You Have 40 Levels: What Do?


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion

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Scarab Sages

Mysterious Stranger wrote:
20th level Zen Archer/20th level Inquisitor. Flurry of Greater Bane, Judgments and a few buffing spells get insane amount of damage. Throw in Cluster Shot and Hammer the Gap for more damage. With proper items I can get over 1000 point of damage in a round. Massive damage rules means this will kill any living thing.

If your using massive damage rules, the kensai/diviner or kensai/sohei always wins.

80+ initiative and nova vs. touch AC. In the game of rocket tag, he who fires first wins.


Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber
Evil Midnight Lurker wrote:
20 Wizard/10 Magaambyan Arcanist/10 Riftwarden. Demons go home!

That beats my idea, as you get caster level 37 with that build.

Of course, now that I am looking at Paths of Prestige, I realize that my real holy grail (to get caster level 40th) would be Wizard 20/Magaambyan Arcanist 10/Veiled Illusionist 10.


1 or 2 level in all PC and NPC classes and then use the left over levels for the Soul Drinker prestige class. Mwahaha I have all the saves!


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L33Fish wrote:

Investigator 20/Druid 20 for 2 reasons

1. Every skill is now a class skill.
2. You can turn into an Allosaurus, activate studied combat, and pounce on someone.

Clever girl....

Liberty's Edge

Blood Arcanist (draconic bloodline) 10, Dragon Disciple 10, Wizard 20.

I am a man turned dragon. I have immortality and a knowledge of the arcane that is simply beyond mortal understanding. Also, I hang out in an extra-dimensional dragon lair styled wizard tower (tower on the inside dragon lair on the outside) with a library the size of a small country and comfy chairs.

Alternatively, I have a homebrew caster-focused variant of Dragon Disciple (Dragon Sage) that I would rather use. It gets full casting progression and some interesting spell abilities tied to bloodline spells along with an expended set of bloodline spells. Also gains mental ability increases instead of physical.


Artanthos wrote:
Mysterious Stranger wrote:
20th level Zen Archer/20th level Inquisitor. Flurry of Greater Bane, Judgments and a few buffing spells get insane amount of damage. Throw in Cluster Shot and Hammer the Gap for more damage. With proper items I can get over 1000 point of damage in a round. Massive damage rules means this will kill any living thing.

If your using massive damage rules, the kensai/diviner or kensai/sohei always wins.

80+ initiative and nova vs. touch AC. In the game of rocket tag, he who fires first wins.

And if your not using massive damage rules they don't always win or alternatively you go first and kill your opponent who automatically resurrects.

However that aside I'm not interested in being the ultimate killing machine, I know my class choices aren't the optimum but they are fun and work much better for someone who just wants to wander around the world seeing what's out there.


Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Mysterious Stranger wrote:
20th level Zen Archer/20th level Inquisitor. Flurry of Greater Bane, Judgments and a few buffing spells get insane amount of damage. Throw in Cluster Shot and Hammer the Gap for more damage. With proper items I can get over 1000 point of damage in a round. Massive damage rules means this will kill any living thing.

A variation of this, inquisitor 20/ZAM 10/evangelist of Erastil 10

Everything MS said, plus Wis to attack and damage rolls on top of the normal Dex/Str combo.

Abundant Step requires 12th level monk. With a full 40 levels you can pick up the full dimensional Savant chain. Combine this with the teamwork feats from the inquisitor that allows you to flank with a ranged attack. Also Diamond Soul gives you a spell resistance of 30 at 20th level. Combine this with stalwart and a ring of evasion (Zen Archers lose evasion) and you laugh at magic. A spell has to get past your spell resistance and you have to fail the save for it to have any effect. You will also be giving up an extra attack per round due to losing the extra attack from flurry at 15th. All in all staying full Zen Archer/Inquisitor seems stronger.


One level of every non-alignment-conflicted base class, one level of random qualified prestige classes to finish up. I want the longest frickin' sheet header ever.

