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Well... That's nice and all, but the amount of effort and resources invested to get a okay bonus for 1 attack makes sure AA is still pretty much useless 99% of the time.
Benevolent is an enhancement I'd never use on add to any weapon, and I sure as hell wouldn't spend a ring slot with a Ring of Tactical precision.
IMHO, if your character has nothing better to do, then someone made some grievous mistake in their character build and/or combat tactics.
Aid Another is one of those mechanics that are good in theory, but got neutered by their implementation.
I'm fairly certain that if someone put as much effort into optimizing pretty much anything else they would be able to do a heck of a lot more.
Still, I'm glad Aid Another exists. It is an option, occasionally has a use, and makes sense in a real world sense which is always nice.
Now, if you could use Aid Another as a single one of your iterative attacks...
Early on it can be quite good. Wizard may not have any spells left but can grant a +2 to the fighter, which is a solid 33% increase in attack bonus. But in higher levels, +2 is only a ~15% increase, the aiding player has a lot of options to do in combat, and honestly if they aren't a frontline class then they need to get far away from the bad guy. Usually at this point, if getting away is impossible, full defense is more useful because you'll get splattered all over your party mate if the monster gets a hit in.
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Everyone keeps talking about aid another in combat.
In my experience, it gets used a LOT more in skill checks. I play PFS, so I'm dealing with different players at the table every week, and I can't remember a session when we didn't use aid another at least 10 times on skill checks. With 3-5 people trying to help the main skill guy succeed at something, even if only half of them succeed at hitting DC 10, you'll get anywhere from +2 to +10 on the skill check.
The article probably should have mentioned the Bodyguard feat, not to mention the Halfling Opportunist prestige class, who gets more aid from others than the normal +2, regardless of who's aiding them. I have a dex based Halfling Opportunist with the Helpful trait, and he already has Combat Reflexes for normal reasons. I'll take Bodyguard for him as soon as I have a spare feat (might not be until level 11).
Lemmy,
If you take the Bodyguard Feat you can do it several times by sacrificing your AOO, and then you still get your turn. If you're looking for biggest number of bangs, I'd say that's probably a way to do it.
This particular build focused only on making it as big as possible.
That's... okay, I guess. However, even ignoring the fact that characters are not usually adjacent to each other, it's still a pretty underwhelming feat.
You need a good bonus on AA for Bodyguard to be truly useful, but as I said, it takes too much effort and too many resources that could have been put to better use. I still would never spend money on AA-boosting gear, especially if it takes an item slot or makes my weapon exponentially more expensive.
I'm sure AA can be useful in combat from time to time... But unless you're going for some gimmicky build, investing in Aid Another seems like a really bad idea for me. Almost as bad as investing on crossbows.
Out of combat, Aid Another is okay, since it's basically a free bonus to skill checks, but I'd still not put money and feats into it.
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RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16
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About a month ago I put together a blog post about "5 Rules Pathfinder Players Keep Forgetting," and it was pretty successful. There were a lot of people who said thanks for giving them reference numbers, and that they'd never even thought about some of the things I mentioned. There were a lot of people though who claimed that Aid Another had no place on the list, because it was useless. According to these people a +2 was a waste of time, and it was better off forgotten.
I was baffled by how people could honestly say it's a better idea to swing knowing you need a 20 to hit, than to pitch in as a group and help out the character who has a fighting chance of actually ending the fight. So I decided to do a little digging and create a guide for making Aid Another as powerful as possible.
These are the results. A +10 to attack or AC, anyone?
I've actually got a current PFS-legal character (level 6) who can spend a Swift action to give an ally a +10 Dodge bonus to AC, and his mount can spend a Move action to give an ADDITIONAL +5 Dodge bonus to AC, for a +15, and still get his entire full attack action in a round.
Aid another is amazing. Period.
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Lemmy,
If you take the Bodyguard Feat you can do it several times by sacrificing your AOO, and then you still get your turn. If you're looking for biggest number of bangs, I'd say that's probably a way to do it.
