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-I love that Paizo is trying to bring back the evil drow, but I find how they did it distasteful.
-I love high level play. More options will always be better than fewer to me.
-I enjoy Vancian magic. Everything else feels almost unnatural to me at this point.
-Enchantment is the best magic school EVER. I don't care if Conjuration or Transmutation are more powerful mechanically speaking, Enchantment is so much more fun. I have never felt so awesome in a game as when my 15th level Sorcerer single handedly defeated what basically amounted to an army with a Mass Hold Person. And even if your main enemies aren't humanoids, almost all of the NPC's are. A creative player can do so, so much with that.
I like Eberron. I think it's a cool setting. Unfortunately, it's associated with 4E, so I may as well have just shoved rabid weasels down my underpants.*whispers* Eberron began in 3.5.I suppose it did at that.
Point still stands though.
4e has tainted the d20 and those other funny dice, terms like AC, hit points, iconic spells like fireball and lightning bolt, all the core classes, the list goes on and on...so how do you play PF?
Or does your rule only apply to settings? In which case I guess you never play any D&D settings anymore? Excepting Golarion and the more obscure ones, of course.
(Not being snarky, I'm honestly curious.)
I would love to play 4e but I never will get the chance because everyone around me hates it.
Come to NYC, I'll DM. :)
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Speaking for myself, it's not that they're mutually exclusive. It's just that tech, particularly that of the post-industrialized world, tends to ruin the mystique of the fantasy world I want to game in. The more tech there is, the less the PCs matter, the less magical the game world is.
Or maybe I just don't want to immerse myself in a world that in any way resembles the hum-drum world I really live in. Take that for what you will.
I assume a lot of the objections come from how people view the real world and how it can be presented in a game setting.
A few months ago we ran a PF game in a sort of pulp-noir campaign set in a fantasy prohibition era. I essentially played the Rocketeer (Spellslinger with his spells refluffed as gadgets). We had a pin-stripe suit mobster with a witch doctor mask and a tengu paper-boy who moonlighted as "The Finch". The car chases especially were hella fun.
With the right themes and some imagination I don't see why a more technology heavy setting can't be just as fun. Granted sometimes I just want some good old low-tech high fantasy. But I want options even more and I'd love to see some Paizo sourcebooks on other eras of play.
I love dragons, and think Dragonlance was the best setting back in 2nd edition AD&D.
I absolutely hated the Planescape, Forgotten Realms, and Ravenloft settings for D&D.
I like the ideas behind Eberron, and a lot of the things in Eberron, but didn't like it as a setting.
I hate "core only".
Point buy is one of the worst things to be included. I much prefer rolling for stats. If you have 2 wizards in a point buy party, you may as well be one of that wizard's mirror images because there's a high possibility you have the exact same stats because you looked it up on a website.
I am not a fan of the adventure paths, and prefer more freeform games.
I really really hate people who complain that the DM won't let them be something, and then rage when the DM tells them to go play in another game or suck it up. If you don't like the restrictions the DM puts forth, "man up" and DM your own game. This has nothing to do with my 4th point, as I just bypass the games that say "core only".
I hate guns in fantasy settings. I feel they are out of place.
On that note, I do enjoy steampunk. Though again, dislike guns being included, even in steampunk. I just hate guns as a whole.
I hate drow with a passion. Biggest reason I hated Forgotten Realms. And I hate that they are included in Pathfinder.
I facepalm at people with Chaotic Neutral for their character alignment, as they invariably play them as Chaotic Stupid (CE in all but name) selfish "donkeys".
I think Paladins should be Neutral Good in alignment, as they hold good above law or chaos.
I enjoy playing "exotic" races, and would really love to play a gnoll. I also find the core races other than dwarf and half-orc to be boring. And I think warforged are an awesome race.
4e has tainted the d20 and those other funny dice, terms like AC, hit points, iconic spells like fireball and lightning bolt, all the core classes, the list goes on and on...so how do you play PF?Or does your rule only apply to settings? In which case I guess you never play any D&D settings anymore? Excepting Golarion and the more obscure ones, of course.
(Not being snarky, I'm honestly curious.)
I dunno, ask the people that it actually matters to. I have a hard time understanding it as well.
I think all the classes are balanced perfectly against each other. It's the player who makes it stronger or weaker by his/her choices of feats, spells, weapons, etc.
Are we telling our serious confessions or making things up? or just lampshading?
