Interest Check -- Everything Old is New Again


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Dark Archive

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I'm considering starting a new PF campaign entitled Everything Old is New Again. It takes place not on Golarion, but in a world of my own creation. Details will be provided when I am ready to kick it off, but it may be a month or so.

The campaign begins in a small borderlands keep called Restwell Keep, but there is plenty to keep young adventurers busy. Not far from the KEEP ON THE BORDERLANDS are the CAVES OF CHAOS, home to tribes of evil humanoids. And somewhere in the nearby hills lie the fabulous ruins of QUASQUETON. The VILLAGE OF HOMMLET is only a few days away, and has a bandit problem they'd like investigated. There are also strange-goings on in the town of SALTMARSH, to the south. And as your characters grow in power, so too will the challenges they face.

This campaign takes many of the classic adventures of old and breathes new life into them, converting them to Pathfinder rules an updating the encounters to make them fresh and exciting. From the Keep on the Borderlands to Tomb of Horrors, we'll play through a history of early RPG classics. If you've never played these, then you're in for real treat. If you're well-and-familiar with them, think again! I've made a few modifications and changes to keep things fresh and exciting.

Well, consider me intrigued! Do you have any ideas on your character specifications at this point? If you're waiting a month then there's obviously no rush to immediately start writing something up, but I am curious.

Liberty's Edge

Hmm. Homebrew has importance to me as a would-be DM myself, and I was only introduced to RPing via a little known game called Talislanta, then later 3.0 D&D. I didn't experience most of what people would call "the classics," so I think I'll keep an eye open for more info here, thankyouverymuch.

I'm also interested

I'm interested. What Gods are you allowing? Do we get traits and if so which ones are allowed (are there any campaign traits?) What character generation system are you using?

I'm definitely interested, but I'm not sure if I'd be much good. I'm still pretty new overall.

Grand Lodge

Hommlet ? hum that smells like Temple of Elemental Evil also...

(i just finished in a home game Tomb of Horror good thing its was a 3.5 format because i am sure we couldn't have done the last encounter.)

but count me interested also.

Dark Archive

More details on the world will be posed later. I need to sort out a few things first, hence, it will be a little while before we start.

Grand Lodge

I am also very interested!

Dark Archive

Okay, so we have interest. I'll work up character creation details and house rules, as well as world details and post them in a while. The world is called Jenneria and the region in which the PCs begin is called Valenor. Valenor is a typical fantasy setting with pseudo-medieval trappings and all the usual fantasy races. The language of the region is Valoran and sounds very similar to French (in fact, I use French as the default representation).

In Jenneria, there is no "Common" tongue. Each region has it's own language, but there is a "Trade Tongue" that is nearly universal. It is a very specialized language, designed to conduct trade, not convey complex ideas. However, it is common enough that in all but the most tiny, isolated village, someone will speak Trade Tongue.

Jenneria is a low-magic setting. Potions and scrolls are fairly common, but more powerful items tend to be rare. Armor and weapons, in particular, are made by someone, for someone (or some specific purpose). They often have a rich history, which may be uncovered through the use of magic or research. There are no magical sweatshops where wizards churn out thousands of magical goodies. Buying magical items is a difficult proposition at best, and risky at worst.

Deities are going to have to wait a bit, as that requires a more lengthy explanation.

I'm very interested--I've never played much of the old stuff, and I enjoy homebrewed, low-magic settings. I'll keep an eye on this.

I'd certainly be interested in this. I'll keep tabs on the thread.

interested will have to check back after vacation to see where this game stands.

Liberty's Edge

Haven't gotten a chance to do the somewhat grittier low-magic settings yet. Should be a refreshing change of pace.

Also should be fun transcribing french accents. "I shoot zee drrragon vith my crrrossbow!"

No wait, that's not right...hang on, time to go dig up that taunting scene from the holy grail...

Yes, this sounds like a lot of fun. Count me as interested.

I haven't played anything at all for far too long and I am just itching to get back into a game. Consider me interested as well.

You had me at low magic sir.