Alternately, cleric 10/paladin 10/inquisitor 10/warpriest 10--all of different gods. Just to make things awkward. Replace one non-paladin class with juju oracle or necromancer if that's how I roll that day.


Okay I've gone over this and I'd go with . . .

Ranger 1 (Youkai hunter), Arcanist (blood arcanist) 9, Eldritch Knight 10, Monk (Master of many styles) 11 and ninja 9.


There are 28 (then 3 you can't take with others Ninja, etc) base classes, so

Alchemist 1
Arcanist 1
Barbarian 1
Bard 1
Bloodrager 1
Brawler 1
Cavalier 1
Cleric 1
Druid 1
Fighter 1
Gunslinger 1
Hunter 1
Inquistor 1
Investigator 1
Magus 1
Monk 1
Oracle 1
Paladin 1
Rogue 1
Shaman 1
Skald 1
Slayer 1
Sorcerer 1
Summoner 1
Swashbuckler 1
Warpriest 1
Witch 1
Wizard 1

That's 28, now I'm pretty sure there are going to be some alignment classes there. After that I'd start taking the prestige classes you qualify for (1 level only), or the NPC classes if you're allowed.

I think that'd be the least powerful level 40 character ever.

Scarab Sages

Liam Warner wrote:
However that aside I'm not interested in being the ultimate killing machine, I know my class choices aren't the optimum but they are fun and work much better for someone who just wants to wander around the world seeing what's out there.

One of the advantages of being a 20th level wizard: Immortality.

Seriously though, the kensai/wizard gestalt combines to form a single seamless class. Unlike a lot of martial/caster hybrids, there are no conflicts, you don't have to decide what you are each round.


Quote:
I think that'd be the least powerful level 40 character ever.

Let's find out!

-----------

+2/+2/+0
+0/+0/+2
+2/+0/+0
+0/+2/+2
+2/+0/+0
+2/+2/+0
+2/+0/+0
+2/+0/+2
+2/+0/+2
+2/+0/+0
+2/+2/+0
+2/+2/+0
+2/+0/+2
+0/+2/+2
+2/+0/+2
+2/+2/+2
+0/+0/+2
+2/+0/+2
+0/+2/+0
+0/+0/+2
+2/+0/+2
+2/+2/+0
+0/+0/+2
+0/+2/+0
+2/+0/+2
+0/+0/+2
+0/+0/+2

+34/+20/+32

-----------

BAB +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1

+10

-----------

d12 [1]
d10 [1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1]
d8 [1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1]
d6 [1+1+1+1]

-----------

At level 28, you've got a +34 fortitude, +20 reflex, and +32 will, and a +10 base attack bonus.

You'd have (4d6 plus 15d8 plus 9d10 plus 1d12) hit dice.

This means 6+(10.5+67.5+49.5+6.5) hit points or 140 hit points.

By comparison, a 40th level commoner 20/expert 20 would have +35 attack bonus, +12/+12/+18 saves, and 20d6 plus 20d8 hit dice and 162 hit points. (An aristocrat would have fewer skill points, but more innate proficiency.)

-----------

None of the above considers anything like class features (which the NPC classes lack entirely) or wealth by level (which the NPC classes strictly have less) or feats (bonus feats narrows the gap a bit, though not too much, between the 40th level character and the 28th).

Obviously, I didn't go beyond 28th level - if you add prestige classes, none of them give you more than a +1 to your saves at first level - hence your saves aren't going to be increasing that much. If you entirely avoid BAB (I'm presuming this is possible over the next twelve levels, though I'm not certain), the most likely one to increase is going to be Will, though Reflex might get a number of boosts in there. Either way, neither are going to get more than +6, I'd guess... though, depending on prestige requirements (I'm not sure about them well enough off the top of my head) some of your choices may be made for you (i.e. you don't qualify for many, thus are required to take some others), which may alter that.

Anyway, onto the comparison:

Considering they've nearly the same number of hit points, despite the rather substantially larger attack bonus on the commoner/expert, my money is on the level 28 character. I mean, just think of the number of magic missiles that could be launched...