This particular build focused only on making it as big as possible.
That's... okay, I guess. However, even ignoring the fact that characters are not usually adjacent to each other, it's still a pretty underwhelming feat.
You need a good bonus on AA for Bodyguard to be truly useful, but as I said, it takes too much effort and too many resources that could have been put to better use. I still would never spend money on AA-boosting gear, especially if it takes an item slot or makes my weapon exponentially more expensive.
I'm sure AA can be useful in combat from time to time... But unless you're going for some gimmicky build, investing in Aid Another seems like a really bad idea for me. Almost as bad as investing on crossbows.
Out of combat, Aid Another is okay, since it's basically a free bonus to skill checks, but I'd still not put money and feats into it.
If you've already got a high dex character with Combat Reflexes, then you're rarely going to use all your AoOs per turn anyway. In that case, it might be worth investing a feat and making a point of standing next to your allies in battle to give them +2 AC regularly. It's not something I'd do on every character, but there are builds where it's nice, even if you don't focus on min/maxing Aid Another.
And remember, Aid Another can help with combat maneuvers, too. In one particular PFS scenario where the BBEG is known for being particularly deadly, our team grappler completely shut him down by grappling him, with the help of 3 or 4 other people using Aid Another to make sure the grapple succeeded and wouldn't be broken.
And if your a summoner (brood master) your flank buddy's can each give you aid another without taxing the party....
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Early on it can be quite good. Wizard may not have any spells left but can grant a +2 to the fighter, which is a solid 33% increase in attack bonus. But in higher levels, +2 is only a ~15% increase, the aiding player has a lot of options to do in combat, and honestly if they aren't a frontline class then they need to get far away from the bad guy.
Improving 1d20+4 to 1d20+6 vs AC 15 is exactly the same as improving 1d20+24 to 1d20+26 vs AC 35.
Here's some food for thought: Do you have a group of murderhobos bullying a village because they feel invulnerable for their level? Show them that being surrounded by angry villagers is really dangerous.
Maybe the PCs AC is high enough someone would need a 20 to hit them. What about 7 villagers all using Aid Another to help that 8th individual make his grapple check to take down that pesky PC...?
Get enough angry villagers and it's almost like "Take 20", as those villagers will just keep coming at you until they score a hit. Then it's tar and feathers time.
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I, for one, am quite interested in seeing Cartmanbeck's character build. That seems like quite the impressive boosting character there.
Thomas, if that Swift and Move action manage to keep another player from getting splattered by a heavy-hitting beast of a monster, it shows Aid Another as being useful. Remember, that same reasoning led to the Crane Wing defense feat getting nerfed hard.
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A +15 AC against the first attack. For everything you've put into getting that +15 you're only basically negating one attack and still spending actions to do so.Aid another isn't worth investing in. Full Attacks win out in damage everytime, and full attacks have more than one attack. Aid another isn't worth the investment. Period.
For a battle herald, the Aid Another strategy can be quite useful, with minimal investment.
Feats:
Bodyguard feat (The honor guard archetype gives you this for free at 3rd level.) Use AoOs when an adjacent ally is attacked to aid another for AC.
Combat Reflexes (You need this to gain additional AoOs, but given this strategy works best with a reach weapon character you are likely to take this anyway.)
Bonus breakdown:
- Normal aid another bonus: +2
- Order of the dragon cavalier (level 2): +1
- Honor guard archetype (level 3): +1
- Benevolent armor (+2,000 gp): +X (X is the armor enhancement)
- Gloves of arcane striking (5,000 gp): +Y (Y is Arcane Strike damage bonus).
- Teamwork inspiring command (move action to activate): usually +1 or +2
I have an 11th level PFS character with this, who has +4 armor and +2 Arcane Strike damage and 14 Dex. Three times per round when an adjacent ally is attacked he can give them a +10 bonus to AC, and still take his full round of actions during his own turn.