I actually like Golarion and the decisions Paizo makes.
Epic level play is a terrible idea and Mythic is a reasonable solution.
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I'm actually only here for the free cake.
There's cake!?!?
- I greatly, greatly despise the Vancian magick system; that is the one thing that I have always despised from the first time I played the magic red box. I prefer a more freeform magick system, or a point based system.
- I have never liked the alignment system. I use it a a guide for my PCs, not a set in stone set of commandments.
- I dislike guns in my fantasy settings. (Though in a steampunk setting I don't mind them)
- I like Drow as the misunderstood heroes (I love to play the reformed evil trying to make good will all the stigma and prejudice that comes with it, makes good role-playing), though I think Drow are WAY over done anymore. Especially Dr'zzt-clones.
- I don't get to play PF near as much as I would, everyone I game with prefers the Palldium system (which I detest, especially Rifts and Heroes Unlimited).
that is all (for now...)
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Part 2 for me:
- I've always been disappointed that Paizo (and WotC before them) have avoided some of the classic tropes so stringently. Such as, rescuing a princess, "a wizard did it", and, heck, having traditional KINGDOMS in their settings. Even not-so-traditional stuff like half-dragons. Yeah, maybe they were overdone for a while, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't ever be used again...
I think that Conan the Destroyer was the best example of an adventuring party ever put to film...and it was a terrible film.
I believe that a good GM can run a great game off the top of his head without rules or using the least well-thought set of rules out there.
I believe that Stealth works just fine in Pathfinder if you use common sense.
I feel that most monsters don't last long enough to bring out the cool attacks in their arsenals.
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Let's see if this works...
I don't enjoy playing PFRPG anymore. There, I said it.
Even just the core rules seem too much anymore. So many spells, minute details galore...Too much. Just not enough time for it.
Oh...and I despise reality shows...
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Oh, this isn't one that comes up a lot, but something that has always been a source of contention between my fellow players and me:
-Paladins don't gamble. They just don't, I'm sorry. If you're playing a Paladin and your GM allows it, fine, cool, whatever. I'll let it go. I hate it, though, and not one of my NPC Paladins would ever indulge. To be sure, in my world you'd definitely get some aside glances from the other Paladins if they caught you doing it. It's not "fall-worthy" (something that's just way too abused) but it's just a really terrible way for a champion of light to spend her time-it would be like if you eyed somebody eating from the bins at the grocery; not something you would turn someone into the authorities for, but distasteful and rude. If you win, you're taking money from poor saps having a run of bad luck. If you lose, you're throwing good coin away that could be put to better use vanquishing evil or helping the less fortunate. Since I am apparently the only person in the world who holds this opinion, I'll include it here.
Oh, this isn't one that comes up a lot, but something that has always been a source of contention between my fellow players and me:
-Paladins don't gamble. They just don't, I'm sorry. If you're playing a Paladin and your GM allows it, fine, cool, whatever. I'll let it go. I hate it, though, and not one of my NPC Paladins would ever indulge. To be sure, in my world you'd definitely get some aside glances from the other Paladins if they caught you doing it. It's not "fall-worthy" (something that's just way too abused) but it's just a really terrible way for a champion of light to spend her time-it would be like if you eyed somebody eating from the bins at the grocery; not something you would turn someone into the authorities for, but distasteful and rude. If you win, you're taking money from poor saps having a run of bad luck. If you lose, you're throwing good coin away that could be put to better use vanquishing evil or helping the less fortunate. Since I am apparently the only person in the world who holds this opinion, I'll include it here.
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Okay, I'll bite...
1) I do not think that there is any "caster/martial disparity."
2) I miss carrion crawlers and umber hulks far more than I miss beholders and mind flayers.
3) I like the alignment system just fine as-is.
4) I like Vancian spellcasting.
5) There is nothing wrong with balancing mechanical advantages with role-playing limitations (e.g. Paladins).
6) I like paladins just fine as they are.
7) As a GM, I have never tried to make a paladin fall. On the contrary, I give in-game warnings to the character if I think a paladin is starting to stray from her vows, to allow the character to take corrective action before she falls out of favor.
8) I really hate drow as PCs.
9) I really hate the summoner class.
10) I don't think that monks are imbalanced vis-a-vis other classes.
11) Telling a good story is more important than letting the dice decide everything. I always roll behind a screen.