Still, it's a fun mental exercise! :D


Hrm, assuming that multiclassing is treated separately for each 20:
5 Paladin/5 Rogue/10 Ranger x 20 Sorcerer (Arcane Bloodline).
Focus Charisma for Spells/DCs/Saves/Smite. Ranger to get feats. Rogue for skills/evasion. Sorcerer because there isn't a Cha-based, full progression, prepared casting class in Paizo's stuff.

Alternatively
18 Sorcerer (Empyreal Blooded)/Sohei Monk 2 x 10 Dragon Disciple/10 Eldrich Knight.
I MUST GISH ALL THE TIME! Get wis to AC, casting, initiative, will save.


Artanthos wrote:
Liam Warner wrote:
However that aside I'm not interested in being the ultimate killing machine, I know my class choices aren't the optimum but they are fun and work much better for someone who just wants to wander around the world seeing what's out there.

One of the advantages of being a 20th level wizard: Immortality.

Seriously though, the kensai/wizard gestalt combines to form a single seamless class. Unlike a lot of martial/caster hybrids, there are no conflicts, you don't have to decide what you are each round.

Maybe not but I'm really more in favour of the arcanist spell style than the wizards and arcnists so far as I know can't get immortality.


Artemis Moonstar wrote:
Investigator 20/Ninja 20, you investigate cases, solve them, and assassinate the problem... Problem is, you're sneaky about it, so the world will never know.

See... My first thought was something along those lines... but my idea was a human or aasimar or half elf mastermind investigator 20/diviner wizard 20.

"It's not often that I am unsure of what to do, but that's when I throw the perfect spell at it."


Artanthos wrote:
Mysterious Stranger wrote:
20th level Zen Archer/20th level Inquisitor. Flurry of Greater Bane, Judgments and a few buffing spells get insane amount of damage. Throw in Cluster Shot and Hammer the Gap for more damage. With proper items I can get over 1000 point of damage in a round. Massive damage rules means this will kill any living thing.

If your using massive damage rules, the kensai/diviner or kensai/sohei always wins.

80+ initiative and nova vs. touch AC. In the game of rocket tag, he who fires first wins.

That is assuming you get to attack. I can be hiding over 100 feet away and use Dimensional Savant to suddenly be within 30 feet of you and attack you 8 times. I have Righteous Might, True Seeing, Divine Power, Find Quarry, Greater Invisibility, Spell Immunity, Stoneskin, Freedom of Movement, Nondetection, Daybreak Arrow, Heroism, Hunters Eye, and each arrow has had Greater Named Bullet cast on it from a scroll.

I teleport in and attack your touch AC, and automatically have a potential critical due to greater magic bullet, if I actually roll a critical the extra +40 damage is also multiplied by 3. Each hit will be doing between 390 to 550 points of damage assuming I confirm the critical, and then at the end I teleport back out to where I was hidden. If you manage to somehow get a shot at me I am immune to your spell, and ignore the first 100 points of normal damage assuming you do not have an adamantine weapon.

Sovereign Court

Wizard 20/Arcane Archer 2/Monk 2/Paladin 16

I can shoot antimagic fields at you, and I have evasion, and insanely good saves.


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Or, there's always the classic Monk 20/Paladin 20.

I have saves. So many saves. Even if you manage to *hit* me with anything, I don't care.

God forbid you're evil, because Flurry of Smites is a thing.

I also take the title of 'Most MAD character ever!," but hey.

Sovereign Court

Ninja 20, Sorcerer 10, Arcane trickster 10
What do you mean you just magic missiled me for 5d4 + 75d6?

Sczarni

alair223 wrote:

Ninja 20, Sorcerer 10, Arcane trickster 10

What do you mean you just magic missiled me for 5d4 + 75d6?

I'm pretty sure you can't deal sneak attack damage with Magic Missile, because there's no attack roll and therefore you aren't "aiming" it. Ray of Frost still works though.