So for the investment of picking a useful cavalier order and archetype, then spending 7,000 gp and taking a feat I was going to take anyway, I think that's a pretty good deal.
And the character isn't even a tiefling who was adopted by helpful halflings. :-)
So I wouldn't say Aid Another is always a great idea, but it can be useful in the right builds or under the right circumstances.
Well... That's nice and all, but the amount of effort and resources invested to get a okay bonus for 1 attack makes sure AA is still pretty much useless 99% of the time.
Benevolent is an enhancement I'd never use on add to any weapon, and I sure as hell wouldn't spend a ring slot with a Ring of Tactical precision.
IMHO, if your character has nothing better to do, then someone made some grievous mistake in their character build and/or combat tactics.
Aid Another is one of those mechanics that are good in theory, but got neutered by their implementation.
Azata-Blooded Aasimar Arcane Duelist Bard 18/Sacred Shield Paladin 2 would heavily disagree with you.
The reason you see it as stupid is because you aren't doing it right. Consider this:
Aid Another is a Standard Action, correct? You can ready a Standard Action, including Aid Another, correct? So, couldn't I ready an Aid Another to Aid my ally's lowest attack roll to help confirm his lower hits? You betcha, my ally just got a heavily increased DPR for me confirming hits for him. What else would I do with my Standard Action? Cast buffs? Sure, if I need to cast them. Crowd-Control effects? If there's anything I need to lock down that we can't deal with right now, certainly. It's not like I have super-gamechanging spells available to me, being a 6th spell level caster and all.
I can also use the Swift Aid feat, granting half an Aid Another bonus to an ally's roll as a Swift Action to help the highest attack confirm too, if the enemy's AC is super-high, but if I don't have to, Quickened Buffs or Crowd Control effects via a Metamagic Rod are still available to me, or better yet, granting my Arcane Strike damage bonus to my ally, or increasing his AC for a single attack, probably the enemy's Highest Base Attack, equal to that of the bonus damage to be delivered via Bodyguard are also valid choices to make with my Swift Action for the round.
Speaking of Bodyguard, the ability to provide Aid of a base of up to +10 AC (I calculated 9 before, thanks for mentioning that ring!), while having an Arcane Bonded +5 Benevolent Cestus (much easier and cheaper to craft it that way). Even if it's for just one attack, having an 18 Base Dexterity. The best part is? These all stack with other people who Aid Another.
And that's just in regards to Aid Another. This character can also go Fighting Defensively, increasing his Reflex Saves, as well as granting half of the extra benefits for doing so to any ally adjacent to him. And once per combat, I add my Charisma as Deflection AC against a target, and if he tries to hit anyone close to me (I save this for the BBEG of a campaign), they only take 50% of the actual damage. Tack on the ability to buff like a Bard with Haste, Heroism, plus Inspire Courage and other great goodies, and your allies are going to have bonuses that make them only not work on a 1 (or 20 if it's against an enemy's roll).
@ Thomas Long 175: A Dazing Spell casts as 3 levels higher, so that's not really a scary thing by the time it becomes relevant. There are better things to apply for lesser spell levels (Empower, Intensify, Heighten, Extend, just to name a few). Even so, unless you get it in a rod, it's highly impractical to take as a Metamagic feat, given that there are much better choices to take.
In addition, reviewing the Dazing Spell description:
If the spell allows a saving throw, a successful save negates the daze effect. If the spell does not allow a save, the target can make a Will save to negate the daze effect.
No matter what kind of spell you use (you can't use non-damaging spells, by the way, so good luck with that Slow spell coming with a Daze effect), you are allowed a Saving Throw to make the Daze go away, which is usually either Reflex or Will, determined by the saving throw type of the spell being cast, if it normally allows one.
Odd question.... if you can get Aid Another as a Move or Swift, is there anything preventing you from using it twice (or more!) on the same ally?
The bonuses granted are untyped, so they should stack, which is even called out in the Aid Another rules. So if some crazy nutter who gets, say, a nice hefty +7 on his Aid Anothers decides to go nuts, what's to stop him from blowing a pair of Move actions (since a Standard can be used for one) and a Swift to grant +21 (or more) to an ally's attack?
