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Or, you could reward the player for specialising in something, especially considering it has out-of-combat and interesting roleplay applications?
Intimidate suffers enough as the weakest social skill. It doesn't need to be nerfed further.
Just keep letting them do as they are now.
If they're managing to succeed that often against things that much bigger than them, that means they've invested a lot into doing it. Let people who've invested a lot be good at what they want to do.
I takes a standard action in battle, and that's a steep cost to pay when things are trying to kill your character. If you've got crazy bonuses and a way to do it without spending a standard action, then you've made an investment to become good. Making someone shaken isn't worth sweating over.
Be the Jerk GM and set the DC to x+his bonus. Where x is the value that gives you the miss percentage you want. And make it so the DC is different for each character. So that way the low skilled people aren't penalized for the good skill guy's skills.
I think it makes perfect sense that someone can always succeed a skill. I think a threatening looking guy looks scary, even if he's nice and peaceful. In game terms, he's using diplomacy but I'm being effected by intimidate.
Plus the effects of the skill don't force anyone to do anything. Also if he's using it in towns and the like then there are consequences, the town watch might be after him, or the town might not do business with him.
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The skill system in Pathfinder does not have natural 1 or natural 20 behavior. This is by design. If a character is good enough at a skill to succeed on a 1, then they succeed on a 1. Figure out the modifiers (including circumstance), roll (or take 10, if possible), and abide by the result. A character who can stare down a dragon well enough to give it pause is certainly rare but fits a number of tropes.
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Chances are you are not using intimidate correctly if you feel it is overpowered in social settings.
From d20pfsrd:
You can use Intimidate to force an opponent to act friendly toward you for 1d6 × 10 minutes with a successful check. The DC of this check is equal to 10 + the target’s Hit Dice + the target’s Wisdom modifier.
Success: If successful, the opponent will:
•give you information you desire
•take actions that do not endanger it
•offer other limited assistance
After the intimidate expires, the target treats you as unfriendly and may report you to local authorities.
Fail: If you fail this check by 5 or more, the target attempts to deceive you or otherwise hinder your activities.
Influence Attitude Action
Using Intimidate to change an opponent’s attitude requires 1 minute of conversation.
Try Again
You can attempt to intimidate an opponent again, but each additional check increases the DC by +5. This increase resets after one hour has passed.
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It's worth noting that the 'make people friendly' use requires a full minute of conversation, same as Diplomacy. And, given the nature of Intimidate, is pretty obvious.
Frankly, if they try to Intimidate powerful people, they should expect a swift and decisive response long before a minute passes: "Are you threatening me?!" followed by violence or a call for their guards seems a very reasonable response in many situations.
Now,if they arrange the situation so that can't happen, well then, they deserve to reap the rewards of their skill checks just like everybody else.
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I'm fine with Intimidate for it's Demoralize use. That's fine.
But the convincing it to help you (in the manner as diplomacy does) really bothers me. Of course, diplomacy and bluff as written also bother me a lot as well.
I typically tell my players that these abilities will not work all the time upfront. Some characters or creatures will not be persuaded through force or brown-nosing to give you what you want.
There is one main official situational modifier: size. If you're smaller than your target, you take a -4 to the Intimidate check.
I'm fine with Intimidate for it's Demoralize use. That's fine.
But the convincing it to help you (in the manner as diplomacy does) really bothers me. Of course, diplomacy and bluff as written also bother me a lot as well.
I typically tell my players that these abilities will not work all the time upfront. Some characters or creatures will not be persuaded through force or brown-nosing to give you what you want.
Really? Paying protection money isn't being 'helpful'? Keeping quiet about being bullied isn't helping the bully?
Unless you know the full motivations and personality of a creature there is no reason to shut down either skill, aside from random dickery. It is fine for a major NPC to be that detailed, but not for random shopkeeper #37 or random bandit #72, that is what the dice are for.
I'm fine with Intimidate for it's Demoralize use. That's fine.
But the convincing it to help you (in the manner as diplomacy does) really bothers me. Of course, diplomacy and bluff as written also bother me a lot as well.
I typically tell my players that these abilities will not work all the time upfront. Some characters or creatures will not be persuaded through force or brown-nosing to give you what you want.
Really? Paying protection money isn't being 'helpful'? Keeping quiet about being bullied isn't helping the bully?
Unless you know the full motivations and personality of a creature there is no reason to shut down either skill, aside from random dickery. It is fine for a major NPC to be that detailed, but not for random shopkeeper #37 or random bandit #72, that is what the dice are for.
I didn't say random characters did I? I said some. I didn't elaborate at the time, but way to go making completely incorrect assumptions. And based on the hostility of your post, I have no desire to elaborate now either.
I warn my players up front. They know what they're getting into.
The DC for intimidate is based on the hit dice and wisdom modifier of the target, so it is already harder to intimidate more powerful creatures. There are also penalties if the target is larger than the character. And you can always apply circumstantial modifiers based on the target's personality, social status, number of buddies, etc.
Since intimidate takes a minute (like diplomacy), you can have the target just do something before the minute is up. There's nothing that says the target has to sit and listen to you for 10 rounds before deciding what to do. In a lot of modules, you'll see Morale comments like "He was bullied as a child, so any attempt to intimidate him makes him immediately call for help" or "He considers himself the toughest guy in town, so if anyone tries to intimidate him, he initiates combat."
I think intimidate already works the way the way you want it to, so maybe I'm not understanding what the issue is.