Personally, I'd go Cavalier 20/Druid 20, and hope that the GM would let my mount also be my animal companion, so my horse would also make it to Level 40. Now I just need non-metal horse armor!


Silent Saturn wrote:
alair223 wrote:

Ninja 20, Sorcerer 10, Arcane trickster 10

What do you mean you just magic missiled me for 5d4 + 75d6?

I'm pretty sure you can't deal sneak attack damage with Magic Missile, because there's no attack roll and therefore you aren't "aiming" it. Ray of Frost still works though.

Personally, I'd go Cavalier 20/Druid 20, and hope that the GM would let my mount also be my animal companion, so my horse would also make it to Level 40. Now I just need non-metal horse armor!

Arcane trickster capstone lets you sneak attack with fireball, much less magic missile. Weirdly, in the latter case the sneak attack only applies to a single missile, while the former case sneak attacks everything within the area of effect. Yeah, I don't get it either.


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The OP didn't mention NPC classes being limited to 20 levels.

I'll make a Commoner 40. I'll pretend to be a Fighter 20 with my BAB +20 and my 20 feats.

Sovereign Court

blahpers wrote:
Arcane trickster capstone lets you sneak attack with fireball, much less magic missile. Weirdly, in the latter case the sneak attack only applies to a single missile, while the former case sneak attacks everything within the area of effect. Yeah, I don't get it either.

Really? I knew it worked for fireball since the capstone states that effects that allow a saving throw for half or negate also halves and negates sneak attack, but I didn't know that sneak attack would only work on 1 missile.

Why is that? If the condition that they are flatfooted holds then all should work? Obviously things like feint and the like only last for 1 attack so 1 missile but since each is a separate thing and an opponent was flatfooted in say a surprise round why wouldn't all missile deal sneak attack?


Summoner 20/3.5 Favoured Soul 20. In addition to the power of spontaneous divine spells, anyone see where this is going? If you said Yuna from Final Fantasy X, you're right and are creepily prescient, guessing that with no hints.


alair223 wrote:
blahpers wrote:
Arcane trickster capstone lets you sneak attack with fireball, much less magic missile. Weirdly, in the latter case the sneak attack only applies to a single missile, while the former case sneak attacks everything within the area of effect. Yeah, I don't get it either.

Really? I knew it worked for fireball since the capstone states that effects that allow a saving throw for half or negate also halves and negates sneak attack, but I didn't know that sneak attack would only work on 1 missile.

Why is that? If the condition that they are flatfooted holds then all should work? Obviously things like feint and the like only last for 1 attack so 1 missile but since each is a separate thing and an opponent was flatfooted in say a surprise round why wouldn't all missile deal sneak attack?

Ruling that any spell that doesn't use iteratives but has multiple missiles is a volley. Ruling that volleys only get sneak attack once per spell.


Thomas Long 175 wrote:
Ruling that any spell that doesn't use iteratives but has multiple missiles is a volley. Ruling that volleys only get sneak attack once per spell.

Because Paizo mandates that even when they're also wizards, rogues must suck.

Also, human Reincarnated Druid 10 Tetori 9 Lore Warden 15 Magus 6

He has 21 feats, 9 fighter bonus feats, 2 arcana, combat expertise, improved unarmed strike, Improved Grapple, Stunning Pin, Greater Grapple, and stunning fist from fixed bonus feats.

Those feats should be Weapon Focus (bite), weapon focus (unarmed strike), Martial Versatility (weapon focus (unarmed strike)), feral combat training (bite), martial versatility (feral combat training (bite)), weapon specialization (improved unarmed strike), greater weapon focus (improved unarmed strike), greater weapon specialization (improved unarmed strike), rapid grappler, dragon style, dragon ferocity, weapon focus (grapple), greater weapon focus (grapple), all 6 save boosting feats, improved initiative, natural speech, natural spell, improved concentration, warrior priest, extra arcana (x2), hamatula strike, body shield, improved critical (unarmed strike), hamatulatsu, power attack, and rime spell metamagic.