I mean, you know, aside from Aid Another being useless and all... ;)
The reason you see it as stupid is because you aren't doing it right. Consider this:
Aid Another is a Standard Action, correct? You can ready a Standard Action, including Aid Another, correct? So, couldn't I ready an Aid Another to Aid my ally's lowest attack roll to help confirm his lower hits?
No, actually, because a ready action occurs before the triggering action.
I've played a Helpful Halfling before, and it was pretty much just for skill checks. The action economy doesn't work out for Aid Another. If your character can't hit, then why are they in melee anyhow?
Here's some food for thought: Do you have a group of murderhobos bullying a village because they feel invulnerable for their level? Show them that being surrounded by angry villagers is really dangerous.
Maybe the PCs AC is high enough someone would need a 20 to hit them. What about 7 villagers all using Aid Another to help that 8th individual make his grapple check to take down that pesky PC...?
Get enough angry villagers and it's almost like "Take 20", as those villagers will just keep coming at you until they score a hit. Then it's tar and feathers time.
I hope that angry villager has grappling experience (Improved Unarmed Strike -> Improved Grapple), or he's going to get cut down when he tries, and that sure would be sad for all the villagers that were aiding him.
I'm just going to laugh softly because you think dazing spell isn't relevant. Btw, magical lineage + wayaang spell hunter says hi. 4th level dazing fireball, able to be cast at 7th level.@ Thomas Long 175: A Dazing Spell casts as 3 levels higher, so that's not really a scary thing by the time it becomes relevant. There are better things to apply for lesser spell levels (Empower, Intensify, Heighten, Extend, just to name a few). Even so, unless you get it in a rod, it's highly impractical to take as a Metamagic feat, given that there are much better choices to take.
In addition, reviewing the Dazing Spell description:
If the spell allows a saving throw, a successful save negates the daze effect. If the spell does not allow a save, the target can make a Will save to negate the daze effect.No matter what kind of spell you use (you can't use non-damaging spells, by the way, so good luck with that Slow spell coming with a Daze effect), you are allowed a Saving Throw to make the Daze go away, which is usually either Reflex or Will, determined by the saving throw type of the spell being cast, if it normally allows one.
It's a good thing I don't fight a lot of second-generation wizards who happened to grow up on the isle of Minata, then.
Seriously, though, how many GMs build all of their enemy spellcaster with such traits--especially since NPCs done by the book don't get traits at all without burning a feat for them?
No, actually, because a ready action occurs before the triggering action.The reason you see it as stupid is because you aren't doing it right. Consider this:
Aid Another is a Standard Action, correct? You can ready a Standard Action, including Aid Another, correct? So, couldn't I ready an Aid Another to Aid my ally's lowest attack roll to help confirm his lower hits?
Right. So my triggering action is Bob's third iterative attack.
You can ready an action for part way through someone's move action, (when he comes around the corner, when he comes into range) why not part way through their attack sequence?
You can certainly ready an action to interrupt Bob's third iterative attack with an aid another, what you can't do is wait until Bob's third attack is over and then go back and apply your aid another bonus.
Whoever thought aids could be so cool?
Of course not. I assumed by "lowest attack", he meant attack with the lowest iterative bonus, not actual lowest roll. Perhaps I was wrong.You can certainly ready an action to interrupt Bob's third iterative attack with an aid another, what you can't do is wait until Bob's third attack is over and then go back and apply your aid another bonus.No, actually, because a ready action occurs before the triggering action.The reason you see it as stupid is because you aren't doing it right. Consider this:
Aid Another is a Standard Action, correct? You can ready a Standard Action, including Aid Another, correct? So, couldn't I ready an Aid Another to Aid my ally's lowest attack roll to help confirm his lower hits?
Right. So my triggering action is Bob's third iterative attack.
