Furious weapon enhancement will give you another +2 attack and damage when raging.
- If you can count the swashbuckler weapon training as "weapon training" for the sake of Gloves of Dueling, there's another +2 attack and damage. (This is a higher level item, but I've found it's worth it.)
- Once you hit swashbuckler 5 and get Improved critical, spring for a wand of Bless weapon. If you're fighting evil creatures, it will automatically confirm any crit threats.
Overall, those tricks will add +7 attack and +8 damage on top of your other bonuses.
That said, a GM who doesn't like Agile... probably won't like the Lace. Worth a shot, but I won't bet too highly on it.I would also have this concern. :)
I'm playing a ninja/magus with craft magical arms and armor, and I just put agile on my wakizachis, and my DM b|tched and moaned about it, claiming it makes Dexterity the overpowered, go-to stat, "and-why-would-anyone-play-anything-other-than-a-dex-build?"
Yes, DMs will complain. Count on it. But if they don't nerf it off the bat then you can probably keep it.
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Consider the feat combo I posted... It works without any magic items at all, and I've never heard of a GM banning any of those feats...