Dark Archive

Jenneria operates on a silver standard in most regions (one of which is Valenor). Gold is still used, but is fairly rare. Platinum is almost unseen these days, as is electrum. In remote areas and small towns and villages, barter is the norm.

In a world of limited magic, the differences in normal craftsmanship become more apparent. Successful adventurers can and do pay extraordinary sums to acquire the finest tools. Impoverished mercenaries pick through battlefields littered with the arms and armor of the fallen seeking to improve their personal kit. Courtiers and potentates demand the finest garb and furnishing from all corners of the world to improve their standing when compared to their peers and rivals. In each case, these people seek to own items of the highest quality they can lay their hands on, because they tangibly benefit from them. Such items also serve as trade goods, some being worth more than their weight in gold.

Above average items come in six levels of improved quality. Each level increases the number or strength of benefit the item's quality can provide. Each level adds one "benefit" to the item, increasing its usefulness or effectiveness. Higher levels of quality allow the same benefit to be taken twice, or even three times, making the item much better for a particular purpose or use. (These rule were liberated from Mythic Vistas: The Black Company.)

We will be using the Wound Point/Vitality Points system from Ultimate Combat, as well as Armor as Damage Reduction, Called Shots, and Piecemeal Armor. In addition, all characters have a Base Defense Bonus equal to their BAB.

I'm still debating how I'm going to reduce the focus on magic without crippling the magic-using classes. One idea is to remove metamagic feats and the Eschew Materials feat. Another thought is to double XP for creating magical items, but to allow any character to contribute XP to the cause. Anyway, just some ideas running through my head.

Would you like stat rolls or point buy?

Liberty's Edge

whoah, truckload of variant rules there, eh? Wait, XP for crafting? Awwww crap he's goin old school on us. RUN! Before he breaks out the THAC0! RUUUN!

Honestly though, this sounds like it's going to get down and dirty REAL quick. Definitely waiting for selection/creation guidelines.

I would be imtrested in this :) I can always run my quintisental alchemist jack of all trades, knowledges and general helpfulness. Seriously the alcheist can make a great skillmonkey and alchemy can be considered low magic :)

I am interested and will keep tabs on the development of this campaign.

I'm somewhat interested, and definitely like the idea. I am also curious about the level of interaction that may be intended for the party. Given that those adventures have everything generated, what draws me more is the story that the PCs can build for themselves.

That said, I'd like to take the route of most resistance and aim for a Mystic Theurge. Presuming that the interest and GM are willing-- and that I get picked-- I'd love to see where we all can take this.

Grand Lodge

hum i think an inquisitor would do it for me...

I miss THAC0. I miss roll your stats and see what you qualify for. I miss gama world being compatible. OK done showing my age. Still very interested.

WhtKnt wrote:

We will be using the Wound Point/Vitality Points system from Ultimate Combat, as well as Armor as Damage Reduction, Called Shots, and Piecemeal Armor. In addition, all characters have a Base Defense Bonus equal to their BAB.

Hungry Mother, that's all the variant rules I was planning to use for my low-magic game! Haha, you've definitely got me hooked.

Grand Lodge

there was a guy about couple weeks ago wanting to run some ADD 2ed...

Would love to be a paladin/cleric for you!

Dark Archive

Stat generation will probably be point buy with 25 points. I really haven't yet decided. Though, I could go totally old-school and say 3d6, in order. <evil GM smirk>

Lots f party interaction, though there will of course, be some combat and a strong storyline to connect all the threads. Thinking of allowing Ultimate Campaign as well.

Races are a bit unique:

Elves (Children of the Stars) come in three flavors, only one of which is available to PCs (there may be others, but not at the outset). Purebred elves (also known as high elves) are direct descendents of the first elves to walk upon the Jenneria. They are xenophobic isolationists who seldom associate with any outside their own kind.

Mixed elves (also known as wood elves) are the only elves available as player characters at the outset. They are aloof and mysterious, but do trade with other races, and occasional dalliances with humans, in particular, have given rise to half-elves.