You can ready an action for part way through someone's move action, (when he comes around the corner, when he comes into range) why not part way through their attack sequence?
I think you are, because he indeed did say lowest attack roll, and not lowest attack. But if you're not, then sure, moot point.
I'm just going to laugh softly because you think dazing spell isn't relevant. Btw, magical lineage + wayaang spell hunter says hi. 4th level dazing fireball, able to be cast at 7th level.@ Thomas Long 175: A Dazing Spell casts as 3 levels higher, so that's not really a scary thing by the time it becomes relevant. There are better things to apply for lesser spell levels (Empower, Intensify, Heighten, Extend, just to name a few). Even so, unless you get it in a rod, it's highly impractical to take as a Metamagic feat, given that there are much better choices to take.
In addition, reviewing the Dazing Spell description:
If the spell allows a saving throw, a successful save negates the daze effect. If the spell does not allow a save, the target can make a Will save to negate the daze effect.No matter what kind of spell you use (you can't use non-damaging spells, by the way, so good luck with that Slow spell coming with a Daze effect), you are allowed a Saving Throw to make the Daze go away, which is usually either Reflex or Will, determined by the saving throw type of the spell being cast, if it normally allows one.
Cool, 2 Traits invested into a single spell so you can cast it with a single spell 2 levels earlier. I'm glad nobody in the party knows how to interrupt spellcasters or counterspell the most commonly selected 3rd level Arcane spell in the game or anything...
Of course not. I assumed by "lowest attack", he meant attack with the lowest iterative bonus, not actual lowest roll. Perhaps I was wrong.You can certainly ready an action to interrupt Bob's third iterative attack with an aid another, what you can't do is wait until Bob's third attack is over and then go back and apply your aid another bonus.No, actually, because a ready action occurs before the triggering action.The reason you see it as stupid is because you aren't doing it right. Consider this:
Aid Another is a Standard Action, correct? You can ready a Standard Action, including Aid Another, correct? So, couldn't I ready an Aid Another to Aid my ally's lowest attack roll to help confirm his lower hits?
Right. So my triggering action is Bob's third iterative attack.
You can ready an action for part way through someone's move action, (when he comes around the corner, when he comes into range) why not part way through their attack sequence?
Correct via the bolded part. Here's what I meant:
Assuming 12th level, I can have the Swift Aid feat, +3 Deathless Benevolent Medium Mithril Armor, Arcane Striking Gloves, and a +3 Benevolent Cestus for a weapon (could be even higher, given it's an Arcane Bond weapon and I can enchant it for half value and count as having the crafting feats necessary to enchant, but I'll play it conservative here), plus Helpful Halfling trait via Racial Heritage (Halfling) at 1st level with Aasimar with Scion of Humanity Racial Trait, resulting in aiding +7 to AC or +7 to Attack rolls, and I can forgo the Swift Aid for attack rolls (I could probably skip taking this feat entirely if to-hit is already plenty high enough with Inspire Courage, Haste, Heroism, etc.) to either grant an additional 3 AC (resulting in 9 total) if Aiding AC, or an extra +3 to my ally's damage roll if aiding to-hit.
For my round, I use my Swift Aid feat to either give my fellow melee a +(X/2) bonus to AC against one attack (if enemies are next in the initiative before him), a +(X/2) bonus to attack rolls for one attack (if he is next in the initiative before the enemies), or make use of my Arcane Strike for an Aid Another type bonus of my choice. I then ready an action for Aid Another when my ally makes his 3rd attack roll.
So, when it becomes his turn, and he makes his attack, he would get +X (X equating to my Aid Another bonus) when he rolls for his 3rd attack roll. Everybody get it now?
Aid Another is fabulous for anyone who summons weak intelligent creatures and wants to leverage them at higher levels.
Imagine summoning 1d4+1 small air elementals (summon monster IV), and telling them (in Auran) to use aid-another in assisting the melee fighter. Instant bonuses plus battlefield control in the form of a protective entourage. At level 7+ this is pretty sweet, adding up to +10 in bonuses.
