| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Ond level of spellslinger and then magus the rest of the way.
|
Especially for PFS I really recommend avoiding trying this
Bladebound Magus with an Axe Musket, Sword Cane Pistol, or Dagger Pistol.
The "Unbreakable" quality really helps with misfires.
These are typed as double weapons.
Double weapons are treated as two separate weapons for the purpose of making masterwork versions and for adding enchantments and special qualities. Only the slashing weapon part of your "combo-gun" would get the black blade qualities. Some GMs might allow the unbreakable part to affect the entire weapon, but some would not.
That is of course assuming that it would be allowed at all. Others would interpret the "must be a light or one-handed slashing weapon, rapier, or sword cane" to disallow those completely. Not saying that's right, just that it can certainly be read that way. I personally would probably allow it in PFS with only the slashing side being the black blade. (In a home game I would tell the player "no" but in PFS I can't do that even though I believe that's the intention, I have to go by RAW and I can't quite draw out "no double weapons for Black Blades" from the text.)
Locally we have a PFS "gunquisitor" who is just plain ridiculous in the damage output front. A gunmagus could easily do as well. Go for 5 levels of gunslinger (musket master archetype, rapid reload, and paper cartridges can reduce reloads to a free action) to get the dex bonus to damage. Go magus the rest of the way. Your arcane pool will be helpful to boost the enhancement bonus on your weapon while you spend money on magical properties (like reliable).
You're giving up the higher level magus abilities doing this though. Your choice :)
|
|
I made a couple of edits while you were posting.
Are you saying that when you sunder a double weapon, you only sunder one end?
Only one end is broken?
Hmmm... Interesting question. I am not saying that, I'm saying that double weapons are treated as two separate weapons when making masterwork weapons and adding magical properties. Also when fighting with them.
Double Weapons: Dire flails, gnome hooked hammers, and two-bladed swords are examples of double weapons. A character can fight with both ends of a double weapon as if fighting with two weapons, but she incurs all the normal attack penalties associated with two-weapon combat, just as though the character were wielding a one-handed weapon and a light weapon.
The character can also choose to use a double weapon two-handed, attacking with only one end of it. A creature wielding a double weapon in one hand can't use it as a double weapon—only one end of the weapon can be used in any given round.
A quarterstaff for example could be (+2)/(+1 disruptive) on the opposite ends. Similarly an axe musket could be (+2 keen)/(+1 distance reliable). You pay for each end separately.
I don't actually know the answer to your question. In a home game, I would totally allow it. (Think of all the martial arts movies where the hero's bo staff gets cut in two and he continues to fight with one or both ends.) In PFS I *think* the entire thing would be sundered. Not consistent, I know.
You can also go Alchemist(Grenadier)/ Gunslinger
Are you saying that when you sunder a double weapon, you only sunder one end?
Only one end is broken?
Yeah, that sounds pretty accurate. Pretty sure when sundering a double weapon you have to specify what part of the double weapon you are sundering.
Are you saying that when you sunder a double weapon, you only sunder one end?
Only one end is broken?
Sunder targets an 'item'. The item is a double weapon, therefore the double weapon gains the broken condition. I can't remember seeing anything to suggest that the rules for enchanting double weapons apply to anything except for enchanting (and masterworking I guess)
THAT SAID.... under the rules for Pistol dagger, Axe Musket and Warhammer musket it explicitly calls out that one being broken applied the broken condition to both weapons. It does NOT though call that out explicitly on a pistol sword cane.
Odd. Sunder rules target an item. Some double items point out that breaking A breaks B as well. Others do not. Wonder if there's anything to read into that.
As to the rest.... Depending on what mood I was in and the themes of the campaign would be if I'd allow it or not. RAW, the Black Blade must be a "One handed slashing weapon, Rapier or sword cane". That immediately cuts you down to Sword Cane pistol or a Pistol Dagger as everything else is 2H.
The Myrmidarch archetype of the Magus can spellstrike through ranged weapons by 4th. It loses some extra niceties, but it adds utility to the bullets (and you don't lose the touch attack in the first increment so it's a win with added bullet damage).
Add in a level of Gunslinger for deeds, or Spellslinger Wizard for firing spells out of the weapon (sans bullets).
Blackblade is an interesting idea, although it looks like (since there is a bit of debate around it) you might need specific approval for that from the GM.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Here's my homebrew version of the Shootist, a gunslinger magus, as a magus archetype. This is definitely not PFS legal, but then I don't participate in PFS games, only home games, not in Golarian.
