Now I picture Amanda Waller doing the Oprah Winfrey thing: "YOU get a Batman! And YOU get a Batman! And YOU get a Batman!"
Damon,
Just saying, Batman has been passed on to others before.
I think white canary is probably one of the best and most fleshed out characters in the show. glad they got rid of hawk girl she seemed the most shotty well next to hawk man who I couldn't stand but to be fair traditionally no one can stand him.
Vid,
I think for Flash, I'm enjoying the REAL Jay Garrick more.
Oops got my forums mixed up. (had two windows open)
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It's okay Vid. :) You were at least in the right area and shared universe. ;)
Set,
Not my favorite but certainly in my top 5.
So good news! We know the overall arch WON'T be dominated by evil Speedster. At least I don't think so since Alchemy got away.
Bad news, sort of... Savitar looks like Ultron with Claws.
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Yeah, um.....
Maybe next season's villain will be the one they just introduced in the comics - Godspeed. Lucky for us, they've got several speesters left to keep the series going for a few more years: Speed Demon, Red/Blue Trinity, the Black Flash. After that, I guess they'll just have to end the series, or hope that some new speedster villain has been introduced in the comics.
I can't wait for that hologram technology H.R. is using to fail at an inopportune time and get him arrested for murder.
Will Caitlin be EVIL? Will Cisco be EVIL?? Will they both be EVIL??? Or will there be some other explanation of that fight he vibed, allowing both characters to remain part of the regular cast without being EVIL?
Ye gods, I hope they're not going to give Iris powers or a costume. That would just be f~!*ing stupid.
That was a far different Shade than from the comics. I thought it might be intended as Shadow Thief, until H.R. provided the name.
Incidentally, Tom Cavanagh is doing an awesome job.
Philosophers Stone!
All in all, the writer's are beginning to disappoint me.
All in all, the writers are beginning to disappoint me.
Yeah, my enjoyment of the show is based 100% on the chemistry among the main cast. (Is there a version of Wells in the multiverse that Cisco is not delightful with?) The 'plots' are nonsensical.
Joana,
I think the thing about last season with Zoom is he just broke Barry's back. So like...yeah that was pretty horrible.
As for this episode (having had time to digest it) I think the writers aren't disappointing me so much as I keep wondering where it's going.
Zoom at least you felt had a plan and purpose. Alchemy and these guys are just...obstacles. Just not the kind that promote growth in the characters.
I wasn't worried about Iris getting powers. I WAS concerned and still concerned we may be losing Catlin. She's pretty awesome in her own way.
Plus I think given the recent summary for Flash/Arrowverse crossover mega thingie, apparently Flashpoint has done MORE damage than we initially thought.
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I wasn't worried about Iris getting powers. I WAS concerned and still concerned we may be losing Catlin. She's pretty awesome in her own way.
Yeah, I like her (and Cisco, and Wells) better than any of Barry, Wally or Iris, so I'm really hoping that anything that does go wrong doesn't result in Caitlin (or Cisco) going away. I also don't really want them costuming up anytime soon, as the Flash doesn't really lend himself to teaming up with slowbies who can't keep up. "Quick, there's trouble across town. Flash, go ahead, we'll get there in time for it to be over, one way or another..."
I keep waiting for one of these alternate realities to have a living Ronnie Raymond in it (preferably without Firestorm powers), so that Caitlin can have her fiancé back and not be stuck in an endless sequence of universes-Barry-chose-to-make-himself-happy-and-screw-everyone-else.
Interesting how HR was sort of cut off explaining how there were a bunch of sentient gorillas on his earth. In my fevered imagination, he was about to say 'there's a whole city full of them!'
I kind of am wondering if Caitlin is going to turn to Alchemy to be "fixed". IF Alchemy can give people powers they had in other timelines, can he take away powers they also don't have in other timelines?
As for not unmasking Alchemy and allowing him to escape, up to this point he had no reason to believe any sort of speedster was involved or that they hadn't caught him. I don't think it's an equivalent situation to Zoom.
Yeah, Savitar was way bigger and more metal-looking than I was expecting. Basically being able to palm Barry by the torso - he's a giant!
I agree with most of the disappointments expressed up thread, but I do like that Savitar doesn't seem to be visible to anyone other than Barry at present. And I'm guessing, by that characteristic, that it was Savitar who killed Clariss in his cell earlier in the season.
Dal,
It would make the most sense yes. I suspected it but also thought it might have been something or someone else.
MCC,
That's my theory as well as too if they want to remove the Killer Frost side of Catlin's power, using the Philosopher's Stone might be the best way to 'transmute' Catlin back to normal Catlin.
Also loved the nod to Gorilla Grodd too.
As for Robbie, I think if anything I'd like him to come back to life so that we get a better Firestorm. But it might not happen.
As for side kicking it, so far I think it's most Cisco as support more than field support. Especially since his vibe powers haven't grown that much.
I suspect the twist might be that Cisco turns evil, not Caitlin. They're fighting because she's stopping him.
Also, can we please have a BBEG that isn't an evil speedster?
Ross,
I'm not convinced that Savitar IS the BBEG. I mean look at what Alchemy has done so far.
Also no evil Cisco. One time was bad enough.
Kal,
Not sure that Cisco is going evil. At least not that I've seen. Plus Wally wasn't around in Earth 2 that we saw.
Kal,
Maybe the fact her cold based powers might require her to drain heat to survive. I mean that's in the comic book lore.
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Vendor - Fantasiapelit Tampere
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Ehhhh. Kinda lame, even though the whole ending scene was cool. Alchemy's dudes reminded me of Cicada (Now that would be interesting villains to see here :P ). And I think the second half of this season will have a different villains. This does not seem all that "big."