I chose air elementals because they can even aid another for flying characters, and also fill squares in three dimensions (allowing more to Aid Another at once).
Wow, fireball is the most common 3rd level spell in your games? Wow....
Cool, 2 Traits invested into a single spell so you can cast it with a single spell 2 levels earlier. I'm glad nobody in the party knows how to interrupt spellcasters or counterspell the most commonly selected 3rd level Arcane spell in the game or anything...
It's no less common than Haste, Dispel Magic, Fly, etc. It's the earliest accessible AoE nuke spellcasters have access to that have amazing range and just the right amount of area to cover. It also has a damage scale (10D6) that can expand even more with Intensify Spell (15D6).
Not to mention, you're the goober who brought it up in the first place. Why not Ice Storm, or Stone Call, or Burning Hands? Because Fireball is the best spell you can use for those 2 traits, so why would anyone who wanted to deal massive damage and get optimal use of those traits not take Fireball?
Seriously, though, how many GMs build all of their enemy spellcaster with such traits--especially since NPCs done by the book don't get traits at all without burning a feat for them?
By the book, PC's don't get traits either unless the DM says they do. As a DM, I have a standing rule that anything I ban or limit I will not, myself, also use on NPC's, unless it's right before it becomes available to them (IE: Psionics were 'unlocked' once they killed the first Psionic NPC baddy). That may seem cheap, but we view it as 'showcasing' the new rules about to be available. It goes the other way, too, though... if I allow them stuff, the NPC's have the same options.
Idle curiosity, how many wizards lobbing fireballs at you do you stop to question about their heritage and childhood?
I imagine none, they just get dissected after the fact.
It just gets rather coincidental when EVERY spellcaster happens to be one. It's almost like there's one location cranking out opposing spellcasters....Wow, fireball is the most common 3rd level spell in your games? Wow....
Until the current part of PC's I'm running a game for, Fireball was universally the most cast 3rd level Arcane spell... and that's without a bunch of Metamagic shenanigans and broken Trait abuse. And this stretches back through 2nd Edition.
Current game it's Lightning Bolt, and only because the main caster has a single Mythic rank and loves being able to 'bend' the Lightning Bolt around corners. If he didn't... it'd be Fireball again.
How often do you need a 20 to hit? If that's the case, the DM might be using unbalanced encounters. Or maybe that's a hint that you need to use Dispel Magic or some other strategy.
I'd like to QFT this.
The DM should know the attack bonuses of his party. If he purposefully designs a creature that can only be hit on a 20, it should be for only 1 of 3 good reasons:1) It's a monster they are not supposed to fight, have been given multiple warnings not to attack, and they proceed to want to anyway. It's probably way above their CR, and they should be expected to keep dying in horrible ways until they run off.
2) It's a monster that has a 'trick' to beating it that is fairly well foreshadowed or obvious. Perhaps dispelling buffs, using some item in the environment, attacking a specific item it carries or summoning specified help to debuff or defeat it, etc.
3) It's designed to require EXACTLY 20 (or as close to it as possible) to hit with physical attacks, such that good strategy (flanking, buffs, and Aid Another) can strike it reliably in the physical realm, but be much easier to hit with spells and other touch effects (IE: The martials are either a really competent team of butt-kickers who work well together, or they 'stall' the monster for the 'casters to drag it down).
There are 2 other, not so good reasons, which generally mean your group has problems...
1) The DM is an a-hole (Yeah, the game is screwed).
2) The DM needs to specifically kill ONE unrepentantly aggressive, obnoxious, or overpowered (or all three) character and then leave the rest alone.
Aid Another is fabulous for anyone who summons weak intelligent creatures and wants to leverage them at higher levels.
That and familiars! Touching AC 10 is well within their capabilities.
I used mine back in 3e to annoy the baddies, and being so small, they were ignored more often than not.
Now what I'd really wish for would be a Ranged Aid Another rule. It would be amazing for a wall of low level archers or a stone throwing mob.