Wild elves (also known as lost elves) are xenophobic to a fault (as with the high elves), but unlike their brethren, who build sprawling cities and live a peaceful, philosophical existence, the wild elves have gone to the other extreme, embracing nature and seeking to become one with it.

Dwarves (Children of Stone) hail from three different bloodlines. The first, the deep dwarves, are not available as a player character race. These are said to be the very first dwarves, created by the God of the Forge himself from the very bones of the earth. They live deep underground and seldom, if ever, venture to the surface.

Mountain dwarves are the dwarves that everyone knows and loves. They live deep in the mountains in their halls of stone and trade beautiful and intricate metalworks with other races.

Sundered dwarves are dwarves without a clan or a home. They are outcasts from dwarven society, shamed and shunned. They often shave their beards and take refuge in human cities, where they eke out a living among the humans, who do not recognize their shame. As sturdy as their kin, they possess a level of cunning that other dwarves do not.

Halflings are, well, halflings. They are exactly as described in the Pathfinder Core Rules; happy, go-luck wanderers. They do not know their origins, and do not speculate on such things. If asked, they shrug and reply, "Only the gods know."

Gnomes also exist in Jenneria, and fall int two categories; rock gnomes and forest gnomes. Rock gnomes are a little taller than their kin and tend to be the more serious of the two sub-races.

Half-elves are a rarity, but they do exist, and the same applies to half-orcs, but doubly rare. They are otherwise as described in the Pathfinder Core Rules.

Dark Archive

Oh, and speaking of going old-school, there are a few small restrictions on race/class combinations, but these mostly will not affect PCs. Wild elves, for example, do not know of clerics; all of their priests are druids. Most of the PC races are free to choose as they wish, I believe.

Approx what level will we be starting at? 1? 2? 5?
Reading over the fluff you have put up so far has given me a great idea but I would have to use some 3.5 material to do it.
Basically the most dwarfish dwarf you could think about. I was thinking of using the Earth Dwarves 3.5 variant and/or the Dwarven Paragon class. How much and which ones I am not entirely sure as I figure that I should run it by you first :)
Some things would have to be adapted and I think I would keep the pathfinder stats but what do you think? Can we make it work?

RPG Superstar 2009 Top 16

Definitely interested. Love the idea of a gritty approach and the variant rules.

Dark Archive

Might be do-able; we'll have a look at it. I'm not adverse to new sub-races, and I will be introducing several through the course of the campaign.

My intent is to start at level 1 and go up from there. I'm certainly not adverse to adding 3.5 material, though I reserve the right to tweak it a little for compatibility.

Na I was thinking of him being a mountian dwarf, he is just a paragon of his race and hence why he is the one going out adventuring, defending, representing the mountian dwarfs. It would need tweaking to make it work and I am fine with you having last say, in fact I would rather you work with me on it :)

Sounds wonderful. And I would be up for 3d6 down the line if that is what you want, I would ask that you allow us to darksun toss out a character that has all below average stats. But if I must play bill the fighter with all 4s and 5s until he dies I will.

I think bill the fighter with all 4s and 5s would be a fun challenge :)
Of course the others might not think so...
Heck, I am playing a 20pb with a group of 45pb characters and doing alright so far :)

Liberty's Edge

I rolled and alchemist with all 7's and 6s for stats once. Made him a halfling and played him to the HILT. Campaign fell flat unfortunately, DM vanished on us...extreme sadface, since I loved the character and the group we started.

If you decide you wanna get masochistic about ability generation, then by god make the call. I will roleplay that monster till I'm blue in the FACE. Point buy works too, allows a few more roles to emerge, but I'm game for whatever we toss out. Roleplaying unplayable characters is a lost art and a priceless gift that is wasted on too many of today's players.


True. I'm a second generation gamer and my father ran me through tagel manor with his group when he thought I was old enough to game all those years ago. 4 characters later I started to get the hang of not walking off into death. Ahh good old judges guild adventure with Arduin starting tables and 2nd ed rules.

Every character deserves to be played!

