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I'm starting WotR with my wife GMing. I'll just be playing with one paladin, no other characters or players. We were thinking 25 point buy and starting with 350 gold might be enough. Any advice before we start?
I was hoping to avoid playing multiple characters. We are both new to pathfinder and the extra paperwork tends to get in the way. I suppose you are right and I'll need some cohorts, but perhaps a 30 point-buy will help, maybe starting with some magic equipment?
Definitely could use some help from some experienced game masters on this. We are both new to pathfinder and would like to keep the GM and me from having to play multiple party members.
Gestalt, 25-30 point buy, maybe an extra trait too. That should be decent for the power curve too.
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How familiar are you with the Gestalt rules for play? That might be a good way to boost your ability to run a single player game without being too reliant on cohorts and NPCs.
**EDIT*** Ninja'd by 45 seconds..... That's what I get for pausing to look up a link :)
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I liked the Sacred Servant with the Tactics subdomain as proposed by STR Ranger here. The versatility that weapon master ability provides will be well needed in one-man party. The Call Celestial Ally will also prove useful to cover your weaknesses. A Hound Archon, a Couatl and a Planetar are all good choices at their respective levels.
With the Sacred Servant I would strongly suggest that you start with the Birthmark trait though.
Mythic rules are interesting too in order to increase your power.
Mythic rules are already an assumption of the WotR AP, so you aren't actually "adding" anything. The challenges of the AP are assuming that they will be facing mythic characters. That's actually one of the reasons I suggested gestalt, because you really need some deep resources to have a chance of soloing an adventure designed for a group of 4 mythic heroes.
I had to look up what a gestalt was, so not familiar. Pretty new to this and a bit overwhelmed. I don't know about paladin gestalt, as it already is a mix between fighter and cleric, but I love the premise of the paladin. Paladin|Fighter or Cleric seems redundant. Perhaps Paladin|Fighter|Cleric? This seems complicated.
Maybe just a paladin with fighter bonus feats and the cleric spell progression and spells?
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I prefer Paladin | Oracle for a gestalt build. Both use Charisma as a pretty major stat, so they have nice synergy.
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Paladin/Fighter is going to be a pretty mediocre Gestalt. you're goign to be resource light, so you want to pick a gestalt combo that broadens your capabilities, while capitolizing on synergies between the classes. Paladin/Oracle is an especially good gestalt combo; Paladin/Sorcerer has some possibilities, though Spell Failure is going to be a bit of an issue; Paladin/Rogue or Paladin/Bard would both be really good choices (probably Bard over Rogue)..... Definitely Bard over Rogue actually. Paladin/Bard Gestalt would open up your spellcasting resources, give you better skills to deal with challenges, and there's a good amount of synergy between the two classes.
That's going to be my recommendation. Gestalt Paladin/Bard, give yourself a 30 point buy, and go kick evil's ass.
Try a Paladin and oracle of the dark tapestry focusing on the many forms revelation. This will allow you to get off some good shapeshifts and smiting natural attacks.try to work in a way to get the shapechange spell. Maybe via eldritch heritage feats. Then get a ring of continuation. So you can have a permanent shapechange.
Is Oracle of the Dark Tapestry compatible in any way with a lawful good paladin? I thought those gods were evil.
This is really helping me out guys, thank you. I'm thinking of just sort of 'dipping' from some other classes. All the oracle abilities plus the paladin abilities seem to make things rather complicated.
Okay so this is what I am thinking right now:
Paladin with oracle's spell casting and the fighters bonus feats (and access to feats that require fighter levels) with these stats: S 16 D 12 Con 14 Int 13 Wis 10 Cha 16
This is really helping me out guys, thank you. I'm thinking of just sort of 'dipping' from some other classes. All the oracle abilities plus the paladin abilities seem to make things rather complicated.
Okay so this is what I am thinking right now:
Paladin with oracle's spell casting and the fighters bonus feats (and access to feats that require fighter levels) with these stats: S 16 D 12 Con 14 Int 13 Wis 10 Cha 16
That's solid, but you need to be aware you will have to run from things sometimes . You can't be lawful stupid and charge everything, or you'll get overwhelmed.
Thanks Gerald, Titania, Ssalarn,XMorsX, and BigCoffee. In addition GM is letting me get whatever non-magical/masterwork gear I want.
