My question deals with the base Summoner class.
just a quick clarification..... If I read the description correctly a summoner cannot use their "Summon Monster" class ability while their Eidolon is active.
Are their any feats that allow for both the Eidolon to be active and to have the ability to use the Summon Monster ability?
Any feats that allow for a Eidolon to be dismissed and summoned more quickly than a 1 minute ritual?
Are their any feats that allow the summoner to get some other ability in place of the "Summon Monster" ability? I am guessing this is more of an Archtype deal?
I read through some of the Archtypes for the Summoner but I am not sure I understand them correctly. Is there an Archtype that replaces the summon monster ability with other useful abilities?
We are playing a home game and not stictly PFS but our GM is trying to stick as close to PFS as possible. I am not trying to be explotive. I just want to understand my options.
Thanks =)
Good answers....
I know the Master Summoner is not going to be allowed and I don't really have any desire to play a Synth summoner.
One other clarification, if I rad the Summon Monster ability correct you can only have one spell effect from that at any given time. Basically, I cannot spam all 6 sommon monster one after another. When a new one shows up the old one goes away. Correct?
You can take the spell Summon Eidolon as one of your spells known. That lets you summon it as a full round action. That or the Elf FCB are the only faster eidolon routes that I know of.
The summoner can also take the summon monster spells for their spells known. This will let you have the small army of summoned monsters. However, I wouldn't take this option unless you first talk it over with your group and GM. MANY people do not like this, because unless you the player are extremely organized and efficient, it can slow the game to a crawl while you make 34 attack rolls, 22 damage rolls, 13 CMB checks, etc...
Repeated for emphasis. Monster spam can be deadly-powerful, but by the GODS does it slow down gameplay.You can take the spell Summon Eidolon as one of your spells known. That lets you summon it as a full round action. That or the Elf FCB are the only faster eidolon routes that I know of.
The summoner can also take the summon monster spells for their spells known. This will let you have the small army of summoned monsters. However, I wouldn't take this option unless you first talk it over with your group and GM. MANY people do not like this, because unless you the player are extremely organized and efficient, it can slow the game to a crawl while you make 34 attack rolls, 22 damage rolls, 13 CMB checks, etc...
Agreed.
One time I did it by group request and with GM approval. I summoned I think 13 small earth elementals and the other sorcerer summoned 8 lantern archons. Playing out the fight took seemingly forever! But we were able to take on a lot more foes all at once than could have reasonably been expected at our level. They couldn't swarm us because our minions were swarming them.
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Your most versatile option for using the Summoner's summons and eidolon in combat is to combine use of the Summon Monster class feature with the Summon Eidolon spell. While many encounters won't even last 2 rounds, you will be able to pull out both of these resources in just 2 rounds for those combats that will both drag on and require them.
That said, the thing that the rules specifically disallow is the use of the Summon Monster class feature while your Eidolon is summoned. It does not disallow your Summoner from summoning his/her Eidolon after calling for a monster using their Summon Monster class feature. If you have the full minute prior to combat to set up this configuration, this can be a viable tactic at levels higher than 1.
Lastly, there are Summoner archetypes that allow you to use the Summon Monster class feature while your Eidolon is out right off the bat. The catch is that you have to sacrifice your Eidolon's growth (you get what is called a Lesser Eidolon) in exchange for this versatility.
The Summoner class is very powerful so it is doubtful that you will need to use these configurations. With just one of the Eidolon or Summon Monster class features it is already in danger of outshining other classes in typical encounters. On top of that, it has decent hit points, 3/4 base attack progression, and 3/4 casting in light armor. No matter what you do with the class, you'll be fine.