A portable hole isn't extradimensional travel. It should work just fine even if you been hit with Dimensional Anchor.
Forbiddance works the same way stating only that it defeats planar travel. A portable hole is not dimensional travel, so it should again work.
Now, I could see it being a reasonable house rule, but the spells make no mention of anything to that effect.
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Complicated.
One of the ways I look at rules is: am I better off drawing a particular conclusion? In this case, I think the better ruling would be that dimensional anchor doesn't impede usage of extradimensional spaces. Why? Because otherwise a simple spell becomes a complicated spell, which is bad. More than portable hole, you'd be making a target immune to create pit and its family. You'd also make a target unable to use a bag of holding or even a lowly handy haversack, let alone an efficient quiver. Depending on how brutal you want to get, the target might not be able to use gloves of storing. My point is that it the scope of what the spell does creeps wider and wider and starts to require more rulings.
So I'd advise focusing on wanting the spell to only apply to actual travel between dimensions, because it's cleaner and neater. Contained.
How I would do that is look at the difference between extradimensional space and an actual other dimension. The ethereal plane? Totally different place from the material plane. Astral plane? Elemental plane of fire? All different places. You can't go there.
On the other hand, I'd rationalize my rule by viewing extradimensional spaces as pockets of the material plane that are contained somewhere else. "Huh?" Okay, take a balloon, blow it up, squeeze the end tight, and shove it under water so only the neck is in air. The contents of the balloon (air) are still "material plane" areas despite that the balloon itself exists somewhere else (water). If you could stop the water from pressing on the balloon, and if you made the balloon temporarily stop wanting to collapse, you could let go of the neck, and put your hand in and out without getting wet. Your hand wouldn't leave the material plane.
I'd view extradimensional spaces as being where the bag of holding or the pit exist, not where the INSIDE of said bag or pit are. The "other dimension" is outside the bag.
But again, that's not RAW or even RAI... that's how I would choose to interpret all of this to make a rational ruling I WANT, for simplicity's sake.
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Is an extradimensional space the same thing as extradimensional travel?
If your answer is yes then it wont function.
If your answer is no then it's fine.
Personally I think it's clear that extradimensional spaces aren't you traveling between dimension. Traveling between dimension is performed with spells or spell like abilities like those mentioned in the spell description.
Forms of movement barred by a dimensional anchor include astral projection, blink, dimension door, ethereal jaunt, etherealness, gate, maze, plane shift, shadow walk, teleport, and similar spell-like abilities. The spell also prevents the use of a gate or teleportation circle for the duration of the spell.
The spell makes no mention of impacting extradimensional spaces. That's a pretty important effect to leave out of the description if it was intended to do so.
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To back up what others have said, extradimensional spaces means "spaces that exist in other than the standard 3 dimensions." A portable hole, bag of holding or a create pit spell bend space until it cries uncle, but they don't actually travel to another plane.
Unless you put a bag of holding in a portable hole, or vice verse, but I digress.
In contrast dimensional anchor uses the word 'extradimensional travel', but the list of example effects being blocked makes it more clear that it actually means 'interplanar travel'. (Alternatively, you can focus on the word 'travel': A bag of holding or a rope trick can't shortcut you to elsewhere.)
TL;DR: Dimensional anchor will not prevent you from entering the TARDIS just because it is bigger on the inside. It does mean the TARDIS will leave you behind if it dematerializes.
Or substitute Baba Yaga's Hut if you're not a Whovian.
Related question. If a portable hole is being used as a trap, what would happen if a Large creature had its arm in the hole when it was closed? Would the entire creature be drawn in?
Used as a trap in what sense?
My answer as a GM (without more knowledge) is that at most, the creatures arm is trapped inside. And he can free himself with at most a move action. But, I definitely wouldn't allow you to just enclose the enemy in the portable hole and remove him from combat.
Personally, I would rule that as long as his arm is breaking the plane between the normal 3 dimensional world and the extra dimensional space that the opening of the portable hole cannot be closed at all.
The hole would never fully close. There doesn't seem to be any precedent for what you mean. Please describe more fully?
In Slumbering Tsar ( spoiler alert!) there is a room where a sorcerer has stretched a portable hole over the doorway, so that when you open it, you are looking into the hole and think it's actually a room. At the far end, ten feet away, is a magic sword. The sorcerer has rigged the hole to close and trap anyone who steps iinside. In my group, there is a Large PC. He is the tank for the party, so I anticipate him simply reaching in and taking the sword without full entering the hole.
In Slumbering Tsar ( spoiler alert!) there is a room where a sorcerer has stretched a portable hole over the doorway, so that when you open it, you are looking into the hole and think it's actually a room. At the far end, ten feet away, is a magic sword. The sorcerer has rigged the hole to close and trap anyone who steps iinside. In my group, there is a Large PC. He is the tank for the party, so I anticipate him simply reaching in and taking the sword without full entering the hole.