Thinking full plate, bastard sword (with the feat), heavy wooden shield, lance, and light horse with chain shirt barding (keep the mount in light armor so I can valiantly run away quicker).
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Thanks Gerald, Titania, Ssalarn,XMorsX, and BigCoffee. In addition GM is letting me get whatever non-magical/masterwork gear I want.
Thinking full plate, bastard sword (with the feat), heavy wooden shield, lance, and light horse with chain shirt barding (keep the mount in light armor so I can valiantly run away quicker).
I don't want to spoil anything for you, but don't count too much on having access to that horse during the first part of the adventure......
GM decided on a 375gp limit, so I'll drop the horse. Buying:
Banded mail
Heavy steel shield
Bastard Sword
Sling & bullets
For feats I'll take toughness, exotic wep Bas Sword, and combat expertise. Though, would power attack be a better choice? Perhaps drop the bastard sword for a long sword: toughness, power attack, and combat expertise.
I'd have 4 Lay on Hands at level 2, but I have none at level 1. I'd also have 13hp, unlucky number.
I took wep prof bastard and power attack, what would you take instead of toughness? At level 1 I cannot take extra lay on hands.
Hoo boy, you're gonna have to be one badass paladin.
But imagine that; one guy just Rambo'ing his way through the Worldwound. If you survive or play to the end of the campaign (which I doubt), you're pretty much going to be the new Aroden. :)
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I'd have 4 Lay on Hands at level 2, but I have none at level 1. I'd also have 13hp, unlucky number.
I took wep prof bastard and power attack, what would you take instead of toughness? At level 1 I cannot take extra lay on hands.
Do not waste a feat on the bastard sword. The very minor boost to damage isn't worth it, and there's quite a few good longswords and and other weapons that you are going to prefer to have.
I'm trying very hard to not ruin anything for you, so please just trust me on this one. It isn't worth wasting a feat for .5 average damage that will be quickly eclipsed by the benefits you could be getting using one of the story-focused martial weapons provided in the game.I'd suggest Power Attack.... And maybe consider going the Shield Master route? That'd help your offense and defense, and is a weapon style that will be well supported by the campaign. Shield Focus isn't a terrible idea either, you're going to want every scrap of defense you can get soloing this thing.
By 3rd level, the feat Squire is a great boost to your party needs, I recommend picking up a Magus, and have him take on the role of primary arcane caster. When he gets access to Magus Arcana, have him nab some things like spell blending so he gets access to utility spells like Knock and/or Rope Trick.
He'll also be able to cast Fly and Haste on you by the time you hit lvl 9-10ish.
I also would not recommend the bastard sword (at least not taking proficiency for it) as it really is a waste of a feat and I do not see the point in gestaulting fighter just to waste the feat on weapon proficiency when you already have so many proficiencies. Power Attack and Fey Foundling as well as Noble Scion (War) all seem to be pretty solid choices.
Also my math isn't adding up for your stats... was it still 25 point buy? What race are you playing(human)? Myself I think you could get away with letting WIS dump to 7 since you have good will saves and Divine Grace, you won't be missing it too much. Detect Evil helps cover a lot of what you would be doing with Perception checks. If you are also taking Oracle, I would consider the Nature Mystery and Legalistic Curse, picking up the Nature's Whispers Revelation which will allow you to also dump DEX completely for even better stats.
My recommended array:
(+10)STR 18 (with human racial)
(-4)DEX 7
(+5)CON 14
(+5)INT 14
(-4)WIS 7
(+13)CHA 17
With the build as is, AC, Initiative, and CMD are all calulated using CHA in place of DEX, only place it hurts is that Ref save which you add CHA to anyway.
Do you get traits?
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Pathfinder and it's predecessors are not really designed to be played with one character. The AP's are written with the assumption that you have 4 PC's. I recommend your DM provide several NPC's to join you or use the NPC's in the modules. Later you can get leadership and get a summoner or druid cohort.
Especially since it's Wrath of the Righteous, keep with a longsword, just don't ask question and use the feat for something else. If you'd like some sort of ally, Paladin / Sorcerer (buff and summon spec) or Paladin / Summoner can be great. Or if you're crazy enough, Paladin/Wizard going to Paladin/Eldritch Knight
After reading, I would say go with Lore over Nature since Sidestep Secret allows you to use CHA on Reflex as well as AC where Nature's Whispers as written does not.