Shootist (magus alternate class)
The shootist blends mystical arcane powers and masterful prowess with a weapon much like his kin the magus, however the shootist uses a firearm as his chosen weapon and a deck of cards as his spellbook. While he can use all simple and martial weapons, including firearms, pistols or revolvers, revolvers are his preferred weapon.
Alignment: Any.
Hit Die: d8.
Starting Wealth: 4d6 × 10 gp (average 140 gp)
Class skills
The shootist’s class skills are Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Fly (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Knowledge (dungeoneering) (Int), Knowledge (planes) (Int), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Spellcraft (Int), Swim (Str), and Use Magic Device (Cha).
Skill Ranks per Level: 2 + Int modifier.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A shootist is proficient with all simple and martial weapons, and all firearms. A shootist is also proficient with light armor. He can cast magus spells while wearing light armor without incurring the normal arcane spell failure chance. Like any other arcane spellcaster, a shootist wearing medium armor, heavy armor, or a shield incurs a chance of arcane spell failure if the spell in question has a somatic component. A multiclass shootist still incurs the normal arcane spell failure chance for arcane spells received from other classes.
Spell Decks: Instead of a spellbook, a shootist uses a spell deck that resembles an ornate playing card deck with cryptic symbols and formula hidden in the numbers, icons and border on each card's face.
Deadeye (Su): At 1st level, the shootist can resolve an attack against touch AC instead of normal AC when firing beyond her firearm’s first range increment. Performing this costs 1 arcane point per range increment beyond the first. The shootist still takes the –2 penalty on attack rolls for each range increment beyond the first when she performs this action.
Quick Clear (Su): At 1st level, as a standard action, the shootist can remove the broken condition from a single firearm she is currently wielding, as long as that condition was gained by a firearm misfire. The shootist must have at least 1 arcane point to perform this action. Alternatively, if the shootist spends 1 arcane point to perform this action, she can perform quick clear as a move-equivalent action instead of a standard action.
Spell Combat (Ex) – At 1st level, a shootist learns to cast spells and wield his weapons at the same time. This functions much like two-weapon fighting, but the off-hand weapon is a spell that is being cast. To use this ability, the shootist must have one hand free (even if the spell being cast does not have somatic components), while wielding a light or one-handed melee weapon in the other hand. As a full-round action, he can make all of his attacks with his melee weapon at a –2 penalty and can also cast any spell from the magus spell list with a casting time of 1 standard action (any attack roll made as part of this spell also takes this penalty). If he casts this spell defensively, he can decide to take an additional penalty on his attack rolls, up to his Charisma bonus, and add the same amount as a circumstance bonus on his concentration check. If the check fails, the spell is wasted, but the attacks still take the penalty. A shootist can choose to cast the spell first or make the weapon attacks first, but if he has more than one attack, he cannot cast the spell between weapon attacks.
Magus Arcana
As he gains levels, a shootist learns arcane secrets tailored to his specific way of blending martial puissance and magical skill. Starting at 3rd level, a shootist gains one magus arcana. He gains an additional magus arcana for every three levels of shootist attained after 3rd level. Unless specifically noted in a magus arcana’s description, a shootist cannot select a particular magus arcana more than once. Magus arcana that affect spells can only be used to modify spells from the magus spell list unless otherwise noted.
Ranged Spellstrike (Su) – at 2nd level a shootist can use ranged spellstrike to cast a single target touch attack range spell and deliver it through any gun attack. Even if the spell normally has multiple targets, only a single missile, ray or effect accompanies the attack. At 11th level whenever a shootist using a multiple target spell with this ability may deliver one ray or line of effect with each attack when using a full round action, up to the maximum allowed by the spell (in the case of ray effects). Any effects used in the round the spell is cast are lost. This replaces spellstrike.
Quickfire (Ex) – At 4th level a shootist gains the ability to draw and fire his firearm as a standard action. This ability replaces spell recall.
Bonus Feats – At 5th level, and every six levels thereafter, a shootist gains a bonus feat in addition to those gained from normal advancement. These bonus feats must be selected from those listed as combat, item creation, or metamagic feats. He must meet the prerequisites for these feats as normal.