He has a domain, probably plains, so he qualifies for warrior priest and can, a few times per day, charge when shaped like a Quetzalcoatlus. The only weapon training group that matters is the natural weapon group.

His arcana are Natural Spell Combat (bite), Natural Spell Combat (claw), and Broad Study (druid), and ki arcana.

He prefers to spend his days as an allosaurus or quetzalcoatlus, but being a dire tiger or even leopard is acceptable if squeezing is an issue. He uses martial versatility in feral combat training to apply every single feat or effect augmenting unarmed strike to every natural weapon. He pounces and uses hamatula strike to make a grapple attack for every weapon he hits with (both bite and claw do pierce, but then with hamatulatsu and feral combat training and martial versatility every natural attack can do piercing damage) until he succeeds.

Sure, he's no kensai 20 wizard 20 or druid 20 cleric 20, but he's pretty good at making his one trick stick. Besides, save DCs for spells and class abilities stop scaling when you stop taking levels in the class, but stunning fist just keeps on scaling with all of your levels, making it one of the few abilities with a saving throw that might occasionally work against CR 40 foes.


ooh a double helping of alchemist one of which is a combo of chirurgeon/vivesectionist with the other being the reanimator archetype, maybe see if I could throw the crypt breaker in too,

another one, and this is thanks to Interjection Games, who I have just discovered and were it not premature to buying their stuff, would be humping their leg already.

A brewmaster 20 herbalist 20

Dark Archive

Woodland skirmisher Ranger 20//Wood school Wizard 10/Maagambyan Arcanist 10

You have full BAB, all good saves. You are a 20th level Wizard. But you are also a Ranger. And you are also a Druid!


I'm a man of simple tastes.

Either a Fighter/barbarian 20 or fighter/brawler 20.


FormerFiend wrote:

I'm a man of simple tastes.

Either a Fighter/barbarian 20 or fighter/brawler 20.

That would make punching daggers really, really fun to flurry with.


Oh, why the heck not....

Ninja 20/Slayer 20. I'm a simple man... I stab you, and you never know it.


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A Half Orc Paladin 16/Sorcerer 10/Dragon Disciple 10/ Eldritch Knight 4. Take Fey Foundling, Ferocious Resolve, Greater Mercy, and Reactive Healing. Have a Contingency that casts Deathless on yourself when you are killed.

This character will be almost unstoppable. He cannot be killed for 20 rounds from HP damage. He has multiple immunities, and will probably make any saving throws vs anything he is not immune to. He is fully functional during the 20 rounds after being “killed”. He can cast Timestop and have 2-5 rounds of casting to heal and, or buff himself after being “Killed”. He can also heal himself for around 50 HP per round as a swift action. On the 19th round he again casts Timestop and use Wish to fully heal himself.

He also has full 20th level casting level of a sorcerer to back up his martial ability. Vs. an evil opponent he will be doing a ridicules amount of damage. If he uses a falchion and takes improved critical, and casts Bless Weapon he will automatically critical on a 15 or better. Throw in Litany of Righteousness to for double damage vs. evil.


Eldritch Godling 20 + Psion 20

I have all the awesome.


Westphalian_Musketeer wrote:

Let's play a game, you're building a character with 40 levels, but cannot progress past 20 levels for core/base/hybrid class, nor the max level of a prestige class as it is written in its source material.

This effectively means you get two 20 level capstones, or a prestige class capped and a single 20 level capstone, or any number of other combinations. This is all purely for fun. Archetypes permitted as well.

I'll start us off: Alchemist and Sorcerer (sage archetype for ability synergy), getting one of the bloodlines that grants immunity to an energy type. Top it off with a bunch of Detonate extracts, and become a constantly exploding, self-buffing maniac.

So, how awesome/powerful of a character could you make with 40 levels?

Cleric 15, Wizard 15, Mystic theruge 10.

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