12) While I like the scenarios, I am not a fan of PFS organized play. I find it stifling to creativity as a GM, and it encourages bith rules-lawyering and power-gaming by players.
13) I REALLY hate power-gaming.
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Oh, one more...
14) I did prefer the more abstract combat of 1st- & 2nd Ed D&D to the tactical focus of 3.x (including PFRPG).
I knew about it.In the 1950's I was part of a government agency located in Arizona tasked with secretly locating, detaining, and researching roleplaying games. All this was done without the public's knowledge, as it was at that time unclear if people were ready for the knowledge of the existence of role plaing games, or even the possibility of roleplayed life on other roleplaying worlds. If they were ready for this knowledge, the effects to the country's stability would still be irrefutable. From time to time there would be a leak or our efforts would be observed and we were made to destroy the roleplaying games and the people they came in contact with to keep our task a secret.
Even though these games have gained some acceptance in today's changing society, the full extent of our work will likely never see full light during our lifetimes or our children's. It was different time, and America was a very different place. I knew the implications of my actions and continue to see their ripples today. I make no apologies.
Was your father a senator?
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- I've been a member of Paizo's forum and following PFRPG since the early stages of Alpha testing. I have yet to play of DM a single Pathfinder game...
[edit] scrap that, I DMed a few Beginner's Box games for my son.
- Considering the Beginner's Box was his Christmas gift, my 9-year-old son owns more Paizo products than I do.
- I actually prefer Vancian Casting both in flavour and application, and wish that non-vancian elements of the game (at-will cantrips, spontaneous casters etc) would go away.
- I actually enjoy the 2 hours of chitty-chatting we loose every time our gaming group meets.
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We have played through 3 Adventure Paths (1 Levels 1-20 (3.5) and 2 Levels 1-17 (Pathfinder)) without ever experiencing any of the balance issues often discussed on the boards.
Was your father a senator?I knew about it.In the 1950's I was part of a government agency located in Arizona tasked with secretly locating, detaining, and researching roleplaying games. All this was done without the public's knowledge, as it was at that time unclear if people were ready for the knowledge of the existence of role plaing games, or even the possibility of roleplayed life on other roleplaying worlds. If they were ready for this knowledge, the effects to the country's stability would still be irrefutable. From time to time there would be a leak or our efforts would be observed and we were made to destroy the roleplaying games and the people they came in contact with to keep our task a secret.
Even though these games have gained some acceptance in today's changing society, the full extent of our work will likely never see full light during our lifetimes or our children's. It was different time, and America was a very different place. I knew the implications of my actions and continue to see their ripples today. I make no apologies.
I'm not at liberty to say...
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There is a house in New Orleans they call the Rising Sun...Oh, this isn't one that comes up a lot, but something that has always been a source of contention between my fellow players and me:
-Paladins don't gamble. They just don't, I'm sorry. If you're playing a Paladin and your GM allows it, fine, cool, whatever. I'll let it go. I hate it, though, and not one of my NPC Paladins would ever indulge. To be sure, in my world you'd definitely get some aside glances from the other Paladins if they caught you doing it. It's not "fall-worthy" (something that's just way too abused) but it's just a really terrible way for a champion of light to spend her time-it would be like if you eyed somebody eating from the bins at the grocery; not something you would turn someone into the authorities for, but distasteful and rude. If you win, you're taking money from poor saps having a run of bad luck. If you lose, you're throwing good coin away that could be put to better use vanquishing evil or helping the less fortunate. Since I am apparently the only person in the world who holds this opinion, I'll include it here.
.....
*Narrows eyes at Tequila Sunrise, then turns back and quickly scribbles something into well-worn notebook*
Carry on.
I actually enjoy Synthesist Summoner.
I think PFS has some pretty arbitrary rules restrictions, and refuse to use them, or participate in it in general.
I use the prd as a source when I don't own the book, because I don't feel like spending thousands of dollars on material I won't use except for a single feat or trait.
I enjoy optimization, but not minmaxing. I don't believe in arbitrary stat reductions just to get that one stat just a little bit higher.
I think the basic point system for stats is bad, and pidgeon-holes characters into being awful or forced into min-maxing, so when I gm I give my players more points to spend and do it on a 1:1 basis instead of that incremental stuff. Or I'll let them roll if they want, but I have to watch. And if they get bad stats, they can suffer.
I have no idea what Vancian casting is.