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I'm fairly certain that if someone put as much effort into optimizing pretty much anything else they would be able to do a heck of a lot more.
More with Cure spells? IIRC, the highest practical amount I saw in there equated to about the same thing as a +15AC, which is, negating the damage from one attack.
Correct via the bolded part. Here's what I meant:
Assuming 12th level, I can have the Swift Aid feat, +3 Deathless Benevolent Medium Mithril Armor, Arcane Striking Gloves, and a +3 Benevolent Cestus for a weapon (could be even higher, given it's an Arcane Bond weapon and I can enchant it for half value and count as having the crafting feats necessary to enchant, but I'll play it conservative here), plus Helpful Halfling trait via Racial Heritage (Halfling) at 1st level with Aasimar with Scion of Humanity Racial Trait, resulting in aiding +7 to AC or +7 to Attack rolls, and I can forgo the Swift Aid for attack rolls (I could probably skip taking this feat entirely if to-hit is already plenty high enough with Inspire Courage, Haste, Heroism, etc.) to either grant an additional 3 AC (resulting in 9 total) if Aiding AC, or an extra +3 to my ally's damage roll if aiding to-hit.
For my round, I use my Swift Aid feat to either give my fellow melee a +(X/2) bonus to AC against one attack (if enemies are next in the initiative before him), a +(X/2) bonus to attack rolls for one attack (if he is next in the initiative before the enemies), or make use of my Arcane Strike for an Aid Another type bonus of my choice. I then ready an action for Aid Another when my ally makes his 3rd attack roll.
So, when it becomes his turn, and he makes his attack, he would get +X (X equating to my Aid Another bonus) when he rolls for his 3rd attack roll. Everybody get it now?
Yes, that makes significantly more sense.
Although I'm not sure it's hugely mechanically impressive. You've spent buckets of gold (I count 21k out of your ~108k), plus feats, plus traits, plus race, to give +3 to one and +7 to a second out of three (or out of four with Haste) attacks per round at 12th level, and +3 to a damage roll, for one ally?
A 12th level bard who starts inspiring courage and casts good hope on his turn, at that level is giving +5 to hit, +5 to damage, +2 to all saves, +2 to all skill and ability checks, and +3 vs charm and fear. To the entire party plus allies. On all their rolls rather than just a few preselected ones.
That's already markedly better before you consider that,
a) he didn't need to buy several magic items, feats, and traits to achieve this, nor be a specific race, it's nice and simple.
b) he won't need to spend his next turn in a similar fashion to keep the bonuses going
c) he doesn't need to worry about a change of circumstances ruining his readied action and thus wasting his turn, and you do (at higher level, I've found, losing an anticipated full attack due to your foe's actions is depressingly common).
Nice system mastery getting to those results, but from over here it still looks kind of like optimizing a Commoner. Lots of trouble, mediocre results.
Am I missing something?
@ Coriat: I'll do the math breakdown.
You have a +4 Benevolent Cestus crafted at cost (since it's his Arcane Bond), so 25K right there, making it 57K of my 108K WBL. That's not too much.
Throw on a +2 Benevolent Deathless Mithril Medium Armor (probably a Kikko), and that'll rack up about 13K, making it 70K of my 108K WBL spent.
With a Cloak of Resistance +3 (9K), Ring of Protection +2 (8K), and an Amulet of Natural Armor +2 (8K), that will equate to a 25K price, making it 95K of my 108K WBL spent.
Finally, throw in Gloves of Arcane Striking for 5K, and a +2 Living Heavy Steel Shield for another 5K, and we're about at my WBL when we factor in consumables.
He is a level 10 Arcane Duelist Bard and a level 2 Sacred Shield Paladin, with the Helpful and Magical Knack traits, so he has his full 12 CL and has a base Aid Another of +4 instead of +2. (Before you ask, he is an Azata-Blooded Aasimar with Scion of Humanity Racial Trait with the Racial Heritage feat taken at 1st level, so he can legally take Halfling stuff.)