Dual Pistols (Ex) – At 7th level, the shootist learns how to use his magical abilities to effectively blend two one-handed firearms fighting and casting spells. When holding two one-handed firearms in separate hands, the shootist may spend a shootist pool point as a swift action to count one of his hands (shootist's choice) as free for the purposes of casting spells and delivering touch attacks. The shootist may also use this hand to cast spells for the spell combat class ability (but then cannot fire the firearm the hand is holding as a part of spell combat). This ability lasts for a number of rounds equal to the shootist's Charisma modifier. This ability replaces the medium armor ability..
Knowledge Pool (Su) – At 7th level, when a shootist prepares his magus spells, he can decide to expend 1 or more points from his arcane pool, up to his Charisma bonus. For each point he expends, he can treat any one spell from the magus spell list as if it were in his spell deck and can prepare that spell as normal that day. If he does not cast spells prepared in this way before the next time he prepares spells, he loses those spells. He can also cast spells added in this way using his spell recall ability, but only until he prepares spells again.
Improved Spell Combat (Su) – At 8th level, the shootist’s ability to cast spells and make range attacks improves. When using the spell combat ability, the shootist receives a +2 circumstance bonus on concentration checks, in addition to any bonus granted by taking an additional penalty on the attack roll.
Fighter Training (Ex) – Starting at 10th level, a shootist counts 1/2 his total magus level as his fighter level for the purpose of qualifying for feats. If he has levels in fighter, these levels stack.
Swerve Bullet (Su) – At 11th level, the shootist gains the ability to alter the trajectory of bullet fired at him by sheer force of will, working as deflect arrow feat, but with magic instead of your hand. This ability replaces improved spell recall.
Lightening Reload (Ex) – At 13th level, as long as the shootist has at least 1 arcane point left in his pool, he can reload a single barrel or chamber of a one-handed or two-handed firearm as a swift action once per round. If he has the rapid reload feat or is using an alchemical cartridge (or both), he can reload a single barrel or chamber as a free action. Further more using this ability does not provoke attacks of opportunity. This ability replaces heavy armor.
Greater Spell Combat (Su) – Starting at 14th level, a shootist gains the ability to seamlessly cast spells and make ranged attacks. Whenever he uses the spell combat ability, his concentration check bonus equals double the amount of the attack penalty taken..
Counterstrike (Ex) – At 16th level, whenever an enemy within reach of the shootist successfully casts a spell defensively, that enemy provokes an attack of opportunity from the shootist after the spell is complete. This attack of opportunity cannot disrupt the spell.
Greater Spell Access (Su) – at 19th level, a shootist gains access to an expanded spell list. He learns and places 14 spells from the Bard spell list into his spell deck as magus spells of their bard level. He gains two of each of the spells from the Bard list, not on the magus spell list: 0 level, 1st level, 2nd level, 3rd level, 4th level, 5th level and 6th level.
He can ignore the somatic components of these spells, casting them without normal chance of failure.
True Shootist (Su) – At 20th level, the shootist becomes a master of spells and combat. Whenever he uses his spell combat ability, he does not need to make a concentration check to cast the spell defensively. Whenever the shootist uses spell combat and his spell targets the same creature as his melee attacks, he can choose to either increase the DC to resist the spell by +2, grant himself a +2 circumstance bonus on any checks made to overcome spell resistance, or grant himself a +2 circumstance bonus on all attack rolls made against the target during his turn.
Suggested Magus Arcana
Arcane Accuracy, Bane Blade, Close Range, Critical Strike, and Ghost Blade. Note: Bane Blade and Ghost Blade can be applied to firearms for the shootist.
| 1 person marked this as FAQ candidate. |
Hmm... okay, so question. If you have a Myrmidarch Magus who uses his Ranged Spellstrike through a scatter weapon such as a Dragon Pistol, what happens? Does the spell affect all targets in the cone(Such as the Holy Gun's Smiting Shot?), or does it only affect one target(chosen before or after the attack rolls?) or something else entirely?
|
|
Am I getting across that this doesn't really work?
Indeed you are. That's why I would say a flat "no" in a home game. I'm pretty sure the intention is that a black blade should be a blade only (not part of a double weapon).
Or if I think the character fits in with the theme of my campaign (Eastern Europe in the Middle Ages), I'd say "absolutely, we'll ignore that bit of the rules, that's really cool!"
However in PFS this kind of issue can be extremely divisive. A GM who disallows something a player has based much of their character and wealth on - even something 90% of players would agree is against the spirit of the rules - is crossing the line unless its against the letter of the rules as well. The same is true for a GM who allows things against the rules. And when there's uncertainty, problems occur. If you are used to playing with your GM buddy who lets anything go and then show up at a con and run into the GM who flat out disallows any gun as a black blade you are now missing your major class feature.