I find the first three levels of character development boring, and don't truly start enjoying most characters till 5 or higher.
I enjoy playing monsters more than regular PC races. One of my current favorite characters is a vampire, and I once played a dragon as a character, and had more fun with it than any standard game.
I loved Eberron, and Forgotten Realms, and Greyhawk. I still "Greyhawk the Room" whenever possible, and if necessary will take multiple trips just to ensure I got every piece of loot possible, often at the dismay of my GM.
I like Psionics.
Come at me bro.
Also: Can someone tell me what Vancian casting is? too lazy to look it up.
Edit: Oh, and I find it a point of order that when a GM kills my character "for story purposes" to absolutely minmax/optimize/power-game the s&!$ out of my next character, just to ruin his day.
Also: Can someone tell me what Vancian casting is? too lazy to look it up.
It's the core casting mechanic of D&D; i.e., fire-and-forget spell casting. It's called 'vancian' because it's loosely based on the magic of Jack Vance's Dying Earth stories, in which magicians memorize a limited* number of spells. The spells are then completely wiped from memory once cast.
*As in, the archmage character of one story can memorize all of four whole spells. Yeah.
Oh. Alrighty. I don't particularly mind Vancian casting. I always thought it was a pretty interesting system. Harkening back to the Dragonlance settings, I always thought it was interesting to see even the mighty Raistlin having to struggle with precisely where and when to cast his spells.
Thanks guys. Turns out I knew what it was, just not the proper name for it.
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Not really game related, but...
I hate texting. I would much rather call someone and speak directly to them.
Also, the term "hashtag" annoys me.
Oh I think there's truth in that, right there
#IfIamincabableofmakingmypointclearwiththewordsIamusingwhyshouldIbesopompou sastobelievethatbydrawingattentiontomyinabilitytoexpressacompletethoughtbya ssigningameaniglesssymboltoaphrasethatIcleverlybelieveisassumationbutisinre altiyjustapedanticwasteoftime
#longphrase #yolo #swag
#longphrase #yolo #swagOh I think there's truth in that, right there
#IfIamincabableofmakingmypointclearwiththewordsIamusingwhyshouldIbesopompou sastobelievethatbydrawingattentiontomyinabilitytoexpressacompletethoughtbya ssigningameaniglesssymboltoaphrasethatIcleverlybelieveisassumationbutisinre altiyjustapedanticwasteoftime
#preachingtothechoir #downwithtwitter #takeawaycellphonesfromkids
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I hate texting. I would much rather call someone and speak directly to them.
I hate phone calls. They should only last as long as you have information to impart. Otherwise they get drawn out with long silences and meaningless noise.
Texts are for when you don't need a response right away.
Oh I think there's truth in that, right there
#IfIamincabableofmakingmypointclearwiththewordsIamusingwhyshouldIbesopompou sastobelievethatbydrawingattentiontomyinabilitytoexpressacompletethoughtbya ssigningameaniglesssymboltoaphrasethatIcleverlybelieveisassumationbutisinre altiyjustapedanticwasteoftime
That might be the first time it didn't annoy me.
#lol
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No, hehe, no, you hang up fist...I hate texting. I would much rather call someone and speak directly to them.I hate phone calls. They should only last as long as you have information to impart. Otherwise they get drawn out with long silences and meaningless noise.
Texts are for when you don't need a response right away.
*CLICK*
Texts are for when you don't need a response right away.
I thought that was what email is for. (or voicemail)
Also,
1) email is free,
2) doesn't have a character limit,
3) and doesn't require a smartphone to do quickly (try using an old phone to text, you'll see what I mean).
Just sayin.
I liked pun-pun.
So did I.
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Texts are for when you don't need a response right away.I thought that was what email is for. (or voicemail)
Also,
1) email is free,
2) doesn't have a character limit,
3) and doesn't require a smartphone to do quickly (try using an old phone to text, you'll see what I mean).Just sayin.
1. So are my texts.
2. Never have messages that long.3. You've never been proficient in them.
I like dump stats. Where would Raistlin or Elric have been without their dump stat. Dump stats can bring just as much to the table as high stats.
And in that same vein, I wish I had the courage to dump constitution on a caster. And the ability to keep such a caster alive.
I don't think it's dump stats that so many gamers seem to be irked by; I think it's that one particular stat gets pretty consistently dumped more than the others.
That said, I agree with you. Good characters have flaws.