The Flash TV Series


Television

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Liberty's Edge

Kalshane wrote:
There's also the fact that an alternate timeline shouldn't be any different than an alternate Earth, yet The Flash treats them as two distinct things.

If that were so then Flash should be able to just keep running until he got back to his 'original' timeline. Instead, the mechanic posited on both this show and Legends is that when the new timeline becomes 'set' the old one ceases to exist.

Hypothetically, Flash could then search through infinite Earths looking for one which exactly matched his original timeline world EXCEPT that Flash on that Earth didn't go back and change it... but that could potentially take an infinite amount of time, and when he finally got there it would already be occupied by a different Flash.


CB,

Or it might be he'll be old and dead by then running that much for that length of time. Remember he still does need to eat...


Thomas Seitz wrote:
So you're saying we have time travelers to thank for the current state of affairs Drah?

I have it on good authority that of the 500 people who attended Christ's Sermon on the Mount, all but 50 of them were time travelers.


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CBDunkerson wrote:
Kalshane wrote:
There's also the fact that an alternate timeline shouldn't be any different than an alternate Earth, yet The Flash treats them as two distinct things.

If that were so then Flash should be able to just keep running until he got back to his 'original' timeline. Instead, the mechanic posited on both this show and Legends is that when the new timeline becomes 'set' the old one ceases to exist.

Hypothetically, Flash could then search through infinite Earths looking for one which exactly matched his original timeline world EXCEPT that Flash on that Earth didn't go back and change it... but that could potentially take an infinite amount of time, and when he finally got there it would already be occupied by a different Flash.

If you remember Flashpoint the movie, the problem is that changes in time travel aren't neat. Major temporal incursions don't just affect the future from that point on, they cause chronal shockwaves that echo backwards and sideways from the moment of disruption. The original timeline is as shattered as Humpty Dumpty... there is no restoring it... and that's the painful lesson that Barry Allen has finally learned.


Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
Thomas Seitz wrote:
So you're saying we have time travelers to thank for the current state of affairs Drah?
I have it on good authority that of the 500 people who attended Christ's Sermon on the Mount, all but 50 of them were time travelers.

I thought there were 1,000 at the Sermon...

Oh well. Stupid time travelers! :p


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In today's episode of Flash:

Barry DOESN'T screw up the timeline!

Scarab Sages

Well, that was entertaining...

Spoiler:
It took me a few seconds to realisze that was Frankie Kane. Yet another element from the Wally West era (and Teen Titans). I think it was the goth look that threw me off. I remember her as being more petite blondish. Still, the character was pretty spot on - good and evil personalities, with one being extremely powerful.....when she's psychotic.

Loved seeing Jessie Quick and Harry!

Wally is an idiot. I can see now how they'll give him his powers. He's going to find Alchemy.

My wife, who does not regularly watch, thinks Draco is going to be the face behind the Alchemy mask. I both agree and disagree.

And, next week, Mirror Master! Took them long enough!

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Aberzombie wrote:

Well, that was entertaining...

** spoiler omitted **

Spoiler:
Saw the teaser of next episode, and I have confused emotions. I love Mirror Master, the mirror tricks are just what I expected but I really don't like that he wears just a business suit like in the old show. Mirror Master has a cool costume in the comics, I would have loved to see their version of it. Maybe some day.

I agree on Wally, he's pretty much being set up to become a badguy pawn out of desperation. Which of course gives him a redemption arc next season (or the 2nd half of this season if they don't drag it out)

Love having Harry back even if it's only for a little while.


I think the things that stood out for me is: Yes Wally will probably go to Alchemy for his power but who knows what kind of limits he'll put on Wally. Plus the whole "I just help sell my soul to a guy that does Alchemy!"

Secondly, Harry and Jessie were great, but I'm looking forward to seeing her in her costume. (I wonder if it will look anything like Rebirth Flash in some way. Or who knows...

Also I think Alchemy isn't Draco if only because I don't see him being in two places at once.

Scarab Sages

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Thomas Seitz wrote:
Also I think Alchemy isn't Draco if only because I don't see him being in two places at once.

Clearly, you are unaware of the strange case of Albert & Alvin Desmond.

There was also Mr. Element, Alexander Petrov. He was originally a lab assistant in the Keystone City Police crime lab.


I don't want Felton to be Alchemy for the same reason I didn't want Eddie to be the Reverse Flash in the first series....making the bad guy's identity be the unlikeable guy the hero already knows is lazy and stupid and overused.


Aber,

I have those issues, yes. I just didn't think it applied here. I also agree with Norman, it's an overused trope.

Dark Archive

Norman Osborne wrote:
I don't want Felton to be Alchemy for the same reason I didn't want Eddie to be the Reverse Flash in the first series....making the bad guy's identity be the unlikeable guy the hero already knows is lazy and stupid and overused.