Havocprince wrote:
Arduin starting tables

Talk about name dropping your obscure gaming lore. Well played sir. :)

Now I'm off to see if those three little tan books are still somewhere in my old gaming box in the attic.

I'd like to make a elf rogue if that is ok with you

Dark Archive

Not only have my little tan books, but also the box they came in. :) And Tegel Manor is a classic. I have the distinct pleasure of knowing one of the men who playtested it, and provided the cover art for the revised edition.

Love turning threads into nostalgia kicks.

Liberty's Edge

Nostalgia...even for a slighty newer newcomer like me the value of Nostalgia is not to be understated. STILL not sure I really grasp THAC0, though. But there's plenty of time for that later.

This sounds cool. I'd be down to try it.

I never got to try the old adventures (I'm a fairly recent convert to the TRPG nation) and I'd really like to see what they were like.

So to continue on with my mountian dwarf paragon idea, here are my thoughts and suggested changes.

Mr. Dwarf:

Earth dwarfs get the following.
Earth race traits +1 attack bonus against air creatures, -2 on saves against spells, spell-like abilities and supernatural abilities of air creatures, +4 CMD against being tripped or bullrushed. Sounds good, maybe drop the CMD to +2 to keep more in line with pathfinder.
+2 str, con, -2 wis, dex Maybe keep regular dwarves +2 con, wis, -2 cha? I would think so, you?
Improved Stonecunning +4 racial bonus on sight checks to notice unusual stonework. Replaces regular bonus. Change sight checks to perception and it sounds good.
No hardy trait
No hatred trait
+4 on appraise and craft checks for stone/metal items This one is a mix of greed and craftsman race traits. Do you want to say it doubles whichever one you choose?

The Dwarf Paragon class.
d10 hit die.
Class Skills Appraise, Climb, Craft, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge (Dungeoneering), Profession, Sense Motive, Survival.
2+int mod skills per level.
Proficent with simple and martial weapons, all armor and all shields except tower shields
Full BAB
Good Fort saves
1st level.
Craft Expertise Gain class level as a racial bonus to craft checks related to metal and stone. Should this stack with the dwarves regular racial bonus? It seems kinda odd.
Improved Stonecunning Inprove stonecunning ability to +4 and 20 feet. Should this stack with the earth dwarf for +6?
2nd level.
Improved Darkvision Increase the range of darkvision by 30ft.
Save Bonus Hardy ability increases by 1.
3rd level.
Ability Increase +2 Con.

What do you think?

So here are Mr. Dwarfs racial stats for your inspection

Mr. Dwarf:

Racial Traits
Ability Score Racial Traits:
Dwarves are both tough and wise, but also a bit gruff. They gain +2 Constitution, +2 Wisdom, and –2 Charisma.
Size: Dwarves are Medium creatures and thus receive no bonuses or penalties due to their size.
Type: Dwarves are humanoids with the dwarf subtype.
Base Speed: (Slow and Steady) Dwarves have a base speed of 20 feet, but their speed is never modified by armor or encumbrance.
Languages: Dwarves begin play speaking Common and Dwarven. Dwarves with high Intelligence scores can choose from the following: Giant, Gnome, Goblin, Orc, Terran, and Undercommon. See the Linguistics skill page for more information about these languages.
Defense Race Traits
Deep Warrior: Dwarves with this racial trait grew up facing the abominations that live deep beneath the surface. They receive a +2 dodge bonus to AC against monsters of the aberration type and a +2 racial bonus on combat maneuver checks made to grapple such creatures (or to continue a grapple).

Stability: Dwarves gain a +6 racial bonus to their Combat Maneuver Defense when resisting a bull rush or trip attempt while standing on the ground.
Feat and Skill Racial Traits
Craftsman: Dwarves are known for their superior craftsmanship when it comes to metallurgy and stonework. Dwarves with this racial trait receive a +4 racial bonus on all Craft or Profession checks related to metal or stone.