Hence my original statement: "I really recommend against trying this in PFS."
My interpretation may not be the one Mike, Mark, or John would make, but until they chime in (actually this is a general rules question, so Jason, SKR, etc. might be better names to throw around) it's my best interpretation.
A little bit of specifics:
Actually, I (the OP) didn't make mention of the damage perspective, Belafon. This is a thought experiment more rooted in flavor than statistics. Though of course, statistics matter...
And I am not a hardcore PFS player... I have never been to a con to play pathfinder. I have participated in local organized play only once. I doubt that would change. I just felt that the preference towards PFS rules would prevent too much munchicanery (I think I just made up that word... munchkin + chicanery...).
But on the other hand, I was just double checking PFS allowable material, and found that spellslinger, holy gun, trophy hunter, and something else I just looked up but already forgot and was somehow relevant to this build are all disallowed. So maybe PFS legal is not a worthy goal to aim for.
As I said in my posted homebrew gunslinger magus, mine is definitely not PFS legal, but I don't believe it's a 'munchkin' build either - being balanced, play-tested. Note I do freelance work for various 3PP, and in my opinion, most if not all 3PPs for Pathfinder create balanced non-munchkin material, being nothing like d20 glut days.
The level of mistrust by some PF gamers for PF 3PP material, is unfounded. In much of the 3PP material, I see as more balanced than Paizo material itself. You're not likely to see 'munchkin' material from any PF 3PP.
gamer-primer, I think that taken individually, few add-ons are unbalanced and munchkin fodder. The issue is when material published by different sources, or even the same source but for different purposes get mixed together - that is when munchicanery occurs.
Even sticking to all core material, stuff can get broken, if combined just right. Adding 3PP into that mix, which is not often made taking into account everything else that has been published (official + other 3PP sources) just makes it ridiculously easy to break the game; even sometimes without intending to.
I can agree with that. I'm the primary developer of Kaidan setting of Japanese horror (PFRPG) as an imprint under Rite Publishing. In my home games running with Kaidan material, I generally allow the the main PF books (Core, APG, UM, UC) with Kaidan material, but that's it, I don't allow any of the material from Golarian setting guides, for example, nor most other 3PP material. I even generally disallow summoners in my games for example, as well. And while I generally feel other 3PP like Super Genius Games create balanced material - I don't allow that in my Kaidan games (I limit to Kaidan material and Paizo hardcovers only.)
Also, I tend to use the custom monsters of Kaidan, and generally don't allow most of the Bestiaries. In some cases I have monsters with the same name as Bestiary monsters, and the builds are nothing like the other. My monsters are created based on balancing for PF, at the same time closely matching Japanese folklore. I feel that many of the same name monsters created by Paizo do not closely follow Japanese folklore, so don't belong in Kaidan games. For example, the Rokuro-kubi in the Bestiary is an undead creature, however, in Japanese folklore a rokuro-kubi is a cursed normal living being, and not undead at all.
Back to the topic at hand, for my Shootist magus archetype above, Ranged Spellstrike replaces normal Spellstrike, because of 2 reasons. A gunslinger magus needs ranged spellstrike at 2nd level, not having to wait for 4th level as it is for Myrmidarch, and this build is intended for use in an Old West style setting, and there's no need for this magus build to ever use a melee weapon - so there's no need for normal Spellstrike.
I do think spellslinger and magus is the best way to go. Mage Bullets aren't limited to wizard spells. Not that I advise using that ability. I hate any ability that sacrifices a spell for raw damage. However, you do benefit greatly from Arcane Gun since the magus spell list is almost all blasting spells. Get a pistol dagger or a pistol sword cane. Make the blade be your blackblade and make the pistol be your arcane gun. You can shoot a spell through your gun and then stab someone.
Myrmidarch Magus is pretty lousy, in my opinion. It's not really meant to turn the magus into an archer, but rather some kind of weird fighter that can channel spells into whatever weapon he wishes. Trading a class's iconic ability is never worth it.
The level of mistrust by some PF gamers for PF 3PP material, is unfounded. In much of the 3PP material, I see as more balanced than Paizo material itself. You're not likely to see 'munchkin' material from any PF 3PP.