And it's not like I'm not factoring buffs in. A lot of the Bard's spell buffs will be active before combat even begins, and if not, then a Quicken Metamagic Rod will definitely do a lot more than a few bits of damage or AC for a given attack. He won't have access to it quite yet, unfortunately, so he'll just have to make due. He otherwise has no use for Swift Actions every round.
Buffs that last minutes per level can be cast before a combat begins; exceptions are round/level spells like Haste, and there aren't too many of those.
To be honest, choosing that race and those feats and traits really makes the character. Having a base 20 Charisma and 18 Dexterity is very nice to have as a Bard of this type, something I certainly can't do without an Aasimar. Plus having Scion of Heritage for Halfling benefits is really huge, and having to spend one feat and one trait for all of the Halfling defensive feats I can take, the ability to increase my base Aid Another to twice that of the previous is amazing for the low levels, and only makes his ability later on that much stronger.
While you are correct, Good Hope can be cast before the combat begins, and Haste can be cast as soon as it begins, along with Inspire Courage. So I'm still pumping the same numbers, but the Haste and Inspire Courage only take one round's worth of actions to do. What do I do with the rest of them for the combat? Debuff perhaps, but I can't just throw spells out like hot cakes, and I can't really buff anyone else, since I'm already spending 2 3rd level spell slots. I'm not designed to do a lot of damage, and having 3/4 BAB I'm lucky to hit AC 10 anyway, so why spend actions swinging and missing all game when I can be making the guy who does it and is good at it, even better at doing it with those same actions?
I've actually made a whole aids party. It's a cavalier, cleric, investigator, and a halfing opportunist, it's a pretty tough party to take on.
I've actually made a whole aids party.
I laughed more than I should.
About a month ago I put together a blog post about "5 Rules Pathfinder Players Keep Forgetting," and it was pretty successful. There were a lot of people who said thanks for giving them reference numbers, and that they'd never even thought about some of the things I mentioned. There were a lot of people though who claimed that Aid Another had no place on the list, because it was useless. According to these people a +2 was a waste of time, and it was better off forgotten.
I was baffled by how people could honestly say it's a better idea to swing knowing you need a 20 to hit, than to pitch in as a group and help out the character who has a fighting chance of actually ending the fight. So I decided to do a little digging and create a guide for making Aid Another as powerful as possible.
These are the results. A +10 to attack or AC, anyone?
I've actually got a current PFS-legal character (level 6) who can spend a Swift action to give an ally a +10 Dodge bonus to AC, and his mount can spend a Move action to give an ADDITIONAL +5 Dodge bonus to AC, for a +15, and still get his entire full attack action in a round.
Aid another is amazing. Period.
A +15 AC against the first attack. For everything you've put into getting that +15 you're only basically negating one attack and still spending actions to do so.
Aid another isn't worth investing in. Full Attacks win out in damage everytime, and full attacks have more than one attack. Aid another isn't worth the investment. Period.
Actually, that first attack is usually the hardest hitting one. In general, the first attack made is the one that has the highest to-hit bonus. So by negating that one, you've negated a martial creature's highest attacking attack. Or at least one of them. The iterative attacks have a better chance at missing because of their negatives. Now, this won't work the same for all monsters, but it'll work well as you level.
Kensai Magus with the bodyguard feat and gloves of arcane striking (and possibly a benevolent haramaki).
Kensai end up with an insane amount of AoO per turn, so they aren't giving anything up action-economy-wise to give their adjacent allies a significant AC boost.
Sure, it costs some wealth and feats - but it looks like a pretty effective build for keeping a glass cannon friend alive.
Anything scared of Dazing Fire Ball probably cries blood from Persistent [insert level appropriate adjective here] Pit. Until everyone flies, that is. :)
On topic, I have found most use for Aid Another with the skill checks mentioned and with summoned chaff/followers/cohorts ect. All these people that just hang around you can team up to aim a ballista or something. Give them a Wand of True Strike too : )