Speaking of Eddie, it's kinda convenient that all these new earths don't seem to have a living Eddie Thawne, or living Ronnie Raymond, almost like those actors aren't available... :)

Scarab Sages

Norman Osborne wrote:
....making the bad guy's identity be the unlikeable guy the hero already knows is lazy and stupid and overused.

Agreed. And I hope the writers don't do it, but I don't have much faith. At least they are, so far, making it look like a speedster won't be the main villain of the season.


Aber,

Well it helps they are using a good villain that has proven he can beat up a Flash. I mean Doctor Alchemy has had decent staying power for a time.

Scarab Sages

Tho,

True. Although the way they're portraying him seems kind of weird (with the cult vibe), and he seems way more powerful than previous comic iterations.

Plus, I thought there had been mention of Grodd being the big bad for this season. That would have been way more awesome.


spoilers I heard about were Savitar being a duel big bad Alchemy. I am guessing Alchemy's cult maybe worships Savitar and are somehow preparing for his appearance.

Scarab Sages

MMCJawa wrote:
spoilers I heard about were Savitar being a duel big bad Alchemy. I am guessing Alchemy's cult maybe worships Savitar and are somehow preparing for his appearance.

Ye gods, I hope not. I was worried when the brought Clariss in, fearing we'd have yet another season of Barry being the Fastest Man Alive except for the main villain. I don't want them to get trapped in the cycle of the only real threats to Flash are people who can do exactly what he does.


Savitar and Alchemy are the two main villains for Season 3. A quick google search for Flash Season 3 villains turns up loads of hits, but this one one here was spoiler free.


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My problem with Flashpoint is they didn't establish that universe as being anywhere near bad enough that I buy Barry thinking it would be better off with both of his parents murdered.


Probably it's guilt over all the people who were dead or in a worse position than they were in the base timeline.
There's a world of difference between feeling bad for people who are dead (even ones you failed to save) and knowing that your actions killed or messed people up.


Norman,

It's a problem for some of us sure, but I'm guessing now that we're seeing more stuff bleeding through, we'll see.

Also I don't think Savitar and/or Godspeed will be the main villains. Mostly because I think it's more likely that Alchemy (using his powers) will be trying to bring change to this world in preparation for take over by magical forces.

I mean it's possible. Also Speed Force cultists seem a little out there.

Aber,

I think the reason they 'beefed' him up is because some how now that's he crossed over, he's got access to more magic maybe. I mean people did die thanks to Darkh.

Scarab Sages

Dal Selpher wrote:
Savitar and Alchemy are the two main villains for Season 3. A quick google search for Flash Season 3 villains turns up loads of hits, but this one one here was spoiler free.

Ah, damn. Sucks they're including Savitar. That gives me much less faith in the abilities of the show runners.


Aber,

I don't think he'll be the main bad guy though. At least I'm REASONABLE sure he won't but I could be wrong...


So Sam Scudder aka Mirror Master got shown along with the name drop of Evan McCulloch.

Anyone else? Thoughts? Feelings? Glad we didn't have more time travel screw ups?


Plus we got us a NEW Harry.

how fun must this be to play that part "ok each season you are the same guy but you are a totally different person"

Scarab Sages

Not bad.

Spoiler:
I liked Mirror Master. I liked the name dropping of both Scudder and McCulloch, as well as the nod to John Broome. At first, when I caught the chicks last name, I thought for sure she was going to be Roscoe's brother and that would be the lead in for Top. Oops....looks like they decided to go with a skirt version instead. At least they gave her some variation on the actual Top costume.

I enjoyed the side plot about the weird s*%! between Barry/Iris/Joe. It was actually kind of funny.

Seriously? Let's just reach out to the multiverse and find a new Wells! How f&*#ing stupid is that?!? Hey, time travel is a definite no-no, but let's go ahead and pull in random versions of HArrison from wherever. Because that won't go wrong in any way....

It was nice to see the actor clearly having fun with the various versions.

Although, I thought for sure they might have Grodd intercept that multiversal communication and answer it. Boy, that would have been funny.

Oh my dear Doctor Snow - Seems we might have Killer Frost on the way again (especially since an upcoming episode is named after her).


I wonder why Earth-2 Wells' metahuman-detector didn't go off around

Spoiler:
Caitlin.
You could argue he stopped wearing it because it would be always going off because of Jessie, but that never stopped him with Barry and Cisco last season.

I suppose that since Flashpoint, the new-timeline Wells could never have invented it. It's definitely a convenience for the writers if they want to reset anything -- like how no one's ordinary clothes catch fire from the friction while speedstering anymore. (Even Flashpoint!Wally needed Flashpoint!Cisco to make him a friction-proof suit, although Barry was following Kid Flash around the city in street clothes in the same reality.)


I agree with Joana, this was a BAD idea. If they made a computer BASED on his brain that at least wouldn't be as bad. Hell cloning Earth-2 Well would have worked. But jumping through the Multiverse? That just REEKS of badness greater than what Barry has wrought.

