So I ran a group of all new classes through First steps part 1. Not a huge amount to test with level ones but some thing stood out.
The party was 2 warpriests, a swashbuckler, a hunter, an investigator, and a shaman.
First things first... the shaman had a flying pig which was interesting to say the least.
I was concerned with how the swashbuckler did. Firstly apparently had taken weapon finesse with the intention to switch it after level 1. I don't think that sort of situation should occur. The class being so dex based, and themed as a melee class should get the ability to hit things better at first level without strength or level one rebuild shenanigans. He did dump strength really low though so damage output was really low.
The war priests were essentially clerics at this level, nothing setting them apart. One idea I heard from them was if the warpriest got spell combat, even if it was just for spells cast on themselves. Just something to set them apart a little.
The shaman also seemed very much like a cleric at this level, though did use the fearie fire like thing on something that was identified as being able to go invisible.
The investigator was a skill monkey largely, and helpful in many of the challenges, though less so in combat, but it is first level.
The hunter seemed the most combat ready at level 1, having a pet always does that though so no surprises there.
Thanks for your playtest feedback, Sporge! :)
Sporge wrote: The war priests were essentially clerics at this level, nothing setting them apart. One idea I heard from them was if the warpriest got spell combat, even if it was just for spells cast on themselves. Just something to set them apart a little. Being that the warpriest is pretty much almost a complete ripoff of the Magus class, giving them Spell Combat wouldn't set them apart at all. Rather, it'd make them even more like the Magus.
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I have to disagree, giving them spell combat but limiting it to spells effecting allies would be a reversal of the magus.
Imagine a Warpriest 5 foot steps up, drops bulls strength on his fighter buddy and takes a swing. Next round he drops bless (can't use it with Spell combat, its not touch). Fighter gets hit, he drops a cure light on his buddy and hits the bad guy.
Now instead of constant barrage of shocking grasps, you have a character swinging and hitting but in a very different method than the magus, but one that is complementary. Plus you have a similar mechanic to the paladin lay on hands in that he can heal and strike in the same round.
A reverse magus would be really interesting. I like the idea of healing and smashing something in the same turn. This would help distinguish the warpriest from the cleric and paladin too (both of whom would likely use Quicken Channel if they wanted to try something similar).
Taenia wrote: I have to disagree, giving them spell combat but limiting it to spells effecting allies would be a reversal of the magus.
Imagine a Warpriest 5 foot steps up, drops bulls strength on his fighter buddy and takes a swing. Next round he drops bless (can't use it with Spell combat, its not touch). Fighter gets hit, he drops a cure light on his buddy and hits the bad guy.
Now instead of constant barrage of shocking grasps, you have a character swinging and hitting but in a very different method than the magus, but one that is complementary. Plus you have a similar mechanic to the paladin lay on hands in that he can heal and strike in the same round.
Spell Combat doesn't work like that
Spell Combat (Ex): At 1st level, a magus learns to cast spells and wield his weapons at the same time. This functions much like two-weapon fighting, but the off-hand weapon is a spell that is being cast. To use this ability, the magus must have one hand free (even if the spell being cast does not have somatic components), while wielding a light or one-handed melee weapon in the other hand. As a full-round action, he can make all of his attacks with his melee weapon at a –2 penalty and can also cast any spell from the magus spell list with a casting time of 1 standard action (any attack roll made as part of this spell also takes this penalty). If he casts this spell defensively, he can decide to take an additional penalty on his attack rolls, up to his Intelligence bonus, and add the same amount as a circumstance bonus on his concentration check. If the check fails, the spell is wasted, but the attacks still take the penalty. A magus can choose to cast the spell first or make the weapon attacks first, but if he has more than one attack, he cannot cast the spell between weapon attacks.
You can use Spell Combat to cast any spell with a casting time of one standard action. It doesn't have to be a touch spell or an offensive spell.
Defensive spells, utility spells, offensive spells. All of them. You could use Spell Combat to hit one guy and lob a fireball at another guy. You could use Spell Combat to hit a guy and buff yourself with Shield. You could hit a guy while casting Identify to know what the hell you're hitting him with. The most common use, of course, is to use Spell Combat to cast Shocking Grasp and then use Spellstrike to channel it through your weapon.
Having a version of Spell Combat which only allowed touch spells would be such a pale shadow of the actual ability as to be laughable, especially on a Cleric chassis which has so many useful non-touch buffs.
Saber_Prime wrote: Sporge wrote: The war priests were essentially clerics at this level, nothing setting them apart. One idea I heard from them was if the warpriest got spell combat, even if it was just for spells cast on themselves. Just something to set them apart a little. Being that the warpriest is pretty much almost a complete ripoff of the Magus class, giving them Spell Combat wouldn't set them apart at all. Rather, it'd make them even more like the Magus. I'd hardly call Warpriest a rip-off of the Magus.
For one, Magus actually has the action economy to accomplish its stated goals.
For another, the Enhancement Bonus abilities that a Warpriest gets are terrible by comparison. Buffing a weapon for one round per level is awful. Further restricting it by forcing the player to choose these enhancements once a day and be stuck with them is even worse.
Say a 10th level Warpriest buffs her weapon with Flaming to fight some bad guys. This takes 4 rounds. Her sister, a Magus, does the same.
Later, the two face off against a young red Dragon. The Warpriest is now stuck with only 6 rounds of enhancement and has to use the version she determined earlier in the day, complete with useless fire damage. The Magus uses another Arcane Point and gets another whole minute of whatever enhancements she wants.
The Magus' ability is much more versatile and allows for more overall time in use. The Magus can tailor her weapon enhancements for each individual encounter.
To make matters worse, the Magus' ability is just a cherry on top while the Warpriest's version is a central function of the class.
It's terrible.
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