It's not a matter of trust. This isn't the homebrew forums, gamer-printer. I personally find it disrespectful to throw your homebrew archetype into everyone's faces. And finally, a homebrew alternate class that blatantly steals abilities from other classes is munchkinny.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
I do think spellslinger and magus is the best way to go. Mage Bullets aren't limited to wizard spells. Not that I advise using that ability. I hate any ability that sacrifices a spell for raw damage. Get a pistol dagger or a pistol sword cane. Make the blade be your blackblade and make the pistol be your arcane gun.
Myrmidarch Magus is pretty lousy, in my opinion. It's not really meant to turn the magus into an archer, but rather some kind of weird fighter that can channel spells into whatever weapon he wishes. Trading a class's iconic ability is never worth it.
The level of mistrust by some PF gamers for PF 3PP material, is unfounded. In much of the 3PP material, I see as more balanced than Paizo material itself. You're not likely to see 'munchkin' material from any PF 3PP.It's not a matter of trust. This isn't the homebrew forums, gamer-printer. I personally find it disrespectful to throw your homebrew archetype into everyone's faces. And finally, a homebrew alternate class that blatantly steals abilities from other classes is munchkinny.
I wouldn't have responded at all, except the OP stated "preferably PFS legal, but not necessarily." So my posts are indeed 'respectful' of the OP's intent in this thread. Had the OP stated PFS legal only, I would not have responded at all. Archetypes are builds that often use abilities from other classes, so it's definitely not 'munchkinny', rather perfectly in line with how legal archetypes are built. All I've done is convert 2 gunslinger deeds into arcane pool properties.
I wouldn't have responded at all, except the OP stated "preferably PFS legal, but not necessarily."
That means the OP might entertain non-PFS but official Pathfinder material or he might look at D&D 3.5e material. Neither of these are necessarily 3PP and definitely not homebrew. Homebrew generally stays in the homebrew forum.
Archetypes are builds that often use abilities from other classes, so it's definitely not 'munchkinny', rather perfectly in line with how legal archetypes are built. All I've done is convert 2 gunslinger deeds into arcane pool properties.
Nearly all archetypes do not steal from other classes. Some do, but that's not the point of archetypes. Even so, PF designers like Sean K. Reynolds have a great distaste for archetypes that borrow abilities from other classes because they're uncreative, munchinny, and rob other classes of their individualism.
I wouldn't have responded at all, except the OP stated "preferably PFS legal, but not necessarily."That means the OP might entertain non-PFS but official Pathfinder material or he might look at D&D 3.5e material. Neither of these are necessarily 3PP and definitely not homebrew. Homebrew generally stays in the homebrew forum.
Almost every thread in this board does not mention "not necessarily PFS legal" which means only this thread, could be applicable to homebrew suggestions. Non-PFS does not mean non-Pathfinder (only non-Pathfinder Society), so any suggestions outside of PF rules would not apply. Nothing on the forum rules suggest that homebrew is only for the homebrew forum. So I don't agree with your point at all.
Archetypes are builds that often use abilities from other classes, so it's definitely not 'munchkinny', rather perfectly in line with how legal archetypes are built. All I've done is convert 2 gunslinger deeds into arcane pool properties.
Nearly all archetypes do not steal from other classes. Some do, but that's not the point of archetypes. Even so, PF designers like Sean K. Reynolds have a great distaste for archetypes that borrow abilities from other classes because they're uncreative, munchinny, and rob other classes of their individualism.
This is a homebrew build only, and not for RPG Superstar, so what SKR likes or dislikes has no meaning whatsoever. And as you stated some archetypes do indeed use abilities of other classes. I do build many homebrew archetypes, some published, and some not, but I usually never mix class abilities. A gunslinger magus, though, mixing abilities seems appropo, so that's why it was done here.
Note: I'm not only a freelancer for 3PP, but I am one of the contributing authors for The Empty Throne, Jade Regent AP, so I do freelance work for Paizo Publishing as well. Meaning, I have some knowledge as to what I'm talking about.
|
Myrmidarch Magus is pretty lousy, in my opinion. It's not really meant to turn the magus into an archer, but rather some kind of weird fighter that can channel spells into whatever weapon he wishes. Trading a class's iconic ability is never worth it.
A classes Iconic ability?
Is Not Spell combat and Spell strike the classes iconic abilities? Or is spell recall now the #1 reason to play Magus? Curious.. very curious.
