Masterwork Throwing Darts?


Rules Questions


So I DM and play every week or so but I have yet to see or play a character that uses throwing darts and I've decided to make one, however I'm have an issue with pricing for masterwork darts.

According to the Core Rules throwing darts are considered a simple ranged weapon and should be 300 GP + initial cost of 5 SP, but to me that seems a little ridiculous. In comparison to blowgun darts which would come out to about 302.5 GP for a stack of 50. You'd need to somehow throw and retrieve that same dart about 25 times - 50 throws would be double the blowgun dart damage so I halved it - for it to be cost effective.

What are your thoughts, ideas for making this a little more balanced or do you think it's fine as it is?


It does seem somewhat silly to me. But the difference appears to be that one is a weapon while the other is considered ammunition.

From a house rules perspective, I would probably treat them similarly to shuriken, which is priced at 1g per 5; it would still be a bit pricey to make them masterwork, and I'd probably eventually try for a pair that just have returning on them as it'd be less of a hassle.


Returning would be nice but I'm pretty sure the world we're in is a little less magic item oriented. I'll talk to my DM about it.


Oooh, got a trick for you, if you've got a very rules-oriented DM. ;)

Mithral items are always considered masterwork automatically. Mithral weapons cost 500g per pound, with the masterwork cost included. Darts weigh 1/2 pound. RAW, that would make a mithral dart cost 250g 5s.

It's very cheesy, but it's also RAW.

Designer, RPG Superstar Judge

Throwing Dart: "This thrown weapon is larger than an arrow and shorter than a javelin, with a weighted tip and a shorter range than a javelin. Most darts are wooden shafts with a thick metal point."

Blowgun darts are consumable ammunition. Regular throwing darts are not consumable (i.e., they are reusable) and not ammunition. Thus, a masterwork dart is 300 gp + 5 sp

Silver Crusade

Sean K Reynolds wrote:

Throwing Dart: "This thrown weapon is larger than an arrow and shorter than a javelin, with a weighted tip and a shorter range than a javelin. Most darts are wooden shafts with a thick metal point."

Blowgun darts are consumable ammunition. Regular throwing darts are not consumable (i.e., they are reusable) and not ammunition. Thus, a masterwork dart is 300 gp + 5 sp

@SKR: how much do mithral darts cost? A mithral dart weighs one quarter of one pound, and mithral weapons cost 500gp/lb. That would price them at 125gp 5sp per dart, yes?


Sweet now all I need to do is find me some mithral. Thanks for the feedback all around. My DM has been keeping tabs on the page too so he knows for sure the rules now. Although I am curious if Malachi is right about going off the original item weight or not.


Darts (as Sean's quote above points out) have wooden shafts. Can't make them out of mithril (or if you did, they would be heavier than the wooden ones, negating what benefit you're trying to achieve).

You could talk to your DM about a house-rule on 'disposable' darts that are considered ammunition. "Larger than arrows" isn't too far from the ammunition stage.


Majuba wrote:

Darts (as Sean's quote above points out) have wooden shafts. Can't make them out of mithril (or if you did, they would be heavier than the wooden ones, negating what benefit you're trying to achieve).

You could talk to your DM about a house-rule on 'disposable' darts that are considered ammunition. "Larger than arrows" isn't too far from the ammunition stage.

Arguably, the quote says "Most darts..." But I see your point; a mithral dart probably wouldn't work.

Going with a house-ruled one-time use dart might be the best bet in this case.


If you want lighter darts, you can always try darkwood.


Ashram wrote:
If you want lighter darts, you can always try darkwood.

OP was wanting masterwork darts specifically. There's a bit of a rules loophole regarding mithral, where any weapon weighing less than a pound is cheaper to buy as mithral than to buy as a normal metal masterwork.

Masterwork is weapon cost plus 300g, whereas a mithral weapon (which is always considered masterwork per the material description) is 500g per pound of the item; therefore, a small-sized dagger (1 pound for the medium size, 1\2 for the small) made of mithral costs 251g, while the masterwork variant costs 301g.


A dart is a small javelin essentially. The problem really is how masterwork and magic items are priced in 3.0 up - a +1 dagger cost the same as a +1 greatsword (+49 gp or so), yet seems a lot less useful. Back in the day smaller weapons cost less to enchant, so magic darts were not that expensive.

Sovereign Court

Why not use shuriken instead of "darts" as listed in the CRB? Some shuriken were historically, just short pointed rods.

Linkage


Nebelwerfer41 wrote:

Why not use shuriken instead of "darts" as listed in the CRB? Some shuriken were historically, just short pointed rods.

Linkage

Well, for one thing there is the matter of proficiency. Shuriken are exotic weapons, while darts are simple weapons.

Darts have a longer range, and deal more damage.

And the other reason is because the OP has never seen any character use darts, so wanted to make one. Using a different weapon kind of removes that.

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