Ros,
Big maybe not but it does seems more personal in some ways.
Also,
Also I'm pretty annoyed to have the big bad be Savitar. I honestly thought it would be Alchemy. But I guess the writers enjoy making me feel like an idiot thinking we're done with more villainous speedsters.
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Well, my theory looks to be somewhat correct.....
Savitar looks f!$&ing idiotic. And, of course he's got "big plans" for someone on Team Flash.
If there's a next season, and the writers once again prove incapable of having a non-speedster main villain, I may just have to stop watching the show. Come on fellas, decades of Flash stories, and you losers keep up the same old s~*~ of "I'm Barry Allen, the fastest man alive except for this dastardly new arch villain I must spend all season trying to beat". Bring back Grodd! Introduce Abra Kadabra! F#~#, I'd even welcome Cobalt Blue at this point.
I was almost hoping the whole Killer Frost/Vibe's dead brother story would see the dissolution of Team Flash. I would prefer a superhero on his own style show, without the gazillion and one people who know his secret identity and without whom he couldn't even tie his shoelaces, let alone be a hero.
I was starting to like Wally, until they made him too desperate to have powers. Now that he's got them, I just kind of find him annoying.
For all that he's a faker and douchebag, HR is rapidly becoming one of the things I always find enjoyable about this show. Even if they are shoehorning in things to show Team Flash how "valuable" he is.
All in all, I'm looking forward to next week as a hopeful break from the disappointment this season has been for me.
...given the Vibe thing...
I'd have to go back and watch the previous episode to be sure, but I was under the impression that we just saw what Cisco had vibed. So there should be no cause for immediate concern about Caitlin's future.
Damon,
Not sure since it looks full on Killer Frost versus Catilin having a bad moment.
Aber,
I do agree, we need less speedster villains. Just not Cobalt Blue. Grodd would be a great choice given the fact they've basically left him there. Maybe he'll evolve enough to start speaking in full sentences.
Damon,
Just saying, Batman has been passed on to others before.
Wasn't there also a time of multiple Batmen, such as during the return of Bruce Wayne when Grayson was still doing the gig?
Drah,
There were two Batmen, yes. But no more than two that I was aware of.
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Was it just me or did you guys think Ms snow made the best villain the show has had for a long time? I also totally called Alchemy not that that is saying much.
Vid,
I think we all called it but we just weren't 100% sure. But yeah she did a good job of being evil like her Earth-2 counterpart. But I'm glad she didn't go full on villain.
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I think the fact she was on the fence made it even better myself you could see her motivation and it made it more relate-able then mustache twirling bank robbing.
I dunno...I like Savitar because they seem to be going with him not being a Meta in this interpretation but something else, something no longer human.
Iris' encouraging speech to Barry halfway through this episode was some of the best stuff I've seen on the CW this season. That was SO well done and excellent. Geez Louise.
So am I the only one who noticed that this episode was directed by Kevin Smith? I was astounded that there wasn't an increase in snarky dialogue, nor a Jason Mewes cameo. ;)
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Tar,
I think he's saving Jason for cameos in other shows. I mean he's got a few more directing credits for DC CW coming up I thought.
MMC,
I can see that but I'm getting REALLY tired of speedsters as the main villains.
Right now I just wonder what to make of all this other crap...
I think we all called it but we just weren't 100% sure.
I called it...wrong. I didn't know enough about Dr. Alchemy from the comics, and I had already heard that Godspeed (who in the comic was revealed as a fellow CCPD employee) was coming this season, so I guessed that Julian = Godspeed.
Caitlin did/does make a really good villain but I prefer her non-Killer reluctant meta side.
Regarding Savitar, I wonder if (for purposes of the TV show) he was originally an "ordinary" speedster who inadvertently became One with the Speed Force -- comic readers have seen that happen -- and it's that state of being that has changed him. His acolytes are trying to bring him back from the Speed Force dimension, and until that happens, he can only manifest on Earth partially and/or for short periods.
Damon,
No worries. It wasn't like you bet money on it right? *pause* Right?
I also think we all prefer our Caitlin Snow as a good person versus being the killer frost.
Savitar...is weird. But no clear idea how he's doing what he does.
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Vendor - Fantasiapelit Tampere
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So am I the only one who noticed that this episode was directed by Kevin Smith? I was astounded that there wasn't an increase in snarky dialogue, nor a Jason Mewes cameo. ;)
Two episodes directed by Kevin Smith are both really good. If TV is were he feels comfortable and especially here I say welcome aboard.
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Ros,
I think we all agree, we need more Rogues more than we need more evil speedsters.
I think they've given us a lot of rogues but I feel they get delt with quickly (well i suppose of course quickly) and easily (with a few exceptions I was pretty happy with trickster).
Vid,
Well that doesn't mean they shouldn't come back trouble the hero again if they get a different plan.
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True. Recurring villains is a comic book stable after all.
I was pretty annoyed when they moved heat wave and Captain Cold to Legends of Tomorrow. Cold was still the best villain that show's produced yet... and they just took him off the table.
Mic was pretty lame for the most part... but somehow he HAS become my favorite Legend at the moment. Still, I'd like a solid team of rogues to go after flash for a change.
Phantom,
Maybe in season 4. Especially after they fix the stupid Barry has done.
So I'm going to make a hopeful prediction slash what i would like to see.
I want Savitar to be taken out by a group of the speedsters. I want Wally Barry and Jay (maybe even throw jesse into the mix) to unite would make coolest end to the season IMO.
Vid,
It might have to happen since it's clear Savitar is faster than most speedsters.
That is what I'm thinking either that or they have to escalate Barry to a whole new level.