Also I keep hoping Grodd shows up soon. Cause right now, other than Alchemy, there's not much I'm interested in. Well except maybe if Wally gets his Speed from Alchemy.

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Norman Osborne wrote:
I don't want Felton to be Alchemy for the same reason I didn't want Eddie to be the Reverse Flash in the first series....making the bad guy's identity be the unlikeable guy the hero already knows is lazy and stupid and overused.

You gave me an interesting thought if Felton is going to be a recurring character...

Felton found the alchemy stone and it put him in touch with his alt/empowered counterpart. But instead of dreams, it gives him... a split personality. Flash ends up beating Dr. Alchemy and saving Felton, and in exchange Felton becomes a fan of the flash, while still being a jerk to Barry. Think Flash Thompson.

That would be something new for the series.


Matthew,

It has the benefit of fitting in with the character's history.

Dark Archive Vendor - Fantasiapelit Tampere

I kinda giggled that

Spoiler:
The fact that Top was the most accurate version of....Count Vertigo in CWverse.

Dark Archive

So if she's Top, does that make her partner Bottom?

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Set wrote:

So if she's Top, does that make her partner Bottom?

Badum *tsss*


Set,

BOOO!! Horrid joke.

Ros,

Yeah I just now noticed that. I wish they had given Count Vertigo that power.


Yeah, I do not trust hipster Wells at all. This was one of the worst ideas from a group of people with a history of some really bad ideas.


Kalshane wrote:
Yeah, I do not trust hipster Wells at all. This was one of the worst ideas from a group of people with a history of some really bad ideas.

You're really not supposed to trust anyone named Wells. Why is anyone trusting the current incumbent?


Drah,

Because at least now he has a daughter to keep from making too many stupid decisions. Maybe. I dunno. I just know Hipster/Earth-19 Wells gives of the wrong vibes.

Scarab Sages

I thought this episode was kind of lame....

Spoiler:
The bonding between Julian and Barry was kind of weird, especially since Felton seems so much better at being an antagonistic douche. Still, that bit about him driven to be a world-class, top-of-the-heap scientist, coupled with him coming from a wealthy family, heightens my suspicions that his evil doppleganger is Dr. Alchemy.

I really hope they find a way to get rid of Caitlin's powers. If they write her as keeping them, she's probably going to try and be a hero. That just doesn't seem right to me. Killer Frost is a villain. Always has been, always should be.

And at the rate they're going, it won't be too long before Joe and Iris have powers as well.

The new Wells is lame. At least he's different, though. That dude is a pretty decent actor.


I keep thinking the new Wells STILL isn't telling us everything.

Also I agree that Julian works better as a foil/antagonist/frenemy than as a colleague. Plus yes, I'm pretty sure he's unknowingly Doctor Alchemy.

I also hope Caitlin doesn't keep Killer Frost powers. It's not unnecessary for her character. I DID like her bonding with Mom though.


Aberzombie wrote:

I thought this episode was kind of lame....

** spoiler omitted **

To be fair, in the comics Killer Frost is apparently going to be a member of the JLA soon

plus others

oh man that is an interesting choice of team

Scarab Sages

Greylurker wrote:
Aberzombie wrote:

I thought this episode was kind of lame....

** spoiler omitted **

To be fair, in the comics Killer Frost is apparently going to be a member of the JLA soon

Yeah, I read that somewhere. It made me glad I dropped JLA.


I'm with the Deadman, the new JLA seems not as good as the original.

I'm okay with the Atom, Vixen complimenting the Team, but Killer Frost?! No.

Makes me wonder about the future.


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Greylurker wrote:
oh man that is an interesting choice of team

Batman and the Legion of Second-String Heroes?


Damon Griffin wrote:
Greylurker wrote:
oh man that is an interesting choice of team
Batman and the Legion of Second-String Heroes?

lol

Still having problems imagining Batman and Lobo on the same team

(but I am glad it looks like the Main Man version)

Liberty's Edge RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16

Becoming friends with Julian could be a nice twist if he is Doctor Alchemy without realizing it, and a tough call for Barry to make if defeating Doctor Alchemy requires him screwing over/killing Julian once he's become friends with him.


Joel,

I think it's very possible, considering it would be in keeping with Doctor Alchemy's history.


Damon Griffin wrote:
Greylurker wrote:
oh man that is an interesting choice of team
Batman and the Legion of Second-String Heroes?

Second is being very kind... closer to fourth for some of these.

Heroes is also pretty kind.

I honestly don't think I've seen a JLA team that I had LESS interest in since that Detroit league that crashed years ago...

Batman and Atom are about the only ones I actually like there. MAYBE Black Canary on a good day... the rest??? were they literally the last kids picked for dodgeball or something??

It looks like the editors all picked who they wanted use... and JLA got the leftovers... and Batman. Everyone gets a batman ;)


Well they get A batman for sure....

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