Is there any method for the PC to avoid it, or does it just close with no save or chance to perceive? What's the mechanism governing the interaction between PC and the closure?
I mean, portable hole notes,
When opened fully, a portable hole is 6 feet in diameter, but it can be folded up to be as small as a pocket handkerchief. When spread upon any surface, it causes an extradimensional space 10 feet deep to come into being. This hole can be picked up from inside or out by simply taking hold of the edges of the cloth and folding it up. Either way, the entrance disappears, but anything inside the hole remains, traveling with the item.
So really, to me, it seems like the hole would basically clamp around the guy's hand and close. Then... they'd open it, I guess? I mean what happens if the entire party doesn't enter at the same time?
There seem to be some missing rules, here.
If you want to create a
you can do so by copying the following:
[ spoiler=spoiler! ] write whatever you want in the spoiler here [ /spoiler ]
... and then delete the spaces in between the brackets and the words and symbols within them.
Let's replace the brackets with parenthesis to show you. Thus, isntead of:
( spoiler=spoiler! ) words ( /spoiler )
... you'd write:
(spoiler=spoiler!) words (/spoiler)
... which, if you replace the parenthesis with the brackets I used above generates:
Anyway, with more information, I could help better. Otherwise, it's up to GM fiat.
Thanks for the info about the spoiler tag. I wasn't sure how that worked.
In the room description, it states that the sorcerer(actually a goblin liche) is hiding in the back of the room, behind the portable hole. He has rigged a drawstring around the mouth of the hole, and pulls it to close the hole when the first person enters. No save.
Glad to help! It's easy to miss that sort of stuff, so I'm always interested in helping, where possible.
If he's pulling it closed via draw-string, than it's going to be his strength v. whatever else it is.
Otherwise, the "no save" effect is... bad news.
To me, it seems that the hole would simply close the same way a door or any other portal would "close" if there is something inside the middle of it - it either wouldn't close, or it would harm the thing in its way of closing.
To me, it would feel odd to instantly force a creature into the hole if, say, only their hand was present.
In any event, you're somewhat going beyond RAW here anyway. The Slumbering Tzar, I understand, is built around PC death and dismemberment. Make of that what you will.
If it were me, I'd allow a reflex save (opposed by, say, the undead's attack roll) to withdraw your hand. If it fails, your hand (and any other part of the body) is simply stuck inside the extradimensional space while the space itself is stuck onto you. Like sticking your hand into something too small to get it back out of.
The lich would likely paralyze the creature whose arm was sticking in with his lich touch.
Depending on how brutal you want to be, while he's paralyzed, he might cut his wrist while gnawing on the guy's arm or something, I dunno. Whatever the creature's motivation is, run with it to inform their tactics.
Of course, if the lich was interested in killing as many as possible and was aware that there are more, he might do something even more sinister: as the guy is reaching in, actively make a CMB to pull him in. Since the creature will be hopefully paralyzed from the lich's touch attack, it's pretty much an automatic success (effectively dropping bonus from STR and DEX and applying a quick -10 penalty to their CMD by treating those two scores as if they were 0), and then close the hole. Coup De Grace, followed by hiding -> his friends coming to rescue him, only too late. This means that he's got a much more manageable battle.
THAT SAID, I'm not sure what his actual motives are. He might just let them get away with it, if he suspects that it will turn against him. Maybe choose his time to strike later.
All very good food for thought. This event may come up at our weekly game this Sunday, so I'll have to let you know the outcome. Should be interesting and entertaining.
Why not place the sword more than 10 feet away?
A portable hole is only 10 feet deep.
So this went down last night, but not quite like I expected. The Large PC (a synthesist summoner) was actually forced to reduce himself to medium to fit in the cramped hallways. However, it was not he who feel for the trap. He saw the sword in the back of the room, and he also saw the invisible grick hiding in there as well. With reach, he made quick work of the grick. Then, however, using Perception, he heard movement from beyond the far wall of the room. That's when the party sorcerer, with gloves of reconaissance, stepped into the room/portable hole, intending to have a look through the back wall. The trap was sprung. The hole shut, and then the Handy Haversack the sorcerer was carrying ruptured, tossing him and everything in his haversack, and the contents of the portable hole, adrift in the Astral Plane
The hole shut, and then the Handy Haversack the sorcerer was carrying ruptured, tossing him and everything in his haversack, and the contents of the portable hole, adrift in the Astral Plane
Oh. Good point. Just stepping into the portable hole while carrying a handy haversack or bag of holding or similar common gear is very dangerous, even without any additional trappage.
Thanks for the update! Ross covered exactly what I would have said. :)
I think that is precious about the haversack especially considering several of my players have one or a bag of holding. I wonder who is going to enter the whole and get trapped.
But is it 10 feet long? Or 10 feet wide?Why not place the sword more than 10 feet away?A portable hole is only 10 feet deep.
According to the PRD, it is 6 feet across and 10 deep.