It also gives all of the Knowledges as class skills, which are always useful. If you are gestaulting, Arcane Archivist lets you get in some Arcane casting so you can have access to some utility spells, or some really good buffs such as the spell Shield for optimal AC.
You guys are giving me much to think about. We went with a 30 point buy as suggested. I'll drop the bastard sword for a long sword and use the feat for something else. These are all really good ideas everyone.
I took fey foundling, power attack, and cleave. Look good?
What will your stats look like? I imagine you will go Sword'n'Board for this? Since you're alone for this I bet you will have more money then a normal group so don't be afraid to have wands, potions and to buy magic items for different situations instead of just 1 set of armor and 1 sword and 1 shield for your paladin's entire career.
Stats are S16 D12 C14 I13 W10 Ch16. Yeah, going sword 'n' board. I had 375 gold to buy gear with. I had about 50 or 60 left over after buying equipment, I'll look into how much it is for some potions.
Cleave sounds like a good idea but after 6th level it is not as good as it looks. A better choice would be to go full sword and board with improved shield bash. With a 30 point buy you can probably afford the DEX for two weapon fighting to really rack up the damage. Keep in mind smite evil works on all your attacks including shield bash. If you can keep the DEX up to go for improved two weapon fighting then that is even better.
Not sure if it's possible, but another AP sounds like it would be better suited to solo-ing. Wrath of the Righteous takes a full party of level 20/tier 10 characters. Other AP's take a party of level 15ish characters with no tiers. With another AP, you could use high point boy, extra wealth, and mythic tiers to make up for the fact that you're alone; not so much with Wrath of the Righteous.
If it's possible to do this, I would recommend Carrion Crown as it has plenty of evil stuff for your paladin to smite. If it's not possible, then good luck! :)
All those dump stats hurts my eyes.
Daethor, I think I'll get some npc companions.
I agree with BigCoffee about not liking all those dump stats. Maybe I should just have some ridiculous stats.
You could simply roll for stats, 4d6 dump lowest reroll 1's could have some interesting results.
Hmmm...
I would really recommend against this. It's a matter of the action economy: The encounters are written assuming a party of 4 to 6 PCs.
Even if you run a 75-point gestalt character, your wife (the GM) is going to have to re-write just about EVERY encounter in the entire AP to give you a fighting chance. And that's going to be a LOT of work on her part!
I've found that re-writing APs to suit a party that's severely over- or underpowered is HARDER than just writing a homebrew adventure from scratch.
But, if you want to go for it, good luck!
I think the one-man Gestalt Paladin idea seems like a really strong option. I would not recommend dumping stats, because you're going to have to handle things like skill checks.
It's worth noting that Cleave isn't so bad when you're constantly surrounded.
Also, since you guys are new at Pathfinder, here's an easy adjustment to make to the encounters. At least for the first few levels, I suggest shrinking the numbers advantage enjoyed by the bad guys. Instead of fighting six demons at once, it's not hard for your wife to throw three demons at you instead. As mentioned above, APs are designed for four-man parties, and the enemy numbers reflect that. So, by shrinking enemy numbers, that's an easy way to help deal with that. The second sorta-easy way is a Gestalt character, who can handle both fighting and spellcasting.
For simplicity's sake, Paladin|Bard seems like it would work really well. There isn't a whole lot of overlap between Paladin and Bard abilities, and they compliment each other well. All of your saving throws are great, you get great skills as a Bard, you get full fighting ability as a Paladin, and you get some relatively-simple-to-learn spellcasting as a Bard.
Rambo-ing your way through the Worldwound sounds like a blast. I'd love to try that sometime.
That being said... holy cow, if you're new to Pathfinder, starting off with Wrath of the Righteous is a terrible idea, simply because of the Mythic rules, which take Pathfinder's complexity and just makes things go nuts. I am not the most experienced with Paizo's APs, but I would suggest Jade Regent instead. The built-in relationships with NPCs would be a boon for a new GM, as it means that the GM can focus on roleplaying a given group of NPCs who have a built-in reason to be traveling with the character. Just skip caravan combat though, because it's lame. I believe that one is pretty easy to find in print, as well.