Myrmidarch isn't 'some weird fighter' but rather a multifunctional tactician. You can wear heavy armor, light armor, or medium armor with less penalties that a normal magus can for example.
I have put together what should be a functional character Desperado Magus with Spellslinger/Magus
|
That's what I'm trying to do except spell combat states,
To use this ability, the magus must have one hand free (even if the spell being cast does not have somatic components), while wielding a light or one-handed melee weapon in the other hand.
light or one-handed melee, I think GM's are pretty strict on that.
For the ranged spellstrike, Myrmidarch already has less spells so to abuse it fully is there any "ranged-touch" cantrip that is deserving to be spammed.
I think the gunquisitor is probably the closest, to being Emiya Kirutsugu from Fate Stay Night.
Myrmidarch is better suited for a switch hitter than a pure ranged character. For a pure ranged mage/shooter probably the better thing is going spellslinger/EK (especially with the new FAQ)
The real problem of the spellslinger is that his ability are conflictual. Shooting spell with the gun is usefull to increase the DC, witch benefit a pure caster build focusing on INT, while mage bullets benefit a full attacking approach, focused on getting BAB and pumping DEX.
Also, the restriction on what can be cast with the gun are very limiting. No targeted spell, and no area spell (no fireball -.-). Spellslinger is quite cool but very underwhelming.
|
|
That's what I'm trying to do except spell combat states,
To use this ability, the magus must have one hand free (even if the spell being cast does not have somatic components), while wielding a light or one-handed melee weapon in the other hand.
light or one-handed melee, I think GM's are pretty strict on that.
For the ranged spellstrike, Myrmidarch already has less spells so to abuse it fully is there any "ranged-touch" cantrip that is deserving to be spammed.
I think the gunquisitor is probably the closest, to being Emiya Kirutsugu from Fate Stay Night.
thats why you have to use a dagger pistol or sword cane pistol. You have a light or one handed melee weapon. It just also has a gun attached to it too.
Myrmidarch does.. yes. But its only 1 less spell per day. Rings of Wizardy help some with that though.
Overall a Magus/Spellslinger would be a switch hitter, using a wide variety of rays/Lines/cones/melee touch or ray spells + bullets.
|
|
@Karossii I dont know the build but Belafon said he has seen one in action so we have to wait if he decides to share it.
@Espy Hmm since a dagger pistol can be used as any so it qualifies for the the spell combat and spell strike part I think.
*nods*
Exactly.. Actually Dagger Pistols are pretty fun weapon over all. You can shoot, stab and throw it.
a swordcane pistol is NOT a sword cane and so i cant be used as a black blade!
it spicificly states "sword cane or rapier" and not a sword cane pistol
if there would be somthing as a rapier whip that wouldnt clasifie as a rapier either! those are specefied weapons not types of weapons so no go on a black blade for a gun!
its a BLADE! NOT a gun
|
|
a swordcane pistol is NOT a sword cane and so i cant be used as a black blade!
it spicificly states "sword cane or rapier" and not a sword cane pistol
if there would be somthing as a rapier whip that wouldnt clasifie as a rapier either! those are specefied weapons not types of weapons so no go on a black blade for a gun!
its a BLADE! NOT a gun
Something like a rapier whip would be unwieldy and impractical to put a rapier on the the back end of a whip. However if it was a double weapon of a rapier and a whip.. however impractical it would be, it would count.
And while you are correct that you are not able to be used as a black blade, having very little sharpness, I don't see what that has to do with the sword cane pistol.
You are having a blade. your blade just comes with an attached firearm.
Well, if the effects of the Black Blade only effect one end, then you run into some interesting results.
This means the other end can be enchanted, and only one end is intelligent.
It would be like the catdog of weapons.
|
|
@Karossii I dont know the build but Belafon said he has seen one in action so we have to wait if he decides to share it.
A gunquisitor is actually pretty straightforward. The order of levels taken can vary a bit from player to player, but here's what the local one did:
Primary Stat: Dexterity
Secondary Stat: Wisdom
-3 levels of Gunslinger (Musket Master archetype) so that reloading a musket is only a move action or a free action if using an alchemical cartridge.
-5 levels of Inquisitor. This gives access to judgements, spells, and - at 5th level - bane.
-2 levels of Gunslinger to get Musket Training (+dex to damage).
-Back to Inquisitor from here on out.