Stonecunning: Dwarves gain a +4 bonus on Perception checks to notice unusual stonework, such as traps and hidden doors located in stone walls or floors. They receive a check to notice such features whenever they pass within 10 feet of them, whether or not they are actively looking.
Senses Racial Traits
Minevision: Dwarves can see perfectly in the dark up to 90 feet; however, they are automatically dazzled in bright light and take a –2 penalty on saving throws against effects with the light descriptor.
Offense Racial Traits
Earth race traits: +1 attack bonus and -2 on saves against spells, spell-like abilities and supernatural abilities of creatures with the air subtype.

Weapon Familiarity: Dwarves are proficient with battleaxes, heavy picks, and warhammers, and treat any weapon with the word “dwarven” in its name as a martial weapon.

Given the opportunity, I would like to play a Human Monk. Given that this is a low magic campaign, would you say Qinggong is out?

I'd kind of like him to be a remake of a character I played before, in a game that was sadly cut short, though that character was Lawful Evil (can be changed to Lawful Neutral if that is unacceptable with little change in character besides a bit of a loss in bloodthirstiness. Even Lawful Good is possible, though I don't particularly like the alignment.). Crunch-wise, he'd be a Master of Many Styles, likely mixed with Monk of the Sacred Mountain as well, and a few Fighter levels mixed in periodically.

Stats like thus, if acceptable.


Character-wise, he's very devoted to attaining self-perfection (twisted into a bit of an obsession if LE) and gaining power, but he's loyal to his comrades and can be trusted to keep his word and protect those he is allied with (LE justification: It reflects badly on him if he is too weak to protect his allies). Worshiper of both Irori and Achaekek, though that is likely going to be a nonexistent personality trait in this setting if the gods are different.

There's a few backstory bits that shaped him to be this way, though they're somewhat setting specific. Suffice to say, assassin killed his parents, and left him for dead, he then strives to make himself stronger to avoid such shame in the future (LE: Jealous of the assassin's power, he strives to attain the assassin's moral values [ruthlessness, clarity, etc.] as that philosophy is what he supposes allowed him to achieve that power)

Disregard if I'm not chosen to join or the concept is unacceptable, obviously. =)

Liberty's Edge

I haven't gotten a chance to play a ranger yet. Might be a good change of pace to bring someone whose specialty is combat for once. Many of my characters are kind of unoptimized with more of a gimmick or backstory in mind, and a ranger would be a more straightforward choice for crunch. Switch hitter for good damage at any range, longbow, sword, that kind of thing. As for backstory, well, just have to wait for inspiration to srike, perhaps when more world details are revealed.

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Maps Subscriber

Count me among the interested. I am considering a religously motiviated do-gooder, either paladin, cleric or inquisitor. Would need to see the pantheon in play to get all the details down, but LG with a big sword that keeps kicking others back into line.

I played most of those adventures your reference in opening in middle school years ago, so I'm down for relivin them again. I may still have old modules in a box in my attic someplace...

Grand Lodge

Here is my submission:

Male human Inquisitor 1
Init +1; Senses Perception +7
AC 19, touch 13, flat-footed 17 (+6 armor, +1 dex, +1 trait, +1 dodge)
hp 11 (1d8+2)
SR 0
Fort +4, Ref +1, Will +5
Armor Steel Lamellar, Medium
Spd 20 ft/x4
Melee Greatsword +4 (2d6+6) 19-20/x2
Str 18, Dex 13, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 16, Cha 10
BAB +0, CMB +4, CMD +17
Feats Armor Proficiency (LIGHT / MEDIUM) (PFCR 118), Dodge (PFCR 122), Shield Proficiency (PFCR 133)
Skills Bluff +4, Diplomacy +4, Knowledge (religion) +5, Perception +7, Sense Motive +8, Spellcraft +5, Survival +7
SU Judgment (PFAPG 38 - 39), Destructive Smite (PFCR 43), Destructive Smite (PFCR 43)
MC Inquisitor Domain (Rage), Inquisitor Orisons (PFAPG 38)
Traits Birthmark (Faith) (PFAPG 328), Defender of the Society (Combat) (PFCh: FcGd 62)
Languages Common, Draconic

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