-Matt
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Can't believe no one has said this yet: MAX OUT USE MAGIC DEVICE. Unless you're going gestalt with Wizard or Sorcerer, there's a very good chance you will need some Wizard or Cleric-only spells at some point. With a high charisma you should be pretty good at UMD, and with you getting all the cash you should be able to afford plenty of wands and scrolls. Having access to spells like Knock, Fly, Dispel Magic, Teleport, etc. will mean a much smaller chance of you being stumped by some obstacle or another.
Also make sure you have a backup in case you get Feebleminded or blinded or something. This is going to be a very dangerous campaign, as when you go down, it's a TPK.
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Can't believe no one has said this yet: MAX OUT USE MAGIC DEVICE. Unless you're going gestalt with Wizard or Sorcerer, there's a very good chance you will need some Wizard or Cleric-only spells at some point. With a high charisma you should be pretty good at UMD, and with you getting all the cash you should be able to afford plenty of wands and scrolls. Having access to spells like Knock, Fly, Dispel Magic, Teleport, etc. will mean a much smaller chance of you being stumped by some obstacle or another.
Also make sure you have a backup in case you get Feebleminded or blinded or something. This is going to be a very dangerous campaign, as when you go down, it's a TPK.
Absolutely, and get wands of cure x...and all the arcane spells that seem useful... or scrolls...potions...
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I would say start at at least level 2 or more, also more treasure, but WOTR gives a lot of treasure. Paladins are good for solo because they can heal and fight.
Also here is what James Jacobs says
Any words of wisdom for GMing Solo campaigns? Solo as in one GM and one player
Hmmm...Make sure to avoid using monsters that do things like paralyze or stun or the like—monsters that do things that kind of require other PCs to help.
Or consider running a helper NPC for the player.
Or make that player a Mythic character once those rules are out to give the PC a much needed edge.[\quote]
remember that even at level 1--before you get castng--you can activate use-activate spell items (wands and such) that are on your class list without needing to roll UMD.
Kalthios,
If I may, I'll just throw out another suggestion. On rainy weekends when no one else is around, my brother and I occasionally run one-on-one games for each other. We haven't tried it with higher-level installments of the Adventure Paths yet, but we've gone through the first volume of both Curse of the Crimson Throne and Second Darkness, and started Council of Thieves.
What's worked for us is starting at a rather drastically higher effective level, around 5, but I think that's the CR for a group of 4 1st-level PCs anyway. We normally take the opportunity to try out some of the wackier 3.5 templates to reach that effective challenge rating/character level, but award experience as if our characters are 1st level, and generally rule generously when odd situations come up in game. Under the right circumstances, our characters can look pretty dangerous, but when outside their main skill areas there's still ample scope for the risk that provides dramatic tension.
My brother likes stealthy characters while I favour spellcasters, for example, and in our experience even if our characters are blessed with bizarre templates that increase their CR/ECL considerably, dedicated martial opponents who see us coming or are able to better dictate the terms of engagement (like someone holed up in a dungeon where you can't launch a fireball at range) still make us sweat quite a bit.
If you do go the gestalt route, I don't think a 25-point buy starting at level 4 would be too much. You might well feel epical against the lowly minions to start with, but the more challenging opponents, particularly those who play to your weaknesses, should still feel quite dangerous.
As a side note, however you decide to play a solo campaign, be prepared for your encounters to run much longer than the adventures as written assume. With only one PC, there will very often be situations where having only one character's worth of actions on the side of the good guys will slow you down. That's one of the reasons why a higher-level PC isn't always as much of an advantage as it looks: every round spent chasing down one more archer out of a scattered group is so many extra arrows that might get past the point or two of extra defense offered by better gear, and so on. Anyway, I'm just chattering away, so good luck!
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Can't believe no one has said this yet: MAX OUT USE MAGIC DEVICE. Unless you're going gestalt with Wizard or Sorcerer, there's a very good chance you will need some Wizard or Cleric-only spells at some point. With a high charisma you should be pretty good at UMD, and with you getting all the cash you should be able to afford plenty of wands and scrolls. Having access to spells like Knock, Fly, Dispel Magic, Teleport, etc. will mean a much smaller chance of you being stumped by some obstacle or another.
+1 to this, you want UMD. If you gestalt with Bard you will get it as a class skill.
I like the standard Bard, but as you are going solo, an Archeologist Bard might work better. Paladin will take care of your "punch Evil in the face!" needs, while the Bard will round you out for skills and other non-combat stuff. Archeologist's Luck is nothing to sneer at as well.