So at 8th level he was targeting touch at a range of 40 feet, doing 1d12+2(gun+enhancement)+(2d6+2)(bane) with two attacks per round (unhasted). At 10th level it was around 1d12+2+2d6+2+7(Dex). More if he judges as well. It may not sound like much, but remember that it's targeting touch at range, so it's almost a guaranteed hit; an average of 30 points per round at 8, 48 at 10 (unhasted, unspelled, unjudgemented). Once he hit levels 12-13 he became an absolute beast. When his group ran the Eyes of the Ten scenarios (considered the "toughest" parts of PFS) very few combats lasted longer than two rounds due to his absolutely amazing damage potential (easily over 120 points per round - still targeting touch). Oh and I haven't mentioned that it's a x4 weapon and that build qualifies for improved critical at level 11.
There's definitely an argument for taking all of the gunslinger levels first but that's what he did. (Also since this was PFS he had a fairly good idea of how much wealth he would have and at what levels he would be able to pick up certain items like a bane baldric or belt of incredible dexterity.)
For a gunmagus: Here your bonus damage comes from your arcane pool and various arcanas rather than bane and judgements. Whether or not you want to go myrmidarch is debatable. Weapon Training is nice and so is ranged spellstrike but if you use ranged spellstrike you are limited to one attack per round until magus level 11. I would recommend taking all 5 levels of gunslinger first with this build, that bonus dex damage is big and you're not going to get a huge bump at one magus level like bane gives the inquisitor. In addition you would qualify for Improved Critical at level 9.
a "sword cane" is a cane with a sword in it
a "sword can pistol" is a cane with a sword and a pistol in it
they are not coverd by the black blade discription
the black blade specefies a "rapier" and a "sword cane" as specific weapons not as a group of weapons. those are alowed others who have the same origine are not!
@Karossii I dont know the build but Belafon said he has seen one in action so we have to wait if he decides to share it.A gunquisitor is actually pretty straightforward. The order of levels taken can vary a bit from player to player, but here's what the local one did:
Primary Stat: Dexterity
Secondary Stat: Wisdom-3 levels of Gunslinger (Musket Master archetype) so that reloading a musket is only a move action or a free action if using an alchemical cartridge.
-5 levels of Inquisitor. This gives access to judgements, spells, and - at 5th level - bane.
-2 levels of Gunslinger to get Musket Training (+dex to damage).
-Back to Inquisitor from here on out.So at 8th level he was targeting touch at a range of 40 feet, doing 1d12+2(gun+enhancement)+(2d6+2)(bane) with two attacks per round (unhasted). At 10th level it was around 1d12+2+2d6+2+7(Dex). More if he judges as well. It may not sound like much, but remember that it's targeting touch at range, so it's almost a guaranteed hit; an average of 30 points per round at 8, 48 at 10 (unhasted, unspelled, unjudgemented). Once he hit levels 12-13 he became an absolute beast. When his group ran the Eyes of the Ten scenarios (considered the "toughest" parts of PFS) very few combats lasted longer than two rounds due to his absolutely amazing damage potential (easily over 120 points per round - still targeting touch). Oh and I haven't mentioned that it's a x4 weapon and that build qualifies for improved critical at level 11.
There's definitely an argument for taking all of the gunslinger levels first but that's what he did. (Also since this was PFS he had a fairly good idea of how much wealth he would have and at what levels he would be able to pick up certain items like a bane baldric or belt of incredible dexterity.)
For a gunmagus: Here your bonus damage comes from your arcane pool and various arcanas rather than bane and judgements. Whether or not you want to go myrmidarch is debatable. Weapon...
I am playing something similar to this in an upcoming game. However, the game is allowing access to advanced firearms, and so that I could get the love that is the double-barreled shotgun, I didn't take Pistolero or Musket Master.
|
|
a "sword cane" is a cane with a sword in it
a "sword can pistol" is a cane with a sword and a pistol in it
they are not coverd by the black blade discription
the black blade specefies a "rapier" and a "sword cane" as specific weapons not as a group of weapons. those are alowed others who have the same origine are not!
Very well! A +1 sword cane isn't allowed then!
I see nothing in the RAW that makes me believe a sword cane pistol would not qualify as a black blade. The sword cane pistol specifically calls out that it is considered a double weapon - i.e., a sword cane and a pistol - separate for purposes of enhancement, meaning that when you enchant the blade part, you are enchanting a sword cane.
Sticking a gun on it does not stop it from being a sword cane as well; it makes it a sword cane and something else, similarly to how a klar is a sword and a shield.
